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I'm in the camp that wants stricter debate rules, whether that means D&D changes or we get a subforum with stricter rules. I also agree that we don't need more moderators, what we need is someone to enforce an overall vision. I would prefer an admin who would like to see stricter debate rules, who would be interested in bringing back the old rules. I feel like meeting effort with effort has been thrown out almost completely. There's still effort posts, but CSPAM has captured a good chunk of that despite having a lot more white noise posting, because neither forum cares one way or the other how much effort you put into your posts, it's all about ideology. Professor Beetus posted:e: It's basically the "I'm being silenced!" guy Funny, I was about to say the whole D&D/CSPAM split is exactly like that, D&D being the publisher that denies leftist effort posts and CSPAM being the media that feeds off and bullhorn's the outrage. But that's kind of a separate discussion.
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Sep 5, 2021 05:12
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I'm being absolutely serious here. I want to see what they'd do with a modicum of power and accountability.
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Sep 5, 2021 05:53
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Athanatos posted:I realize I am asking this question when I have limited who can reply, so I will re-ask it when I fully open the thread to everyone, AND I'm also veering way the gently caress off the topic of "Who should I give buttons too" but: Edit: I guess you could make USNews into the “new thread thread” and have no discussion there
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Sep 5, 2021 06:23
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Somfin posted:I'm being absolutely serious here. I want to see what they'd do with a modicum of power and accountability. If offered mod powers I will decline them, if given mod powers I will not use them.
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Sep 5, 2021 06:30
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Freakazoid_ posted:I'm in the camp that wants stricter debate rules, whether that means D&D changes or we get a subforum with stricter rules. I think generally speaking there are plenty of CSPAM regulars that I enjoy, that I agree with, and that I am happy to see post in DND. There are also a small handful of toxic assholes who keep mashing their hand onto the hot burner. I know folks like to bang on about decorum and civility but people constantly barging in to a shared space to drop turds everywhere and then complain about the smell gets pretty loving old.
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Sep 5, 2021 06:42
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Closed for a bit while I decide if I want to do round 3 of letting people who haven't posted give input before I re-open the flood gates. Edit: all the same edits as last time
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Sep 5, 2021 06:58
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Back open. Let's start the day with allowing anyone who hasn't posted before this post to add their thoughts. Same thing as yesterday, if it's a ghost town, I'll open it up for everyone to hate each other again.  If you have posted in this thread before this post, hold off commenting anymore for now. If you don't read this post I'm setting your probe timer to 2021-09-09 12:12:12. Describe what you think the largest issue facing D&D is, then nominate a moderator who you think could work towards addressing that issue.
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Sep 5, 2021 16:46
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thehandtruck posted:what if nobody could see each other's names in d&d. mods too. serious suggestion. That is the coolest idea yet. D&D has turned into team sports where a few loud mouths on either side of the left/lib debate shout a bunch of bullshit and a few others follow blindly and dogpile. Removing the team jerseys would be pretty cool, as people would then be forced to form their own thoughts instead. They may even realize they align with their posting enemies on some topics!
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Sep 5, 2021 17:01
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The problem with modding in D&D is that it’s entirely ideological but masquerades as impartiality. The mod who made it against the rules to use the term “Concentration Camp” the moment Team Blue was running the border Concentration Camps is still a mod. The mod who said the main reason people bring up Tara Reade is to “own posting enemies” is still a mod. These mods, through one-sided enforcement of rules and subsequent thread and forum bans, have created a self-selected echo chamber of an ever-dwindling number of posters who all agree with each other. There is no debate or discussion to be had in this subforum - this is the subforum for Democrats to cheerlead elected Democrats and do dunks on obviously odious chuds. If anyone challenges the fragile liberal worldview, the few forum regulars who are still around mash that report button until one of their Discord buddy mods drops by with a probe or a ramp. There was one time recently when a debate had broke out in USnews and a former mod (who’s in this thread begging that no one outside of the self-selected echo chamber be allowed in here) ran to QCS screaming about an emergency. The “emergency” was people debating the breaking news story of the Afghanistan withdrawal. This isn’t about rules being broken, it’s about liberals on this subforum thinking it’s a world-ending emergency to see an opinion they disagree with. I think Willa Rogers would be a good mod. She always posts effortful and thought-out posts and it’s clear she is very annoying to the worst of the crop of current mods. Alternatively - double down on making the ideological alignment official, rename this subforum “Democrats In Discussion” and allow the rest of the forum to appropriately mock it. the 2016 lover fucked around with this message at 18:02 on Sep 5, 2021 |
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Sep 5, 2021 17:22
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That'd be a great idea and solve the problem of every thread being a two sided slapfight. For a while even the IKs were in on it and just targeting their posting foes. If it's doable removing that (and I guess turning off avs) would solve it pretty handily. I don't have a mod recommendation except someone who doesn't give a poo poo either way I guess; instead of anyone in either clique
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Sep 5, 2021 17:23
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Gros Tarla posted:That is the coolest idea yet. D&D has turned into team sports where a few loud mouths on either side of the left/lib debate shout a bunch of bullshit and a few others follow blindly and dogpile. Removing the team jerseys would be pretty cool, as people would then be forced to form their own thoughts instead. They may even realize they align with their posting enemies on some topics! How would this work with having some people in discussions (mods and iks) being able to see people's names, and everyone else not? Also has this anonymity idea ever worked successfully before any of the numerous times it's been tried elsewhere?
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Sep 5, 2021 17:41
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Flying-PCP posted:How would this work with having some people in discussions (mods and iks) being able to see people's names, and everyone else not? Also has this anonymity idea ever worked successfully before any of the numerous times it's been tried elsewhere? Wouldn't help with modding itself, but could at least reduce the petty bullshit going on that requires so much mod intervention in the first place.
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Sep 5, 2021 17:55
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If I had my way with everything, I would make D&D the super tryhard debate club forum, and CSPAM the lol lmao laidback venting forum. I think that's what it's supposed to be anyway, but unfortunately there's an ideological divide on top of it too. Which also leads to a bizarre us vs. them mentality. You can see it in this very thread, where people with a nojoe tag or even just a different opinion gets declared an outsider "swooping in" to poo poo up a thread. Or people freaking out about forum banned people having a say in this. Heck, just the idea of forum banning in the first place. CSPAM can be pretty toxic and insular too, but I'll admit I'm pretty biased. So like a lot of others said, I think D&D needs to decide what it wants to be. If it wants to be the level headed effort post debate forum, then I think there needs to be some effort towards bridging the ideological divide. Having more leftist mods and IKs would be a step in the right direction. Echoing what others said that ytlaya would be a great choice, assuming they're up for it. It would definitely ruffle a lot of feathers, but I think it would be good for the long term health of the forum, and I'll admit it would be pretty funny. And get rid of Handsome Ralph, they're extremely trigger happy and has a noticeable ideological bent in handing out probations, more than any other mod in D&D. OTOH, if D&D just wants to double down and define itself in opposition of CSPAM and be the Democrat cheerleading forum, then go right on ahead. how are u would be the perfect mod for that, and it would be really interesting to see what they do with a little bit of power. If they go that route, it would also be helpful to have a venting thread where they can make fun of dumb CSPAM posts. Of course, I think this is a terrible direction to take and would make things even worse. But I get the feeling that this is what a lot of people want, even if they won't admit it. Anyway, thanks for listening. Hope everyone has a nice day 
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Sep 5, 2021 18:08
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Fister Roboto posted:If I had my way with everything, I would make D&D the super tryhard debate club forum, and CSPAM the lol lmao laidback venting forum. I think that's what it's supposed to be anyway, but unfortunately there's an ideological divide on top of it too. Which also leads to a bizarre us vs. them mentality. You can see it in this very thread, where people with a nojoe tag or even just a different opinion gets declared an outsider "swooping in" to poo poo up a thread. Or people freaking out about forum banned people having a say in this. Heck, just the idea of forum banning in the first place. CSPAM can be pretty toxic and insular too, but I'll admit I'm pretty biased. Posters like this are what I think the issue with D&D is, D&D has never been a Democrat cheerleading space and the people who keep saying it is usually are just upset because someone disagreed with some misleading Hill or right wing trash article, the concentration camp was stupid that was less about the words then it was about people just all capsing CONCENTRATION CAMP over and over when trying to discuss and figure out what was actually happening at the border. The idea that D&D wants to somehow define itself as being in opposition to CSPAM doesn't even make sense D&D doesn't have some equal of the succ thread where we obsess and harass Cpsam posters, in fact most D&D posters I know don't want anything to do with CSPAM due to the large amount of hostile assholes. Like a thread dedicated to basically bullying another part of the forum just seems like it just drains more users and drives people away. Also I'm unclear how Ralph can be considered the most biased D&D mod when The Steve literally posts more in a thread dedicated to harassment of the thread he is IK of then the thread itself and only probes people who disagree with those who post in the succ thread with him, like why is an IK who literally posts all day about how much he hates the people he is in charge of probing a good idea? I think How are u or Leon would make good mods, however I do understand that Cspam has a real hate on for How are u and that would probably lead to even more drama.
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Sep 5, 2021 18:32
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thehandtruck posted:2) for the most part punishments should be for posts that discourage discussion. mods should always be looking to encourage discussion, but it seems like ppl feel they shut down discussion a lot. ive scratched my head a few times when i see a lot of new posts in a thread, go to check it, and at the end of it there's a mod saying "ok we've covered it lets move on". move on from what? why? we're on this dead gay site to discuss whatever is being discussed. let people discuss it. i think the response to this will be championing for lurkers, the silent majority lol. stop protecting them, if they are bothered by a few posters drilling down in a civil disagreement, they can post about it. why do mods have to be the ones to say, "take it to a new thread"? let people decide for themselves where a post needs to go. if a thread is being poisoned by 1 person and the rest of the people in the thread make it known, then the mod can step in. the way dnd operates right now is not organic and that's why the friction is felt everywhere. This is true. There are obviously limits (if an argument has been going on for like 5+ pages with just the same people in a more general topic thread, it might be good to clamp down after a while), but in practice arguments are often shut-down extremely fast (within like 2 pages, if that). I don't think there's much of a benefit to moderators being "trigger-happy." What's the worst that can happen if they're too slow to probate? A bad argument continues for an extra page? At any point they have the power to shut down a discussion, so I don't understand why they seem so worried about things escalating. It's not like posters develop the magical ability to repel probations if they've been raging out for more than 2 pages. Acebuckeye13 posted:There should be one rule: don't be an rear end in a top hat. If a poster can't manage that, it's a week. If they come back and are still an rear end in a top hat, it's two weeks. repeat as needed. What constitutes "being an rear end in a top hat" is usually subjective. People will consider "disagreeing with their opinion in a way that isn't super polite" to be "being an rear end in a top hat." In an environment where people think other peoples' opinions about important topics are stupid and/or harmful, it's impossible to avoid people think that others are assholes. If you have a group of people who more or less agree with each other (or at least don't disagree enough that they think it reflects negatively on anyone) and someone else enters the equation who strongly disagrees, that person is probably going to be perceived as an rear end in a top hat by the former people, because (from the perspective of the former) they're "coming in and stirring poo poo up." I think this is what frequently happens in D&D. Different types of "being an rear end in a top hat" also usually go unpunished. Someone who makes a short directly insulting post will usually be probated, while longer posts dripping with condescension (that are no less rear end in a top hat-ish) won't be. I pretty frequently do the latter, largely because I know that's how the rules work (and a number of other posters are considerably worse than me about it; I'll at least openly acknowledge disliking people). My opinion isn't that the latter posts should also be punished, but that neither should be punished. I think it only becomes a problem when someone makes multiple posts in a row like this or is only contributing insults. At the end of the day, you can't force people to like each other. When it comes to a topic as important as politics, people are going to end up judging other people for (what they perceive to be) harmful and stupid ideas. Banning direct insults isn't going to magically change that; it's just going to change the way people express it. I think that the role of moderation should be to prevent completely substance-free insults (or insults that reach an unacceptable level, like incorporating bigotry or something), and to clamp down when things reach a point where most posts aren't directly responding to other posts and are just hurling insults.
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Sep 5, 2021 18:34
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socialsecurity posted:Posters like this are what I think the issue with D&D is, D&D has never been a Democrat cheerleading space and the people who keep saying it is usually are just upset because someone disagreed with some misleading Hill or right wing trash article, the concentration camp was stupid that was less about the words then it was about people just all capsing CONCENTRATION CAMP over and over when trying to discuss and figure out what was actually happening at the border. The idea that D&D wants to somehow define itself as being in opposition to CSPAM doesn't even make sense D&D doesn't have some equal of the succ thread where we obsess and harass Cpsam posters, in fact most D&D posters I know don't want anything to do with CSPAM due to the large amount of hostile assholes. Like a thread dedicated to basically bullying another part of the forum just seems like it just drains more users and drives people away. Well, steve isn't a mod for one thing  It also doesn't help that you seem to see steve as an outsider because they post in CSPAM a lot. That's really not a healthy view to take about anyone on these forums. And I guarantee they don't "literally post all day about how much they hate people", that's some wild hyperbole. It's also weird that you see me, personally, as a threat ("posters like this" as opposed to say "posts like this"). That's definitely not a healthy attitude to have in a discussion forum, and points to one of the larger problems being the big weird grudges that people have against each other. There's way too much attacking the poster rather than the post. It is pretty funny to be told that I'm the problem with D&D though. What an honor!
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Sep 5, 2021 18:59
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Ytlaya posted:This is true. There are obviously limits (if an argument has been going on for like 5+ pages with just the same people in a more general topic thread, it might be good to clamp down after a while), but in practice arguments are often shut-down extremely fast (within like 2 pages, if that). This is a great post and how I've been trying to approach the covid thread since resuming IK duties there. I'm not going to mandate kid gloves but I don't want people tearing at each others' throats constantly because it doesn't add anything to the discourse. Covid thread is probably easier than most considering it's mostly 90% people on the same page, but it's essentially the principle I'm using to determine if I need to step in. It's going well so far and I've had multiple people tell me they are happy with how it's been going. Anyway I will leave space for everyone else but I wanted to shine a light on this post, especially the last paragraph.
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Sep 5, 2021 19:22
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I do agree with how are u and Willa would make good mods. However, in the spirit of bipartisanship we should initiate reconciliation of the D&D and C-SPAM forums by making Willa mod D&D and How are u mod C-SPAM. Maybe the forums should beckne sub forums under a larger DMZ, but we can leave that conversation for future diplomatic talks.
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Sep 5, 2021 19:34
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I've been reading D&D for 15 years and at this point have entirely written off the forum because right now the atmosphere is worse than probably any other time in SA, mostly due to how worthless the admin staff is. The actual problem is that there is a group of insane brain poisoned dipshits who spend all their time hate reading D&D and screaming about how horrible the posters in D&D are. And if anyone tells them (rightfully) to shut the gently caress up, they proceed to melt down all over QCS about how they've been silenced by evil Democratic cheerleader mods. And for some reason the admins allow this to happen. If your goal as an admin staff is to help create a positive atmosphere or grow the site or whatever the gently caress, maybe do something about the posters screaming about killing other posters or trolling for probations to cry about. It has nothing to do with politics and everything to do with being an insufferable brain poisoned terminally online idiot who needs to log the gently caress off, but because this is about politics, and not video games, for some reason its tolerated because politics are so important! Its insanely stupid and toxic and if this was any other era of SA it would've been either shut down immediately - either by admins actually issuing punishments, or by other posters being allowed to troll them into oblivion. Its so loving boring and tedious and it sucks all the air out of the room and leaves no place for any sort of actual conversation. I don't really give two fucks if you think Biden is worse than Trump, but having that opinion and seemingly never being able to shut the gently caress up about it and how everyone is silencing you is the worst poo poo in the world. Just... shut the gently caress up. D&D was once a place where you could come to learn about foreign politics or find interesting perspectives, but, lol, no more. This thread is actually the perfect example of this. Allowing people who are forumbanned from D&D to give suggestions on how to moderate a forum that rejected them (and who seemingly spend hours a day hatereading D&D and buying hundreds of dollars worth of avatars, which is loving pathetic) is insanely stupid. Stop assuming people are posting with good intentions, especially when you can just read their post histories and see them literally brag about trolling the forum they're deeply concerned about. (I also want to point out how hilariously ironic it is that despite the key admin lesson of the last two years being "don't listen to extremely online morons who claim how their forum enemies are actually evil racists who silence everyone against them" the admin staff still doesn't seem capable of actually reading D&D and making opinions on the content and moderation and instead relies on second hand evidence. Instead of listening to the people crying about the mean mod who gave them their 150th 6'er, just read USNews for a week and see how moderation works.) Valor fucked around with this message at 19:47 on Sep 5, 2021 |
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Sep 5, 2021 19:38
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It might be interesting if the umbrella news thread were just for posting about facts and other things happened in sub threads. Not that you can't disagree about what's a fact, but I don't know why "politician did thing" and "thing is good/bad" have to happen in the same place. It would be impossible to moderate though, also anything with splitting up uspol is predictably going to end with one of the split threads becoming de facto uspol and all the nontoxic threads getting one post a week.
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Sep 5, 2021 19:57
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I've been posting in d&d since lf closed. I consider this one of my "home" boards. I even ran our politoon awards thread for three years. These last couple of years, I lve enjoyed d&d less and less. The problem is coming from inside (US specific threads) d&d itself, not from outside agitators. Here's a small list of the few things that are causing me to dislike d&d more and more
Also, do not turn off avatars. If I wanted to read fully anonymous political posts I can find them elsewhere Also also, I nominate joepinetree for mod World Famous W fucked around with this message at 21:29 on Sep 5, 2021 |
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Sep 5, 2021 21:08
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Valor posted:Allowing people who are forumbanned from D&D to give suggestions on how to moderate a forum that rejected them When people get forum banned there isn't a poll asking the people who post in it their opinion, it's the mods doing the rejecting and they don't speak for the entire forum
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Sep 5, 2021 21:29
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Booourns posted:When people get forum banned there isn't a poll asking the people who post in it their opinion, it's the mods doing the rejecting and they don't speak for the entire forum Sorry, this is very dumb. No single mod is forum banning people in a vacuum, they are doing it with the approval of admins and the other D&D mods and IKs. The reality is that the admins and mods are far too permissive. Also for the record, my politics are probably to the left of most people in this thread, and my issue isn't with the political content of D&D or CSPAM, its with people being insufferable morons who need to log the gently caress off. Spending hours of your life hate reading D&D is extremely unhealthy and pathetic. Valor fucked around with this message at 23:09 on Sep 5, 2021 |
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Sep 5, 2021 22:51
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Thank you for you opinions and poster history research, person with a three month old account, clean rap sheet and 15 years experience reading the forums. You are definitely the kind of person that should be driving the conversation in this thread. Maybe even mod material!
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Sep 5, 2021 22:58
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HiHo ChiRho posted:Thank you for you opinions and poster history research, person with a three month old account, clean rap sheet and 15 years experience reading the forums. Here's how to fix D&D: let posters attack posters (especially if its funny), stop the dumb decorum moderation, and start banning insane people who can't stop hatereading poo poo for their own good. Also before any admin makes any decisions about D&D they should actually read and participate in the forum for a month. This is true of any forum. You don't need to be a D&D regular or anything, but, like, stop taking people's words for what's going on (even mine!) and just read the forum. Think about how different the Flavius poo poo would've gone when instead of just closing the first QCS threads complaining about him an admin said "hm this seems to be a problem" and just read his posts for a few weeks. He would've been removed far earlier. Valor fucked around with this message at 23:07 on Sep 5, 2021 |
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Sep 5, 2021 23:01
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Here's an example. At least this is funny! Definitely sad, but I laughed. If you're going to be insane about D&D, at least be funny. 
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Sep 5, 2021 23:08
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World Famous W posted:I've been posting in d&d since lf closed. I consider this one of my "home" boards. I even ran our politoon awards thread for three years. These last couple of years, I lve enjoyed d&d less and less. The problem is coming from inside (US specific threads) d&d itself, not from outside agitators. quoting this because I think it sums up my thoughts better than I did. here are my two cents: I'm posting because I haven't posted before. I don't feel any ideological affinity to either see Spam or DND. I will say I feel a lot more comfortable posting in cspam simply just because there's no rules. The environment there is friendly and collegial. in contrast I feel like this forum has gone from a lively place for debate news and current events to a place where you have to tiptoe through the loving tulips about everything. there is too much management of discussion. part of discussion is organic: there will be derails, there will be slap fight between posters. to my mind that's fine it's natural. 75 or 80% of the time I see a probation in this forum I click on the users rap sheet out of pure curiosity. why does this poster get probated for this comment? why does this tangent have to end now whereas another tangent can go on for 15 pages or come up in one form or another over and over and over again in the thread without being spun off. I don't think any one of the comments so far on either side of whatever debate this is thinks that the rules are enforced clearly and consistently. since that is the implicit goal of moderation and we have seen failure after failure on this front I doubt anyone has the self-control to accomplish that. so why don't we just ease up on the moderation. Bring the hammer down on racism homophobia sexism and rape apology. speaking for myself I'm comfortable debating without any rules on how a poster is supposed to behave or if they're engaging in so-called bad faith posting. this moderation question has brought up so much acrimony and so much tedious back-and-forth. at the same time the moderators are desperate to decrease their workload by frantically siphoning off discussions controlling how the discussions are conducted and then end up exhausting themselves when this whole system ends up working exactly how anyone would've predicted: to the benefit of pants pissing dweebs who smash the report button all day and care more about slap fights and owning their posting enemies than actual issues. as far as posters I would like to see moderate the forum I'm really not sure. I guess I just don't keep track of posters that closely. however I've seen willas name brought up a lot and I think she would be a good mod because I don't really see her going out of her way to probe people. at the same time I think she would probably come down on posts that I would find offensive, which are few and far between
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Sep 5, 2021 23:57
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socialsecurity posted:Posters like this are what I think the issue with D&D is, D&D has never been a Democrat cheerleading space and the people who keep saying it is usually are just upset because someone disagreed with some misleading Hill or right wing trash article, the concentration camp was stupid that was less about the words then it was about people just all capsing CONCENTRATION CAMP over and over when trying to discuss and figure out what was actually happening at the border. The idea that D&D wants to somehow define itself as being in opposition to CSPAM doesn't even make sense D&D doesn't have some equal of the succ thread where we obsess and harass Cpsam posters, in fact most D&D posters I know don't want anything to do with CSPAM due to the large amount of hostile assholes. Like a thread dedicated to basically bullying another part of the forum just seems like it just drains more users and drives people away. This post is an example of the largest problem facing D&D. The guy thinks they're being persecuted by gangstalkers because someone made fun of the dumb thing they said. Making fun of the dumb things people say is a core SA value. Many of D&D's posters have this bunker mentality where they are under constant assault from the laughing hyenas who do not respect their obviously correct worldview. Anyone who disagrees is an unserious troll posting in bad faith. Arguments can be easily dismissed with no effort as childish fantasies that don't bear engaging with. Only *serious* people, who believe *serious* things, should be allowed to speak in this *serious* holy place and everyone else is a defiler. It leads to mods policing the argument itself rather than the posters making the argument. Uncomfortable topics get siloed off to wither and smug posts on the 'right' side of an argument are ignored while the 'wrong' side gets smacked, because obviously the only reason anyone would hold a 'wrong' belief is to harass and troll Also, just look at this poo poo. the_steve associated with the enemy! Impure! They should be purged before it emboldens the harassers! That kinda poo poo is the foundation for half the petty sniping and condescension that pervades D&D. D&D has a very us vs them, bunker mentality going on. They're constantly under siege by monsters in their mind. There used to be a channel on the USPOL discord that was basically 24/7 complaining about posting enemies until it was shut down for being too toxic. I leave it as an exercise for the reader to determine who the superstars in that channel were. So what do you do about it? Either appoint mods of explicitly differing biases or just double down on building an echo chamber. For the former, pick an actual leftwing poster like Willa, Ytlaya, or joepinetree. Not only are they all good posters in a vacuum, but having someone on the D&D mod team with actual left wing views would shake up the way moderation happens. For the latter pick How are u, Raenir Salazar, or Discendo Vox. All three are distillations of the current spirit of D&D. Or if you really wanted to show D&D is a wasteland containment zone for tedious shitheads, put evilweasel back in charge. Under no circumstances should D&D get an admin though, thats insane. Admins should be drawn exclusively from chill forums. Also get rid of Ralph
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Sep 6, 2021 00:21
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I lurk mostly and post news when I see it. I find the cspam/D&D drama annoying and anyone even bringing up one or the other should eat a probation. The moderation is poo poo mostly because there is a clear lack of consistency. Bring back USPol and make Vilerat the only mod.
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Sep 6, 2021 00:41
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Also the concept of a derail is dumb. Most 'derails' naturally end in a page or two if no one is really interested, and if a topic goes on for longer than that its either a slow news day without much to talk about or it keeps getting engagement because its relevant to the topic of the thread. If you want to end a 'derail' just post something else relevant to the thread that posters want to engage with. The attempt to manage and prune discussion is inherently self defeating because then the derail becomes discussing the management of the discussion, and meta poo poo always draws out posting feuds more reliably than anything else.
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Sep 6, 2021 00:42
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In my opinion, anyone who actively wants to be a mod shouldn't be allowed to be a mod
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Sep 6, 2021 00:47
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Ego should be as out of the equation as possible. The opinions of IKs, mods and admins are sacrosanct, which stifles discussions. There should be different, ideally anonymous accounts for the modding and adminning from the posting. Call them mod_1 through mod_8 or something. Additionally, it's ridiculous that someone like Professor Beetus is some kind of IK, but the account has no icon or nothing and you get probed for disagreeing with them.
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Sep 6, 2021 00:52
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fuctifino posted:In my opinion, anyone who actively wants to be a mod shouldn't be allowed to be a mod A million times that. They are all so eager, it oozes out of their every atom. Hedge in case not nominating specific modes/admins is against the rules: Nooner Derpies Lil Swamp Booger Baby Mr. Smile Face Hat fucked around with this message at 04:28 on Sep 6, 2021 |
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Sep 6, 2021 00:53
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I follow DnD closely, one might almost say obsessively, yet I never post here. I would make for the ideal mod.
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Sep 6, 2021 00:59
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I think people should be able to make a thread like 'Trump is good, actually' or say that 'every member of the American armed forces is morally bankrupt'. Perhaps these things are true, perhaps they are not, but if this is supposed to be a debate forum we should be able to debate things in it. I'm sorry I do not have a mod recommendation for you because it is pretty clear d&d is ideologically focused and this has largely kept me from posting outside the NZpol thread. Thanks for the effort anyway.
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Sep 6, 2021 01:24
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Weka posted:I think people should be able to make a thread like 'Trump is good, actually' or say that 'every member of the American armed forces is morally bankrupt'. Perhaps these things are true, perhaps they are not, but if this is supposed to be a debate forum we should be able to debate things in it. Are there rules against such things? Have you ever seen someone punished for making such a thread?
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Sep 6, 2021 01:29
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When it comes to what's forbidden in D&D the main things in comparison to C-SPAM are slurs, advocating political violence and genocide denial. That's what C-SPAM has fought for and like hell anyone should ever forget it.
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Sep 6, 2021 02:40
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I had originally sent a PM as the thread was closed when I had finished typing up my post, but currently I think D&D as a subforum is mostly fine, having largely corrected its excessive drift towards radicalization during the primaries but currently lacks enough moderators to properly implement its relatively simple rules. As for what D&D should be, its the debate forum; but also the discussion forum, D and, as it turns out, another D. In order to have discussion, people should be able to feel comfortable to express themselves, especially when such opinions can be transgressive or unpopular; as an example, suppose hypothetically someone was a monarchist and not merely playing devil's advocate; they absolutely should in an ideal version of D&D, be able to feel safe in posting in D&D without fear of harassment, without people finding out of context posts to try to trigger mod enforcement for something that didn't happen in D&D. This is what I consider to be the ideal form of D&D, that people of various beliefs, as long as they are willing to put in the effort, find the historical economic, or scientific or theoretical evidence to back up their beliefs, they should be able to post threads or posts or participate in discussion with the mods carefully navigating the discussion to extract the most amount of value for the community by exposure to those beliefs and keeping the discussion from getting heated; ideally mods should be neutral-ish participants acting like a more casual form of debate moderator, asking questions of each "side" in a debate to encourage people to expand upon their points and create a more friendly and casual space while simultaniously working to make it a place where actual discussion happens; and not merely as refs calling fouls with a really loud whistle and only after things have degraded to that point. D&D to me is the forum I'm most comfortable posting in, one that most plays to my style of online posting and to my interests in various topics and hobbies; D&D is a subforum that to me, feels like I am encouraged to post more instead of less, and that my effort is actually rewarded in an environment where the expectations are to respond with a proportionate amount of effort. Why should anyone put in an hour or so effort in writing a post, trying to make your point clear only for "lol" or some blatant misrepresentation of your point? D&D is the place that at least ostensibly claims that bullshit isn't tolerated, and that no matter how right someone thinks they are, the expectation is on them to substantiate their argument and not respond with copy and paste talking points. So when it comes to "picking sides" or whatever, I don't think its somehow impossible to pick mods who value sanity, chill, and reasoned longform argument. This isn't a liberal vs leftist vs progressive thing, very often its "is this person being too aggro? Does this person need to chill for a bit? Can they respond better" and so on; but probably the most important thing is on a somewhat deeper level a willingness to hear people out and some sort of belief that sectarian beefs are a waste of everyone time; people got books to read, anime to watch, games to be playing, classes or work to go to, commitments, poo poo thats more important than an internet argument, and that's something I think a lot of people easily forget, these are internet arguments; I'm certainly guilty of stressing out too much over them, I know how that feels to so desperately want to prove that I'm right; yet to be drawn into these arguments nonetheless; it's annoying. It makes my hackles stand on end, to what goal do we do this? What do we want to accomplish? It's frustrating, even if you try to avoid it, the end result is the same. This is why its important to have good moderators, or rather, good moderation. So people don't feel frustrated or stressed over an online space that doesn't affect the real world. So to summarize, more mods/iks, like twice as many so more threads can recieve the attention they deserve and the busier threads aren't without an IK or moderator or two for more than a 30 minute to an hour stretch of time unless it's like late in the evening over most North American timezones. To that end, here is my list of people who I think could be good moderators in keeping with the above principles, people/posters who I think have typically acted as part of living their principles or at least seemed chill enough. My mod suggestions: Thorn Wishes Talon Alchenar Dead Reckoning (at least a SCOTUS thread IK!) Nebakenezzer Promote CommieGIR to mod. Leon Trotsky 2012 Dapper_Swindler Rust Martialis Darkrenown James Garfield Paracaidas SlothfulCobra zoux Mellow Seas I haven't seen them post much in D&D but I think they all have good heads: mlmp08 bewbies
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Sep 6, 2021 03:15
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World Famous W posted:I've been posting in d&d since lf closed. I consider this one of my "home" boards. I even ran our politoon awards thread for three years. These last couple of years, I lve enjoyed d&d less and less. The problem is coming from inside (US specific threads) d&d itself, not from outside agitators. Largely agree with this. Also there needs to be a lot less tone policing and people trying really drat hard to be MLK Jr's "white moderate." US politics is hell and every lovely political thing that happens at this point affects thousands if not millions in tangible ways. People are going to get heated and abrasive over this because being angry is the natural response to what is happening around us right now. Trying to push every post to be 100+ words or some calm detached tone comes across more as sociopathy than reasonableness. As long as it doesn't just turn into a bunch of slurs and direct insults, letting people vent and slapfight a bit is better than being heavyhanded at the first sight of hostility. Also less democrat bootlicking unless you're going to just make an unironic "dem cheerleading thread." The trend of it being discussions that are negative towards democrat leadership that quickly get shut down or silo'd off is pretty clear and pretty pathetic. Anyway I nominate Willa, Ytlaya, or joepinetree for mod if you want to actually make the place better.
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Sep 6, 2021 03:45
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No one wants to read D&D much less be a mod for it because everyone who regularly posts here takes five paragraphs just to get to their point and then they expect the same wordcount in response or else they'll report or disregard. It's an insular bubble of petty and verbose people who - according to site admins - will frequently burn through their daily allotment of reports in order to get their so-called "posting enemies" in trouble for disagreeing with them. The latest mods meanwhile use their power as a cudgel to shut down and divert discussions about the effectiveness of democrats in the U.S. because anything that goes against the democratic party line actively makes them uncomfortable and irritable. This is not a functional model for a debate forum that will create anything other than a centrist neoliberal echo chamber. As for choices, I nominate Willa, Ytlaya, the_steve, and joepinetree for mod, since they seem to have a better head about these sorts of problems than most.
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Sep 6, 2021 04:25
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