(Thread IKs:
fart simpson)
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FrancisFukyomama posted:the inscrutable New Zealander and his Confucian value system
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Sep 21, 2021 16:25
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*bows solemnly* there is much wisdom in that land
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Sep 21, 2021 16:27
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gradenko_2000 posted:I'm almost done with reading a biography on Deng and not only did he consider himself to be a communist through-and-through, he himself was struggling against the liberals and the roaders that wanted China to open up even more than he already did poo poo, i might have to read that book, it sounds fascinating. i've really only read a few of his speeches but they were pretty loving straightforward; he wanted productive forces to get the country off the ground and the people out of poverty. it really wasn't some secret sneak attack plan against the US, they were pretty open about what they were trying to do, but deng also knew that hamming up awe over the developed world and putting on the cowboy hat, literally and figuratively, would lead the western capitalists to believe what they wanted to believe. it didn't have to be this big conspiratorial secret, it could be and was done all out in the open. i think he also had more of a hand in that there aren't really deng worshippers or a powerful cabal of unironic dengists than we may know; he very clearly saw this period of building productive forces as a transition phase and there's a lot of people in politics, even in china, who start worshipping methods that bring results and trying to apply them to wildly inapplicable material conditions. this is also called the dialectics coming to a screeching halt and ending in disaster. i'd like to know more about some of the inside baseball of what the party was like between zemin and jintao, and then jintao to xi eras, like what various factions and cliques were fighting about. from what i understand, some "dengists" still had a lot of power and influence in the party and xi's clique is what finally wrested control away from them. my best guess is that deng continued and highly encouraged open self-crit sessions, which made it harder for people to do that thing where they dogmatically follow a method and hide the disasters that causes from everyone else to protect their ego.
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Sep 21, 2021 16:36
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No nazis in ukraine! https://twitter.com/Mango_Press_/status/1440086092074549249
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Sep 21, 2021 16:36
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hot witch divorcee posted:i think he also had more of a hand in that there aren't really deng worshippers or a powerful cabal of unironic dengists than we may know; he very clearly saw this period of building productive forces as a transition phase and there's a lot of people in politics, even in china, who start worshipping methods that bring results and trying to apply them to wildly inapplicable material conditions. this is also called the dialectics coming to a screeching halt and ending in disaster. i'd like to know more about some of the inside baseball of what the party was like between zemin and jintao, and then jintao to xi eras, like what various factions and cliques were fighting about. from what i understand, some "dengists" still had a lot of power and influence in the party and xi's clique is what finally wrested control away from them. my best guess is that deng continued and highly encouraged open self-crit sessions, which made it harder for people to do that thing where they dogmatically follow a method and hide the disasters that causes from everyone else to protect their ego. yeah the book is going to peter-out after Deng (ofc it's a biography lol) but we've just been introduced to Jiang Zemin as a Shanghai party boss that worked to repress a proto-Tiananmen in 1986 and I wanna see what happens next
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Sep 21, 2021 16:50
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gradenko_2000 posted:yeah the book is going to peter-out after Deng (ofc it's a biography lol) but we've just been introduced to Jiang Zemin as a Shanghai party boss that worked to repress a proto-Tiananmen in 1986 and I wanna see what happens next as i recall the actual tienanmen protests are why zemin was president in the first place, i forget names offhand but there were some party members (one in particular?) that were being primed to lead the party after deng but hosed up bigtime with the tienanmen square protests and were purged. zemin was always more of a good hatchetman that got poo poo done mostly without drawing a lot of attention to himself, but stepped up when circumstances called for it; in other words he was exactly the kind of guy who would become the first internet meme in china for SOMETIMES SIMPLE, ALWAYS NAIVE western media doesn't understand hong kong elections or their relation to the mainland and cpc to this day 😔
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Sep 21, 2021 16:57
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BrutalistMcDonalds posted:new xi-land
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Sep 21, 2021 16:57
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lmao "social trust"
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Sep 21, 2021 17:20
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mila kunis posted:No nazis in ukraine! letting the ukraine break away from Russia, yet another crime of Gorby
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Sep 21, 2021 17:26
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https://twitter.com/chow_global/status/1440160973168381952?s=20 https://twitter.com/chow_global/status/1440162156415111184?s=20 https://twitter.com/chow_global/status/1440162335948042250?s=20 even despite Canadian Tories shooting themselves in the foot with Sinophobia, Trudeau couldn't get a majority.
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Sep 21, 2021 18:00
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https://twitter.com/Sturgeons_Law/status/1440322092344307722
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Sep 21, 2021 18:02
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mila kunis posted:No nazis in ukraine! So Nazis are like penguins. They look stupid and taste like poo poo.
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Sep 21, 2021 18:02
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Pener Kropoopkin posted:even despite Canadian Tories shooting themselves in the foot with Sinophobia, Trudeau couldn't get a majority. We'll see what that means though in practice. Probably just going back to saying the quiet part quietly.
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Sep 21, 2021 18:03
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the mid-autumn festival is going on and the sissyboy ban is in effect... wait hold on a second... the transmission is being jammed... i don't know what's going on... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QaZ7bA7ziVA
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Sep 21, 2021 18:21
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Wish I had the balls to belt the high notes like that.
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Sep 21, 2021 18:23
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holy loving poo poo those are some pipes. cant believe xi personally pointed a gun at his family to force him to hit those high notes
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Sep 21, 2021 18:31
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Are there paid by the local fans or mostly by the agency posting as fans? I ask because what Beijing tried to crank down on was this kind of culture (fan clubs peer pressure fans into buy big gifts for the idols)
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Sep 21, 2021 18:33
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hot witch divorcee posted:holy loving poo poo those are some pipes. cant believe xi personally pointed a gun at his family to force him to hit those high notes
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Sep 21, 2021 18:42
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I'm an idle member of a kpop fandom and the level of organization and collective material donations these groups are capable of mustering would put any mutual aid society to shame Like, the DSA will tell you to go read a book, but these folks will have someone walk you through setting up a listening party playlist on Spotify if that's what it takes to make sure Lisa's new solo album goes trending
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Sep 21, 2021 18:54
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i am going to listen to k pop and see what all the fuzz is about edit: not as good as the backstreet boys
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Sep 21, 2021 18:56
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Judakel posted:i am going to listen to k pop and see what all the fuzz is about have some good kpop https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FUjqYfyvynQ
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Sep 21, 2021 19:14
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ah, a woman of culture, i see
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Sep 21, 2021 19:23
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Supporting korean dan schneider by listening to kpop. Shameful
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Sep 21, 2021 19:25
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ISI vs. kpop stans let's goooooo
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Sep 21, 2021 19:25
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Rent-A-Cop posted:I was going to compare Nazis to some kind of objectionable animal, but Nazis ruined all the good animal comparisons. drat, penguins taste bad? that sucks
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Sep 21, 2021 19:29
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thank you to whoever in this thread (at least I think it was this thread) mentioned The Spoils of War by Andrew Cockburn, a simultaneously hilarious and horrifying collection of essays about the insanity and incompetence of US military spending. he draws a lot of comparisons to Soviet and later Russian defense spending but it'd be interesting to know what it's like in China - have they had any notably massive F-35 style boondoggles (that we know about)?
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Sep 21, 2021 19:29
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https://twitter.com/SahilBloom/status/1439920043404546050 I hope the chairman nationalizes the real estate agencies companies and murder all the execs.
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Sep 21, 2021 19:46
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I just read an article that said they had a bunch of employees give them loans earlier this year (threatening to take away their annual bonus if they didn’t) then stopped paying them back a few months ago lol
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Sep 21, 2021 19:47
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Gato posted:thank you to whoever in this thread (at least I think it was this thread) mentioned The Spoils of War by Andrew Cockburn, a simultaneously hilarious and horrifying collection of essays about the insanity and incompetence of US military spending. China did some major bad investments in early semiconductor and civilian airplane projects, probably the two most capital intensive business in the world. Some may argue China still make bad investment in semiconductor. I don't agree even though it will take at least 10+ years to see the result of current domestic fabs. In the 80s China tried to make their own civilian airliner Yun-10 with Beoing 707 engines. It was famous for almost greenlit but ultimately cancelled. In general, China is very good at learning foreign technology and reverse engineering and compete in entry level and midtier industrial products.
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Sep 21, 2021 20:03
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hot witch divorcee posted:western media doesn't understand hong kong elections or their relation to the mainland and cpc to this day 😔 can someone elaborate on the relation?
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Sep 21, 2021 21:06
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Gato posted:thank you to whoever in this thread (at least I think it was this thread) mentioned The Spoils of War by Andrew Cockburn, a simultaneously hilarious and horrifying collection of essays about the insanity and incompetence of US military spending. 
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Sep 21, 2021 21:15
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i'm late to this discussion but i think it's important to keep in mind that deng's strategy wasn't a trick that could only work insofar as it successfully fooled the west. capital literally cannot help itself - if the opportunity for investment and the creation of billionaires appears in a country, investment has to flow into that country because capital abhors a vacuum. no doubt the CIA was telling itself "heh heh heh they don't realize they're not going to be able to stop us" while other parts of it were telling themselves "heh heh heh we've finally won", and no doubt some of the CPC was telling itself "heh he heh they don't realize we're going to stop them" while other parts were thinking "heh heh heh they don't realize i'm a capitalist roader", but it doesn't really matter because the west simply cannot control its own capital, and when left to its own devices capital behaves predictably
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Sep 21, 2021 21:24
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I mean, didn’t mao purge Xi’s dad from the party?
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Sep 21, 2021 21:33
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Ferrinus posted:i'm late to this discussion but i think it's important to keep in mind that deng's strategy wasn't a trick that could only work insofar as it successfully fooled the west. capital literally cannot help itself - if the opportunity for investment and the creation of billionaires appears in a country, investment has to flow into that country because capital abhors a vacuum. no doubt the CIA was telling itself "heh heh heh they don't realize they're not going to be able to stop us" while other parts of it were telling themselves "heh heh heh we've finally won", and no doubt some of the CPC was telling itself "heh he heh they don't realize we're going to stop them" while other parts were thinking "heh heh heh they don't realize i'm a capitalist roader", but it doesn't really matter because the west simply cannot control its own capital, and when left to its own devices capital behaves predictably Yes the Chinese created a situation where American capital was essentially forced to defeat itself. Had America put even a few regulations on Capital they could have stopped this but America would rather cut it's own throat than do that.
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Sep 21, 2021 21:42
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“Xi does think he’s moving to a new kind of system that doesn’t exist anywhere in the world,” said Barry Naughton, a China economy expert at the University of California, San Diego. “I call it a government-steered economy.” You can tell Barry has a PhD in econ
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Sep 21, 2021 21:45
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Grapplejack posted:“Xi does think he’s moving to a new kind of system that doesn’t exist anywhere in the world,” said Barry Naughton, a China economy expert at the University of California, San Diego. “I call it a government-steered economy.” lol the commentariat are awesome to behold.
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Sep 21, 2021 21:46
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Grapplejack posted:“Xi does think he’s moving to a new kind of system that doesn’t exist anywhere in the world,” said Barry Naughton, a China economy expert at the University of California, San Diego. “I call it a government-steered economy.”
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Sep 21, 2021 21:49
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Some kind of command system that's universal for the state's markets.
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Sep 21, 2021 21:51
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Cpt_Obvious posted:I mean, didn’t mao purge Xi’s dad from the party? did he now? lmao (deng got called out and put to work in a tractor factory lmbao)
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Sep 21, 2021 21:51
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Grapplejack posted:“Xi does think he’s moving to a new kind of system that doesn’t exist anywhere in the world,” said Barry Naughton, a China economy expert at the University of California, San Diego. “I call it a government-steered economy.” depending where he learned econ he might never seen even the faintest possibility of a non-market economic direction tbqf but to say like it is an entirely new category is peak neolib econ brain. "Government-steered economies", yeah, like the ancient egyptians, the greeks, the romans...
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Sep 21, 2021 21:53
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