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Why did mashmyre die so anticlimactically
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Aug 30, 2021 06:14
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Stairmaster posted:Why did mashmyre die so anticlimactically Because ZZ has a messy, rushed ending that betrays most of its themes?
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Aug 30, 2021 06:22
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Stairmaster posted:Why did mashmyre die so anticlimactically because of stupid adults
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Aug 30, 2021 13:21
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Stairmaster posted:Why did mashmyre die so anticlimactically It was honestly pretty hilarious/on brand how Mashymre, is, from his own perspective, having a heroic last stand where he flares up his newtype powers and goes out laughing while yelling Haman-sama's name... ...and no one else cares. Haman barely acknowledges his death and it functionally achieves nothing beyond being another blip contributing to the internal self-destruction of Neo Zeon.
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Aug 30, 2021 13:32
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Booted up Star Fox 64 for fun and of course you fight Zaku monkeys in Sector X, a red one that moves three times normal speed and you finish the stage by taking down a Monkey Gundam.
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Aug 30, 2021 16:33
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Arc Hammer posted:Booted up Star Fox 64 for fun and of course you fight Zaku monkeys in Sector X, a red one that moves three times normal speed and you finish the stage by taking down a Monkey Gundam. Yeah, actually watching the original Gundam is a bit of a Rosetta stone for a lot of Japanese pop culture stuff. So many shooters with a Char or black tristars, so many Newtype flash noises...
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Aug 30, 2021 20:39
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chiasaur11 posted:Yeah, actually watching the original Gundam is a bit of a Rosetta stone for a lot of Japanese pop culture stuff. Star Fox 64 is jam packed with references to films and tv that I never got as a kid. I always noticed the independence day level but then you've got Gundam and Mad Max levels and obvious Star Wars parallels. It's fun trying to pin down what the game is currently riffing on. I'll have to keep my eyes open on other shows riffing on Gundam ala Akira's bike drift. Arc Hammer fucked around with this message at 21:53 on Aug 30, 2021 |
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Aug 30, 2021 21:36
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My favorite bit of Japanese pop culture iconography is probably the Ashita no Joe shot of him with blue scale shadows over him. That one keeps showing up in Magical Girl anime for some reason…
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Aug 31, 2021 02:19
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Omnicrom posted:My favorite bit of Japanese pop culture iconography is probably the Ashita no Joe shot of him with blue scale shadows over him. That one keeps showing up in Magical Girl anime for some reason… It's one of the most famous endings ever, from an anime with a real murderer's row on the production side, so it makes sense it shows up pretty much everywhere. Finally read that manga last year. Didn't disappoint. For Gundam, one bit I noticed was how many little callbacks IBO had that I didn't catch when I'd "only" read the origin version. There's a lot of lines and shots playing off the original in fun ways, including Julieta and Mika's final conversation playing off Lalah and Amuro's.
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Aug 31, 2021 02:25
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One that I always like to see is whenever a Gundam strikes the Dirty Harry "do i feel lucky?" pose. 0079 started it and naturally the Unicorn does a Dirty Harry every time it shoots the beam magnum.
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Aug 31, 2021 02:33
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Arc Hammer posted:One that I always like to see is whenever a Gundam strikes the Dirty Harry "do i feel lucky?" pose. 0079 started it and naturally the Unicorn does a Dirty Harry every time it shoots the beam magnum. That's just a classic gun-duelling stance. It's got a much older and broader cultural presence than just Dirty Harry, and is still used today in several major marksmanship competitions (including the Olympics).
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Aug 31, 2021 02:41
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Darth Walrus posted:That's just a classic gun-duelling stance. It's got a much older and broader cultural presence than just Dirty Harry, and is still used today in several major marksmanship competitions (including the Olympics). Yes it has its basis in reality, but that particular framing of the barrel up to the slightly cocked head is 100% a callback to Dirty Harry's visual language.
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Aug 31, 2021 02:49
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Arc Hammer posted:Star Fox 64 is jam packed with references to films and tv that I never got as a kid. I always noticed the independence day level but then you've got Gundam and Mad Max levels and obvious Star Wars parallels. It's fun trying to pin down what the game is currently riffing on. For recent examples that come rapidly to mind, there's Granbelm, and a G Gundam reference scene in Pokemon Sun and Moon. There was also a background shot referencing Orga's famous "don't stop" pose in the background of Pop Team Epic. I'm sure there's more (Onizuka had a bit about the class genius having to spend a vacation around Gundam otaku) but those were the first ones I could think of in the last five years.
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Aug 31, 2021 03:03
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Stairmaster posted:Why did mashmyre die so anticlimactically I feel like you could dig deep and find some resonance with the early marshmallow being a representative of the idealized neo zeon and the one who dies pitifully being the stark reality of the faction but I don't like the show or character enough to really toss it around in my head.
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Aug 31, 2021 04:11
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I mean that’s not very deep digging required it’s pretty blatant and ties very well into what ZZ is going for
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Aug 31, 2021 04:22
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Yeah, I feel like mashymere, Judea, and Haman are all pretty clear, but then I got to Chara and just could not wrap my brain around her. Glemy and Puru also kind of don't sit right in my mind either. Knowing glemy was supposed to be char I think is throwing me off, cause his thematic importance makes zero sense if he was a char
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Aug 31, 2021 04:31
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Gaius Marius posted:Yeah, I feel like mashymere, Judea, and Haman are all pretty clear, but then I got to Chara and just could not wrap my brain around her. Glemy and Puru also kind of don't sit right in my mind either. Knowing glemy was supposed to be char I think is throwing me off, cause his thematic importance makes zero sense if he was a char Yeah, Char's got a lot of flaws as a human being, but he's not a spoiled brat.
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Aug 31, 2021 04:33
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In rewatching Zeta while showing it to some friends, got to the bit where Kamille and Amuro fight side by side to protect the second shuttle launch to send more AEUG pilots back into space and one little interaction just destroyed me Amuro casually slices a Hizack's backpack off mid-flight, disabling it without killing the pilot. Kamille notices, thinking that maneuver is really impressive, so like a minute later he tries to do the same thing but misses and kills the pilot he was fighting. He's all annoyed thinking, "gently caress, I just stabbed that dude's cockpit, welp." Considering the genre, including other series in the same franchise, is full of ace pilots capable of disabling enemy mechs without killing their pilots that little moment was funny and humanizing in an understated way.
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Aug 31, 2021 05:16
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Xarbala posted:In rewatching Zeta while showing it to some friends, got to the bit where Kamille and Amuro fight side by side to protect the second shuttle launch to send more AEUG pilots back into space and one little interaction just destroyed me Yeah, it was one of the things brought up on the Mobile Suit Breakdown discussion of the episode, highlighting how Amuro was the one soldier who wasn't consumed by warfare in the episode's themes. He's not just "good", he's superhuman, transcendent, even capable of fighting without killing. Kamille, by contrast... isn't. Not yet, at least. And so his attempts to emulate Amuro just end in dark comedy. (Of course, later Kamille manages to succeed, saving Four... for a bit, letting this whole thing pay off, and making Amuro's faith in Kamille seem well founded.)
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Aug 31, 2021 05:32
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It also helps to be precise when a stray shot can set off a nuclear reactor.
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Aug 31, 2021 05:34
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Arc Hammer posted:It also helps to be precise when a stray shot can set off a nuclear reactor. Yeah, Amuro learned that the hard way. Amuro really learned a lot of things the hard way. But in the end, he managed to grow into a mostly healthy, well adjusted adult in a happy relationship with a nice girl who shared his interests. (Needless to say, the UC couldn't let that stand.)
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Aug 31, 2021 05:35
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I like to think Al had better life after having such a horrible experience during the war. Poor kid deserved better than that. Knowing UC he was probably at the Metis colony and got hosed by Zoltan. At least we know Kai got a good deal becoming a super spy in a white suit and Sayla lived happily ever after by ignoring her dipshit brother.
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Aug 31, 2021 05:42
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RevolverDivider posted:I mean that’s not very deep digging required it’s pretty blatant and ties very well into what ZZ is going for its undermined by him being gone for half the show also watching reconguista in g movie and why are there cheerleaders
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Aug 31, 2021 06:09
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Arc Hammer posted:It also helps to be precise when a stray shot can set off a nuclear reactor. That's always been maddeningly inconsistent. Most of the time we see pilots on both sides blasting and slashing with little concern for popping the adversary's power unit, though admittedly in space nobody cares. Then you have a moment like the start of ep 4 or 5 in Unicorn where everyone is very concerned about it in the city fight to set up the scene later where the Zaku Sniper pilot tries to pop his own power unit. Then nobody cares again and we go back to blasting away from distances where you can't really aim. Victory did something similar too if I remember right, somebody pops a power unit and Uso and company poo poo their pants looking at the mushroom cloud.
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Aug 31, 2021 06:11
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its also not an issue in turn-a gundam but thats mostly because everyone has a-team marksmanship in that show.
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Aug 31, 2021 06:13
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Arc Hammer posted:I like to think Al had better life after having such a horrible experience during the war. Poor kid deserved better than that. Knowing UC he was probably at the Metis colony and got hosed by Zoltan. Honestly it kind of surprises me that they haven't had an older Al show up in one of the various side story manga or games, but then War In The Pocket in general remains relatively untouched by other works outside of using its MS designs when compared to say 08th MS Team or Stardust Memories
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Aug 31, 2021 06:15
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Arc Hammer posted:I like to think Al had better life after having such a horrible experience during the war. Poor kid deserved better than that. Knowing UC he was probably at the Metis colony and got hosed by Zoltan. They probably got together, too, at least casually. They've got a decent amount of scenes showing that they stayed in touch. And it's unlikely Al got killed offscreen or something. The UC makes sure that people suffer, but killing named characters without a bit of a production about it isn't common, especially not outside of the Z, ZZ, CCA setup.
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Aug 31, 2021 06:19
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I just want the kid to be okay. Not growing up to be a mobile suit pilot or an AEUG fighter or a Karaba agent. Just a normal person who finds a way to be happy in an unhappy world. Even if it was just a brief cameo of AL as a 20 something it would be nice.
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Aug 31, 2021 06:31
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Arc Hammer posted:I just want the kid to be okay. Not growing up to be a mobile suit pilot or an AEUG fighter or a Karaba agent. Just a normal person who finds a way to be happy in an unhappy world. Even if it was just a brief cameo of AL as a 20 something it would be nice. I mean, I wouldn't mind if he got involved with one of Sayla's charities or something. Nothing fancy. Just taking the tragedies he saw when he was a kid and using it as fuel to prevent as much of that as he could going forward. Edit: As for age, Al's 28 as of Unicorn. chiasaur11 fucked around with this message at 08:19 on Aug 31, 2021 |
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Aug 31, 2021 08:09
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if i'm being realistic i'm pretty sure al was psychologically destroyed by watching someone close to him get murdered by someone else close to him in a situation basically engineered to make it as hard to talk to other people about as possible, immediately after already having an existential breakdown. that's the kind of trauma that maybe can be worked through eventually but chances are pretty low that his adult life "only" has some serious emotional scars from that. it's not something that i'm happy with because al definitely deserves better but i can't really see the rest of al's life playing out terribly well for him after what he went through (i mean the ending goes out of its way to demonstrate how the events of the series have emotionally isolated him from his peers), it's not like he was the most stable or well adjusted kid to begin with either. ultimately the core of the show was the war came into the life of this innocent child and completely ruined him despite almost everyone involved being a decent enough-good person ninjewtsu fucked around with this message at 09:02 on Aug 31, 2021 |
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Aug 31, 2021 08:58
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ninjewtsu posted:if i'm being realistic i'm pretty sure al was psychologically destroyed by watching someone close to him get murdered by someone else close to him in a situation basically engineered to make it as hard to talk to other people about as possible, immediately after already having an existential breakdown. that's the kind of trauma that maybe can be worked through eventually but chances are pretty low that his adult life "only" has some serious emotional scars from that. I mean, Amuro wound up a healthy and functional adult despite killing Lalah (and getting the Newtype experience piped directly into his brain at the same time for extra fun). I think Al can do alright. He's got a loving family, a social support network, and Dolores seemed to get what was going on with him to some extent, even if Al can't talk about the details. He'll carry that weight, sure. After something like the One Year War, it's going to be a very short list of people who don't have some major traumas haunting them. But the fact he's got people who care about him around gives him better odds than most.
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Aug 31, 2021 09:13
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Eh, I mean amuro had a few years on al which helps, and amuro almost certainly had some kind of postwar support group (in addition to like, every member of the white base) while al almost certainly never mentioned what happened to anyone until maybe breaking down in his mid-late teens at the earliest, is mostly what I think would gently caress al up really bad. Al has people around him to help but I can't imagine him talking to anyone about how when he was 11 he met a zeon spy and became best buds with him before watching him get killed by his next door neighbor/babysitter (? I don't have a better way to describe al's relationship with chris) who also happened to be a secret federation test pilot for a gundam. How does that conversation play out? How does al think that conversation would play out? And I mean bernie loving told him that if he told anyone about what was going on the police would have him executed. Like that wouldnt actually happen and eventually al would figure that out but the timeline on "al works through any of this in a remotely healthy way" just isn't something I can be optimistic about. I think adult al probably emotionally resembles reccoa a lot more than amuro
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Aug 31, 2021 09:37
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ninjewtsu posted:I think adult al probably emotionally resembles reccoa a lot more than amuro What the gently caress? Reccoa was a child soldier who had almost everyone she ever cared about die, and that's aside from possibly having been raped at some point. She had no support structure, and was addicted to the rush of combat, with no one even attempting to help her deal since people mostly didn't know her issues, and when they did, those issues were seen as a way to use her more effectively. Al was a regular kid who had a guy he knew for less than two weeks die in combat, and who might not have been able to talk about it in any detail because it involved, you know. Treason. Still, when he broke down sobbing in the school shot, Dolores ran off immediately to get a teacher to help him however she could. People recognized that Al had something bad happen and are doing what they can. Those are not remotely similar circumstances. (Also, Al went to the police already, and they just told him to go away since he'd cried wolf before. I don't think the fear of execution thing is that major a factor for him by the end.)
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Aug 31, 2021 09:54
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I more meant in the sense that reccoa's traumatic childhood left her as a technically functional adult that was mostly a thin facade over a person with incredibly deep emotional wounds that weren't really healing and led to some incredible mistakes in decisionmaking, and I think the end result of al could be similarly described. The comparison does not necessarily imply a direct equivalence of their trauma? They obviously went through very different things in very different circumstances and their trauma would probably be expressed very differently too. I'm not so sure "the only reason serious consequences were avoided was because no one believed me" is actually a healthier takeaway for a kid here. It's almost like the barrier of convincing someone that his story is factual would be a major barrier to al opening up to anyone, on top of how if they did believe him, you know. Like you said, he committed treason. Even if "execution" isn't a likely outcome al's fears of that conversation ending very badly wouldn't exactly be unfounded. Meanwhile amuro could probably pick the name of a white base crew member out of a hat and have a fairly healthy conversation with them about his war trauma, even if they might not fully understand the newtype stuff. ninjewtsu fucked around with this message at 10:32 on Aug 31, 2021 |
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Aug 31, 2021 10:12
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At the end of the day war in the pocket is the story of how the war entered a random kid's life and destroyed him specifically, for no benefit to anyone anywhere, with an ending that goes out of its way to both show how emotionally devastated the child is by the events and how they isolated him from everyone in his life. as depressing as it is i think any "al turns out just fine" reading is ultimately going to be at odds with what the story was about. "All this fun with bernie and playing soldier led to al being permanently damaged" is the tragedy. the ending is sad not because the kid cries but because of the implication of the depths to which the story changed al's life for the worse. war in the pocket is a depressing show.
ninjewtsu fucked around with this message at 11:21 on Aug 31, 2021 |
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Aug 31, 2021 11:03
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Arc Hammer posted:Booted up Star Fox 64 for fun and of course you fight Zaku monkeys in Sector X, a red one that moves three times normal speed and you finish the stage by taking down a Monkey Gundam. I'm more surprised nobody brings up the Doms in Space Harrier.
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Aug 31, 2021 11:11
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Neddy Seagoon posted:I'm more surprised nobody brings up the Doms in Space Harrier. The head looks more like a flipper Zaku, really. The rest is more like a Dom, though. Cybattler has a pretty blatant bit with the recurring red enemy ace to contrast with the green mook mechs, if anyone else played through that one. It even gave you a beam sword for your mech.
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Aug 31, 2021 11:29
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chiasaur11 posted:The head looks more like a flipper Zaku, really. The rest is more like a Dom, though. They even do Jet-Stream Attacks at the player.
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Aug 31, 2021 11:34
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At least Al had enough smile in him to take a happy new years photo that ends up in the ED sequence.
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Aug 31, 2021 13:07
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Arc Hammer posted:At least Al had enough smile in him to take a happy new years photo that ends up in the ED sequence. And, again, his teacher is helping him at the end, and he's at least able to openly cry. Assuming that, because the show is a tragedy it can only mean an eleven year old is traumatized forever is a pretty weird view.
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Aug 31, 2021 19:23
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