|
It's the thread everyone has been waiting for... The catchall Mahjong thread.  What is mahjong? Mahjong is a tile-based game that was developed in China during the Qing dynasty and has spread throughout the world since the early 20th century. It is commonly played by four players (with some three-player variations found in South Korea, Japan and Southeast Asia). The game and its regional variants are widely played throughout Eastern and South Eastern Asia. Similar to the Western card game rummy, Mahjong is a game of skill, strategy, and calculation and involves a degree of chance. The game is played with a set of 144 tiles based on Chinese characters and symbols, although some regional variations may omit some tiles and/or add unique tiles. In most variations, each player begins by receiving 13 tiles. In turn players draw and discard tiles until they complete a legal hand using the 14th drawn tile to form 4 melds (or sets) and a pair (eye). A player can also win with a small class of special hands. Some Clarification It sounds simple enough but the game has about a thousand variants ranging from very simple to very complex. In the west Chinese communities regularly play numerous regional variants of Chinese Mahjong, older non-chinese in the US will sometimes play the simplified American "Mahjongg" and most everyone else ends up teaching themselves Riichi (or Japanese Mahjong). Riichi Mahjong is considered the most complex form of Mahjong and has a healthy but very small player pool outside of Japan. Inside Japan it is very popular and there are professional Riichi players. This thread will be for discussing all forms of Mahjong but probably this op will Primarily focus on Riichi Mahjong. Riichi Mahjong Japanese Mahjong uses 136 tiles, has many unique rules, and has a complex and initially very confusing scoring system. Also compared most other forms of Mahjong, playing defensively in Riichi is rewarded more. Those are the main macro differences between Japanese Mahjong and other Mahjong styles. Typing out all the nuances and rules here would take up a lot of time and space and I would do a poor job so I'm going to provide some links and resources for getting started. Below is Gandhitron's post for basic basic play in order to complete a Mahjong mission in Yakuza 0. GANDHITRON posted:There are three suites—circles, bamboo, and Chinese characters. Each suit has tiles 1-9, and there are four copies of each. Gandhitron's writeup is very basic and while it won't have you consistently winning against humans it can get you going enough to mess around on some cpu games to experiment and learn from your mistakes. Getting started Read page 46 to 104 of this book before you really start dipping into the game (seriously, just do it). This section covers the very basics of hand construction that will save you a lot of time, questions and frustrations. It's basically a section covering the backbone of the game. https://dainachiba.github.io/RiichiBooks/index.html After looking that over try and play around against the cpu in one of these free Riichi games Noten Riichi Mahjong (app for android) http://www.gamedesign.jp/flash/mahjong/mahjong_e.html (online flash Mahjong) After messing around with declaring riichi with a closed hand and Yakuhai with an open hand (normal hand but with a triplet of dragons, prevailing wind or your wind) consult this Yaku list and start trying to construct other scoring hands/combine your scoring. This list has a visual aid and yaku grouped by how much they score, attempting lower scoring yaku will obviously be easier. I strongly recommend learning Tanyao as your third winning condition as it is very common and simple. http://arcturus.su/wiki/List_of_yaku Once you've messed around in one of those games for a bit and you're comfortable with basic hand construction, declaring riichi, and creating basic open hands that score it's time to step up to the big leagues and join the scary world of Tenhou. Tenhou  Tenhou is the site for online Riichi play. It has something like 500,000 active users and attracts all types of players from scrubs to pros. You are ranked as you play and higher tier rooms will become available to you the higher up you rank. quote:It has become a common understanding among players in Japan that your rank and rating on Tenhou are one of the most reliable indicators of your mahjong skill levels. Tenhou handles the game very well, looks slick, offers nice stat tracking, and has a great replay feature where you can rewatch your games play by play. That being said Tenhou it is also a one man project and is very very barebones. There are no avatars, flashy graphics, customizable tilesets, voicepackages or anything like that. To get started playing on Tenhou install this chrome Tenhou English extension first! It will translate everything happening in the webclient and replaces the base tileset with a gaijin friendly tileset that has arabic numerals for base tiles, and translations for winds and dragon tiles. https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/tenhou-english-ui/cbomnmkpjmleifejmnjhfnfnpiileiin Then just click this link to access the web client http://tenhou.net/3/ Seltzer fucked around with this message at 17:28 on Jun 2, 2019 |
#
?
Sep 18, 2018 02:01
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 2, 2024 04:50 |
|
|
Reserved post
|
|
#
?
Sep 18, 2018 02:01
|
|
|
Sidenote- I only started learning riichi mahjong because trying to track down information on how to play, or where to play, one of the 1,000 forms of chinese mahjong and it's near impossible. I used to play a form of Chinese Mahjong many years ago and I picked up Riichi to re-familiarize myself with mahjong so I can begin playing some of the Chinese versions in person again. Anyways feel free to discuss all forms of mahjong and info on Chinese/other rule sets is cool to post here as well. Also I will probably abandon this thread after I get bored with Tenhou but right now it's pretty fun. The message you get when they promote you is inspiring  (6th Kyuu now for the record!) Also I'm finally getting a little more experience and actually doing ok in some rounds.   Nothing crazy but it feels good. Seltzer fucked around with this message at 07:18 on Sep 18, 2018 |
|
#
?
Sep 18, 2018 02:03
|
|
|
I've always been curious why it's spelled with 2 Gs. Apparently, the Mandarin name mah jiang is a reverse transliteration of a madeup name:quote:In the very earliest known writings about the game (the 1890s), the game was referred to by various names, among them chung fa, que ma que or ma que (in Cantonese: mah cheuk ). The game was not called "mahjong" by the Chinese who played it, and that name was not used until the early 1900s.
|
|
#
?
Sep 18, 2018 06:23
|
|
|
It used to be 麻雀 but Mandarin speakers use 麻將 these days. Anyway I downloaded the Noten app and screwed around a little (it really eats battery for some reason). I'm getting a bit of a feel for winning rounds but the scoring is still a complete mystery to me.
|
|
#
?
Sep 18, 2018 12:59
|
|
|
I prefer 麻婆, personally  I got really hooked on this game thanks to Yakuza. I’m still terrible at it.
|
|
#
?
Sep 18, 2018 13:57
|
|
|
I wish there was a iPhone riichi app like that flash game. All of them are either bloated with worthless features or are terribly optimized.
|
|
#
?
Sep 18, 2018 14:03
|
|
|
dragon enthusiast posted:I wish there was a iPhone riichi app like that flash game. All of them are either bloated with worthless features or are terribly optimized. Mahjong Demon is a really good single player Mahjong app. It runs fast and it’s easy to customize it to whatever Riichi ruleset you prefer.
|
|
#
?
Sep 18, 2018 14:15
|
|
|
P-Mack posted:It used to be 麻雀 but Mandarin speakers use 麻將 these days. That's weird, it doesnt seem to effect my phone much. But for the scoring think of it a bit like poker, the more complex your hand the better it is. So for instance winning with a riichi and nothing else special about your hand is like winning a poker pot with an ace high or pair instead of say, a straight or fullhouse (obviously in poker it doesn't matter so long as you win but I'm trying to draw a lovely analogy). Dora is a simple concept that provides an extra han in scoring. It's worth getting down when you're starting. If you look at the deadwall each round (end of the wall where tiles don't get drawn from) there will be one tile face up. If you have the tile after that tile in your winning hand, it's considered "dora" and is 1 han. So for instance, if a bamboo 5 is showing, having a sequence in your hand with a bamboo 6 will score. If a 9 value tile is facing up then it means the 1 tile of that suit is a dora, so a 9 circle tile showing means that a 1 circle will count towards dora. So if you have a dora qualifying tile it's worth thinking about holding onto it even if it isn't readily suited to scoring a run or triplet. The dora sequence of winds and dragons is a bit more annoying to remember so I'll skip that. Speaking of, one of my bad habits at the moment is chasing points from Akadora. I hold onto certain Akadora tiles too long, longer than normal dora scoring tiles. The cool color and versatility of having a 5 is tempting, even if it's getting late and it's not part of meld. Akadora are the red color 5 tiles. Each suit has one red 5 tile out of the four total tiles. So there will be 3 akadora in the whole set. Akadora adds another han to your score like dora. In that big Chinitsu hand I posted above i had an akadora in my kan call. The extra han gave me six total bringing me up to Hanneman. Seltzer fucked around with this message at 17:48 on Sep 18, 2018 |
|
#
?
Sep 18, 2018 17:36
|
|
|
the real power is being able to combine fan, even a simple hand like riichi tsumo pinfu tanyao dora is worth a mangan. the dora order of dragons is W G R, I remember it with the mnemonic "wiggler". the dora order of winds is E S W N, I don't have a good mnemonic for it yet.
|
|
#
?
Sep 18, 2018 18:12
|
|
|
dragon enthusiast posted:the real power is being able to combine fan, even a simple hand like riichi tsumo pinfu tanyao dora is worth a mangan. Username thread title combo
|
|
#
?
Sep 18, 2018 18:18
|
|
|
dragon enthusiast posted:the real power is being able to combine fan, even a simple hand like riichi tsumo pinfu tanyao dora is worth a mangan. Eh, swan.
|
|
#
?
Sep 18, 2018 18:25
|
|
|
Also if there is any interest I'm thinking about setting up a mini discord and getting some people together to play private tenhou games. We could have a set night or time, you only need three people. Tenhou doesn't have in game chat even in privates so discord would make the most sense.
|
|
#
?
Sep 18, 2018 20:01
|
|
|
I'm really struggling at keeping my offense in check and playing more defensively. I love open hands. That being said some presumably japanese dude named "dontrump" was crushing my room yesterday so I used at as practice at playing safe and got 2nd. Seeing someone get roned for 15k+ is terrible lol, I always feel for them.
|
|
#
?
Sep 20, 2018 00:06
|
|
|
Are there any good clients + AI for non-riichi variants?
|
|
#
?
Sep 20, 2018 06:48
|
|
|
Used to play a bunch of private Tenhou a few years ago. There's nothing quite like the feeling when three players have called riichi and you're the only one who has to make choices.  Staying closed unless you have a very good reason to open is definitely the way to go. Though I like chasing quick garbage 1ks when that gets me in the lead or I'm dealer.
|
|
#
?
Sep 20, 2018 07:50
|
|
|
Tonfa posted:Staying closed unless you have a very good reason to open is definitely the way to go. Though I like chasing quick garbage 1ks when that gets me in the lead or I'm dealer. If I have I viable yakuhai or tanyao off the bat I find it kind of easy to get a dora or akadora on top of it which scores ok. But yea I'm probably opening up too much. Tuxedo Catfish posted:Are there any good clients + AI for non-riichi variants? All the chinese stuff seems to be behind the great firewall and built with only chinese users in mind. I found an explanation for Sichuan mahjong and a Sichuan app as well but it was a tencent app and I'm pretty sure there's like chinese malware bundled with that stuff (?) so I passed.
|
|
#
?
Sep 20, 2018 17:07
|
|
|
dragon enthusiast posted:the dora order of winds is E S W N, I don't have a good mnemonic for it yet. EaSt WiNd?
|
|
#
?
Sep 21, 2018 10:12
|
|
|
dragon enthusiast posted:the dora order of winds is E S W N, I don't have a good mnemonic for it yet. Order of cardinal directions clockwise. What's hosed up though is that the seating order clockwise is reversed, E N W S. Just mahjong things.
|
|
#
?
Sep 21, 2018 11:29
|
|
|
God dammit you've got me playing Mahjongg (really badly) again. On the one hand I wish this was more prevalent in the U.S. because it's a great game and I'd watch the poo poo out of the World Series of Mahjong (assuming I understood it better than I do). But on the other hand, if there's a game out there that could turn me into a degenerate gambler it'd probably be this one.
|
|
#
?
Sep 22, 2018 02:17
|
|
|
I was in tenpai like 4 times in one set and didn't win one round. gently caress. Anyways. I'm thinking about private tenhou games via discord. I was thinking on having a set time. Sunday evening est sound good for anyone interested? Seltzer fucked around with this message at 06:05 on Sep 22, 2018 |
|
#
?
Sep 22, 2018 05:16
|
|
|
Here's the link to the discord https://discord.gg/YhzQ63 Hopefully three of you will join me tomorrow evening and will play some tenhou. I'm trash so don't worry about how much you know.
|
|
#
?
Sep 23, 2018 06:12
|
|
|
Seltzer posted:Here's the link to the discord It said invite expired 
|
|
#
?
Sep 25, 2018 00:12
|
|
|
P-Mack posted:It said invite expired I dont really know how discord works, I'll try to make a permanent link
|
|
#
?
Sep 25, 2018 01:17
|
|
|
Here we go. Old one expired in a day apparently https://discord.gg/gm5YpxD
|
|
#
?
Sep 25, 2018 01:23
|
|
|
Hell yeah, sign me up. I'm back on Tenhou nowadays but it's gotten markedly harder to compete - I assume that there's slightly less players and the ones who are sticking around are flat-out better at the game.
|
|
#
?
Sep 25, 2018 04:55
|
|
|
Seltzer posted:I was in tenpai like 4 times in one set and didn't win one round. gently caress. I had like four perfect pinfu waits go to draws and then I won two straight furiten riichi declarations. Mahjong. dragon enthusiast posted:the real power is being able to combine fan, even a simple hand like riichi tsumo pinfu tanyao dora is worth a mangan. dragons are colors in alphabetical order starting with green, winds is clockwise on a compass face Stelas posted:Hell yeah, sign me up. I'm back on Tenhou nowadays but it's gotten markedly harder to compete - I assume that there's slightly less players and the ones who are sticking around are flat-out better at the game. there's a lot more english-language strategy literature these days, so if you're playing in western prime hours, the western players are much less likely to be really bad at the game. by the way, for the OP, this is almost an essential link: Why won't the computer let me declare mahjong? http://www.sloperama.com/mjfaq/yaku/yaku.htm Feels Villeneuve fucked around with this message at 19:52 on Sep 30, 2018 |
|
#
?
Sep 30, 2018 19:30
|
|
|
Tuxedo Catfish posted:Are there any good clients + AI for non-riichi variants? Four Winds is ancient (though still supported for modern OS compatibility) but has like literally every variant on it and an impossible amount of rule customization. I think the only thing it doesn't support out of box is American/NMJL style, probably because the contents of the NMJL cards is copyrighted. https://www.4windsmj.com/ it also supports rarely-seen features like allowing you to make bad declarations and getting penalized (if you need to practice stuff like complex waits for real-life play). Feels Villeneuve fucked around with this message at 19:50 on Sep 30, 2018 |
|
#
?
Sep 30, 2018 19:41
|
|
|
Feels Villeneuve posted:Four Winds is ancient (though still supported for modern OS compatibility) but has like literally every variant on it and an impossible amount of rule customization. I think the only thing it doesn't support out of box is American/NMJL style, probably because the contents of the NMJL cards is copyrighted. Thanks! I'm both a huge baby who doesn't want to deal with learning yaku and I live in a neighborhood that is predominantly Jewish and Chinese, so I have no real interest in learning the Japanese version when it's probably not what anyone around me plays.
|
|
#
?
Sep 30, 2018 21:17
|
|
|
proper/modern chinese mahjong has even more hands to learn than riichi, honestly the yaku list isn't that hard once you realize that a lot of them are upgraded versions or "opposite" versions of other yaku like IIRC "proper" chinese is: must have 8 points from a combination of like a hundred hand types, while riichi is just "one yaku" where riichi and closed tsumo with any valid hand structure always count if you have nothing else i think the simplest form of mahjong that people actually play is "old hong kong mahjong" (chinese classical is also simple but nobody actually plays it) Feels Villeneuve fucked around with this message at 21:28 on Sep 30, 2018 |
|
#
?
Sep 30, 2018 21:21
|
|
|
Feels Villeneuve posted:proper/modern chinese mahjong has even more hands to learn than riichi, honestly the yaku list isn't that hard once you realize that a lot of them are upgraded versions or "opposite" versions of other yaku well this complicates matters but i still appreciate having a wide array of options, in any case
|
|
#
?
Sep 30, 2018 21:26
|
|
|
american mahjong is also complex and primarily exists to give Jewish grandmothers an extremely complicated ruleset to argue with each other about also it's the one where you literally have to buy a card every year to get the valid hands e) really, the hardest part of Japanese/riichi to learn is the weird-rear end scoring system, and even that's OK to just fudge if you only plan to play online or on the computer. also, furiten is kind of a pain to learn, though you get the hang of it after a week of play or so. there are other weird rule exceptions but a lot of these apply to like 0.01% of game situations. Feels Villeneuve fucked around with this message at 21:33 on Sep 30, 2018 |
|
#
?
Sep 30, 2018 21:29
|
|
|
This is probably my favorite cheat sheet for yaku btw, I particularly like the dots to show which ones are the most common. My only real problem is the non-standard english terms for them , eg "three-color chi" instead of "mixed triple chow" but the Japanese terms should be learned anyway. https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B1Vjevtlm-y2d2MxTmxWOEhWaU0/view
|
|
#
?
Sep 30, 2018 21:58
|
|
|
Off topic but what's that completely insane mah jong anime called?
|
|
#
?
Oct 2, 2018 16:28
|
|
|
P-Mack posted:Off topic but what's that completely insane mah jong anime called? Akagi is the one where people are constantly staking their lives and getting blood transfusions and there's a match that's been going on for like 20 years of real time.
|
|
#
?
Oct 2, 2018 16:32
|
|
|
akagi finally ended a few months ago
|
|
#
?
Oct 2, 2018 16:42
|
|
|
Tuxedo Catfish posted:Are there any good clients + AI for non-riichi variants? I got hooked on the game thanks to my inlaws. My wife and I go back to NYC every year for the Holidays. We stay at the in-law's house and I end up playing - I look at the money I lose as "rent." To practice I use "HK Mahjong." It's a phone app. This is the closest I've found to the version my wife's parents play. The AI is decent, but not amazing. It's a good practice tool for learning the basics. The big difference I notice is that the game artificially stops when there's a tile you could pick up - in real life, they just keep playing and if you missed it, too bad.
|
|
#
?
Oct 2, 2018 17:34
|
|
|
playing in real life is a completely different game almost, you have to be very careful about stuff like waits on flush hands because it's really, really easy to get into furiten, or even calling empty riichi on those without realizing it.
|
|
#
?
Oct 2, 2018 17:45
|
|
|
Tuxedo Catfish posted:Akagi is the one where people are constantly staking their lives and getting blood transfusions and there's a match that's been going on for like 20 years of real time. And Saki is the one where everyone has a Mahjong-related superpower.
|
|
#
?
Oct 2, 2018 18:03
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 2, 2024 04:50 |
|
|
Tamba posted:And Saki is the one where everyone has a Mahjong-related superpower. And Koizumi is the one where world leaders cheat their asses off while conducting politics via mahjong.
|
|
#
?
Oct 3, 2018 00:25
|
|