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Sunsetting was game-ruining dogshit and the game is good again specifically because it’s gone
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Sep 2, 2021 18:17
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How does somebody who buys every season and expansion but choose to use a few guns a problem? They have to grind for what reason? They're playing and spending money? I don't see what the goal other than to make sure you burn out everybody that likes your game.
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Sep 2, 2021 18:19
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Mesadoram posted:I feel like they nerfed heavy drop rate. Might just be confirmation bias... I thought they straight up said they reduced it (again) Which you're not the only one describing it being an issue, it really is anemic (again)
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Sep 2, 2021 18:20
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Mazerunner posted:hitting the problem guns with targeted nerfs would've been fine They did do this, to solve the problem of "some guns are too good". Pay old friend Mountaintop or Recluse a visit and look at how weak they are! Mazerunner posted:throwing everything out This was the point of sunsetting. Fill up that vault again, Guardian! Gay Rat Wedding posted:Sunsetting was game-ruining dogshit and the game is good again specifically because it’s gone It will be back under a new name with new mechanics in another 3-ish years. Their game depends on a periodic deep cleansing of our loot
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Sep 2, 2021 18:22
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Isn’t there a Twitter account, or other webpage or something that says what the legend lost sector is and what a recommended loadout is? I swear I saw it once but I can’t find it.
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Sep 2, 2021 18:28
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Mazerunner posted:cause they're not sitting on one specific gun, they're still farming out the new fotm Yeah it's this, you had Spare Rations/Mindbender's Ambition for the longest time and they got sunset so people started using Dire Promise/Felwinter's Lie and theoretically The Problem Of Quickdraw + Shot Package would've been solved via Sunsetting the next year but they reversed course so they had to nerf/remove Quickdraw itself which took Astral Horizon out of the picture too. The 150 nerf pushed people to 120s (True Prophecy, The Steady Hand, Igneous Hammer, Bottom Dollar) and those got nerfed which pushed people back to 140s (Fatebringer Timelostus, Palindrome Adeptus, oh wait there's nothing better in these slots than those two guns woops). The Quickdraw and sliding nerfs kinda threw a spanner into the shotgun meta because everyone's using every kind of shotgun now it seems which is Probably Good. In any case within two specific archetypes of guns you have a lot of churn via balance changes and new guns being released which is basically the way Bungie wants people to play the game. Get New Stuff. RBX posted:How does somebody who buys every season and expansion but choose to use a few guns a problem? They have to grind for what reason? They're playing and spending money? I don't see what the goal other than to make sure you burn out everybody that likes your game. The problem is that someone who doesn't care about new loot is less incentivized to buy every season and expansion. There was probably some combination of developers wanting to avoid constant power creep and some internal data suggesting that players with less loadout variety are more likely to drop out of the game.
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Sep 2, 2021 18:31
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GoGoGadgetChris posted:It will be back under a new name with new mechanics in another 3-ish years. Their game depends on a periodic deep cleansing of our loot by that point they'd be probably deciding whether to go/no go on destiny 3 and that would do it as much as "destiny 3" sounds impossible for where bungie's resourcing is alongside new IP(s), i do wonder if there was some alternative to the destiny 2 content vault stuff we got where like... post-vault destiny 2 + beyond light is just "destiny 3" or some other new name, and maybe players lose everything but their exotics in the "new game." i bet this was drafted as an idea at one point, at least, and rejecting it is probably how they got to content vault + sunset ("we need to stop maintaining all this old poo poo and we need players to grind without creating an actual new game")
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Sep 2, 2021 18:33
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Blind Rasputin posted:Isn’t there a Twitter account, or other webpage or something that says what the legend lost sector is and what a recommended loadout is? I swear I saw it once but I can’t find it. Guy hasn’t responded to today’s yet but: https://twitter.com/legionlesstv/status/1433154316999827456?s=21
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Sep 2, 2021 18:38
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Eej posted:Yeah Seasonal mods are a clunky way of saying "it's Fusion weather!" and making people dig deep into their vaults for things that say Fusion and discovering they're good. I agree from a personal standpoint, I'm just sympathetic to those people who did not want it arbitrarily forced on them due to players like me. Like, I was one of those edge cases that had one loadout. In a sense, I guess I kinda still do 'cause I have only have one masterworked set of armor and Armamentarium basically never leaves my titan unless it absolutely has to for something, but the difference is that before sunsetting (and really before seasonal mods I should say) I ran the same 3 weapons quite literally all the time because they worked and I liked them. It meant that any time a fusion or HC or whatever dropped it was an instant shard or infuse because I didn't need it or want it and honestly I will say that made the game a bit boring. I don't think sunsetting was the right approach, and I don't really think think seasonal mods are either (it's cool getting to try out poo poo I've never used before but I don't like feeling forced to), but I can't deny that they made me engage with the game a lot more than I was before (and game modes I never engaged with before so if you ever stomp me in crucible thank sunsetting I guess??). But Bungie if you're reading this I buy and play the game mainly for the story so don't get any more dumb ideas 
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Sep 2, 2021 18:40
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Gay Rat Wedding posted:Sunsetting was game-ruining dogshit and the game is good again specifically because it’s gone I disagree with this. I think the game is good again because they did it and then subsequently undid it. Before sunsetting, the godroll for a good 90% of the guns in the game is Outlaw/Rampage or Outlaw/Kill Clip. Now these combos barely drop, even on guns that used to roll it. Instead, they created a whole bunch of perks and combos that are objectively worse than an Outlaw/Rampage or Outlaw/KillClip combo, but because you almost never see those combos anymore and all the guns with them were sunset, there is a wide space to play with gun rolls nowadays. Outlaw, Rampage, and Kill Clip still drop on guns and they are objectively good perks, but now they stopped doing those combos on most guns we get really interesting combos that are more varied and interesting. I am extremely happy the game is in the current state it is. Destiny is actually good right now. I am annoyed at the process it took to get here, but in the end, you can't have this high of a high point without the lowpoint it was at, and clearing out all the degenerate combos they printed in Year 2.
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Sep 2, 2021 19:16
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PathAsc posted:I thought they straight up said they reduced it (again) In a way I am glad to hear it is not just me. But yeah, it's been REAL rare.
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Sep 2, 2021 19:30
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The refreshed moon guns loving suck though. Sunsetting to keep people running on the GaaS treadmill because gee whiz if timmy just keeps using his favourite gun how will we get him to buy ornaments for new, worse guns? Yes I'm mad that my autoloading holster & box breathing kinetic sniper is sunset and the refreshed perk pool doesn't even come close.
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Sep 2, 2021 19:33
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The gun situation is fine. I like the old pool of perks better because all the new ones have small novels to describe them but at least they open up some play style options (that I assume everyone ignores in favor of overpowered artifact builds, but that's a different issue). The armor situation is still kind of a disaster though. It's better than it used to be but the RNG is bullshit and needing to re-mod stuff depending on the role you want to fill (or collecting a dozen different sets of armor to fit all those rolls) is very Not Fun. The armor itself should be purely cosmetic and then you fill out your stats in a separate screen where you check off the mods you want and can swap between them with a menu. And lol that element affinity still exists.
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Sep 2, 2021 19:35
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the mod situation is catastrophically bad the variable cost weapon handling mods when they already solved this with ammo color mods is infuriating I wonder what destiny would be like without the constant annoyances 
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Sep 2, 2021 19:41
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They’re never getting rid of this stupid bounty system right?
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Sep 2, 2021 19:42
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RocketRaygun posted:I disagree with this. I think the game is good again because they did it and then subsequently undid it. I feel like a bunch of weapons with Outlaw and Kill Clip/Rampage are dropping lately. No I don’t have any examples!! Even on the guns that can roll them I’d rather have other perks though (I love Heating Up, Killing Wind, and Demolitionist forever). I wish Bungie would talk more about designing guns. It’s the core of the game but instead they talk endlessly about anything but, except in terms of buffs/nerfs.
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Sep 2, 2021 19:50
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xzzy posted:The gun situation is fine. I like the old pool of perks better because all the new ones have small novels to describe them but at least they open up some play style options (that I assume everyone ignores in favor of overpowered artifact builds, but that's a different issue). Large agree here, elemental affinity for armor does nothing but sectionalize your mod use.
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Sep 2, 2021 20:02
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I think DIM does it but there’s no way to store/save loadouts in-game, right?
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Sep 2, 2021 20:05
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outlaw/rampage etc. is another situation where Bungie hit them with targeted nerfs to reduce their effectiveness, and buffed up some other perks to better compete. But it's hard to say they don't want [reload] + [damage] perk comboes when they introduce frenzy, or rewind rounds or buff subsistence and so on. So they say they wanted to eliminate some gameplay comboes, but at this point there's a huge variety of different [reload] and [damage] perks so you can always have a similar sort of gameplay experience so really it's what gogogadgetchris said, just a reset of the treadmill. That said their perk designs are better and there's now room for perks that don't fall into those categories, but that was because, again, they nerfed those categories and are more willing to have stronger perks for other categories. Like, compare air assault to tunnel vision/heating up or killing wind, right?
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Sep 2, 2021 20:16
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Biowarfare posted:gonna be honest, i've not done much other than extremely casual play during breaks, am i doing this wrong? i've never done item management, or cared too much about rolls or weapons, i just use what i like and add the unstoppable/anti barrier mods when i need them, die frequently in battlegrounds, and just shotgun-punch in pvp. My Sweet Business is like a siren calling me back every time.
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Sep 2, 2021 20:21
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Mattavist posted:I feel like a bunch of weapons with Outlaw and Kill Clip/Rampage are dropping lately. No I don’t have any examples!! Even on the guns that can roll them I’d rather have other perks though (I love Heating Up, Killing Wind, and Demolitionist forever). You're in luck! Mercules, the guy who made the Massive Breakdown posts for guns had Chris Proctor, lead weapon guy, on his podcast: https://soundcloud.com/destinymassivebreakdowns/sets/massive-breakdown-episodes Is where we get stuff info like quote:Several weapons archetypes have way too many subfamilies (SMGs and Pulse Rifles in particular).
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Sep 2, 2021 20:36
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I miss lightweight and aggressive pulses and want 2x of each ASAP, TIA
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Sep 2, 2021 21:07
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I honestly think the game would be better with more archetypes because hypothetically it will result in more options for people to play around with. I also believe that if some of them suck then that's OK. There's going to be someone who loves the way the feel and makes them work regardless. It's OK to have bad guns/gun archetypes if you make them distinct enough and have different enough perk pools that you don't run into the reload perk/damage perk problem that has been brought up already.
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Sep 2, 2021 21:16
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Pour one out for Adaptive SMGs. The last one they made was in Season 8 (Exit Strategy) just like Aggressive Pulse Rifles (Sacred Provenance).
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Sep 2, 2021 21:19
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They're limited on how many archetypes they can make room for because of the ~1 second TTK the game is built around and the framerate of the gun simulation (which afaik is still 30fps). In short, adjusting the TTK of a gun one frame slower or faster has a big chance to intrude on the domain of a different gun type. Then you have to factor in the balancing aspects of weapons, like recoil pattern and range all the zillions of perks that affect those stats and it turns into an annoying spreadsheet really drat fast.
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Sep 2, 2021 21:23
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On paper I get excited by new archetypes But in practice I like new sight pictures & new sound effects. Pew pew!!! (Forge's Pledge has the sneaky-worst sight in the game btw)
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Sep 2, 2021 21:29
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It's really funny that after that podcast where they confirmed that fusions and LFRs are hitscan the devs discovered that Sidearms, Fusions and LFRs mistakenly had 999 projectile speed instead of 9999 which means at 60 fps and higher they start acting weird which is why Sidearms feel off on PC. A fix should be sometime soon but they're checking to see if it doesn't break things especially on this, the season of fusion
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Sep 2, 2021 21:39
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I remember using Go Figure a lot back in the day until I got a Bygones then never went back. Aggressive pulse rifles were sexy on paper but kicked too much versus the other archtypes so you basically ended up missing part of your precision shots or relying on body shots then the kick upwards to land a couple rounds on the head. Don't miss them at all. I guess they were good for primary weapon boss damage on targets with large weak points. You know, if you have zero special or heavy ammo.
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Sep 2, 2021 21:48
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While outlaw/rampage or kill clip was the old good combo, I am sort of glad as well that they reduced their occurrence and effectiveness in exchange for introducing several other perks that are just as good if not better. Like, One for All is 35% damage buff (vs 30-33% for kill clip) and lasts 10 seconds, twice as long. It’s also very easy to proc and man is probably one of my favorite perks. Frenzy, swashbuckler, harmony, several others all giving 20% or more damage for very little input on the player’s part. I used to basically run outlaw/killclip or bust and now I get to use all sorts of random combinations and it’s definitely more interesting and fun.
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Sep 2, 2021 21:50
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Outlaw and rampage are at the bottom of the list of perks I want now, in this era of making everything frosty with stasis. It's all about grenade and melee uptime for me so demolitionist and wellspring are the ones that get me looking closely at a new drop.
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Sep 2, 2021 21:57
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Eej posted:It's really funny that after that podcast where they confirmed that fusions and LFRs are hitscan the devs discovered that Sidearms, Fusions and LFRs mistakenly had 999 projectile speed instead of 9999 which means at 60 fps and higher they start acting weird which is why Sidearms feel off on PC. A fix should be sometime soon but they're checking to see if it doesn't break things especially on this, the season of fusion This suddenly makes a lot of sense. I was wondering why the side arms felt weird on my main PC but ok on the Xbox and Neo.
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Sep 2, 2021 22:11
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How much story/mission content is there in the recent seasons after beyond light came out? Would it be worth it buying the deluxe upgrade mostly for that?
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Sep 2, 2021 22:31
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Eej posted:It's really funny that after that podcast where they confirmed that fusions and LFRs are hitscan the devs discovered that Sidearms, Fusions and LFRs mistakenly had 999 projectile speed instead of 9999 which means at 60 fps and higher they start acting weird which is why Sidearms feel off on PC. A fix should be sometime soon but they're checking to see if it doesn't break things especially on this, the season of fusion FUUUUUUUUUCK.
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Sep 2, 2021 22:34
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Saintv77 posted:How much story/mission content is there in the recent seasons after beyond light came out? Would it be worth it buying the deluxe upgrade mostly for that? I would say this is entirely subjective. But if you felt Beyond Light had enough story content that you enjoyed I would highly recommend the seasons then. Chosen in particular I felt really upped the narrative. But the good news is apparently they really want to focus on delivering a high quality story experience with Witch Queen.
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Sep 2, 2021 22:36
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Always interesting to read the perspective of people who like their one single loadout. I’m running around with 8/9 slots filled in each category switching weapons constantly, plus maybe 20-30 guns in the vault that I actively miss.
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Sep 2, 2021 22:39
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RocketRaygun posted:I disagree with this. I think the game is good again because they did it and then subsequently undid it. I actually agree with this. I think sunsetting was a massive mistake, but the refresh of weapons wasn't. While it's true that it just reset the treadmill, the treadmill is getting better. We're starting to see a lot of really interesting perks like killing wind, headstone, heating up that lead to performance increases but more indirectly. And then apparently in the Witch Queen they're going to lean in more on headstone-like perks that synergize with abilities over just straight throughput. Edit: I want to point out like, heating up is such an interesting and fun perk to me. I don't enjoy the gridskipper, until I get a kill with it and proc heating up. Then I REALLY like the gridskipper. That's how weapon perks should be. Throughput perks like Rampage (just +damage) have their place in the game, but honestly I really enjoy the direction we're going perk wise. We have a lot more variance and choice now. Even something like Thresh, which is fairly low power can lead to some interesting outcomes. I've seen a buddy use a full thresh build just constantly chain supers. Popping one off in the time it took me to get to 20% super bar. What I want to see next is honestly removing Direct Impact and Spike Grenades. I feel like these are so good that they're basically a requirement and limit our choices. Nelson Mandingo fucked around with this message at 22:52 on Sep 2, 2021 |
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Sep 2, 2021 22:47
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Saintv77 posted:How much story/mission content is there in the recent seasons after beyond light came out? Would it be worth it buying the deluxe upgrade mostly for that? Season of the Hunt is fairly story-light but Season of the Chosen is full of great Cabal Lore and Zavala being a badass, battlegrounds as a mode are a lot of fun and set a precedent for much higher enemy count activities we've been enjoying since then. Season of the Splicer just finished and afaik universally regarded as being great story-wise which brings us to now: Season of the Lost which is gonna be double length and goes till February, tying up all the other stories of this year with the lingering plot threads from the Forsaken expansion.
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Sep 2, 2021 22:47
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Eej posted:It's really funny that after that podcast where they confirmed that fusions and LFRs are hitscan the devs discovered that Sidearms, Fusions and LFRs mistakenly had 999 projectile speed instead of 9999 which means at 60 fps and higher they start acting weird which is why Sidearms feel off on PC. A fix should be sometime soon but they're checking to see if it doesn't break things especially on this, the season of fusion lol, and most importantly, lmao
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Sep 2, 2021 22:56
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Kith posted:lol, and most importantly, lmao
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Sep 2, 2021 23:23
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So I just started playing through Forsaken since I skipped it when it was a thing, and the quality of the storytelling is such a huge contrast. There's an actual plot, with characters and drama! I know the base game's campaign had that too but it makes Shadowkeep and Beyond Light look pathetic in comparison. Did Bungie's storytelling talent leave when they lost Activision's money?
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Sep 2, 2021 23:23
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