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Edgar Allen Ho posted:poo poo like gamergate helped propel it, especially among younger people, but the state of the US right today goes back way further. Dudes like Romney, Liz Cheney, and the Bush clan act like they're ashamed but the inmates are running the asylum directly because of right-wing political strategy that started long before. Gamergate hardly propelled anything, it consisted of 5,000-10,000 supporters at it's peak, and half of them weren't even american, and most identified as leftist or liberal. Sean Hannity has been speaking to 3-5 million people 5 days a week for the past 15 years. Even stormfront's registered userbase dwarfs gamergate's most optimistic numbers. It was inevitable that white nationalists would creep onto every other new social media site that became popular. The Tea Party movement alone was a million times more influential on the state of modern conservatism, and it's amazing how many people have forgotten all the insane rallies and the record number of seats the GOP picked up in 2010.
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Aug 15, 2021 05:05
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OgNar posted:To round all the Mike Lindell poo poo up The best part of it all was the person who supplied the stolen election information to this very public freakout was none other than Dennis L. Montgomery. A professional con man. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dennis_L._Montgomery His own lawyer called him a con man. I honestly believe Lindell is using again, on top of some massive mental illness.
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Aug 15, 2021 06:22
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Zeroisanumber posted:Like, tbf the German rockets really would have been war-winning wonder weapons if they'd been deployed in 1940. But they weren't. They were developed at a time when they were basically weapons of spite. I don't think they would have been. Even in 1940 the costs in both money and materiel would have been prohibitive then.
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Aug 15, 2021 11:28
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DarkCrawler posted:I don't think they would have been. Even in 1940 the costs in both money and materiel would have been prohibitive then. And they were also super inaccurate and some would even blow up at launch.
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Aug 15, 2021 12:36
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DarkCrawler posted:I don't think they would have been. Even in 1940 the costs in both money and materiel would have been prohibitive then. Literally every myth of German superiority from WW2 was completely fabricated. Everything from the rockets to their uniforms, to their meth'd to the gills generals constantly trying to stay one step ahead of their rivals to avoid losing power. That fact that Nazi Germany actually achieved anything with the sheer amount of incompetence, waste, and personnel mismanagement is a testament to institutional inertia more then anything. The famous Tiger Tanks were so over engineered and insanely hard to repair the fact there were any effective German armored divisions was practically a miracle.
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Aug 15, 2021 13:03
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pentyne posted:Literally every myth of German superiority from WW2 was completely fabricated. But they were great at naming things and looking cool, and that is pretty much all you need to be remembered as a badass fighting force by most.
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Aug 15, 2021 13:44
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Zeroisanumber posted:Like, tbf the German rockets really would have been war-winning wonder weapons if they'd been deployed in 1940. But they weren't. They were developed at a time when they were basically weapons of spite. Not a chance. The V1 was interceptable by aircraft and the V2 while certainly terrifying couldn't do anywhere near enough damage to make a difference. Unless you're picturing millions of missiles just popping up out of nowhere magically.
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Aug 15, 2021 14:14
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Gamergate got a bunch of already shifty white boys involved in politics that would have been content to stay apolitical and at worst scream racial slurs during halo matches. Tea Party was for the Olds, gg brought in the young.
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Aug 15, 2021 16:41
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Hahahaha no seriously goons, if the Nazis had gotten the entire planned array of V3 rocket bunkers online and also had built and orbited the loving space station they had plans for they could have held out against the combined resources of like 60% of the earth’s landmasses 
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Aug 15, 2021 18:32
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I went on a bit of a V2 research kick after reading Gravity's Rainbow, and one of my favorite things about the operating manual (available in English, thanks Operation Paperclip!) is that it has to repeatedly warn the reader not to drink rocket fuel, with even a poem to make it memorable.
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Aug 15, 2021 18:55
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If the hollow earth project had been completed in time the Allies would never have been able to breach Aryan defenses
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Aug 15, 2021 18:56
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Ravenfood posted:Not a chance. The V1 was interceptable by aircraft and the V2 while certainly terrifying couldn't do anywhere near enough damage to make a difference. Unless you're picturing millions of missiles just popping up out of nowhere magically. I was thinking more of a larger program that had been properly developed and had a good number of V-2s deployed during the Battle of Britain. But everyone is right that anachronistic wankery over the Nazi war machine gets stupid fast.
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Aug 15, 2021 19:03
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After The War posted:I went on a bit of a V2 research kick after reading Gravity's Rainbow, and one of my favorite things about the operating manual (available in English, thanks Operation Paperclip!) is that it has to repeatedly warn the reader not to drink rocket fuel, with even a poem to make it memorable. Part of the problem with the ME-262 was that the fuel was ridiculously volatile and corrosive. A lot of people were burned by the corrosive fuel, but at least one pilot died when the fuel tank ruptured and flooded the cockpit with corrosive fuel and dissolved him like an antacid tablet.
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Aug 15, 2021 19:08
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Zeroisanumber posted:Part of the problem with the ME-262 was that the fuel was ridiculously volatile and corrosive. A lot of people were burned by the corrosive fuel, but at least one pilot died when the fuel tank ruptured and flooded the cockpit with corrosive fuel and dissolved him like an antacid tablet. The V-2/A4 was fueled with ethyl alcohol, so it makes a little more sense that they were afraid grunts would partake. The poem was something to the effect of "a soldier drank rocket fuel and went blind, and was so distraught he had some more to kill himself." Fun stuff!
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Aug 15, 2021 19:14
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The Red Army's occupation of Afghanistan was fueled by terrible booze distilled from MiG jet fuel. It's not uncommon. Also it will make you go blind.
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Aug 15, 2021 19:29
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DarkCrawler posted:I don't think they would have been. Even in 1940 the costs in both money and materiel would have been prohibitive then. The Germans also never figured out large scale mass production of war material, since Hitler (and the people he put in charge of various parts of the economy) basically refused to stop producing consumer goods in the way the US did, and with a much smaller industrial capacity to being with. As an example, from 1939-45, Germany built about 46,000 tanks of all types, whereas the US managed to produce somewhere around 80,000 in 1942-44. The same thing applied to aircraft. From 1939-45, Germany built about 18,000 bombers and 53,000 fighters of all types, whereas the US alone built around 100,000 fighters and about the same number of bombers from 1940-45, so even if various wonder weapons made it into production, they would have simply been overwhelmed by the fact that the Allies were producing a hell of a lot more of everything.
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Aug 15, 2021 19:53
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After The War posted:I went on a bit of a V2 research kick after reading Gravity's Rainbow, and one of my favorite things about the operating manual (available in English, thanks Operation Paperclip!) is that it has to repeatedly warn the reader not to drink rocket fuel, with even a poem to make it memorable. Everyone needs to be reminded not to do that though.
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Aug 15, 2021 20:11
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I mean it practically invites you to sample with its intoxicating aroma!
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Aug 15, 2021 20:15
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There were some very good posts on here maybe in the pyf historical facts thread that went into great detail on how the Nazi uniforms were insanely stupid and bad. Like, they demanded completely unnecessarily complex pocket structure for supposedly mass produced uniforms, they had details that were entirely useless because those features were overlayed by other uniform layers, and how some uniforms required the wearer to strip 90% naked to piss.
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Aug 15, 2021 20:27
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my two cents on the current WW2 tech chat, is stuff i learned from this video about massively giant heavy metal presses https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hpgK51w6uhk and i think its bullshit the US thinks its current 50 Kton presses are fine for our needs. gently caress you
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Aug 15, 2021 20:29
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Zeroisanumber posted:Part of the problem with the ME-262 was that the fuel was ridiculously volatile and corrosive. A lot of people were burned by the corrosive fuel, but at least one pilot died when the fuel tank ruptured and flooded the cockpit with corrosive fuel and dissolved him like an antacid tablet. I believe that was the 163, not the 262. The 163 was the rocket propelled one that only had a skid to land on and the pilot supposedly couldn't land until the rocket was out of fuel.
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Aug 15, 2021 20:37
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Pookah posted:There were some very good posts on here maybe in the pyf historical facts thread that went into great detail on how the Nazi uniforms were insanely stupid and bad. Like, they demanded completely unnecessarily complex pocket structure for supposedly mass produced uniforms, they had details that were entirely useless because those features were overlayed by other uniform layers, and how some uniforms required the wearer to strip 90% naked to piss. I'm glad someone else remembered that, was trying to find it and couldn't, thought maybe I'd made it up.
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Aug 15, 2021 20:42
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It was Cessna in the milhist thread originally. Nazi procurement and industry was hosed compared to the US or USSR, on almost every level. Even ignoring the RWM-adjacent faults specific to them being fascists, which was common, they lacked even basic competence in things like the assembly line. The allies were running tanks down the line Ford-style, the nazis were having a single crew build them from start to finish, bespoke crafting each panzer. Less efficient and it means when the thing breaks you can't just use any part, you need to know when and where it came from. A Sherman or a T-34, if any three break you can gut them and stuff the parts into one functional tank. Then comes the nazi poo poo, like resenting the idea of letting women replace the men drafted at the job, or using slave labour that encouraged poo poo tier jobs and active sabotage. This is drifting from the topic pretty far but it does illustrate really well the myth of the ultra-efficient survival of the fittest right propaganda vs the reality of what it leads to Edgar Allen Ho fucked around with this message at 20:57 on Aug 15, 2021 |
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Aug 15, 2021 20:48
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Taerkar posted:I believe that was the 163, not the 262. The 163 was the rocket propelled one that only had a skid to land on and the pilot supposedly couldn't land until the rocket was out of fuel. Primarily because the T-stoff (oxidizer, the thing that dissolved the test pilot) and the C-stoff (the fuel) were hypergolic, immediately igniting when mixed at room temperature. Also the fuels looked almost the same to the naked eye. So they had to make a complex testing system just to make sure they put the two fuels in the right tanks lest they explode right then and there. The 163 was an incredibly unsafe design even by rocket plane standards. The landing skid idea alone caused severe skull and spinal injuries if the pilot didn't do it right. Angry_Ed fucked around with this message at 20:50 on Aug 15, 2021 |
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Aug 15, 2021 20:48
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Pookah posted:There were some very good posts on here maybe in the pyf historical facts thread that went into great detail on how the Nazi uniforms were insanely stupid and bad. Like, they demanded completely unnecessarily complex pocket structure for supposedly mass produced uniforms, they had details that were entirely useless because those features were overlayed by other uniform layers, and how some uniforms required the wearer to strip 90% naked to piss. PlisskensEyePatch posted:I'm glad someone else remembered that, was trying to find it and couldn't, thought maybe I'd made it up. I'm sad y'all can't find that cus it sounds hilarious and I'd love to read more
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Aug 15, 2021 21:27
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Found it. Apologies for derail. Hot tip, sort by Cessna's username cuz he's got some incredible stuff prior to this post, including the Special Booties that Special Partroopers had to wear on their Special Paratrooper Boots so as not to dirty up the cargo planes they jumped from. https://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=3950461&pagenumber=104&perpage=40&userid=0#post513996717 PlisskensEyePatch fucked around with this message at 22:22 on Aug 15, 2021 |
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Aug 15, 2021 21:34
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I'll admit that the only thing I know about German WW2 tech was what I learned playing Axis & Allies. Which wasn't much since we didn't use those optional rules.
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Aug 15, 2021 21:40
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“Person who knows way too much about WWII” has become quite the negative stereotype in recent years. For….reasons….
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Aug 15, 2021 21:48
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PlisskensEyePatch posted:Found it. Apologies for derail. I read this when the discussion came up in another thread. Don't skip this, it's amazing history. In the same thread Cessna goes into detail about tanks and industrial manufacturing thereof and how fascism can't help but poo poo the bed in every aspect of life.
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Aug 15, 2021 21:57
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Everything I ever needed to know about the reality of the nazi war machine myth was laid out in a Lions Led by Donkeys episode from, poo poo, several years ago at this point. The host lays out that somewhere under 1600 Tigers were manufactured and fielded by the nazis during all of World War Two, and during the year 1942 just the state of Michigan was rolling 1200 Shermans per month off of their lines. There are plenty of other hilarious details to dig into, but just understanding this production disparity and that it extended to basically every activity required to support war-making gives a workable and comprehensive understanding of the issues.
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Aug 15, 2021 22:39
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Taerkar posted:I believe that was the 163, not the 262. The 163 was the rocket propelled one that only had a skid to land on and the pilot supposedly couldn't land until the rocket was out of fuel. Oh, you're right, the 262 used diesel. Although the 163 was even more famous for simply exploding when the engine was turned on.
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Aug 15, 2021 22:40
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Lemniscate Blue posted:I read this when the discussion came up in another thread. Don't skip this, it's amazing history. In the same thread Cessna goes into detail about tanks and industrial manufacturing thereof and how fascism can't help but poo poo the bed in every aspect of life. the problem with fascism is that it shits everyone's beds. it has all the power in the world to get bedshitters into positions of authority and then they go and do what they do
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Aug 15, 2021 23:00
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LonsomeSon posted:The host lays out that somewhere under 1600 Tigers were manufactured and fielded by the nazis during all of World War Two, and during the year 1942 just the state of Michigan was rolling 1200 Shermans per month off of their lines. Sounds like this dude I used to play Civ IV against. HOW DO YOU HAVE NEW TANKS EVERY TURN? HOW ARE THEY ALL PROMOTED TO BLITZ?!?
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Aug 15, 2021 23:59
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LonsomeSon posted:Everything I ever needed to know about the reality of the nazi war machine myth was laid out in a Lions Led by Donkeys episode from, poo poo, several years ago at this point. The host lays out that somewhere under 1600 Tigers were manufactured and fielded by the nazis during all of World War Two, and during the year 1942 just the state of Michigan was rolling 1200 Shermans per month off of their lines. John Parshal, one of the men behind the excellent "Shattered Sword" book on Midway did a presentation as part of a whole thing on Kursk talking about the overall inefficiency of the German tank production. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N6xLMUifbxQ&t=1581s Timestamp of 26:21 if it doesn't load properly.
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Aug 16, 2021 00:36
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Taerkar posted:John Parshal, one of the men behind the excellent "Shattered Sword" book on Midway did a presentation as part of a whole thing on Kursk talking about the overall inefficiency of the German tank production. Btw, "Shattered Sword" is the best book about a portion of the Pacific War that I've ever read.
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Aug 16, 2021 01:38
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Lawdog69 posted:Isn’t it more “was developed using” rather than “made from”? I think you got to the right conclusion in any case. I know that. The republican base doesn't. So, I keep saying "oh you don't trust science but you'll let THEM use stem cells on you?" It's less about "changing minds" and more about "loving with idiot traitors".
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Aug 16, 2021 20:47
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Zeroisanumber posted:Btw, "Shattered Sword" is the best book about a portion of the Pacific War that I've ever read. And also very economic and operations focused, for something about a specific battle in the middle of the Pacific. It's not that much a book about how leadership tactics and troop training/morale shape the tide of battle except in how those themselves are shaped by organizational culture, national economies, and past experiences that may or may not be presently applicable.
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Aug 16, 2021 21:32
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So Fox News was on this morning and they were talking to a senator from I think Wyoming about the Taliban taking the presidential palace today. Unsurprisingly the right wing talking points are what everyone knew they were going to be: namely, that all of this is Biden's fault, Biden is so awful for doing this, with zero mention of how Trump is the one who signed the peace treaty with the Taliban and started the troop withdrawal. The dude even said that this was "Biden's Vietnam," despite being a war that Biden neither started nor even made the decision to end.
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Aug 16, 2021 22:34
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Donnie signed the surrender papers, before which he ignored the conflict for 3 years.
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Aug 16, 2021 22:47
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When Trump made plans to pull out of Afghanistan it was still cool and good but when Biden executed those plans Afghanistan became hosed and awful. What’s the difference? Biden.
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Aug 16, 2021 22:47
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