|
Well, in addition to being voiced by a white guy, a lot of the jokes with Apu are about his ethnicity. Maybe not completely mean spirited, but often the fact that he’s different is the thing you’re supposed to laugh at. A lot of fans denied this and brought up that he’s actually one of the more fleshed out and respectable secondary characters on the show, but when you look at even their more well-intentioned attempts to humanize Apu, they still come off as condescending and something that wouldn’t fly today. I think ceasing use of him was the right choice rather than recasting him. I mean ignoring that the right choice would have been to end the show 20 years ago.
|
#
?
Jul 7, 2021 10:30
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 23, 2024 17:49 |
|
|
His clothes are different from my clothes! HAHAHA
|
|
#
?
Jul 7, 2021 13:28
|
|
|
Also it's more of an impression of this brownface Peter Sellers character than an actual attempt at any sort of Indian accent https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZFKJuzrCGj4
|
|
#
?
Jul 7, 2021 14:05
|
|
|
The problem with a poo
|
|
#
?
Jul 7, 2021 14:12
|
|
|
Talking Simpsons podcast had Shivam Bhatt for a couple of the Apu-centric episodes they did to give his perspective as an Indian American. It was pretty interesting, iirc Apu is based very heavily on 1970's Indian immigrant stereotypes. His view was that as a young kid it was at first nice to see someone who looked like him on mainstream media, and he had a similar take regarding Dhalsim in Street Fighter 2. As he grew older he saw more of the problems with the stereotypes of course, and he was able to provide a lot of cultural Indian immigrant background. Apu was not originally an Indian in the script, but Harry did the voice at an early table read and they all loved it so it stuck.
|
|
#
?
Jul 7, 2021 15:09
|
|
|
https://twitter.com/daveweigel/status/1412776839483961346
|
|
#
?
Jul 7, 2021 15:14
|
|
|
brugroffil posted:Talking Simpsons podcast had Shivam Bhatt for a couple of the Apu-centric episodes they did to give his perspective as an Indian American. It was pretty interesting, iirc Apu is based very heavily on 1970's Indian immigrant stereotypes. His view was that as a young kid it was at first nice to see someone who looked like him on mainstream media, and he had a similar take regarding Dhalsim in Street Fighter 2. As he grew older he saw more of the problems with the stereotypes of course, and he was able to provide a lot of cultural Indian immigrant background. A few Indian actors also talked about how they had to adopt the Apu accent, because that's what people in Hollywood wanted when they hired an Indian.
|
|
#
?
Jul 7, 2021 17:23
|
|
|
I watched the Loki thing It's actually only like 2 minutes and then a bunch of slides over the credits of Simpsons characters as Marvel characters. Basically Loki is banished by Odin to Springfield, lands in the Simpsons yard, throws Lisa into an Asgard dungeon at Bart's request where she finds Thors hammer and becomes Thor, then Lisa/Thor chucks Loki out of Springfield and it's revealed Loki has swapped places with Bart. At least it's only 2 minutes long. There's a mid-credits scene of Loki back on his TV show with the lady from his TV show but I think she's being voice by Tress McNeille instead of the actual lady.
|
|
#
?
Jul 7, 2021 17:32
|
|
|
Cemetry Gator posted:A few Indian actors also talked about how they had to adopt the Apu accent, because that's what people in Hollywood wanted when they hired an Indian. Sakina Jaffrey named that "patanking"
|
|
#
?
Jul 7, 2021 18:00
|
|
|
An audience member just now having the moment of clarity, and realizing -this- is what they've dedicated their life to, and realizes their brain is turning to dust. They get a mild chuckle as they are reminded of the movies, and a really "good" joke the Simpsons just made about it in at least 27 of the 100 references. Able to let out a sigh of relief as their dust filled head shuts their body down.
|
|
#
?
Jul 7, 2021 18:44
|
|
|
Thinking about Leopold and how both his appearances were the same fakeout gag.
|
|
#
?
Jul 8, 2021 00:09
|
|
|
Cemetry Gator posted:A few Indian actors also talked about how they had to adopt the Apu accent, because that's what people in Hollywood wanted when they hired an Indian. Harold And Kumar Go To White Castle directly addresses the Apu problem, and that was 17 years ago. That makes sense though considering the whole film is a deconstruction of racial tropes in-between all the stoner stuff (and a couple iffy gay jokes)
|
|
#
?
Jul 8, 2021 00:23
|
|
|
super sweet best pal posted:Thinking about Leopold and how both his appearances were the same fakeout gag. I liked how in the first episode guide, there's a little character profile for him and one of the entries is "KNOWN FOR: Introducing people".
|
|
#
?
Jul 8, 2021 01:04
|
|
|
Yeah Carl, Apu, Hibbert etc should have just been retired. They are great and funny characters and re-casting voice actors just to appease people 20 years too late just sucks extremely hard and makes it even more pronounced. But as others said, it was like 1990, and the show should have ended 20 years ago regardless.
|
|
#
?
Jul 8, 2021 02:04
|
|
|
The show joked about an old has been comedian using ancient racist stereotype jokes more than two decades ago. That's what made some of them doubling down and then that tone deaf response episode so dumb.
|
|
#
?
Jul 8, 2021 02:06
|
|
|
AHH F/UGH posted:Yeah Carl, Apu, Hibbert etc should have just been retired. They are great and funny characters and re-casting voice actors just to appease people 20 years too late just sucks extremely hard and makes it even more pronounced. But as others said, it was like 1990, and the show should have ended 20 years ago regardless. The problem is exactly this, character that were okay 20 years ago are not okay today. This show has outlived its time. But another thing worth noting is that the best Apu jokes were stuff like him ranting at Skinner for his asinine rehash of Jurassic Park, or Apu constantly getting shot protecting his store. Stuff that had nothing to do with him being Indian. Somewhere along the line, the writers got lazy.
|
|
#
?
Jul 8, 2021 02:14
|
|
|
I would argue (ill-advisedly, since this is a) wading back into the long-dead Apu debate and b) not my lane) that a lot of what made Apu such a beloved character even to people who would call themselves non- or anti-racists was that he was constantly skewering racist/xenophobic tropes by being a "better American" than people like Homer. Witness the "flag that disappeared from the library last fall" scene. Or "slavery it is, sir". Or the bit where he's wearing the Mets uniform and putting on a thick American accent (which is a neat voice-acting trick in its own right). Just the fact that he could lambast Marge for her banana bread ("what the hell were you thinking?"), demonstrating complete mastery of the local social mores, even though he's got that accent, was kind of the whole joke. A lot of the stuff he did (asking if the track could bend, getting indignant over Lovejoy calling him "miscellaneous", singing the who needs the kwik-e-mart song) would have been okay jokes if he weren't a racist stereotype, but the fact that he was one and yet he was running rings around his neighbors put them all on the next level. What I'm saying is it was never a punching-down joke, it was more a way of mocking all the other Springfieldians by showing how much better than them a guy from way out of town is. None of that is to say Apu should have stayed or didn't outlive his time. And even a positive stereotype is hurtful. But it is to say that the writers knew what they were doing and were very careful about it, doing the best they could to keep him alive even as they could see the writing on the wall, even many years in advance, for when it just wouldn't be cool anymore to keep up the life-support for the throwback joke Shearer handed them to work with. Data Graham fucked around with this message at 03:10 on Jul 8, 2021 |
|
#
?
Jul 8, 2021 03:02
|
|
|
Apu also had dumb lazy visual things like Mughal architecture everywhere in his home instead of just living in an ordinary home. Because he’s Indian, you see. The problem is this: sweet geek swag posted:Somewhere along the line, the writers got lazy.
|
|
#
?
Jul 8, 2021 03:08
|
|
|
has anyone read this Simpsons book? The Simpsons: An Uncensored, Unauthorized History https://www.amazon.com/Simpsons-Uncensored-Unauthorized-History/dp/0865479887
|
|
#
?
Jul 8, 2021 03:17
|
|
|
Data Graham posted:I would argue (ill-advisedly, since this is a) wading back into the long-dead Apu debate and b) not my lane) that a lot of what made Apu such a beloved character even to people who would call themselves non- or anti-racists was that he was constantly skewering racist/xenophobic tropes by being a "better American" than people like Homer. Witness the "flag that disappeared from the library last fall" scene. Or "slavery it is, sir". Or the bit where he's wearing the Mets uniform and putting on a thick American accent (which is a neat voice-acting trick in its own right). He was also a shifty guy who knowingly sold expired and overpriced food.
|
|
#
?
Jul 8, 2021 03:29
|
|
|
I'd like to congratulate Rick and Morty on topping their fresh take "What if the avengers were sellouts" with the next level idea of "What if the planeteers were sellouts." Truly there are no limits to sci fi parody.
|
|
#
?
Jul 8, 2021 03:33
|
|
|
AHH F/UGH posted:Yeah Carl, Apu, Hibbert etc should have just been retired. They are great and funny characters and re-casting voice actors just to appease people 20 years too late just sucks extremely hard and makes it even more pronounced. But as others said, it was like 1990, and the show should have ended 20 years ago regardless. They recast Carl? I thought his very faint 'accent' was supposed to be from Iceland?
|
|
#
?
Jul 8, 2021 04:32
|
|
|
Most of the funniest things about Apu had nothing to do with him being Indian or having an accent but instead were about how he was corrupted by the lovely Americans around him, and also “so, I don’t know, you might want to wear a hat”.
|
|
#
?
Jul 8, 2021 04:35
|
|
|
Arbite posted:They recast Carl? I thought his very faint 'accent' was supposed to be from Iceland? They've recast or are in the process of recasting every POC character voiced by a white person with a voice actor of the appropriate race. I haven't heard Nu-Carl yet but he's supposed to be spot on, based on reactions posted here. Dr. Hibbert's new voice actor is a really talented voice actor (Principal Lewis on American Dad, has already done a bunch of voices on newer Simpsons), but he is miscast as Hibbert, based on impressions in this thread.
|
|
#
?
Jul 8, 2021 04:47
|
|
|
you broke my grill posted:has anyone read this Simpsons book? The Simpsons: An Uncensored, Unauthorized History Yep IIRC it's pretty good. Mostly a series of quotes with a little context filled in by the author. Author takes a hard stance about the golden 9 season run and he seems to really hate Matt Groening. It goes into the early writers room and Sam Simon's influence, looks at the big name writers and show runners and analyses why it all worked so well for 9 years through behind the scenes drama. Big interesting things are: James L Brooks going from artist focused to business focused. How they got in with Fox. The involvement of Sam Simon and his departure following a conflict with Groening. Conan O'Brien leaving and how they find new talent. The show's writers all being Harvard nerds and how hard it was for people of colour or women to fit in with them. How the show itself dealed with diversity. And some ideas as to why everything has sucked since series 9 and who is to blame.
|
|
#
?
Jul 8, 2021 06:29
|
|
|
I've probably said it before but Much Apu About Nothing is one of my favourite episodes for reasons already discussed. It's not a particularly pleasant episode, but it's unpleasant for a good reason. Definitely an outdated stereotype on a white male-led show in 2021 though.You Are A Elf posted:Apu also had dumb lazy visual things like Mughal architecture everywhere in his home instead of just living in an ordinary home. Because he’s Indian, you see. I do quite like how he has Concert Against Bangladesh in his record collection, that's a joke that's probably more clever than they intended.
|
|
#
?
Jul 8, 2021 07:37
|
|
|
LIVE AMMO COSPLAY posted:I'd like to congratulate Rick and Morty on topping their fresh take "What if the avengers were sellouts" with the next level idea of "What if the planeteers were sellouts." And you are bringing it up in this thread because...?
|
|
#
?
Jul 8, 2021 07:48
|
|
|
SirSamVimes posted:And you are bringing it up in this thread because...? The same reason other cartoons come up in this thread from time to time?
|
|
#
?
Jul 8, 2021 07:51
|
|
|
you broke my grill posted:has anyone read this Simpsons book? The Simpsons: An Uncensored, Unauthorized History I'm a sucker for an oral history, so I enjoyed it but as stated upthread the writer definitely frames a lot of things in a certain way, so be ready for that.
|
|
#
?
Jul 8, 2021 15:12
|
|
|
The episode where Lisa tap dances has that scene where you see little black lines emanating from their shoes when the kids are first learning to tap dance as if it were a comic strip that didn’t have sound I hate that!!!
|
|
#
?
Jul 9, 2021 13:33
|
|
|
Plant MONSTER. posted:The episode where Lisa tap dances has that scene where you see little black lines emanating from their shoes when the kids are first learning to tap dance as if it were a comic strip that didn’t have sound tappatappaTAPPA! ....Great, now that's going to be stuck in my head all day....
|
|
#
?
Jul 9, 2021 22:06
|
|
|
Plant MONSTER. posted:The episode where Lisa tap dances has that scene where you see little black lines emanating from their shoes when the kids are first learning to tap dance as if it were a comic strip that didn’t have sound Maybe those lines were the hearing impaired. There's probably a percentage that still accidentally watch the Simpsons, because they haven't looked at the tv for a bit, and didn't realize it was on.
|
|
#
?
Jul 9, 2021 23:15
|
|
|
They only appeared on some frames though and weren't properly animated, they're weirdly static.Space Cadet Omoly posted:tappatappaTAPPA! It's in mine too. Ugh. Both Lisa's sarcastic delivery of it and the many times Tress MacNeille says it in the episode. I don't like it! Also I swear the scene where the teacher hisses at Lisa, the sound isn't synced up properly
|
|
#
?
Jul 10, 2021 02:20
|
|
|
 This is the only good part of that episode.
|
|
#
?
Jul 10, 2021 04:04
|
|
|
Do we see Apu's home before he gets married? While it's still an excuse, would make sense if most of the Mughal stuff is Manjula's, whose family probably brought it over with her since she's moving to America for the first time and would probably be a lot more comfortable with familiar stuff at home.
|
|
#
?
Jul 10, 2021 04:38
|
|
|
Ghost Leviathan posted:Do we see Apu's home before he gets married? While it's still an excuse, would make sense if most of the Mughal stuff is Manjula's, whose family probably brought it over with her since she's moving to America for the first time and would probably be a lot more comfortable with familiar stuff at home. like the doorframes????
|
|
#
?
Jul 10, 2021 05:24
|
|
|
i thought he lived in the kwik e mart
|
|
#
?
Jul 10, 2021 05:25
|
|
|
Ghost Leviathan posted:Do we see Apu's home before he gets married? While it's still an excuse, would make sense if most of the Mughal stuff is Manjula's, whose family probably brought it over with her since she's moving to America for the first time and would probably be a lot more comfortable with familiar stuff at home. We saw him washing his car(A 1979 Pontiac Firebird) in the driveway of a standard suburban house in 'Two Bad Neighbours'
|
|
#
?
Jul 10, 2021 07:01
|
|
|
The Awesomesaurus posted:
An accurate statement. Some of the worst Simpsons episodes still have at least one scene that makes a truly amazing gif.
|
|
#
?
Jul 10, 2021 08:54
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 23, 2024 17:49 |
|
|
IIRC that episode isn't terrible. It also has another joke I'm fond of: "You just have to turn that frown upside down! .... That's a smile, not an upside down frown! Work on that too!"
|
|
#
?
Jul 10, 2021 18:33
|
|