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AweStriker posted:You can only call Chii from the player discarding before you - since you’re North, that would be West. Oh wow I had no idea that was a rule and I've been playing this daily for like 2 weeks. thanks!
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Sep 7, 2021 19:47
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It makes more sense when you see the players in a circle- you can chi from the player on your left.
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Sep 8, 2021 08:09
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gay for gacha posted:I'm just starting to learn that getting to the riichi state doesn't mean I win Riichi actually lowers your odds of winning, though it is more than balanced out by the extra yaku and uradora chances. This is why if you are able to, you generally do not declare riichi if you have a confirmed haneman (6 han+). Of course, there are occasions where declaring riichi can actually make it more likely to win- the guest wind tanki wait is a classic example. Feels Villeneuve fucked around with this message at 16:08 on Sep 9, 2021 |
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Sep 9, 2021 16:02
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VgameT posted:One habit that's good to pick up is thinking to yourself "what do they have?" when you see people start making calls. You can't calculate the value of a riichi hand, obviously, but you can often estimate what someone's hand is going to be worth once they open it up. If they've got an obvious open tanyao and they can't have dora (because it's the 9sou and you can see two red 5s in your hand or the discards, etc) then it's probably not correct to bail against them if you have anything. There are even occasions where dealing into a 1000 point hand is strictly better than defending and ending the hand noten, because you're pretty sure you're going to pay out at least 1500 there, and maybe even 3000. In that case it's pretty much a freeroll to keep your tenpai going; you either draw the round in tenpai, win, or deal in and lose less points than you would have by defending. This can even be true if you see someone call a valueless wind and two chis of the same suit of tiles. They probably have honitsu, sure, but that's 2 han. If there's nothing else there, it's 2000 points. Not particularly scary! P-Mack posted:Pretty sure all green is the rarest yakuman statistically. It's for chads only. I think it's Suukantsu, even with Majsoul's reputation for everyone constantly calling kan. Even sankantsu is actually rarer than some yakuman (as is ryanpeikou)
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Sep 9, 2021 16:04
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I think I'm not really cut out for Mahjong, 'cause I've managed to slowly drag myself to within one game of ranking back down to Adept I on Mahjong Soul. My statistic summary is pretty much the same as it was one month ago, except that my 1st place and 2nd place percentages have swapped (19%, 24%). I've still got a bad 16% Deal In Rate, and a just as poor 21% Win Rate. For some reason, it feels like the opposition has been tougher since the last couple of events, or maybe I'm just psyching myself out in some way? I'm definitely much better about successfully folding against Riichi declarations, except for when I'm in tenpai (ready state) myself. I've gotten burned enough by dealing into honitsu and chinitsu (half- and full-flush) hands, as well as tanyao (all simples) hands with open dora, to start folding around those better. But I'm extremely bad about sensing danger from opposing damaten hands, and still don't fold my ready hands enough. Not that I feel like I get into ready state often enough, I feel like I'm generally too slow compared to my opponents. I'm paying basically no attention to when opponents are discarding from their hand or from their draw, except for when opponents have made multiple calls. Basically, my whole gameplay is a mess. In my most recent game, I had four Mangan-level deal ins. I already know that there were a few places where I made some bad discard choices, but I feel like I also had a few opportunities to push for wins that just didn't end up passing. If anyone's got time to look through the record, it'd be much appreciated. OBLIGATORY EDIT: Actually... I should perhaps make it a point to review my own games with more rigor and frequency. Any tips on how to do that effectively are also appreciated. (Never did enough of that when I was into Go either, come to think of it.) EDIT2: Reviewed the game and posted notes in a text file here. The last hand was played much worse than I thought it was, holy moley. I gotta have more guts and read hand developments better. MrBlarney fucked around with this message at 08:41 on Sep 21, 2021 |
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Sep 21, 2021 06:53
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The thing about Mahjong is it's a very skill-intensive game that requires a lot of knowledge and experience to play that is also mostly driven by luck. You can do everything right and still get Ron'd into fourth place out of nowhere. The tiles are cruel.
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Sep 21, 2021 09:03
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MrBlarney posted:In my most recent game, I had four Mangan-level deal ins. I already know that there were a few places where I made some bad discard choices, but I feel like I also had a few opportunities to push for wins that just didn't end up passing. If anyone's got time to look through the record, it'd be much appreciated. If this is an example of your standard play, I think you'd be rising in rank, overall. I think you got fairly unlucky this hand, and were on reasonable riichi waits and got unlucky. I don't think the errors I'm seeing are egregious, though I think there are some things that I would play differently. If you have other replays, I'd be happy to look at another 1 or 2. One thing that stands out to me is that you tend to keep valueless and low-value honor tiles for too long. Some examples of situations are East 1, turn 6 and East 2, turn 5. You end up making hands in both cases, but overall, I've seen you drop tiles like a [2s] over a valueless honor, which is a leak IMO. There's a few spots in these games where you ended up dropping tiles that would have ended up as nice ryanmen waits, in favor of getting 1 more han. Remember that, if someone drops your seat wind and you have another copy of it, you need to draw both other tiles for it to be worth a han - if you open you hand, you lose riichi, so the net value is equal. It also means you can't stay open for other yaku like pinfu or tanyao, and also keeps less tiles in your hand for you to defend with. I think East 2 is a great example of the kind of tricky stuff that even minor differences in play can yield. Instead of keeping the 3p and 6s and keeping a closed (potentially mangan) hand with plenty of tiles to defend with (south would have been great), you end up with a cheap 1500-point hand with very few tiles to defend with. You also end up not defending, even though you have at least two safe tiles. ^ Seconding Maxwell Lord in that this game is very luck-driven, but I do think there's room to improve.
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Sep 21, 2021 09:32
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IT BEGINS posted:One thing that stands out to me is that you tend to keep valueless and low-value honor tiles for too long. Some examples of situations are East 1, turn 6 and East 2, turn 5. You end up making hands in both cases, but overall, I've seen you drop tiles like a [2s] over a valueless honor, which is a leak IMO. There's a few spots in these games where you ended up dropping tiles that would have ended up as nice ryanmen waits, in favor of getting 1 more han. Remember that, if someone drops your seat wind and you have another copy of it, you need to draw both other tiles for it to be worth a han - if you open you hand, you lose riichi, so the net value is equal. It also means you can't stay open for other yaku like pinfu or tanyao, and also keeps less tiles in your hand for you to defend with. Much appreciated, this is definitely an issue with my play. I'm way too happy to discard solo simples over solo honors of any stripe with the general idea of 'safety', but that reduces the number of tiles available to advance my hand. The resulting inflexibility is slowing me down a lot and making me feel jammed when I should be shifting my hand in a different direction. I'm usually good about keeping valueless honor pairs (off-winds) uncalled in case I need to bail, but on the flipside, that indeed does prevent me from getting tanyao, and those kinds of hands don't always get pinfu or some other stacking value. I guess I need to tip my balance a bit more towards efficiency, and be better about recognizing hand opportunities. For example, it's been only pretty recently that I've really recognized how useful ryantan (e.g. 3334) and kantan (e.g. 3335) groups are when putting hands together. For further reference, here's my next two most recent MJS games: Game t-2: I don't remember anything particularly notable about this one. Looks like I won just one small hand in order to get my dealer turn in a close match, but didn't get anything else to fall my way and went into 3rd. Game t-3: The kamicha, player on my left, was an Expert I player dipping into Silver Room, and they took everyone's lunch money, especially mine. I was super dumb in South 2 and not only gave them a triplet of the 6m dora, I also didn't play any defense afterwards and dealt in.
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Sep 21, 2021 20:08
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MrBlarney posted:The resulting inflexibility is slowing me down a lot and making me feel jammed when I should be shifting my hand in a different direction. Trying to fix this leak definitely contributed to helping me get to Expert. I think it's challenging to adjust - it's not obvious what your hand is inflexible, you just end up with slower hands like 10% more of the time. If you don't mind me looking through the first game, I saw some of what you're talking about. South 4 turn 2 is a great example - you dump the 7p, which can improve on 21 tiles, leading to a potential 8-tile wait as a ryanman. Instead you keep the red and green dragons, which each only improve on 3 tiles, and then lead to a two-tile wait. There's a few other situations where you end up dumping some simples over terminals or honors, and a couple times you opened your hand early - South 1 turn 1 is a good example, where you pon the [222m] to go from 2-shanten to 1-shanten, but lock in just tanyao, rather than a likely good-wait riichi + tanyao, or even potentially riichi + tanyao + pinfu + sanshoku, depending on how the tiles run out.
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Sep 21, 2021 22:27
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Something I noticed as well, that you might want to keep in mind. When you have an efficient hand with reasonable wait potential (even with disconnected 4-5-6 tiles in the middles), keeping your 1-yaku seat wind or prevalent wind is, quite often, worth at most 0 han, as you need to open your hand to claim it. Worse, in some cases, it can be worth (effectively) -1 or even -2 han, as it trades 1:1 for your riichi but then stops you from getting both tanyao and pinfu.
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Sep 21, 2021 23:02
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MrBlarney posted:Game t-3: The kamicha, player on my left, was an Expert I player dipping into Silver Room, and they took everyone's lunch money, especially mine. I was super dumb in South 2 and not only gave them a triplet of the 6m dora, I also didn't play any defense afterwards and dealt in. IT BEGINS posted:Worse, in some cases, it can be worth (effectively) -1 or even -2 han, as it trades 1:1 for your riichi but then stops you from getting both tanyao and pinfu.
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Sep 21, 2021 23:54
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MrBlarney posted:Much appreciated, this is definitely an issue with my play. I'm way too happy to discard solo simples over solo honors of any stripe with the general idea of 'safety', but that reduces the number of tiles available to advance my hand. The resulting inflexibility is slowing me down a lot and making me feel jammed when I should be shifting my hand in a different direction. I'm usually good about keeping valueless honor pairs (off-winds) uncalled in case I need to bail, but on the flipside, that indeed does prevent me from getting tanyao, and those kinds of hands don't always get pinfu or some other stacking value. I guess I need to tip my balance a bit more towards efficiency, and be better about recognizing hand opportunities. For example, it's been only pretty recently that I've really recognized how useful ryantan (e.g. 3334) and kantan (e.g. 3335) groups are when putting hands together. You can usually have a decent idea if you stand a chance of winning the hand without calls or extremely lucky draws by the end of the first discard row. That's generally when you can start to think of safeties, not before. Go full efficiency discards until you reach around that point. If your hand is a hideous 2/3-shanten with all bad shapes and no call value by the time the second discard row starts, yeah, start thinking of safety. Feels Villeneuve fucked around with this message at 14:54 on Sep 22, 2021 |
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Sep 22, 2021 14:50
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Feels Villeneuve posted:You can usually have a decent idea if you stand a chance of winning the hand without calls or extremely lucky draws by the end of the first discard row. That's generally when you can start to think of safeties, not before. Go full efficiency discards until you reach around that point. If your hand is a hideous 2/3-shanten with all bad shapes and no call value by the time the second discard row starts, yeah, start thinking of safety. I've noticed this watching some of the high-level players on Twitch as well. They often start folding completely quite early, much earlier than I'd expect, even against all closed hands.
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Sep 22, 2021 18:09
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It's arguably easier to do that in high level play because you can more or less assume your opponents are extremely good at tile efficiency and knowing when to rush open hand wins. I generally don't pre-emptively fold unless it's a situation where I absolutely can't deal in (e.g. 4th place avoidance) but I do try to avoid situations where I'd be in a bad defensive position (like calling honor/term pons, or having all simple tiles against a dealer riichi) if I'm pretty clearly slow by the middle of row 2 or so.
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Sep 22, 2021 20:59
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my journey as a mahjong noob continues: in 67 ranked games dunno if its just that mahjong is a real game with a long history but ranking up feels real good.
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Sep 23, 2021 20:23
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Have an unsolicited log from a Gold Room hanchan I played last night. Things felt set in stone near the end of S4-0, then mahjong happened. I'll never be naïve enough to claim I played anywhere near perfectly, but I cannot recall feeling more positive about my play than this game. Which only means I'm primed for a yakitori 4th or two. Critiques/thoughts welcome. SeedyV fucked around with this message at 06:42 on Sep 24, 2021 |
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Sep 24, 2021 06:22
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 This 2s discard seemed weird to me. The hand is pretty awkward in general and scoring big relies heavily on the chance that you could draw a second east tile. 1s2s are pretty safe to discard if someones decides to riichi, so I would definitely keep them. Personally, I might have discarded 5s instead. In the case you drew 6s, you could opt to break the iipeikou shape and make 9s your pair.
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Sep 24, 2021 14:36
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BoldFace posted:
I think I would have just discarded the east here, since holding a dora honor hurts your defensive players once Riichi is called, and there is no need agressively hope for completing it yet since its only east 1. You can maybe mangan with the 8 sou and 2 incidental han (riichi + something else), but be ready to throw the hand away if someone had Riichi since its not that valuable.
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Sep 24, 2021 15:40
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2/1s isnt a terrible discard (admittedly I probably void penchan shapes too much) but I'd void the floater 5p because I don't want to discard dora east that late with none on the table. If it comes to it you can riichi with a tanki dora wait which isn't likely to win but is completely reasonable. Though if you wanted to void penchan, 89m is a better discard because something like 3s/4s gets drawn, you can call for ittsu with a dora tanki wait which would be a reasonable 40/3 (?) open hand. (I wouldn't call 3s until you get 4s/6s though) With mostly iffy shapes keep 5s. You have a "hidden" 5/7/9 5/7/9 shape in souzou and 579s has a lot of room for acceptance even if you have an overlapping 789s Feels Villeneuve fucked around with this message at 03:29 on Sep 25, 2021 |
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Sep 25, 2021 03:20
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About time https://twitter.com/MahjongSoul_EN/status/1441960726390792192?s=19
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Sep 26, 2021 13:23
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yeah I'll be blowing my...idk ten or so summon tickets I've gotten through dust, for that I got Koromo in the Saki collab and that's honestly been amazing, because she has a "under the sea" emote and I start spamming it when we get close to a draw, regardless of my tenpai state
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Sep 26, 2021 13:44
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Hi, I learned Mahjong from the Yakuza/RGG games. I am having trouble getting my head around Pinfu. In those games it was defined as straights with a valueless pair. For a long time I though 'valueless pair' meant winds or dragons, but that apparently isn't the case. Also, does it not include any Dora tiles?
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Sep 28, 2021 22:44
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Unlucky7 posted:Hi, I learned Mahjong from the Yakuza/RGG games. Pinfu can have doras. You can't have called any tiles (pon/chi) to get it. The pair doesn't matter. The final thing is just that it has to be a two-sided wait for tenpai, meaning when you are waiting for the final tile, it needs be to complete a run where you can complete it in 2 ways, like if you have 2 sou and 3 sou, then you are waiting on a 1 or a 4. This is as opposed to a one sided wait, which can either be for a set of 3 of the same tile, on a pair, or a run with only a single option (eg: 1 and 2 sou waiting on a 3 sou). Basically, you can think of the idea of pinfu is that it is so "easy" that you even get it with the easiest of all the basic waits. It more precisely comes from you not getting an fu (other than a closed ron fu), which is a scoring mechanism that determines the exact amount you get if you have less than 5 han. MegaZeroX fucked around with this message at 23:20 on Sep 28, 2021 |
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Sep 28, 2021 23:17
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The pair does matter. The thing that trips people up is that "guest" winds (aka not the round wind or your seat wind) can be used as a pair for pinfu.
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Sep 28, 2021 23:22
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MegaZeroX posted:Pinfu can have doras. You can't have called any tiles (pon/chi) to get it. The pair doesn't matter. The final thing is just that it has to be a two-sided wait for tenpai, meaning when you are waiting for the final tile, it needs be to complete a run where you can complete it in 2 ways, like if you have 2 sou and 3 sou, then you are waiting on a 1 or a 4. This is as opposed to a one sided wait, which can either be for a set of 3 of the same tile, on a pair, or a run with only a single option (eg: 1 and 2 sou waiting on a 3 sou). man I am so loving glad for computer mahjong because there's no way in hell I'd remember half of the stuff I'd need to effectively play this game lol
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Sep 28, 2021 23:24
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All the more common hands eventually just kinda get ingrained, but it definitely takes lots of plays.
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Sep 28, 2021 23:34
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Unlucky7 posted:Hi, I learned Mahjong from the Yakuza/RGG games. So, pinfu is a bit of a pain to explain because it's one of the hands that's conditional on how you end it. You need to be waiting on either side of a potential sequence to win, (so, you have a 45 of a suit, you'd be waiting on 3 or 6, this is valid. but if you had 89, you could only be waiting on 7, that's one side, so not pinfu.)., you can't be waiting on the pair with a hand of completed sequences, that's not pinfu. Good tile efficiency tends to lead you in this direction so you might find yourself hitting pinfu without entirely understanding this. Also, you've got it backwards about "valueless pair", a valueless pair is anything that, well, wouldn't have an inherent value if you had a triplet. Dragons are never a valueless pair, and your seat wind/round wind are also not valueless. The other two winds that wouldn't give a yaku are valueless and can be used. Number pairs are always valueless. and yeah pinfu can have dora, I don't think there's a single hand composition that cares about your dora. this is like the first stumbling block of mahjong imo because Pinfu is a good bread and butter hand to build from a lot of positions, but it's really hard to grasp conceptually. But you'll get there eventually, it becomes second nature after some time. SuccinctAndPunchy fucked around with this message at 23:58 on Sep 28, 2021 |
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Sep 28, 2021 23:55
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dragon enthusiast posted:The pair does matter. The thing that trips people up is that "guest" winds (aka not the round wind or your seat wind) can be used as a pair for pinfu. Woops. I guess that says more about how regularly I discard pairs of worthless honor tiles more than anything else.
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Sep 28, 2021 23:57
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Pinfu is notable because you can often get it naturally from developing a closed hand. Like sequences are easier to get and you usually want to end on an open wait.
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Sep 29, 2021 00:11
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SuccinctAndPunchy posted:and yeah pinfu can have dora, I don't think there's a single hand composition that cares about your dora. Dora are bonus points that only get added when scoring, so they aren't really part of your hand. Thats why they also don't count in rulesets where you need a minimum of X han (usually 2) to win a hand
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Sep 29, 2021 01:10
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Son of Thunderbeast posted:man I am so loving glad for computer mahjong because there's no way in hell I'd remember half of the stuff I'd need to effectively play this game lol pinfu sounds more complicated than it is because it kind of matches up precisely with efficient hand building which prioritizes open waits it's the "default" yaku for a reason
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Sep 29, 2021 01:46
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MegaZeroX posted:Woops. I guess that says more about how regularly I discard pairs of worthless honor tiles more than anything else. I rarely keep them for the pair even knowing that rule, because I usually hope to stack-in a tanyao. It's not bad to keep in mind but I think often they can be more useful as discards.
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Oct 1, 2021 23:55
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For those who missed it, the premier Japanese mahjong competition M.League started its new season two days ago. Matches happen every week on Mondays, Tuesdays, Thursdays and Fridays, and should be free to watch live on abema.tv's mahjong channel. https://m-league.jp/
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Oct 6, 2021 01:15
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Akagi collab information was revealed today. Akagi and Washizu will be the gacha characters. Washizu Mahjong and Yamima no Mamiya rules (paying 1000 points lets you make a discard face down) will be implemented as new game modes.  
BoldFace fucked around with this message at 02:53 on Oct 21, 2021 |
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Oct 20, 2021 12:56
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Yesssssssss
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Oct 20, 2021 13:06
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HELL yes. I've always wanted to try Washizu Mahjong but outside buying a one-use set or messing around in TTS it didn't seem possible. I've heard that it's a pain to play once the novelty wears off but the event doesn't last long anyway. We had that event with Sichuan Bloody Rules a while back (I think it was the Kakegurui collab), I'm crossing my fingers we get Buu Mahjong eventually.
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Oct 21, 2021 16:55
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dragon enthusiast posted:the dora order of dragons is W G R, I remember it with the mnemonic "wiggler". Twelve pages late and 10 billion ¥ short, but the Dora order for the dragons is also their English alphabetical order (Green > Red > White). As for winds, I always used NEWS but obviously that's wrong. I think I can remember one thing RGG Studios games have taught me: We Never Enjoy Shogi. As a stand-alone experience, maybe; as a thing standing between me and a platinum trophy, nooooo thanks.
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Oct 21, 2021 17:35
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Oct 22, 2021 19:17
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And 麻酔 is "anesthesia." 麻雀 etymologically comes from a sound change the card game name 馬弔 in China. Then, for the kanji, 雀 came from 孔雀 which is "peacock" and 麻 was just added for the sound.
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Oct 22, 2021 19:36
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oh, cool! Thanks for the explanation
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Oct 22, 2021 19:37
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