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Finger Prince posted:Worse. A 2007 Prius owner. nah that’s a good car
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Sep 24, 2021 04:13
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quote:poo poo, imagine buying a motortrend magazine with the brand new whatever on the front, flipping past all the cigarette ads to page 22, only to find the article saying "well we asked, but Car Company wouldn't give us one or talk to us". Good read. 100%. Would buy again. Wheels - until the Internet destroyed print magazines - was once an actual respected car journalist mag and they have printed exactly that. Also quote:Also think we're kinda getting into a bit of a circular debate here, lets move on please.
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Sep 24, 2021 04:25
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Ok Comboomer posted:except that this isn't like that and y'all clearly don't know what you're talking about. I don’t know why you quoted me when I didn’t say poo poo about the YouTube guys qualities as car journalists. Anyone buying a Rivian right now is taking a leap of faith and that doesn’t change whether they let these guys have a few hours behind the wheel or not. It would be nice if car companies didn’t blackball reviewers (if that’s what’s happening here) but it’s not like review car ringers don’t exist so even a good review by a reviewer you trust should be taken with an appropriate measure of caution. Reviewing a car bought off the lot should be the gold standard. YOLOsubmarine fucked around with this message at 05:43 on Sep 24, 2021 |
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Sep 24, 2021 05:33
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You guys didn't seem this worked up about the ford review embargo.
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Sep 24, 2021 06:17
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cakesmith handyman posted:You guys didn't seem this worked up about the ford review embargo. much of what I’ve heard about the Mach E has me cool on the F150 L
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Sep 24, 2021 06:22
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cakesmith handyman posted:You guys didn't seem this worked up about the ford review embargo. That isn't the same thing though (and some people definitely are upset about the embargo lasting forever!). Ford still communicates, allows testing, etc, just can't release the result until a certain date. And yes, Ford has sort of done similar things too to those who dared report on the Bronco leaks, although they seemed to have gotten over it.
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Sep 24, 2021 06:23
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Charles posted:That isn't the same thing though (and some people definitely are upset about the embargo lasting forever!). Ford still communicates, allows testing, etc, just can't release the result until a certain date. And yes, Ford has sort of done similar things too to those who dared report on the Bronco leaks, although they seemed to have gotten over it. Reviews you can’t actually publish until Ford tells you it’s okay aren’t especially useful. They know the car is hosed up and are forcing people to sit on that info. But they didn’t have any problem having things like this published: https://www.cnet.com/google-amp/news/2021-ford-mustang-mach-e-gt-first-ride-review-exclusive/ This is pretty funny given the issues owners are reporting with their GTs: quote:In the end, though, what's equally true and most important is that the 2021 Ford Mustang Mach-E GT is capable of dizzying acceleration and brain-sloshing levels of grip. (It'd take back-to-back runs to know for sure, but I have a sneaking suspicion the ME GT PE might outperform a Model Y Performance on a track -- particularly as the laps wear on.)
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Sep 24, 2021 06:55
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I’m not sure why Ford doing a similar-but-different thing for a product that is fairly well-established as a dud (for whatever reason, and at this point it seems like they’re expecting to fix it since the embargo won’t be able to last literally forever) makes the Rivian thing somehow more excusable. Do they all do it? Sure, probably. Is it still bullshit? Yes. I, in general, am suspicious of all-glowing reviews like Ford and Rivian are endeavoring to collect right now. Nothing is perfect, and a decent review addresses that. If a manufacturer won’t allow balanced reviews then I have to suspect that they didn’t actually bother to build a better product than the competition. It’s strange to me now, seeing the reports from owners of the GT, recalls on the early models, software/charging issues, etc., that I was very close to buying a Mach-E before I had driven one. Maybe that’s what Ford is going for. Sonic Dude fucked around with this message at 13:02 on Sep 24, 2021 |
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Sep 24, 2021 12:59
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You can't trust any car review on YouTube. They're all entirely dependent on getting review cars in the future, it's all about access. Can't be too critical in that environment. And many of them also get production assistance, which is a nicer way of saying "getting money from car companies". And car reviewers rarely drive a car for all that long, so all you're getting are pretty superficial impressions. And then there are the written reviews where car journalists sometimes write about how a car drives without having ever driven it.
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Sep 24, 2021 13:16
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The best car reviews are in the Problems subforum of any car-specific message board.
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Sep 24, 2021 14:37
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EngineerJoe posted:The best car reviews are in the Pigballs message board.
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Sep 24, 2021 15:19
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ACAB. Mach E is gonna have police pursuit model starting sometime next year, entering the hallowed ranks of the Dodge Charger as cars that used to be cool before the cops started using them. https://www.freep.com/story/money/cars/ford/2021/09/24/ford-mustang-mach-e-michigan-state-police-testing/5840913001/
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Sep 24, 2021 15:55
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Pham Nuwen posted:The biggest annoyance I've found so far is just an Android Auto thing. I want to go to Bob's Big Buttplug Emporium, so I have the location open in Google Maps on my phone. I climb into the car. My phone pairs to the car, and Google Maps closes, telling me to use it through Android Auto instead. When I open Maps in AA, I now have to search for Bob's Big Buttplug Emporium all over again, which is a hassle. If there's a way to turn that off, boy, that'd really make my day. I figured out how to "fix" this, by the way: start navigation on my phone before I get in the car, then just put the phone in my pocket. It'll resume on the screen when I sit down and I don't have to fiddle with anything. Sole downside is that I may have to hear my phone talking in my pocket before it connects (if I've got the volume up).
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Sep 24, 2021 16:19
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Pham Nuwen posted:I figured out how to "fix" this, by the way: start navigation on my phone before I get in the car, then just put the phone in my pocket. It'll resume on the screen when I sit down and I don't have to fiddle with anything. Sole downside is that I may have to hear my phone talking in my pocket before it connects (if I've got the volume up). In 15 feet, at the driveway, turn right.
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Sep 24, 2021 16:35
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Gambled a bit and arrived at a 150kW charger in my ID.3 with 0km range and basically 0%. 0-80% (50kWh) took 40minutes. Based on the range estimation that's about 400km/h charging speed unless I'm way too tired for maths. Went inside and had my dinner, came out and chatted to another ID.3 owner. One fun thing about EVs is that I all of a sudden strike up conversations with a ton of people I'd otherwise never talk to. Also makes time fly when charging.
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Sep 24, 2021 18:36
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MrOnBicycle posted:Gambled a bit and arrived at a 150kW charger in my ID.3 with 0km range and basically 0%. 0-80% (50kWh) took 40minutes. Based on the range estimation that's about 400km/h charging speed unless I'm way too tired for maths. Went inside and had my dinner, came out and chatted to another ID.3 owner. One fun thing about EVs is that I all of a sudden strike up conversations with a ton of people I'd otherwise never talk to. Also makes time fly when charging. Yeah, I enjoy this too. We're leaving on a road trip and being forced to take a break from driving once in a while is something I actually consider a feature now that I'm middle aged. E: Attn Bird With Big Dick: we charged the battery to 100% and now we're going down the mountain, and there's nothing you can do about it hahahahahaha cruft fucked around with this message at 18:50 on Sep 24, 2021 |
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Sep 24, 2021 18:47
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YOLOsubmarine posted:Reviews you can’t actually publish until Ford tells you it’s okay aren’t especially useful. They know the car is hosed up and are forcing people to sit on that info. But they didn’t have any problem having things like this published: https://www.cnet.com/google-amp/news/2021-ford-mustang-mach-e-gt-first-ride-review-exclusive/ I see what you're saying and agree. Neither is good. At least Ford has a PR department, I guess, although their job is to keep bad news out too, lol.
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Sep 24, 2021 18:52
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I got a question about home charging station things. Basically we're getting some electrical work done and while they are here I am thinking I might as well have them install a new 240V circuit and run a line through conduit out to the semi-detached garage for EV charging. We don't actually have an EV yet but we plan to get one in the next 1-3 years. So do the charging station things just like... plug into a 240V outlet? Or do you typically hardwire them in in a junction box? Basically without actually having the charging apparatus yet, what kind of termination should I ask the electrician to put in, an outlet or just a junction box of some kind?
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Sep 24, 2021 22:45
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Get them to put in a NEMA 14-50 receptacle. It's pretty standard for home ev chargers (Tesla and ChargePoint), and also welders, home dryers, other 240 appliances.
Mustache Ride fucked around with this message at 22:52 on Sep 24, 2021 |
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Sep 24, 2021 22:50
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alnilam posted:I got a question about home charging station things. All of the methods you have described are valid options. Which one is best for your particular usage depends on the vehicle you end up with.
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Sep 24, 2021 22:51
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alnilam posted:I got a question about home charging station things. I think you should install a 14-50 outlet if you're having something put in there anyway. 50A circuit will probably be plenty, unless you think you're going to buy the Hummer EV. don't know if there's a child safe plug for this outlet, but I recommend you flip the circuit breaker off until you have the car. And maybe cover the outlet if you might ever have a child nearby who's interested in seeing what objects can fit into what holes. Which is all children. Based on my read of this thread, you're probably going to wind up getting a "mobile" charger that you leave plugged in permanently, and this is the outlet you are gonna want for that. I put in a hardwired charger because it was going outside and I wanted something more difficult to tamper with and more difficult to fit a fork into. cruft fucked around with this message at 23:17 on Sep 24, 2021 |
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Sep 24, 2021 23:15
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Honestly if you're getting one put in, it might be a good idea to put two in for either bay, considering if it's a two car garage. The plug standard isn't going to change in 10 years, and eventually you'll only have ev.
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Sep 24, 2021 23:24
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Thanks all! I'll do the 14-50 outlet, that's kinda what i figured but i didn't want to do that and then find out they all need to be hardwired anyway. We're a 1 car family and it's a 1 car garage so I think 1 outlet will be fine.
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Sep 24, 2021 23:46
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To decide how powerful home charger is necessary, a question for the current EV owners. What is the most power you have needed from your home charger? Has any of you arrived home for the night after ~300 km drive and plugged in for another 300 km drive you need to start in the morning, which seems like the only scenario where you need more than standard wall plug.
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Sep 25, 2021 05:58
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alnilam posted:Thanks all! I'll do the 14-50 outlet, that's kinda what i figured but i didn't want to do that and then find out they all need to be hardwired anyway. FYI this was discussed earlier, but there's a chance you will end up hardwiring anyways depending on what version of the NEC your area has adopted. The latest version requires all outlets, including 240v, in garages to be GFCI protected. Meanwhile, it's apparently an industry standard for EVSEs to have built in GFCI protection, and the two can have undesirable interactions. Running the outlet could be converted to hardwire later, so it's not the end of the world.
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Sep 25, 2021 06:12
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Saukkis posted:To decide how powerful home charger is necessary, a question for the current EV owners. What is the most power you have needed from your home charger? Has any of you arrived home for the night after ~300 km drive and plugged in for another 300 km drive you need to start in the morning, which seems like the only scenario where you need more than standard wall plug. I'm considering getting a level 2 charger. In America the standard wall plug is only 120 V with a 15 A circuit that you really only draw 12 A from, so you're optimistically getting around 5 miles (8 km) per hour of charging. Assuming the car is parked for roughly 12 hours, that puts you on a daily range cap of about 60 miles when many new EVs have a range of at least 250 miles, and some much more than that. Even if you exceed that nominal charge range, you can always just go to a charging station to fill up - I think that's a great option, but it's an inconvenience and more expensive than charging at home So if you really want to charge at home most of the time, and you live in the US, it makes sense to get a level 2 charger. Then it's just a matter of figuring out how much additional amperage your panel can realistically support; a 50 A breaker may not be realistic for a lot of people, but it's also way beyond what most people need.
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Sep 25, 2021 06:28
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Saukkis posted:To decide how powerful home charger is necessary, a question for the current EV owners. What is the most power you have needed from your home charger? Has any of you arrived home for the night after ~300 km drive and plugged in for another 300 km drive you need to start in the morning, which seems like the only scenario where you need more than standard wall plug. This might be helpful: https://evcompare.io/charging-calculator/ The travel charger, while not ideal, charges my ID.3 at about 2.1kW/h which would take 22 hours from 0% to 80%. The only place I'd use it regularly is 70km away, so in order to break even on it, it would take at most (including some driving while there) 12 hours to charge. Will be getting a proper charger in the future, and probably a dual socket one (since I doubt I'll be the only one with an EV in my family in the future. Even then I can't imagine needing more than 11kW as that would take me from 0-80% in less than 5 hours. So yeah, there are a lot of "but what if I do something that I won't be doing for 99% of the time owning the car?!" in EV discussions.
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Sep 25, 2021 06:33
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MrOnBicycle posted:This might be helpful: Word of caution: you're only supposed to continuously draw 80% of the circuit breaker's maximum amperage, which this tool is not accounting for. So if you have a 15 amp circuit, that's actually only 12 amps available. EVSEs take this account, but this tool does not.
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Sep 25, 2021 07:14
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It has the wrong max charge rate for my car so be sure to verify that, too.
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Sep 25, 2021 07:49
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QuarkJets posted:Word of caution: you're only supposed to continuously draw 80% of the circuit breaker's maximum amperage, which this tool is not accounting for. So if you have a 15 amp circuit, that's actually only 12 amps available. EVSEs take this account, but this tool does not. Good point! Also worth checking the travel chargers safety systems when it comes to temperatures etc.
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Sep 25, 2021 08:03
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Saukkis posted:more than standard wall plug. A standard wall plug is agonizingly slow, I think for my car like 30 hours. It depends on your use case of course, but you probably want to be able to fully recharge it overnight.
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Sep 25, 2021 08:06
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knox_harrington posted:A standard wall plug is agonizingly slow, I think for my car like 30 hours. It depends on your use case of course, but you probably want to be able to fully recharge it overnight. My argument is that most people don't need to be able to fully recharge overnight. Maybe you return from a vacation trip with empty battery, but most likely you only need to charge enough to get to work and back. Unless you have a horrendous commute, lower powered chargers should be enough.
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Sep 25, 2021 08:46
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Yeah, it is not a good argument because even if you don't need to do a big charge 95% of the time, you've hosed yourself over the remaining 5%.
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Sep 25, 2021 09:21
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knox_harrington posted:Yeah, it is not a good argument because even if you don't need to do a big charge 95% of the time, you've hosed yourself over the remaining 5%. But how hosed are you really? Don't have enough range to reach your destination with the charge you've got from the plug? Is the trip cancelled then or do you simply spend a few minutes at a fast charger? Oh, you don't want to charge underway? What if the trip was slightly beyond your car's range, would you then not make the trip at all? I also think 5% is overstating it, that's 18 days of the year. More likely it's an imagined scenario that happens 0 days of the year most years and even if it did it's no big deal. Anyway, one reason people are getting wall boxes in Norway is that the rules say for an outlet you regularly charge from, you need a particular type of ground protection device, which detects DC leaking into the domestic circuit. These are easier to get installed in the wall box rather than in the fuse box. But it's not necessarily faster of course, you can get 16A from domestic circuits. But the fastest ones are Type 2 boxes. I would go for one of those even if it was only 10A.
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Sep 25, 2021 10:34
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I tried Fastned for the first time yesterday, in two locations. Got the autocharge working as well. I love that their app shows SoC and power. Great company, quality software. Why can't Ionity do that?   
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Sep 25, 2021 10:41
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Speaking of Ionity. Man that WeCharge deal is poo poo unless you are in a very specific use case. Sadly a ton of chargers (not just Ionity), that aren't even especially fast, charge prices that make it more expensive to drive on electricity than on diesel or petrol. This is in the south of Sweden. Thankfully I have CircleK free charging, and right now they aren't too congested and people are nice to each other.
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Sep 25, 2021 12:23
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Ola posted:But how hosed are you really? Don't have enough range to reach your destination with the charge you've got from the plug? Is the trip cancelled then or do you simply spend a few minutes at a fast charger? Oh, you don't want to charge underway? What if the trip was slightly beyond your car's range, would you then not make the trip at all? I also think 5% is overstating it, that's 18 days of the year. More likely it's an imagined scenario that happens 0 days of the year most years and even if it did it's no big deal. If you stop for an extra 18 days a year for charging store at 20 minutes a piece, that's 6 hours a year you're buying back. I don't know about you, but my time is worth something, and not having to make these stops outside of long trips is one of the often touted benefits of owning an ev. Even at the 3-4 (literal 1 percent) times a year it's relevant for me, it'd be worth it because it's at the time when queues would probably be the worst and time the most valuable (read: major holidays). Also don't forget your basic charger is twice as fast as we get here. A standard wall socket will charge an id4 like 3 miles an hour here, and if you go through the trouble of running a circuit there cost increase going to 50a isn't as much as you might think in many cases. This is also ignoring that time of use is very relevant in some places so you may not have 12+ hours of charging time every day. And that the smaller the battery you have the more likely you need faster charging since you don't have the buffer to absorb higher mileage days. Like great that it works for you, but not everyone has the same priorities or situation
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Sep 25, 2021 12:28
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One of the best things imo about having an electric car is it's always there and charged if you need it. Using charging stations is fine if you're on a long journey, but if you can't charge in a reasonable time at home you'll at some point impact that usability and QOL. How much is the cost of installing a higher power socket vs the cost of the car? Got to be tiny, proportionally.
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Sep 25, 2021 13:11
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Saukkis posted:To decide how powerful home charger is necessary, a question for the current EV owners. What is the most power you have needed from your home charger? Has any of you arrived home for the night after ~300 km drive and plugged in for another 300 km drive you need to start in the morning, which seems like the only scenario where you need more than standard wall plug. Really any 240v charging is going to be fine for 99.5% of situations, even a basic 15a system. I ran a 50a circuit and a 14-50 receptacle to future-proof, and as a selling point on the house, since that is also the standard for RVs and can also be used for welders and machine tools. The incremental cost between running a new 240vac15a circuit and a 50a circuit is negligible compared to the cost of the rest of the project, particularly if you have to hire an electrician to do it. He’s way more expensive than thicker wire and a larger breaker. The only two places this rule of thumb breaks down is very long runs from the breaker box to the desired receptacle/appliance, and for developers putting a ton of these things in. That said, a 50a service in the garage should be mandatory for all new construction nationwide, at this point.
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Sep 25, 2021 13:48
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I’ve had my car for over 2 years. The amount of times I’ve gone about my daily routine and said “oh no, I’m gonna have to hit up a public charger” has been exactly 0 times.
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Sep 25, 2021 14:16
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