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raminasi posted:I don't understand why companies that do this don't just grant promotion bonuses as backpay. (I mean, I do know, it's because they don't have to and nobody thinks like that, but I can dream.) Companies that are famous for doing this in tech will have equity grants alongside the performance reviews required to get promoted that result in you getting paid for your improved performance prior to promotion.
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Sep 14, 2021 22:46
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I hear there's a Discord for jaded tech workers. I'm pretty jaded and ready to mingle. Any chance I could get in?
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Sep 15, 2021 15:36
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You need to have around 25 jaded posts in this thread. Or get approval from someone cool, which I am certainly not at all.
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Sep 15, 2021 15:57
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Dang. sad jaded noises
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Sep 15, 2021 16:25
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I could stand to receive a pm with an invite to this jaded discord, maybe.
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Sep 15, 2021 16:46
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Anyone have tips or stories about sharing or not sharing your wildly high compensation numbers with civilians?
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Sep 15, 2021 17:52
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awesomeolion posted:Anyone have tips or stories about sharing or not sharing your wildly high compensation numbers with civilians? Lead or follow with how ridiculous the market is right now. If you're extremely embarrassed, do that and only talk base not total.
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Sep 15, 2021 17:54
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awesomeolion posted:Anyone have tips or stories about sharing or not sharing your wildly high compensation numbers with civilians? If people are curious or giving numbers I'll be open about it and if they aren't I won't. I also won't open a conversation with it because that's ultra douchey. Like "i just got a new bmw because when you make 200k a year you can treat yourself!" My wife is embarrassed about it so I won't talk hard numbers in front of her at all. She knows how much I make obviously but she feels like it's gauche and braggy under any circumstances.
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Sep 15, 2021 18:21
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I was pretty severely underpaid ($40k in a supposedly hot midwestern job market) when I started my first industry job years ago. I didn't know it at the time, though, as redneck me had just graduated and I'd never seen numbers that big before. Even that vast underpayment elicited a "that's more than both of us make combined" from my parents. I don't talk salary anymore unless it's with my wife or a colleague. I've been interviewing again lately and I'm apparently still underpaid, if a bit less than before. At least we're comfortable enough given our circumstances.
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Sep 15, 2021 19:05
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Talking openly about compensation among my real life programmer friends is one of the biggest mutually beneficial career topics we've discussed. A couple years ago we all motivated each other to get new jobs and everyone like doubled their comp. The market moves fast and in my experience all the things like Glassdoor and Payscale and LinkedIn are woefully behind the times, and also focus way too solely on salary. If you believe those sites you're going to get TC like 25-50% less than market, or worse. Levels.fyi is the best one, but getting real world reports from your own locality from people you know and trust and generally have a feel for their skills and personality is even better. New Yorp New Yorp posted:My wife is embarrassed about it so I won't talk hard numbers in front of her at all. Hopefully you mean when other people are present. I sure hope you can discuss hard numbers about your household finances with your wife. Guinness fucked around with this message at 19:48 on Sep 15, 2021 |
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Sep 15, 2021 19:46
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i'm destitute by thread standards but very comfy by local standards. cost of living around here is super low. i don't ever mention actual numbers unless i know they either make the same as me or could be making the same as me. everyone else i just say something along the lines of "i make decent money" or "enough to support my [honestly very frugal] lifestyle", else i feel like i'm bragging i have a couple (developer) friends who were being comically underpaid and helped them get similar pay.
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Sep 15, 2021 20:05
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Guinness posted:Talking openly about compensation among my real life programmer friends is one of the biggest mutually beneficial career topics we've discussed. A couple years ago we all motivated each other to get new jobs and everyone like doubled their comp. It's this, yes This is true for a lot of things, if you hang out with fat people, statistically you'll probably gain weight; if you hang out with academic nerds, chances are your grades will go up. If you hang out with people gaming their salary numbers.... Chances are your income will rise. That said, the negotiation thread here on SA is probably worth cumulatively $100k to me over the last decade, probably more, everyone should go bookmark that thread immediately
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Sep 15, 2021 20:12
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Hadlock posted:That said, the negotiation thread here on SA is probably worth cumulatively $100k to me over the last decade, probably more, everyone should go bookmark that thread immediately 
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Sep 15, 2021 20:15
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Hadlock posted:That said, the negotiation thread here on SA is probably worth cumulatively $100k to me over the last decade, probably more, everyone should go bookmark that thread immediately I truly believe that thread alone has been cumulatively worth many millions of dollars to goons VVVVV yeah, only with my closer friends that are also devs, not to everyone. if someone asks and really wants to know I'll share, but otherwise i don't bring it up Guinness fucked around with this message at 20:23 on Sep 15, 2021 |
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Sep 15, 2021 20:19
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Guinness posted:Talking openly about compensation among my real life programmer friends is one of the biggest mutually beneficial career topics we've discussed. A couple years ago we all motivated each other to get new jobs and everyone like doubled their comp. Yeah, this is my stance when talking to other devs, but if I'm talking to a friend who isn't a dev I just don't talk about concrete numbers unless directly asked because it really is an embarrassing amount of money
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Sep 15, 2021 20:19
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Hadlock posted:That said, the negotiation thread here on SA is probably worth cumulatively $100k to me over the last decade, probably more, everyone should go bookmark that thread immediately Whoops I meant to say cumulatively $100k extra salary per year lmfao To date it's probably like $500,000-600k lifetime total earnings, so far Best $10 I ever spent Of course nobody talked me out of moving from Texas to California, so now I pay an extra 10% in taxes (state income) but overall it's been a huge net positive
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Sep 15, 2021 20:30
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Hadlock posted:Whoops I meant to say cumulatively $100k extra salary per year lmfao You don't live in Texas which seems pretty great
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Sep 15, 2021 20:38
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Hadlock posted:That said, the negotiation thread here on SA is probably worth cumulatively $100k to me over the last decade, probably more, everyone should go bookmark that thread immediately Highly recommend to every and anyone to read the whole thread front to back. Thread has collectively earned goons millions of dollars more than they'd otherwise have as a class. The outcomes from that thread are insane and individually tangible.
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Sep 15, 2021 20:38
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RC Cola posted:You don't live in Texas which seems pretty great I just moved here. It's hot and terrible, but the tax situation seems nice.
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Sep 15, 2021 20:39
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leper khan posted:I just moved here. It's hot and terrible, but the tax situation seems nice. Don't worry, sometimes it gets cold and you don't have power anymore. That's the price to pay for freedom though 
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Sep 15, 2021 20:43
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Guinness posted:Hopefully you mean when other people are present. I sure hope you can discuss hard numbers about your household finances with your wife. Yes, that's what I meant. My friends and I are very open about talking about how much we make and it makes her uncomfortable, so I stopped doing it in front of her. It's probably for the best because there were a few awkward situations in mixed company with some of her friends. Like saying "I got a pretty decent bonus this year, 40k." in front of someone who makes 35k, for whom a 40k bonus would absolutely be a staggering, life-changing windfall.
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Sep 15, 2021 20:44
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RC Cola posted:You don't live in Texas which seems pretty great Yeah I have a daughter now and I'm regretting leaving Texas a whole lot less now given Very Recent developments The taxes are higher in California but there's just no way I was ever going to get to the point where I could The food in Texas is a lot better though
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Sep 15, 2021 20:47
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Hadlock posted:Yeah I have a daughter now and I'm regretting leaving Texas a whole lot less now given Very Recent developments My TC is still north of 200k, and I can afford to buy what would be an insanely large house in SF. Political sit is real dumb right now. Not sure how to address that really, but if tech keeps moving here maybe that will sort itself. Probably not. 
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Sep 15, 2021 21:04
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Politics in Texas largely boils down to how much of the latino vote republicans can flip before the 2030 census/redistricting Texas almost voted Ted Cruz (R-TX) out in favor of a democratic challenger (Beto), and in the next Trumpless election, a Very Moderate democrat might actually have a shot at winning Texas in a national election but that's 4-8 years away, I'm going to change jobs three times before that happens
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Sep 15, 2021 21:50
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Hadlock posted:that's 4-8 years away, I'm going to change jobs three times before that happens 
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Sep 15, 2021 22:15
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Literally memorizing Kleppmann and then asking myself how I'd design a bunch of example systems should be good prep for an L5 system design interview, right? Was also going to memorize the top 20-40% of papers cited in each chapter but if I'm not aiming for L6 then there's probably no need to shock my interviewers with technical details, so just being able to coherently present an effective solution should be good enough? I'm like 60% through. Got the first 50% understood and memorized but getting pretty burnt out going through it so quick. Takes me like 45 minutes to walk through my memory of it at this point so about to start spacing out my repetitions.
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Sep 15, 2021 22:28
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Any competent interviewer will be able to very easily distinguish between things you've memorized and things you actually understand. You probably shouldn't count on a system design interview being incompetent.
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Sep 15, 2021 22:31
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oliveoil have you literally never done a system design interview? You demonstrate an extremely misguided understanding of them.
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Sep 15, 2021 22:44
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You can't memorize your way into a system design interview. You'll be expected to talk about alternatives and why you didn't use them.
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Sep 15, 2021 22:45
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That and... studying isn't really going to help you get the experience working on something end to end at all, which is what you really need to succeed in these. Not just textbook memorization.
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Sep 15, 2021 22:50
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A friend at a FAANG walked me through some mock system interviews, and I completely flubbed them at first. His problem statement was something like "We want to make an Instagram clone, how would you design that?" and I immediately came up with rapidfire questions about budgets, what repurposable resources were already in place, PII requirements, etc... all the stuff that does need to get asked if you're actually designing a production system. He looked bewildered, and gently explained that really he was just after "you set up a web server with load balancers and a back end DB, and then chat about how you'd scale it up from there".
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Sep 15, 2021 22:56
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oliveoil posted:Literally memorizing Kleppmann and then asking myself how I'd design a bunch of example systems should be good prep for an L5 system design interview, right? I'll go a bit against the grain and say... maybe? If you're actually learning and retaining Kleppmann and are able to put it all together in practice in a system design then that's going to be better than most people do. You should also read up and practice a bit with the actual structure of a system design interview, asking the right questions is one of the most important parts of the system design interview, so if you just go in and take the problem statement and start throwing stuff on the whiteboard you're not going to do well.
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Sep 15, 2021 23:18
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minato posted:A friend at a FAANG walked me through some mock system interviews, and I completely flubbed them at first. His problem statement was something like "We want to make an Instagram clone, how would you design that?" and I immediately came up with rapidfire questions about budgets, what repurposable resources were already in place, PII requirements, etc... all the stuff that does need to get asked if you're actually designing a production system. He looked bewildered, and gently explained that really he was just after "you set up a web server with load balancers and a back end DB, and then chat about how you'd scale it up from there". His question is trash and your answer is way better than what is expected though you can condense it into just asking what the requirements are.
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Sep 15, 2021 23:22
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longtime reader first time poster: normally I want everyone to stack figgies and get paid, companies be damned buuuuuuut the kid trying to parlay "decent L3 review" into "l6 job": lmao gently caress off
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Sep 15, 2021 23:39
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Jose Valasquez posted:I'll go a bit against the grain and say... maybe? Yeah it seems straightforward for the most part and I think I'd be able to use most of it right now except for some stuff about replication challenges and implementing some of the serializable transaction levels which might be tricky to reason about in an interview. Leaderless replication is also something I glazed over so I'll have to go back and understand that before I can really memorize it too. I'll look at some examples of system design interviews and see how they're structured, that's a good idea. Thank you! Good Will Hrunting posted:That and... studying isn't really going to help you get the experience working on something end to end at all, which is what you really need to succeed in these. Not just textbook memorization. If you haven't worked on a system with a graph database then will you just fail if an interviewer's favorite question is best served by one? Ensign Expendable posted:You can't memorize your way into a system design interview. You'll be expected to talk about alternatives and why you didn't use them. How do you know what alternatives exist if you don't read about them and remember them somehow? Very few people would have used all the alternatives, even at big companies. minato posted:I immediately came up with rapidfire questions about budgets, what repurposable resources were already in place, PII requirements, etc... These are things (plus reliability, privacy, testing, future maintenance and operational demands, etc) I've considered in real designs. Even my first job had me figuring out how to process credit card info in my first few months, which probably wasn't a great idea for a junior who barely understood GET vs POST, though my seniors reviewed it. Actually, now that I think about it, my first job lasted six months but gave me way more room to independently gather requirements and design solutions much faster than at Google.
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Sep 16, 2021 01:37
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I feel nostalgic for how!! riling up the thread by saying that tech interviews should be week-long implementations of Enterprise FizzBuzz. Those were good times.
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Sep 16, 2021 03:57
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Mniot posted:I feel nostalgic for how!! riling up the thread by saying that tech interviews should be week-long implementations of Enterprise FizzBuzz. Those were good times. And the solution to every problem was to rewrite from scratch.
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Sep 16, 2021 04:22
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New Yorp New Yorp posted:And the solution to every problem was to rewrite from scratch. When you're L6 it takes them a lot longer to fire you for reimplementing everything. At higher levels you can even make up a new language to use in the rewrite.
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Sep 16, 2021 04:46
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Mniot posted:When you're L6 it takes them a lot longer to fire you for reimplementing everything. Making a new language for a total rewrite of some product at a major tech company is a level of resume driven development that most people can only dream of.
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Sep 16, 2021 04:49
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wilderthanmild posted:Making a new language for a total rewrite of some product at a major tech company is a level of resume driven development that most people can only dream of. it's even better when the proprietary language comes with a 350 page long manual written by the author of that language.
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Sep 16, 2021 12:55
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