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Captain Oblivious posted:Here's my question Look, they're just seeking capital punishment for a fictional character in a cartoon game about a child psychic.
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Sep 5, 2021 17:13
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Oxyclean posted:I feel like this is an incredibly harsh interpretation given if anything, the Lucy/Maligula stuff is an analog to a dissociative disorder. She literally created another personality through trauma. Can anyone in this universe be responsible for anything if they can just be "cured" of that part of their psyche afterwards? Captain Oblivious posted:Kinda dodging the question here. What kind of resolution? Does it not count as resolution if it's not the kind you want because that seems to be what you're implying. Any at all. I'm not writing the story, so I'll judge it when we get *something*. Do you feel Ford and Lucy/Nona living happily ever after is a nice end? Edit: I will say though, that Augustus is forgiving to an almost ridiculous degree. That man got taken for a ride. He lost his parents, and had their murderer installed as mom by someone literally editing his memories to create a fake past. And he is willing to just let it slide. Broken Cog fucked around with this message at 17:21 on Sep 5, 2021 |
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Sep 5, 2021 17:15
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Broken Cog posted:Can anyone in this universe be responsible for anything if they can just be "cured" of that part of their psyche afterwards? Broken Cog posted:Do you feel Ford and Lucy/Nona living happily ever after is a nice end?
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Sep 5, 2021 17:22
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(Maligula talk) I'm not particularly into any retributive aspect of all this, but I do think that in discussions about redemption and rehabilitation there has to be some consideration given to the victims of her actions, and the game doesn't really address that part as I remember. For as much as the game makes a good point about the role of the psychonauts not being to "fix people", the endgame amounts in practical terms to "let's go in this woman's mind and fix the evil demon that lives inside it", and even if you include the fact that Nona was instrumental to Maligula's defeat in the end, you don't build redemption off of a solely internal change of heart. No matter what mental strain she was under at the time, Lucy murdered innocent people and hasn't faced up to any (direct) consequences of it, nor faced the survivors or family members of those she killed. Now, I'm not saying the game is letting her off scot free exactly, but it seems more concerned with what this revelation means for her family and less on what it means for the Grulovians she suppressed.
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Sep 5, 2021 17:22
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Hyper Crab Tank posted:No matter what mental strain she was under at the time, Lucy murdered innocent people and hasn't faced up to any (direct) consequences of it, nor faced the survivors or family members of those she killed. Now, I'm not saying the game is letting her off scot free exactly, but it seems more concerned with what this revelation means for her family and less on what it means for the Grulovians she suppressed. Oxyclean fucked around with this message at 17:34 on Sep 5, 2021 |
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Sep 5, 2021 17:27
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One more question: Is there any evidence that "Nona" is actually Lucy, and not a completely fake persona that Ford made up to hide her, that has now basically overwritten the original? He did make her forget everything, no?Hyper Crab Tank posted:(Maligula talk) I'm not particularly into any retributive aspect of all this, but I do think that in discussions about redemption and rehabilitation there has to be some consideration given to the victims of her actions, and the game doesn't really address that part as I remember. For as much as the game makes a good point about the role of the psychonauts not being to "fix people", the endgame amounts in practical terms to "let's go in this woman's mind and fix the evil demon that lives inside it", and even if you include the fact that Nona was instrumental to Maligula's defeat in the end, you don't build redemption off of a solely internal change of heart. No matter what mental strain she was under at the time, Lucy murdered innocent people and hasn't faced up to any (direct) consequences of it, nor faced the survivors or family members of those she killed. Now, I'm not saying the game is letting her off scot free exactly, but it seems more concerned with what this revelation means for her family and less on what it means for the Grulovians she suppressed. Yeah, this is my main issue, really. It really feels it cheapens the victims role in all this, they get delegated to just being a tool to show how terrible someone is. Like, Lucy's sister/Augustus mother is just used as a tool to show how horrible Maligula is. Which makes them just being brushed aside in the end feel very wrong.
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Sep 5, 2021 17:27
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Hyper Crab Tank posted:(Maligula talk) I'm not particularly into any retributive aspect of all this, but I do think that in discussions about redemption and rehabilitation there has to be some consideration given to the victims of her actions, and the game doesn't really address that part as I remember. For as much as the game makes a good point about the role of the psychonauts not being to "fix people", the endgame amounts in practical terms to "let's go in this woman's mind and fix the evil demon that lives inside it", and even if you include the fact that Nona was instrumental to Maligula's defeat in the end, you don't build redemption off of a solely internal change of heart. No matter what mental strain she was under at the time, Lucy murdered innocent people and hasn't faced up to any (direct) consequences of it, nor faced the survivors or family members of those she killed. Now, I'm not saying the game is letting her off scot free exactly, but it seems more concerned with what this revelation means for her family and less on what it means for the Grulovians she suppressed. the role of the psychonauts is to "fix people," or at least to give them the means and support to overcome their mental demons, which is exactly what raz helped nona/lucrecia do. forsyth was a step too far because he wasn't actually fixing her, he was making her dysfunctional for his own ends. the luctopus is basically a far more benign maligula that he personally manufactured and let loose inside forsyth's mind the game pawns off responsibility for grulovia's drowning on the royal family, and whether you agree with that or not, it puts a sufficient amount of work into the idea. cruller's correspondence makes it very clear that lucrecia wasn't comfortable attacking her countrymen at all, but theodore kept haranguing her to make it rain harder until the dam-breaking incident finally happened
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Sep 5, 2021 17:30
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Oxyclean posted:As for direct consequences, Lucy and Maligula was basically put in mental prison for 20+ years. Yes, and there's a good argument that this amounts to punishment, quite aside from the fact that frankly Ford had no right to do what he did. And if in the totality of time Lucy faces the victims of her crimes (or their surviving family) and they all come to agreement, then that would go a good way towards being more satisfying. But as it is it has this... off flavor of a war criminal coming along 20 years later and going "I have made peace with the inner demons that made me kill all those people, and now I will at last live a happy life without ever facing those I harmed or making any kinds of amends towards them". I know it's not what they're going for, I get it, but it's hard to not feel there's a slight sour note here. Oxxidation posted:the role of the psychonauts is to "fix people" Forsythe explicitly uses the phrase "[We're] not here to 'fix' people" to dress down Raz about it. Hyper Crab Tank fucked around with this message at 17:36 on Sep 5, 2021 |
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Sep 5, 2021 17:31
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I think a big huge thing that all of you retribution wanters aren’t really taking into account is that it’s been like, exactly one night between the final battle and the endgame day. There’s just not enough time for things to sink in yet. Sure maybe some characters seem too flippant about things, but consider that they’re celebrating saving the world before having the more serious discussions about how to proceed
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Sep 5, 2021 17:32
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Broken Cog posted:Can anyone in this universe be responsible for anything if they can just be "cured" of that part of their psyche afterwards? Yeah why not? The truth behind Maligula does not change the 20 years worth of real lived experience Augustus has with Nona. After a certain point the truth is more of an intellectual exercise than something that matters. The perspective of the game is clearly that what happened to Ford and Lucy and Grulovia was a tragedy (one largely caused by Ford despite the best of intentions) and that torturing that tragedy further is unproductive. Just because you don’t agree doesn’t make it not a resolution. Captain Oblivious fucked around with this message at 17:38 on Sep 5, 2021 |
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Sep 5, 2021 17:36
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I mean, really, it was impossible for Lucy to ever face punishment or even come to terms with what she did (even if it were in psychoisolation) entirely due to Ford's actions. He could've just locked Maligula away and then had Lucy confined, and come clean to Augustus about what happened to his mother. Everything that happened after Grulovia was entirely Ford's fault, he's the reason why there was never justice for Grulovia or Augustus's family. So on that note, I don't feel that Lucy/Nona should face punishment. Whoever Lucy might've become, whatever demons she would've been wrestling with or any amends she could've tried to have made in those intervening years... that's all moot now. She's been left a doddering old woman who's only vaguely aware of what even happened. Lucy/Nona isn't even the same person anymore, at all.
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Sep 5, 2021 17:42
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I think we can all agree Ford's actions are pretty hard to defend, not to mention cowardly. I won't quite say he's to blame for everything, but he certainly messed a lot of things up and overreached in pretty hosed up ways.
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Sep 5, 2021 17:46
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But yeah, let Lucy/Nona face judgment from Augustus and the people of Grulovia, and I'm fine with it. If they are willing to forgive, fine, just don't delegate them to a footnote in Maligulas origin story, not a fan of that. Also, I agree that the game really wants you to blame the royals instead of Lucy, but that goes way too close to "Just following orders" narrative for my tastes. Hyper Crab Tank posted:I think we can all agree Ford's actions are pretty hard to defend, not to mention cowardly. I won't quite say he's to blame for everything, but he certainly messed a lot of things up and overreached in pretty hosed up ways. And yet the game doesn't seem to think he needs to face any consequences for this at all. Broken Cog fucked around with this message at 17:53 on Sep 5, 2021 |
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Sep 5, 2021 17:50
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With regards to the discourse that’s going on, the whole situation of how to deal with the fallout of the whole Lucy/Maligula situation is complex and no no answer will please everyone. The need for retributive justice feels uncomfortable due to how Maligula could be construed as a mental disorder that came about as a coping mechanism. Lucy only tried to rain out the protesters and the dam breaking and killing the protesters, including her sister and brother-in-law, was not intended and she obviously was severely affected by it. How would the judgment process go with the Grulovians? Literally less than a day has passed since Augusts had any inkling about his memories being tampered. Lucy wasn’t in control of her mind and body when she committed the actions as Maligula. Mental health and mental disorders are complex issues and demanding that someone be punished when their mental state was compromised and was from a traumatic incident? Her actions were not correct, but punishing a person for their actions when they were arguably someone else feels wrong and lacking in nuance. Lucy never got a chance to reflect on her actions or work through her Maligula aspect healthily because of Ford’s actions. The situation is messy and no perfect solutions exist. Im personally uncomfortable with retribution on Lucy at it strays a bit close to persecuting someone for their mental illness and not providing the help they needed. To be honest, I’m glad that there are interesting discussions about this game and this thread isn’t just “this game is a buggy mess”. The fact that we can have discussions like these is a testament to the thought put into the game and the ideas it tries to present. It’s not perfect, but nothing is.
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Sep 5, 2021 18:10
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also, don't forget that the game explicitly states she only intended to use her hydrokinesis to rain out the people who were protesting, she literally never intended for it to actually kill anyone. her actions caused the dam to break which in turn drowned everyone, but she herself literally did not physically drown those protestors herself- any indications or portrayals of such are either complete misinterpretations of the events or her own grief twisting the facts (especially upon her discovery that her sister was one of the people who drowned). edit: and, again, it has literally been hours since the end of the game. what do you conceivably expect to happen in that time frame when people are probably still scrambling to get a full account of everything that has happened both in the timespan of the game itself but also everything in the past? there is not closure for multiple characters but that doesn't mean that the game is attempting to gloss over or ignore that lack of closure, it just means it hasn't happened yet. Mix. fucked around with this message at 18:13 on Sep 5, 2021 |
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Sep 5, 2021 18:10
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To clarify something, I'm not really advocating for retribution so much as feeling like a redemptive arc is incomplete without facing the victims and at least listening to what they have to say.
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Sep 5, 2021 18:13
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Mix. posted:also, don't forget that the game explicitly states she only intended to use her hydrokinesis to rain out the people who were protesting, she literally never intended for it to actually kill anyone. her actions caused the dam to break which in turn drowned everyone, but she herself literally did not physically drown those protestors herself- any indications or portrayals of such are either complete misinterpretations of the events or her own grief twisting the facts (especially upon her discovery that her sister was one of the people who drowned). Yeah this is why the ”just following orders” comparison objectively does not work. Indeed, she was just following orders. But her orders were non-lethal dispersal and that is exactly what she tried to do. All of this is moot though because she’s not even Lucy or Maligula in any way that matters anymore. You are effectively making a proxy stand trial in effigy if you try to prosecute her now.
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Sep 5, 2021 18:13
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Hyper Crab Tank posted:To clarify something, I'm not really advocating for retribution so much as feeling like a redemptive arc is incomplete without facing the victims and at least listening to what they have to say. And as others have said, that's kind of outside of the scope of the endgame. Maybe we'll get another Rhombus of Ruin-type short game or DLC to bridge the gap or wrap up any loose plot threads.
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Sep 5, 2021 18:26
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Hyper Crab Tank posted:To clarify something, I'm not really advocating for retribution so much as feeling like a redemptive arc is incomplete without facing the victims and at least listening to what they have to say. I mean, the main victim is arguably Lucy herself, and the other is Raz's dad. When you talk to him after, his response is basically "I don't know, I'm still processing". Who else should they face? It's weird to me how many people here seem bloodthirsty for some punishment. It's an old lady who has been tormented by her own split personality for 20 years and a family who are trying to figure out how to come to terms with that old lady being the one who traumatized them. Let them resolve it themselves, jeez.
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Sep 5, 2021 18:39
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I think Augustus is my favorite side character simply because of post game. Him talking about how confused Nona makes him felt very real and grounded to me. He admits that he's getting memories back of his real mother but Ford's fuckery is *still there* and he has life long memories with Nona. They aren't real, but he spent 20 something years believing that and he's not going to be able to just discard that in a few hours. Him not knowing how to feel is the most realistic thing I can think of as I'm sure part of him wants to excuse everything because of his false memories. Like it really can't be underscored enough how bad Ford broke that man in particular. Finding him in the QA once Maligula returns and he's just curled up into a ball, and all he can mutter is 'She's gone.' is like, the most heart wrenching thing in the game to me.
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Sep 5, 2021 19:03
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Heh, the "bloodthirstiness" (which I assume is directed at me here) is almost entirely made up, all I've been arguing for is that Lucy/Nona and Ford should answer for what they've done, if you feel that counts as bloodthirstiness, I don't know what to tell you. Pretty sure I've not even used the word "retribution" once. People also seem to have missed my main point; that Lucy is not a good villain for a game such as this. You can't easily redeem mass murderers, and you can't just brush off the victims. It all feels incredibly tasteless. ThisIsACoolGuy posted:I think Augustus is my favorite side character simply because of post game. Yeah, he's pretty messed up, and yet Ford and Nona are hanging out in their hut, joking and flirting.
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Sep 5, 2021 19:19
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Taffer posted:Who else should they face? I'm primarily thinking of the victims of her deeds in Grulovia. I'm not sure I buy that "separate personality" is the right way to interpret Maligula either; she seems way more like a metaphor for the dark, ugly part of every human that reacts to (possibly life-threatening) stress with violence. She was pressed into her actions by the Gzar and he certainly would face a lot of responsibility too were he still alive, but in the end I think the idea that Lucy and Maligula are separate persons with separate things to answer for doesn't seem right to me.
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Sep 5, 2021 19:20
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Captain Oblivious posted:You are effectively making a proxy stand trial in effigy if you try to prosecute her now. Okay, bear with me on this. We go to Grulovia. We recover the remains of Augustus' actual mother. We say that these are the remains of Maligula, and we Cadaver Synod it up. This is objectively a bad idea, but it's got big Ford Cruller energy. And yeah, to be clear, I'm not advocating any retribution, really. Lucy suffered enough in the break into Maligula. Maligula herself is locked away and attempting to make her face anything would just result in another breakout. Ford probably suffered enough because even fractured, each of his personas was filled with memories of Lucy, he couldn't escape and he probably knew he did it to himself in his more lucid moments. ...Well, okay, I could stand to see some retribution on the Gzar and Gristol. Oh boo hoo, you had to flee your country with all your worldly goods and stay in exile in a luxury hotel with slightly less caviar than you were used to. I have something that will help, IT'S CALLED THE GUILLOTINE! Yes, I know the Gzar is dead. Again, Cadaver Synod.
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Sep 5, 2021 19:25
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Broken Cog posted:Heh, the "bloodthirstiness" (which I assume is directed at me here) is almost entirely made up, all I've been arguing for is that Lucy/Nona and Ford should answer for what they've done, if you feel that counts as bloodthirstiness, I don't know what to tell you. Pretty sure I've not even used the word "retribution" once. You're being referred to as bloodthirsty because you're transparently implying that your desired outcome is capital punishment, by advocating for outcomes that will probably result in capital punishment, with a thin veneer of being aloof and fair and balanced. It's not really fooling anyone.
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Sep 5, 2021 19:37
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Broken Cog posted:Heh, the "bloodthirstiness" (which I assume is directed at me here) is almost entirely made up, all I've been arguing for is that Lucy/Nona and Ford should answer for what they've done, if you feel that counts as bloodthirstiness, I don't know what to tell you. Pretty sure I've not even used the word "retribution" once. Ok, but what does Lucy/Nona and Ford answering for what they’ve done even mean? What resolution are you looking for? I can see the connection of “bloodthirstiness” and answering for their crimes because you haven’t expanded in any way what resolution they should be getting for their actions. The way the posts are coming off are accusatory and I know at least one person has asked what would count as “answering for their crimes” but you’ve danced around the topic. At best, you’ve said they should face judgment from Augustus and Grulovia, but what does that entail and how would that be practical in like a single night?
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Sep 5, 2021 19:37
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And really, again, the main issue here: What's the point? It's been 20 years, as far as the world at large knows Maligula is dead. What is reopening that wound and putting a doddering old woman on trial for a tragic accident going to accomplish? Obviously Ford shouldn't have done what he did and denied everyone the opportunity to engage with the issue in earnest at the time, but that ship has sailed.
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Sep 5, 2021 19:39
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Captain Oblivious posted:You're being referred to as bloodthirsty because you're transparently implying that your desired outcome is capital punishment, by advocating for outcomes that will probably result in capital punishment, with a thin veneer of being aloof and fair and balanced. It's not really fooling anyone. I am absolutely not, this is something you came up with on your own. Hell, capital punishment hasn't been a thing for almost a century in my country. My main point in stressing this, again, is more that when you make a villain that involves mass murder of protesters, you drag in something ugly you don't want in a game as lighthearted as this. I'm criticizing Nona/Lucy/Maligula as a character/villain, since I don't think it was a good decision to write her as she is, as it's made it extremely hard to "resolve" her story without it feeling dirty. jimmydalad posted:Ok, but what does Lucy/Nona and Ford answering for what they’ve done even mean? What resolution are you looking for? I can see the connection of “bloodthirstiness” and answering for their crimes because you haven’t expanded in any way what resolution they should be getting for their actions. The way the posts are coming off are accusatory and I know at least one person has asked what would count as “answering for their crimes” but you’ve danced around the topic. At best, you’ve said they should face judgment from Augustus and Grulovia, but what does that entail and how would that be practical in like a single night? Just as a thought experiment, what would the "punishment" for war crimes be in an arguably kids game? See where I'm going with this? Broken Cog fucked around with this message at 19:48 on Sep 5, 2021 |
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Sep 5, 2021 19:45
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Finally sat down to go around the post game and interact with all the folks. Found out I barely explored the Quarry at all and never even found the KLOB treehouse. Also Lili and her father in a corner catching up and being super adorable. One of the lines of dialogue is Raz bringing up what happened at Whispering Rock, Lili interjecting with a "RAZ!". Truman gets interested and asks, Raz summarizes the events of the first game and the response is just great. :allear: Also a bit late to the conversation about psychic power specialties but to me Raz is unique because he's able to use so many powers so well and this reflects his upbringing as an acrobatic. Because acrobats are flexible, you see. My thoughts on the current ongoing topic: Rather than Psychonauts being a light hearted game the setting to me takes advantage of humor and jokes used to soften the blow of the very serious topics brought up, especially since you're experiencing the game through the eyes of a 10 year old. It's all a matter of perspective though. It also feels like people are glossing over the fact when you talk to Augustus he straight up says he believes Ford has already suffered enough (from having shattered his own mind) and forgives him. I find this makes Augustus quite broadminded personally, but the strokes of the story in the game are empathy and forgiveness so it fits quite well.
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Sep 5, 2021 20:09
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Broken Cog posted:Just as a thought experiment, what would the "punishment" for war crimes be in an arguably kids game? See where I'm going with this?
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Sep 5, 2021 20:13
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Captain Oblivious posted:And really, again, the main issue here: Yeah, we keep circling back to this but Ford's actions basically split Lucy's personality into this hybrid Lucy/Nona personality (now her dominant one) and then Maligula as a totally separate entity. Old Lucy is gone, and Old Lucy was the one for whom Maligula was a "dark aspect" of her personality. Maligula and Lucy/Nona are two totally distinct personalities. Original Lucy wasn't distinct from Maligula, true enough, but this new Lucy/Nona hybrid personality is. Ford shouldn't have done what he did but, just as he'd planned, his actions basically made justice impossible. His selfish actions spared Lucy from punishment, and punishing this totally different person wouldn't be right.
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Sep 5, 2021 20:28
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King Vidiot posted:Yeah, we keep circling back to this but Ford's actions basically split Lucy's personality into this hybrid Lucy/Nona personality (now her dominant one) and then Maligula as a totally separate entity. Old Lucy is gone, and Old Lucy was the one for whom Maligula was a "dark aspect" of her personality. Maligula and Lucy/Nona are two totally distinct personalities. Original Lucy wasn't distinct from Maligula, true enough, but this new Lucy/Nona hybrid personality is. Ford shouldn't have done what he did but, just as he'd planned, his actions basically made justice impossible. His selfish actions spared Lucy from punishment, and punishing this totally different person wouldn't be right. Yeah, I keep waffling back and forth on Ford but I don't think you can hold current Lucrecia/Nona culpable for anything past Lucrecia or Maligula did. The current Nona is clearly a distinct personality(and that's before we get into the infirmity). Also, I think it's pretty hard to make an argument holding Lucrecia accountable for anything Maligula did, in the same way, I would have trouble justifying holding Bruce Banner accountable for anything the Hulk did. I think if I had to set out punishment for Ford it would be to make him fix what he did(to the best they can) strip him of any official powers and let him live with whatever he had left tbh so, mission accomplished! Broken Cog posted:Can anyone in this universe be responsible for anything if they can just be "cured" of that part of their psyche afterwards? Yes Gristol (or Theodore if he wasn't dead) could easily be held accountable for what they did. Gristol's thoughts are juvenile and deluded but he was entirely cognizant of his actions when he did them. Hub Cat fucked around with this message at 00:29 on Sep 6, 2021 |
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Sep 5, 2021 21:29
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Post Game character talk I feel like a lot of people just don't go there to check, but you can talk to Gristol in the Psychoisolation chamber for what it's worth. He's gone insane and is singing about how he 'won' in his mind and when Raz asks if he's learned anything he spits on Maligma and cracks a terrible pun before going back to his creepy singing.
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Sep 5, 2021 23:10
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Seeing Truman post-game is great because of the way he sees you when you use clairvoyance on him  Also I loved that the endgame reveals explain why "Truman" sees you as a peasant at first, which always seemed oddly mean-spirited, because of course it's Gristol and that's how he sees everybody.
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Sep 5, 2021 23:47
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ThisIsACoolGuy posted:Post Game character talk I feel like a lot of people just don't go there to check, but you can talk to Gristol in the Psychoisolation chamber for what it's worth. He's gone insane and is singing about how he 'won' in his mind and when Raz asks if he's learned anything he spits on Maligma and cracks a terrible pun before going back to his creepy singing. I actually don't think he's crazier than he was before, he's still just as deluded as he was when you first find out about it. If you talk to him a second time Raz asks him how he feels about the trial he's gonna be in. His response is along the lines of "Trial? You clearly don't know how the Psychonauts work." Which considering some of the subtext in the game feels kinda spot on.
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Sep 5, 2021 23:50
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Jerusalem posted:Seeing Truman post-game is great because of the way he sees you when you use clairvoyance on him It's easy to miss but in the final level if you use Clairvoyance on him before accepting the egg he sees Raz as a Prince with a less grand crown on his head. Found that kinda odd.
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Sep 5, 2021 23:50
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ThisIsACoolGuy posted:It's easy to miss but in the final level if you use Clairvoyance on him before accepting the egg he sees Raz as a Prince with a less grand crown on his head. Found that kinda odd. Huh, wow yeah I missed that. I wonder if in his mind he assumes that any Grulovian inside the Lady Lucktopus must be royalty too, albeit "lesser" like a cousin or something, or if he just sees Raz as a stand-in for his own young version when he was "just" a prince and Gzar Theodore was still alive?
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Sep 6, 2021 00:00
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ThisIsACoolGuy posted:It's easy to miss but in the final level if you use Clairvoyance on him before accepting the egg he sees Raz as a Prince with a less grand crown on his head. Found that kinda odd. I think it's because Raz is part Grulovian, and he is projecting some of himself onto Raz.
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Sep 6, 2021 00:01
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I’m gonna come back and click these black bars later but I just wanna say (midgame Ford spoilers) in mailman Ford I tried “Lucretia” instead of “Lucy” on the typewriter and was annoyed that not only did it not work but it didn’t even give my any unique dialogue. She wasn’t answering the letters addressed to Lucy, Ford, maybe a slight change in addressee would have been more effective!
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Sep 6, 2021 00:23
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This entire conversation was wild to read through when I woke up. Guys, the entire game takes place in the span of less than 24 hours. In fact, it's been less than a week since Raz ran away to go to Whispering Rocks in the first game. Did Nona and Ford get off easy with no real talk of punishment? Yeah. Because there's been no time to have that conversation. You know who else has gotten off really easy? Oleander. Because there's been no time. Say what you will about Sasha and Milla forgiving him - I don't think Truman's going to be happy about the guy who kidnapped and assaulted 20 or so children, including an attempt on his daughter. But these aren't things covered by the scope of either game because they don't fit the tone of them. Personally, yeah, I really hope there's a serious punishment waiting for Ford for the poo poo he pulled. As for Nona, I'm guessing that if she's even allowed to leave Psychonauts HQ, which she very well might not be, it's going to be with an agent following her around with the circus for the rest of her life. But demanding on screen punishment for them is a bit like asking why Crash Bandicoot doesn't just kill Cortex for repeatedly trying to take over the world. It's just not that kind of game.
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Sep 6, 2021 00:55
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CuwiKhons posted:This entire conversation was wild to read through when I woke up. This is actually covered. His response is almost literally "oh, just that?
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Sep 6, 2021 01:06
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