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shame on an IGA posted:haha did you already have that redtext or did your post already cause someone I've had it for ages from, you guessed it, having had this exact conversation. Two years now at least. At the time I was having this argument in D&D, totally unaware that Jose was handing out probes over here in C-SPAM for pro-Malthus positions. Very funny The red text is more explicitly about the "feminism and healthcare" (or "family planning") of the BMGF in Africa, MENA, and Southwest Asia where they were busying themselves sterilizing the local populations. Whoever bought it was careful to use that phrasing over population control which was the correct phrase but unfortunately (for them) also has the (correct) negative association. To be clear we should refer to it as population control as its proponents are very keen on limiting these programs to "undesirable" populations - see Bill Gates' quote on the population of Yemen, e.g.
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Jul 13, 2021 16:41
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of misunderstanding in the last 15 minutes
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Perry Mason Jar posted:I've had it for ages from, you guessed it, having had this exact conversation. Two years now at least. At the time I was having this argument in D&D, totally unaware that Jose was handing out probes over here in C-SPAM for pro-Malthus positions. Very funny jose has never been a mod of cspam
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Jul 13, 2021 17:37
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That's how I remember it king. That's not on me, that's not my fault
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Jul 13, 2021 17:49
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Surely there has to be another solution to "at current levels of resource use we can only sustain this level of agricultural production for a few more decades at most" besides trying to kill as many brown people as possible and prevent them from reproducing further like stopping the thing where we massively overproduce food and throw a quarter of it in the garbage, or using less fossil fuel generally, or trying not to convert all the earth's biomass into cows, etc but I guess that's not the system we live in
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Jul 13, 2021 18:00
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the bitcoin of weed posted:like stopping the thing where we massively overproduce food and throw a quarter of it in the garbage, or using less fossil fuel generally, or trying not to convert all the earth's biomass into cows, etc but I guess that's not the system we live in Those things would all mildly inconvenience some trillionaire, so no.
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Jul 13, 2021 18:23
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NYC has been hell this summer, there’s supposed to be a month of this, tops, in august
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Jul 13, 2021 18:28
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the bitcoin of weed posted:Surely there has to be another solution to "at current levels of resource use we can only sustain this level of agricultural production for a few more decades at most" besides trying to kill as many brown people as possible and prevent them from reproducing further I mean yeah. The basics of 'we don't have limitless resources' and 'don't relay on science to magic up more', is all pretty solid, it's just everything after that where it gets really iffy. The world has well enough food for the population at the moment and there are plenty of people around the world not getting nearly enough. Proper resource distribution and looking at ways to limit excessive resource use and should be fundamental to any plan on how to tackle issues around upcomming climate change related food/water issues.
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Jul 13, 2021 18:45
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Perry Mason Jar posted:I've had it for ages from, you guessed it, having had this exact conversation. Two years now at least. At the time I was having this argument in D&D, totally unaware that Jose was handing out probes over here in C-SPAM for pro-Malthus positions. Very funny If it's any consolation, I found your perspective valuable. Reading the OP I felt, yes, obviously contraception and reproductive rights are part of the solution. But your framing is even stronger. In the US access to these rights is largely moderated by money. Solve the money problem and the access problem disappears. I would feel comfortable saying that if you can bring economic justice to areas which presently lack women's rights, they will follow not long after the money. This is the actual solution to the malthusian dilemma. But we're just going to kill the global poor, and then ourselves, because lol of course we are.
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Jul 13, 2021 19:11
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turd in my singlet posted:https://www.marxists.org/archive/marx/works/1844/df-jahrbucher/outlines.htm So, like a liberal, Engels rejects Malthusianism due to its implications offending him, and does not provide a scientific basis for how infinite growth on a finite planet is possible. Got it Nature cares not for class struggle, sadly
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Jul 13, 2021 19:15
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OK baizuo posted:So, like a liberal, Engels rejects Malthusianism due to its implications offending him, and does not provide a scientific basis for how infinite growth on a finite planet is possible. Got it Engels is not required to provide a scientific basis for how infinite growth is possible because he has already provided a scientific basis for how the "need" for infinite growth is obviated by a significantly more equitable and rational system. Therefore, having done away with an economic motivation for infinite growth, we can busy ourselves with the growth of population. And there, again, population does not grow infinitely (per se) and it is uncontroversially married to equality or its lack. TehSaurus posted:If it's any consolation, I found your perspective valuable. Reading the OP I felt, yes, obviously contraception and reproductive rights are part of the solution. But your framing is even stronger. In the US access to these rights is largely moderated by money. Solve the money problem and the access problem disappears. I would feel comfortable saying that if you can bring economic justice to areas which presently lack women's rights, they will follow not long after the money. Cheers, thanks. And you got it right. If a resource issue does exist for whatever reason you need to resolve the contradictions inherent to capitalism which themselves give rise to, or are otherwise most responsible for, issues of both resource distribution and population growth THEN you can start talking about rationing or lifestyle changes or whatever such thing.
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Jul 13, 2021 19:32
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Perry Mason Jar posted:Engels is not required to provide a scientific basis for how infinite growth is possible because he has already provided a scientific basis for how the "need" for infinite growth is obviated by a significantly more equitable and rational system. Therefore, having done away with an economic motivation for infinite growth, we can busy ourselves with the growth of population. And there, again, population does not grow infinitely (per se) and it is uncontroversially married to equality or its lack.
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Jul 13, 2021 19:44
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"Scenario panned out"? What are you talking about? The sarcasm is not missed on me but nothing of what you said changes the actual solution to overly-high birthrates. What difference does it make that communism hasn't been globally achieved? You will still fail to remediate the problem if you do not also (or just) make that society equitable (or more equitable, even). You can still overthrow capitalism today.* *as it happens this conversation is pretty loving moot but I like to engage for the intellectual stimulation plus they don't let me play Rocket League at work so this is what I've got going on here. So you can overthrow capitalism and it will cause birthrates to decline but it doesn't matter, we're all super dead anyway, and resource allocation and birthrates don't actually matter for the same reason
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Jul 13, 2021 19:55
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The scenario being communism's inevitable triumph, and the creation of material conditions that would absolve Engels of having to scientifically explain how infinite growth is possible on a finite world. Oops turns out capitalism is just going to wreck the planet first, that circumstance and the failure of Marx and Engels to predict it is their greatest shortcoming. Can't really blame them with the level of tech at the time they lived, tho. I'm mostly just frustrated and shouting into the dark honestly
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Jul 13, 2021 20:14
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No I do understand what you meant, to be clear. I'm just saying that communism's triumph (which to Marx and Engels was inevitable mind you (absolutely not their fault that they didn't account for fascist victory which leads to barbarism OR for the planet to just die altogether from run-of-the-mill capitalist-barbarism)) or lack thereof is really immaterial. You can still create a communist state today and achieve the same within those borders. Listen king you go right on shouting. I support you. I understand the frustration. If it stresses you out too much though please I beg you to figure that out  It's still possible
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Jul 13, 2021 20:26
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How bout this weather
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Jul 13, 2021 21:08
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it's loving hot
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Jul 13, 2021 21:12
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ok how did that double post
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Jul 13, 2021 21:12
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Perry Mason Jar posted:Yeah I've spent way too much time indoors this year but between the insane mugginess, the near constant rains, and the unbearable heat it does seem the sensible thing. It's a shame really. Only upside here is if these TS keep making it all the way up here I can hit some totally sick swell way ahead of our usual surf season (October). It makes me sad because I used to hike like a solid 20+ miles every week over the summer, but it was tolerable because the hiking trails up here are pretty universally forested so they're not too bad in the heat. That goes right out the loving window when it's non-stop humidity, though. Hiking through a sticky, hot forest surrounded by mosquitoes just sucks and I might as well just walk on a treadmill instead.
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Jul 13, 2021 21:40
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gas up the chainsaws
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Jul 13, 2021 21:46
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I'm tired of the weather.
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Jul 13, 2021 21:51
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is that why the nws is actually hiring?
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Jul 13, 2021 21:54
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it would be really nice if the NWS actually had funding to make easy to read maps and make their data publicly available in a format that wasn't deliberately obfuscated because some rich sociopath tech billionaire wanted more people to be forced to download his lovely app
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Jul 13, 2021 23:14
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I just keep the 7 day forecast, hourly and the radar for my zip code open in my browser all the time and just hit refresh whenever I open the tab. Doesn't give you alerts but will give you everything that the apps scrape and is free.
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Jul 13, 2021 23:16
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VectorSigma posted:gas up the chainsaws that legend just looks like random letters
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Jul 13, 2021 23:18
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VectorSigma posted:gas up the chainsaws This a map for murlocs based on the legend
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Jul 13, 2021 23:19
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Shear Modulus posted:that legend just looks like random letters I'm glad it's only going to be MRGL tomorrow and not SLGT
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Jul 13, 2021 23:20
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Engels posted:...The implications of this line of thought are that since it is precisely the poor who are the surplus... Is he like three paragraphs deep in capital-brained hypotheticals/odd usage of "implication" here or was Engels a secret lib? This is the core confusion that always hosed up the conversation when it brushed against D&D so I was pretty surprised to see it in this context but I have never actually read any Engels so I dunno.
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Jul 13, 2021 23:20
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VectorSigma posted:gas up the chainsaws Broyles. The kiss of death.
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Jul 13, 2021 23:26
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Jul 13, 2021 23:36
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I had to look it up, its: TSTM: General Thunderstorm Area MRGL: Marginal chance SLGT: Slight chance ENH: Enhanced chance MDT: Moderate chance HIGH: High chance https://www.spc.noaa.gov/misc/SPC_probotlk_info.html
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Jul 13, 2021 23:40
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i feel like i've explained categorical risk and the accompanying probabilistic forecast enough times in these weather threads to just let people google from now on i look forward to future SPC products needing a categorical risk in excess of HIGH, though
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Jul 13, 2021 23:54
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That guy looks like he loves his job and thats awesome
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Jul 13, 2021 23:54
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VectorSigma posted:i feel like i've explained categorical risk and the accompanying probabilistic forecast enough times in these weather threads to just let people google from now on DEATH
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Jul 13, 2021 23:57
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VectorSigma posted:gas up the chainsaws Upstate ny just had some tornado like action yikes, Dresden near the fingerlakes Harry Potter on Ice has issued a correction as of 02:36 on Jul 14, 2021 |
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Jul 14, 2021 02:25
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Jul 14, 2021 02:31
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Harry Potter on Ice posted:Upstate ny just had some tornado like action yikes, Dresden near the fingerlakes Active tornado warning for Tioga co. now I got a bunch of family scattered across wayne co, they got slammed hard by that line that's over Oswego now
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Jul 14, 2021 02:40
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VectorSigma posted:is that why the nws is actually hiring? The weather never ends. Stereotype posted:it would be really nice if the NWS actually had funding to make easy to read maps and make their data publicly available in a format that wasn't deliberately obfuscated because some rich sociopath tech billionaire wanted more people to be forced to download his lovely app Rich sociopaths aside, practically all the data is readily available. You can PM me if you're looking for something specific. The maps historically looked like poo poo because it was weather nerds making maps for weather nerds, not your grandma on Facebook. There's been a lot more emphasis the last few years on making maps and graphics that grandma can understand. That hasn't caught on everywhere, like SPC for example. There poo poo hasn't changed hardly in decades. They and WPC bought out poo poo like this... https://twitter.com/NWSWPC/status/1415077328707670019?s=20
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Jul 14, 2021 02:57
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https://twitter.com/dbrauer/status/1415129142274760705
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Jul 14, 2021 03:03
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shame on an IGA posted:Active tornado warning for Tioga co. now First one since the 70s 
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Jul 14, 2021 03:08
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Harry Potter on Ice posted:First one since the 70s Oh see this has happened before so it's fine.
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Jul 14, 2021 03:13
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