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So after listening to Greenwald do Tim Dillon's show, I listened to Dillon on Rogan and Dillon suggests a youtube documentary called 9/11 the New Pearl Harbor. It's 5 hours and is an intriguing watch. 9/11 is weird because almost certainly there is something obfuscated there but it's just too massive to figure out all the moving parts. This documentary seems to pose that at least the Pentagon plane and maybe flight 93 were being driven remotely as the skill to fly the planes on the path they took was absolutely out of the hands of the suspected terrorists. I suppose it'd be crazy to think someone who was talented enough to fly the planes in those ways would also be suicidal jihadists. I also found it fascinating that the plane that hit the pentagon hit the outer wall, greatly minimizing the damage it could have done had it landed on top of the building which also would have been much easier to do. Further, the documentary suggests that the planes were swapped out, something that had been posited as possible by the Joint Chiefs in Operation Northwoods, and that the phone calls from survivors had to have come when those people were on the ground, as cell phone technology in 2001 would not have been possible from a plane at 30,000 feet moving hundreds of miles an hour. But that's it's own huge rabbithole of "Where did they take those people and what happened to them?" Anyway, an interesting watch and I have no knowledge of physics or anything to know whether all the engineering stuff is true or not but there's too much weird poo poo going on to think we've heard the whole story (which seems to just be true of every major instance of terrorism in America at this point).
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Jul 7, 2021 19:36
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Cell calls were possible from a plane at that time
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Jul 7, 2021 19:47
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Also, don't forget airfone.
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Jul 7, 2021 20:05
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 https://thehill.com/regulation/court-battles/561856-judge-rules-us-air-force-responsible-for-2017-mass-shooting-at-a The Hill posted:A federal judge on Tuesday ruled that the U.S. Air Force is mostly responsible for the 2017 mass shooting in Sutherland Springs, Texas, due to its failure to enter the gunman's criminal history into a federal background check database, which might have prevented him from purchasing firearms.
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Jul 7, 2021 20:06
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"Kelley was 40 percent responsible for the shooting while the U.S. government was 60 percent responsible" even at it's worst, the capitalist cannot help but generate surplus
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Jul 7, 2021 20:08
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I don't really see the need for the government to complicate things with disappearing planes and poo poo when they could just give Ollie North a suitcase of unmarked bills and some phone numbers of Saudi intelligence
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Jul 7, 2021 20:19
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my bony fealty posted:what was the younger brother's role in all of this? just a kid swept up in the antics of his intelligence asset older bro, or might he actually know something? So I had to sleep on this question. You've identified two types. A: The guy who's doing it because some spook is offering them money or career prospects or sex or whatever and B: the true believer. Zubeidat was definitely the 'A' type. She was clearly a social butterfly who got knocked up by a boring loser, and her brother-in-law offered her a trip away from the conservative Dagestan. She had to keep up the 'devout muslim' shtick in exchange for money, which helped her raise her kids, in addition to side jobs like working at a hair salon and shop-lifting everything that wasn't nailed down. Dkhozhar was about 80% the 'B' type. He was radicalized by his brother and the stuff he read on the Kavkaz website. Before he passes out from blood loss on that guy's boat, he found a pencil and wrote on the side: quote:I’m jealous of my brother who has received the reward of jannutul Firdaus heaven inshallah before me. I do not mourn because his soul is very much alive. God has a plan for each person. Mine was to hide in this boat and shed some light on our actions. I ask Allah to make me a shahied, to allow me to return to him and be among all the righteous people in the highest levels of heaven. Where [hole] was a bullet hole from the SWAT police (almost shooting each other, seriously its amazing that no one died there). Dzhokhar was pissed about that the US was doing in the Middle East, but also showed a lot of sorrow during the trial, because he had blown-up four innocent people. I say 80% because, although he was impressionable, he probably was in some way aware of the spook pond his brother swam in. Which is why, I think, the government was so horny to kill him, despite seeking lesser penalties for worse criminals, and Dzhokhar having the defense attorney's version of Micheal Jordan: quote:In fact, it was Judy Clarke who had saved Kaczynski, and many others, from being sentenced to death. She had a perfect record in death penalty cases. She had helped convince juries to spare the lives of some of the sickest individuals on the planet: Susan Smith, the mother who strapped her two small boys into car seats and then drove them into a lake and watched them drown so that her lover, who didn’t want kids, wouldn’t break up with her; Eric Rudolph, the unapologetic racist and Christian zealot who set off a bomb in Atlanta during the 1996 Summer Olympics, an attack that killed 2 people and injured 150 more; and Jared Lee Loughner, who opened fire in a parking lot near Tucson, Arizona, in 2011, shooting Representative Gabrielle Giffords through the head and killing six others. Even Zacharias Moussaoui, the Al Qaeda operative accused of helping to plan the 9/11 attacks was alive only because of the ferocious defense he had received from Clarke. Over and over again the media pundits and death penalty experts declared that it would be unlikely that Dzhokhar—a teenager so cute, as the Jaharians (Dzhokhar developed an online fan club during the trial, calling themselves The Jaharians, after his nickname 'Jahar') liked to say, that he was put on the cover of Rolling Stone magazine looking like Jim Morrison, the lead singer of the Doors—would be sentenced to death with Clarke in his corner. Also there are the 'A -> B' types, like Tamerlan, who probably got radicalized partially because the government screwed him, and partially because he started to identify with his adopted role as a fake pious Muslim. Finally, the 'B -> A' types, like Morley, who was likely a somewhat mentally-ill radical whom they thought they could make use of. However, I think the distinction really doesn't matter. I glossed over about a dozen guys who were either plausibly accomplices or were likely aware of what was going on (including one guy who walked into the police station and confessed to knowing the bombers.) I feel like there must be a joke out there about some cops that go to infiltrate a communist meeting and eventually they all realize that they're all cops, and no communists are at the meeting at all. That's the feeling I got when reading about this mosque. Remember the article about a loser pizza delivery man who wanted to commit jihad but would have settled for a girlfriend? Chapo had a good take on it: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_UqxEpQ5BlU&t=1535s I think the nature of Modern Gladio, at least in the West (including Russia) is that spooks spend all their time chumming the waters. It attracts the 'A' types, who are hungry for money or fame or sex or whatever, and all the commotion attracts the 'B' types, who are usually people looking for an identity to identify with, and/or are pissed off about our vile government and their treatment of the Middle East (in the case of Muslims). This leads to a violent feeding frenzy, which normal people are rightly afraid of. This leads to actual terrorist violence, most of which some subset of spooks know about, usually because they just entrap them.(How often has the FBI given some Muslim idiot a fake bomb or told them to shoot up a 'draw Muhammad' convention?). If the law enforcement apparatus can stop it, wonderful, they call themselves heroes and demand more money and less oversight. If they can't (and importantly, they can reasonably claim they didn't know anything), some innocent people die and they proclaim that this never would have happened if only they just had more money and less oversight. I think with Tsarnaev, the feds didn't expect him to do anything because they knew everyone in that mosque was spying on everyone else. They just didn't count on Tsarnaev meeting Morley in the wild and becoming a terrorist odd couple. And they couldn't claim to not know anything, because Tamerlan was the most obvious informant in the world, so everyone who plausibly knows everything keeps their heads down or leaves to get a cushy job in the private sector. I don't know what to say about that, except to expect more of it in the future. Conditions are getting worse, neo-liberalism is getting more neo-liberal, politics are getting stupider, and police are getting a lot less popular. You're going to see more of this from Muslims, chud militias, and to a lesser extent Antifa and other leftist organizations, spooks gotta justify their existence somehow. What I'm saying is  is coming to a town near you! Run! Don't Walk! to be the first in your neighborhood to see it!
The Atomic Man-Boy has issued a correction as of 23:19 on Jul 7, 2021 |
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Jul 7, 2021 22:29
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So what is the actual extent of the Russian connection in the story and why would the FSB and the FBI be on the same side here beyond maybe some common methods?
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Jul 8, 2021 00:22
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Ardennes posted:So what is the actual extent of the Russian connection in the story All of the CIA connections around the family are all from organizations built around stirring up Muslims against the USSR (and to a lesser extent, the CCP) while we were "fighting Communism." While those nations are now capitalist, they don't subscribe to American centered capitalism. This actually proved convenient to the the same spook organizations that were fighting the cold war, since the same geo-political dynamics remained. The Jamestown Institute et. all could keep getting a budget to do the same stuff they were doing since the 80's. (Which is why we're in a newer, dumber "Cold war 2.0" with all the ideology shaved off.) Probably a lot of what the Tsarnaev family (and informants like him) was meant to do (and why he recorded his relatives) was to help the CIA understand how Islamic Insurgency is going in Chechnya, and support it when it suits their interest to do so. Ardennes posted:why would the FSB and the FBI be on the same side here beyond maybe some common methods? While Tamerlan is in Chechnya, Russian security services go to the forest compound where his English-speaking western Jihadis pals are living and Waco them. After that he leaves the country in a hurry. What isn't said in the book, but what is implied by events, is that Tamerlan either: accidentally leads them to the compound and he's scared they'll kill him next, or he rats on his fellow jihadi's to the FSB and skips town before the jihadis kill him for being a rat. That they just let him leave Moscow on a plane without a passport indicates the latter. The FSB might have warned the FBI of his movements so they wouldn't suspect that he was a snitch for them as well. Tamerlan may have been the omni-snitch that the prophecies foretold of. And they were open with American lawmakers because it embarrassed the hell out of the FBI. Russians be trolling like that. So they weren't really on the same side here... quote:There had long been tensions between the American FBI and the Russian FSB. FSB agents had been known to break into apartments of American agents and defecate on their pillows. gradenko_2000 posted:seriously though, thanks for the summary. Top-shelf work Thanks, I appreciate it. The Atomic Man-Boy has issued a correction as of 04:22 on Jul 8, 2021 |
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Jul 8, 2021 01:37
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Well knowing the Russian Federation, if he was allowed to get on a plane without a passport then an order given up on high but the question is why would they let what could be a useful asset go. Even if he was a snitch for the FSB and allowed them to roll a compound, I don't know if it would enough to get a ticket out of town. I guess he could have been a simply traded for another asset but I would say at least it is unclear.
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Jul 8, 2021 03:43
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Fleetwood posted:was is Dersh who brought his Harvard Crimson nephew on the Lolita Express? what happened to that guy? yes and when he came back to school after that trip he bragged about losing his virginity
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Jul 8, 2021 11:00
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https://twitter.com/PostOpinions/status/1412863878367690752?s=20WaPo posted:Simply put, there is no one with any real authority in position to run the country. Though the UN legally wants to foist all the blame on Nepalese peacekeepers, the spread of cholera from the base camp was contingent on MINUSTAH contractors completely failing to deal with waste management following any regulatory guidelines. The associated death toll is on the low end 10,000. And the "credible allegations of rape and sexual abuse", interestingly put in a separate sentence from the fathering of hundreds of children, is being a little downplayed here. https://theconversation.com/they-pu...-fathers-114854 The Conversation posted:Various media organisations have reported that minors were offered food and small amounts of cash to have sex with UN personnel, and MINUSTAH was linked to a sex ring that operated in Haiti with seeming impunity: allegedly, at least 134 Sri Lankan peacekeepers exploited nine children in a sex ring from 2004 to 2007. As a result of this story, reported by the Associated Press in 2017, MINUSTAH became a classic example of lack of appropriate response to allegations of sexual abuse. In the wake of this report, 114 peacekeepers were returned to Sri Lanka, but none were ever prosecuted or charged after repatriation. Like with the cholera, whenever any of these problems arise in the news, the ~United~ Nations suddenly decomposes itself and compartmentalizes blame onto specific races and countries like in the appended graph. UN leadership washes their hands of it, acting like the UN program itself was not the most integral component in producing any of this exploitation. 
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Jul 8, 2021 13:51
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nut posted:"Various media organisations have reported that minors were offered food and small amounts of cash to have sex with UN personnel" what a black hell these "peacekeeping zones" must be, how is this worse than some angry locals trying to figure out who should be in charge? and yeah, the country graph implications are disgusting lmao
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Jul 8, 2021 14:55
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So I don't know the first thing about haitian politics - does anyone have an explanation as to why the cia is fomenting a coup this time?
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Jul 8, 2021 16:24
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It's a question that was posed to me yesterday and unfortunately I don't have anything I feel is a particularly satisfying answer. It's my impression that they are protecting multinationals, of course, and ensuring that a US friendly government stays in power - which is a matter of course for the US globally but I think particular for Haiti they are trying to obviate a left bloc in the Caribbean. Conspiratorially, presuming the US has an active role in child and human trafficking (rather than a role in cover-up or protection solely), there could be (even) more nefarious motives.
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Jul 8, 2021 17:05
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Hooplah posted:So I don't know the first thing about haitian politics - does anyone have an explanation as to why the cia is fomenting a coup this time? The assassinated President was part of a center-right party and hated by the people. Fearing a shift to the left in the upcoming Parliament and Presidential elections, maybe?
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Jul 8, 2021 17:09
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DesertIslandHermit posted:The assassinated President was part of a center-right party and hated by the people. Fearing a shift to the left in the upcoming Parliament and Presidential elections, maybe? Doesn't track. We have every indication at this time that the assassination was carried out by GNB (fascists).
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Jul 8, 2021 17:14
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It could still be true if powers-that-be feared Moises going soft or being overthrown, if he was replaced by anyone not friendly to the US regime that would be an issue so they could be pre-empting something of that sort.
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Jul 8, 2021 17:15
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The Haiti episode of TrueAnon with Dr. Jemima Pierre from the Black Alliance for Peace predicted that Moise would have to be forcibly removed out of growing public cries for anti-imperialism that have been at an incredible boiling point since February this year, when Moise's presidential term ended and he refused to step down. The entire face of the UN peacekeeping mission was to produce something that could at least be sold through PR as legitimate with some kind of election ritual and even that has fallen apart under Moise. https://soundcloud.com/trueanonpod/haiti e: this is a complete IMO post as I too am totally unfamiliar with the political history of Haiti outside of this podcast and some articles on the Black Agenda Report
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Jul 8, 2021 17:19
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nut posted:The Haiti episode of TrueAnon with Dr. Jemima Pierre from the Black Alliance for Peace predicted that Moise would have to be forcibly removed out of growing public cries for anti-imperialism that have been at an incredible boiling point since February this year, when Moise's presidential term ended and he refused to step down. The entire face of the UN peacekeeping mission was to produce something that could at least be sold through PR as legitimate with some kind of election ritual and even that has fallen apart under Moise. the thing that kills me about trueanon is it is insightful and often does a good job of bringing in interesting POV like Dr. Pierre, im always blown away when it feels like they are not just being a funny podcast but also doing better journalism than actual journalists.
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Jul 8, 2021 17:23
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oh drat, i completely glossed over that trueanon ep. gonna have to check that out, thanks nut
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Jul 8, 2021 17:23
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Delta-Wye posted:the thing that kills me about trueanon is it is insightful and often does a good job of bringing in interesting POV like Dr. Pierre, im always blown away when it feels like they are not just being a funny podcast but also doing better journalism than actual journalists. the ep with Jodi dean has a similar tone of weird impressiveness
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Jul 8, 2021 17:27
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it is also possible it was internal politics, there is no indication that these assassins were so well funded the only culprit was some developed country.
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Jul 8, 2021 18:03
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probably just some rich fucks that got tired of getting squeezed e : keep in mind in a rich person's mind an added 0.0000001% tax is "getting squeezed"
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Jul 8, 2021 18:17
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Torpor posted:it is also possible it was internal politics, there is no indication that these assassins were so well funded the only culprit was some developed country. I mean maybe not but...  https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/worl...says/ar-AALU9iu
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Jul 8, 2021 19:04
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Perry Mason Jar posted:I mean maybe not but... im the most-clicked thumbs up emoji
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Jul 8, 2021 19:06
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I heard Jerry Edgar might get a Bosch spinoff but this is nuts!!
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Jul 8, 2021 19:07
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https://twitter.com/FBI/status/1408500354367508488?s=20 Couple of things about this incident: All of the circumstantial evidence pointed towards Al Qaeda being responsible for the bombings. The Saudi government never released the outcome of the trials for the men who were indicted, and disappeared them.
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Jul 8, 2021 19:07
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haitians have a nasty habit of popularly supporting turbulent priests who might not play ball with every one of washington's dictates, so it makes sense they want to ensure an outcome https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jean-Bertrand_Aristide (note: bill clinton was essentially supporting the bush coup)
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Jul 8, 2021 19:23
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https://twitter.com/josephfcox/status/1413164205000167429?s=19
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Jul 8, 2021 20:32
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Perry Mason Jar posted:I mean maybe not but... I heard early reports a couple of the gunmen were speaking spanish
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Jul 8, 2021 23:29
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Earliest reports said Spanish. Current reports are saying "a mix of English and Spanish speaking men"
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Jul 9, 2021 00:13
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whoa that msn article says 4 other suspects have been killed
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Jul 9, 2021 00:16
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I've been thinking about this a lot in relation to Northern Ireland specifically, and can someone describe the difference to me between "domestic Gladio" and "COINTELPRO". Wasn't COINTELPRO just the USA's domestic Gladio? Like when you dig deep into Gladio and the years of lead in Italy specifically there's a lot of non-state actors involved (e.g. propaganda due etc) but it seems like what a lot of gets called "domestic Gladio" is just state-directed terrorism along the lines of COINTELPRO. I can't really articulate what I'm trying to say here, but basically I want to know where the lines blur, if they do at all
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Jul 9, 2021 00:22
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I guess I'm thinking in terms of codenames rather than the actors actually involved: e.g. the FBI and the CIA may have had the same end goal but they certainly weren't working together to achieve it and in fact may have even been in competition with eachother. Does that sound right?
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Jul 9, 2021 01:06
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multistability posted:I guess I'm thinking in terms of codenames rather than the actors actually involved: e.g. the FBI and the CIA may have had the same end goal but they certainly weren't working together to achieve it and in fact may have even been in competition with eachother. Does that sound right? i def don't remember the details but TrueAnon pretty recently had a good podcast with a pair of authors who write about COINTELPRO and they went to some lengths trying to clarify it. The only things I remember are that COINTELPRO is, i think, only a passive surveillance program and isolated to specific groups vs. active counterinsurgency
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Jul 9, 2021 01:34
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nut posted:i def don't remember the details but TrueAnon pretty recently had a good podcast with a pair of authors who write about COINTELPRO and they went to some lengths trying to clarify it. The only things I remember are that COINTELPRO is, i think, only a passive surveillance program and isolated to specific groups vs. active counterinsurgency I don't doubt at all what you / they are saying but aren't COINTELPRO the fuckers who infiltrated the Black Panthers and made them so paranoid they all ended up killing eachother? Lol
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Jul 9, 2021 01:36
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multistability posted:I don't doubt at all what you / they are saying but aren't COINTELPRO the fuckers who infiltrated the Black Panthers and made them so paranoid they all ended up killing eachother? Lol like I said I dunno the details just what the guests kept trying to clarify about COINTELPRO, and specifically about the Black Panthers I found the ep for u https://soundcloud.com/trueanonpod/snitch-city
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Jul 9, 2021 01:43
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nut posted:like I said I dunno the details just what the guests kept trying to clarify about COINTELPRO, and specifically about the Black Panthers Ty brother 
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Jul 9, 2021 01:45
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multistability posted:Ty brother np tell us if u hear something good cuz I clearly don’t remember anything 🙏🏻
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Jul 9, 2021 02:10
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