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His Divine Shadow
Aug 7, 2000

I'm not a fascist. I'm a priest. Fascists dress up in black and tell people what to do.

And these fuckers are who we're supposed to integrate out electricity market with.

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Wibla
Feb 16, 2011

We're currently draining our already too-empty water reservoirs so the government and big power companies can profit off of this crunch via the continental power cables that have gone online the last couple of years.

I sure as gently caress am happy to live in an apartment with electric heating. Not.

CommieGIR
Aug 22, 2006

The blue glow is a feature, not a bug


Pillbug
https://twitter.com/isabelleboemeke/status/1438501245619105809?s=20

Heck Yes! Loam!
Nov 15, 2004

a rich, friable soil containing a relatively equal mixture of sand and silt and a somewhat smaller proportion of clay.

Its going to be the same in CA for Diablo Canyon.

It's so shortsighted and stupid.

MomJeans420
Mar 19, 2007



No don't worry the law says it needs to be replaced with carbon neutral power, problem solved.

Grouchio
Aug 31, 2014

One should always expect a little pushback when there's a massive shift towards action on an issue.
Renewables is unfortunately no exception.

Unormal
Nov 16, 2004

Mod sass? This evening?! But the cakes aren't ready! THE CAKES!
Fun Shoe

If you cant just use gasoline whats the point.

Pander
Oct 9, 2007

Fear is the glue that holds society together. It's what makes people suppress their worst impulses. Fear is power.

And at the end of fear, oblivion.



Grouchio posted:

One should always expect a little pushback when there's a massive shift towards action on an issue.
Renewables is unfortunately no exception.

What does this even mean?

Are you suggesting that an inability to deliver on promised renewable deployment at the level needed to prevent the eradication of most species on earth through unfettered fossil fuel deployment is "a little pushback"?

bane mask golem
Sep 16, 2021

by Fluffdaddy

Grouchio posted:

One should always expect a little pushback when there's a massive shift towards action on an issue.
Renewables is unfortunately no exception.

Doesn't that depend on why there's a massive shift towards action? I mean, I really wish there was more of a massive shift towards action on fighting climate change, lord knows we could use it. I'd hate for anyone to have a knee-jerk reaction against that.

QuarkJets
Sep 8, 2008

Grouchio posted:

One should always expect a little pushback when there's a massive shift towards action on an issue.
Renewables is unfortunately no exception.

No, this is the desired outcome and is why the fossil fuel industry aggressively pushes to shut down nuclear power. Replacing nuclear power with more fossil fuels is the intended end state.

RDevz
Dec 7, 2002

Wasn't me Guv

Wibla posted:

We're currently draining our already too-empty water reservoirs so the government and big power companies can profit off of this crunch via the continental power cables that have gone online the last couple of years.

There's a 1.4 GW, 450 mile long HVDC interconnector between Norway and England that's going through commissioning. Britain could really use that power right now. Week-ahead baseload for delivery next week was trading at about £230/MWh on Thursday. This is caused by both European gas prices being really high, and in part because the substation at Sellindge where the 2 GW IFA1 cable lands in England from France caught fire earlier this week. As a result, 1 GW of capacity will be offline for one month, the other 1 GW of the capacity will be offline for six months, and it currently looks like this:



This is not how it's supposed to look. It's meant to look like this:

MomJeans420
Mar 19, 2007



Are the winds still abnormally calm there? I don't really follow wind power but there was more variation than I expected in its generation. Definitely isn't doing as well in 2021 as it was in 2020, and from what I've read the France - England cable won't be repaired until March 2022.

RDevz
Dec 7, 2002

Wasn't me Guv

MomJeans420 posted:

Are the winds still abnormally calm there? I don't really follow wind power but there was more variation than I expected in its generation. Definitely isn't doing as well in 2021 as it was in 2020, and from what I've read the France - England cable won't be repaired until March 2022.

Yes, we’ve got wind running at less than 10% of nominal capacity right now, which isn’t helping matters.

The last time I checked National Grid’s REMIT submission for IFA, there were saying an outage to mid-October on one cable and to 31st March 2022 on the other. The latter date is almost certainly a guess and was probably published in a massive rush to stop the regulator swooping in with a massive fine for misleading the market.

CommieGIR
Aug 22, 2006

The blue glow is a feature, not a bug


Pillbug

QuarkJets posted:

No, this is the desired outcome and is why the fossil fuel industry aggressively pushes to shut down nuclear power. Replacing nuclear power with more fossil fuels is the intended end state.

And hell, you've got Germany telling the EU Commission that "Natural Gas is Green Energy", its pretty blatant now days how bad this is.

MiddleOne
Feb 17, 2011

CommieGIR posted:

And hell, you've got Germany telling the EU Commission that "Natural Gas is Green Energy", its pretty blatant now days how bad this is.

The clearest indication that natural gas isn't going anywhere is that through the last two decades cutting off the pipelines to Russia has never even been on table. Instead it's expansion.

CommieGIR
Aug 22, 2006

The blue glow is a feature, not a bug


Pillbug

MiddleOne posted:

The clearest indication that natural gas isn't going anywhere is that through the last two decades cutting off the pipelines to Russia has never even been on table. Instead it's expansion.

Yup

https://twitter.com/chrispydog/status/1439375895693697029?s=20

Phanatic
Mar 13, 2007

Please don't forget that I am an extremely racist idiot who also has terrible opinions about the Culture series.
https://twitter.com/thehill/status/1439046767622774785


Um...sure. 2025. At that point why not just say "By next Tuesday"?

mediaphage
Mar 22, 2007

Excuse me, pardon me, sheer perfection coming through

Phanatic posted:

https://twitter.com/thehill/status/1439046767622774785


Um...sure. 2025. At that point why not just say "By next Tuesday"?

lmao what????

like. what, i don't even.

mediaphage
Mar 22, 2007

Excuse me, pardon me, sheer perfection coming through
i bet he misspoke and meant to say coal.

Gort
Aug 18, 2003

Good day what ho cup of tea

mediaphage posted:

i bet he misspoke and meant to say coal.

Even that doesn't seem likely.

mediaphage
Mar 22, 2007

Excuse me, pardon me, sheer perfection coming through

Gort posted:

Even that doesn't seem likely.

not sure, it was "only" 10% of energy production last year.

CommieGIR
Aug 22, 2006

The blue glow is a feature, not a bug


Pillbug
"Look, we're burying the carbon as fast as we can!"

QuarkJets
Sep 8, 2008

Phanatic posted:

https://twitter.com/thehill/status/1439046767622774785


Um...sure. 2025. At that point why not just say "By next Tuesday"?

100% he said twenty when he meant thirty, that's clear from the context of the video. The infrastructure plan has always had 2035 as that target.

SporkChan
Oct 20, 2010

One day I will proofread my posts well, but today is not that day.

QuarkJets posted:

100% he said twenty when he meant thirty, that's clear from the context of the video. The infrastructure plan has always had 2035 as that target.

Even that date is almost certainly predicated on using carbon tax credits so they can claim there is "0 effective carbon".

Grouchio
Aug 31, 2014

Let the President shoot for the stars - it's way better than what I expected from him a year ago.

QuarkJets
Sep 8, 2008

SporkChan posted:

Even that date is almost certainly predicated on using carbon tax credits so they can claim there is "0 effective carbon".

Maybe, I don't recall the infrastructure plan mentioning carbon tax credits anywhere but that's possible. The point is that a green (or "green") electrical grid by 2035 is somewhat possible, but optimistic, whereas 2025 isn't

FreeKillB
May 13, 2009
The payment program (CEPP) last I saw was essentially targeting 80% clean energy (excluding most CCUS and biomass) by 2030. 2025 is close enough that I am not sure it would be technically feasible even if you removed literally all political obstacles and applied the entire productive capacity of the economy towards clean energy.

Grouchio
Aug 31, 2014

FreeKillB posted:

The payment program (CEPP) last I saw was essentially targeting 80% clean energy (excluding most CCUS and biomass) by 2030. 2025 is close enough that I am not sure it would be technically feasible even if you removed literally all political obstacles and applied the entire productive capacity of the economy towards clean energy.
Yeah I think he meant 2035. Replacing every source of energy with renewables within four years is implausible.

Wibla
Feb 16, 2011

They can't even get an area regulated for nuclear power in 4 years, by the looks of things :v:

Orvin
Sep 9, 2006




Phanatic posted:

https://twitter.com/thehill/status/1439046767622774785


Um...sure. 2025. At that point why not just say "By next Tuesday"?

Well, there is one way to get it done by 2025. Just shut it all down. Not a realistic approach, but definitely a possible solution.

And if crazy poo poo like the Texas cold snap keeps happening with no repercussions to the companies that helped to cause it, a nationwide blackout is definitely a possibility. Because during that event it wasn’t just Texas that was having a bad time. MISO Energy (ISO for the center of the country) was having a really bad time, and I am pretty sure was one or two unit trips away from losing it all. I see the grid adjacent to them, and I had never seen transmission transfers like I did that day.

FistEnergy
Nov 3, 2000

DAY CREW: WORKING HARD

Fun Shoe

Orvin posted:

Well, there is one way to get it done by 2025. Just shut it all down. Not a realistic approach, but definitely a possible solution.

And if crazy poo poo like the Texas cold snap keeps happening with no repercussions to the companies that helped to cause it, a nationwide blackout is definitely a possibility. Because during that event it wasn’t just Texas that was having a bad time. MISO Energy (ISO for the center of the country) was having a really bad time, and I am pretty sure was one or two unit trips away from losing it all. I see the grid adjacent to them, and I had never seen transmission transfers like I did that day.

I uh have a lot of experience and information in the same realm (MISO/PJM) and I uhhhh......agree lol

Total Meatlove
Jan 28, 2007

:japan:
Rangers died, shoujo Hitler cried ;_;
Talking about criminally under-invested in transmission networks, have PG&E replaced all of their rotten parts yet?

evil_bunnY
Apr 2, 2003

Total Meatlove posted:

Talking about criminally under-invested in transmission networks, have PG&E replaced all of their rotten parts yet?
Lol what does your heart tell you. I'd be shocked if they even had a decent inventory/plan

MomJeans420
Mar 19, 2007



I think you have to give the CPUC some of that blame

Phanatic
Mar 13, 2007

Please don't forget that I am an extremely racist idiot who also has terrible opinions about the Culture series.
Ah, cool, all our problems have been solved.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2021/09/17/whitest-paint-created-global-warming/8378579002/

quote:

The whitest paint in the world has been created in a lab at Purdue University, a paint so white that it could eventually reduce or even eliminate the need for air conditioning, scientists say.

The paint reflects 98.1% of solar radiation while also emitting infrared heat. Because the paint absorbs less heat from the sun than it emits, a surface coated with this paint is cooled below the surrounding temperature without consuming power.

Young lady, in this house we obey the laws of thermodynamics!

Grouchio
Aug 31, 2014

Phanatic posted:

Ah, cool, all our problems have been solved.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2021/09/17/whitest-paint-created-global-warming/8378579002/

Young lady, in this house we obey the laws of thermodynamics!
It could be considered the tiniest sliver of progress, but it's progress I'll take.

MomJeans420
Mar 19, 2007



between this paint and solar roads, we're set

CommieGIR
Aug 22, 2006

The blue glow is a feature, not a bug


Pillbug
In all seriousness I know there was a lot of studies showing changing streets from black to light grey/white lowered temperatures in cities by a couple degrees.

Kalman
Jan 17, 2010

CommieGIR posted:

In all seriousness I know there was a lot of studies showing changing streets from black to light grey/white lowered temperatures in cities by a couple degrees.

This is actually semi-meaningful because it reduces temperature inside buildings which means less AC required in the building, which means less power required.

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Phanatic
Mar 13, 2007

Please don't forget that I am an extremely racist idiot who also has terrible opinions about the Culture series.

Kalman posted:

This is actually semi-meaningful because it reduces temperature inside buildings which means less AC required in the building, which means less power required.

Which is just a matter of white paint. We've known for a long time that painting roofs white reflects sunlight and if you're in a sunny environment that will keep the building cooler.

Phanatic fucked around with this message at 18:01 on Sep 21, 2021

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