|
Oxxidation posted:anyone can. it's only boss monsters who have souls hardy enough to possibly be absorbed by a human afterwards, since they persist for a few seconds after death while all other monsters' souls crumble instantly So could a human use a living monster to get through the barrier? Like, just grab Shyren or somebody and both go through together?
|
#
?
Oct 2, 2021 02:30
|
|
|
|
| # ? Jun 7, 2024 20:56 |
|
|
Space Cadet Omoly posted:I gotta be honest: I'm not totally against Asgore's human killing policy. He did that because he didn't actually want to go through with his plan of "wage war on the humans once we reach the surface", he was basically hoping no more humans would ever fall down into the Undergound.
|
|
#
?
Oct 2, 2021 02:40
|
|
|
Space Cadet Omoly posted:So could a human use a living monster to get through the barrier? Like, just grab Shyren or somebody and both go through together? probably not, since that'd make the game's central dilemma very silly. you need someone who's packing both a monster and a human soul inside of them as an unlock condition it's either amazingly short-sighted or amazingly cruel. maybe both!
|
|
#
?
Oct 2, 2021 02:42
|
|
|
Considering even the biggest baddest monster under the mountain can't take a literal child in a fight, probably wasn't much need to seal them away in the first place
|
|
#
?
Oct 2, 2021 02:46
|
|
|
How'd they even have a war in the first place, considering that a grouchy child would of torn through any monster army like butter?
|
|
#
?
Oct 2, 2021 02:49
|
|
|
I’m also assuming that monsters in Deltarune are a little sturdier than the ones in Undertale or at least operate under different rules (otherwise Susie would probably be dust by now).
|
|
#
?
Oct 2, 2021 02:53
|
|
|
Vagabong posted:How'd they even have a war in the first place, considering that a grouchy child would of torn through any monster army like butter? by all accounts it was only a "war" in the loosest sense of the word, since humankind probably didn't suffer a single casualty. if they had then the tide would have turned very quickly
|
|
#
?
Oct 2, 2021 02:54
|
|
|
Vagabong posted:How'd they even have a war in the first place, considering that a grouchy child would of torn through any monster army like butter? Considering the Monsters lost and were sealed underground by human sages, I think, probably not much of one. I can imagine Monsters managing a few kills, humans don’t necessarily have the greatest protection against magic if they’re unprepared for all the ways Monsters can attack their souls. Imagine someone having to deal with Asgore without the practice of an entire game. Gerson at the very least I think is implied to have fought in the war and been successful enough to be a war hero. Also Monster+Human Soul isn’t even a recipe for success, super powerful or not Asriel could still die from taking damage (specifically getting pitchfork stabbed I think), so whilst it might be extremely devastating the combo is likely to not last long against weaponry.
|
|
#
?
Oct 2, 2021 02:57
|
|
|
Considering one of the primary methods of combat in both games is "don't get hit" it's also entirely possible the monsters just are REALLY GOOD at tohou minigames.
|
|
#
?
Oct 2, 2021 02:59
|
|
|
There's dialogue about that I'm sure, the war being really one sided and sealing up the monsters is a hell of a internment camp situation. Like humanity was bored with killing monsters and just wanted them out of the way. Or maybe the people who locked the monsters away thought they were doing them a favor.
|
|
#
?
Oct 2, 2021 03:01
|
|
|
ImpAtom posted:Considering one of the primary methods of combat in both games is "don't get hit" it's also entirely possible the monsters just are REALLY GOOD at tohou minigames. Monsters have a real hard time at "don't get hit" though.
|
|
#
?
Oct 2, 2021 03:02
|
|
|
Lord_Magmar posted:Considering the Monsters lost and were sealed underground by human sages, I think, probably not much of one. I can imagine Monsters managing a few kills, humans don’t necessarily have the greatest protection against magic if they’re unprepared for all the ways Monsters can attack their souls. Imagine someone having to deal with Asgore without the practice of an entire game. gerson is a war hero because he didn't die. that's literally described as his outstanding accomplishment. nothing about what he did to the other side, just the fact that he fought in the war without getting dusted was enough for people like undyne to tout him as a legend asriel's circumstances were unique because he took a soul but then stood and let humans whale on him afterward without fighting back. in an actual combat situation where the monster's willing to defend itself, it's a very short jump from one human soul acquired to seven, and then you're dealing with an opponent that can create black holes by wishing for it
|
|
#
?
Oct 2, 2021 03:03
|
|
|
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hCS-xZnlxIU
|
|
#
?
Oct 2, 2021 03:06
|
|
|
Flesnolk posted:Considering even the biggest baddest monster under the mountain can't take a literal child in a fight, probably wasn't much need to seal them away in the first place In fact the history carvings in waterfall say almost exactly that. Humans got paranoid that there could hypothetically be a dangerous monster and thrashed them all almost effortlessly.
|
|
#
?
Oct 2, 2021 03:29
|
|
|
imho Asrial really hosed up both practically speaking and morally speaking by not letting Chara just use the soul power to exterminate humans to the last.
|
|
#
?
Oct 2, 2021 03:44
|
|
|
What if a human fell down and used the Metamoran Fusion Dance technique with a monster? Could they get through the barrier together that way? Also, shout outs to that barrier too, absolutely one way of circumventing it and no substitutes allowed. Gaster tried something to juke it and he doesn't even exist in game anymore.
|
|
#
?
Oct 2, 2021 03:50
|
|
|
What if humans... are the REAL monsters..?
|
|
#
?
Oct 2, 2021 03:52
|
|
|
I thought only humans with sufficient determination could hurt monsters, or is that wrong? Acerbatus posted:What if humans... are the REAL monsters..? 
|
|
#
?
Oct 2, 2021 04:09
|
|
|
Acerbatus posted:What if humans... are the REAL monsters..? What if monsters...are the real HUMANS!?
|
|
#
?
Oct 2, 2021 04:14
|
|
|
I'm pretty sure the literal monsters are the real monsters; it's in their name, guys.
|
|
#
?
Oct 2, 2021 04:36
|
|
|
Neuronyx posted:I thought only humans with sufficient determination could hurt monsters, or is that wrong? Monsters are made of magic, so the amount of damage you do them is based on your willingness to hurt them in the first place. Which is the explanation for Level Of ViolencE being increased by EXecution Points. The more you learn to hurt others the easier it becomes to distance yourself emotionally and your intent to harm increases.
|
|
#
?
Oct 2, 2021 04:37
|
|
|
Murderous intent is pretty much enough to kill monsters, which is how you're able to kill them even though you're just a kid with a stick, and one-shot bosses on the bad times route. Incidentally, if your attack stat is high enough, weaker monsters will be able to be insta-spared. (Which is why hacking in the Real Knife early basically makes most monsters spareable from the get-go with that massive 99 attack.) Course in Deltarune a bunch of rules have changed. Monsters don't seem to be able to use magic naturally there. Nothing really suggests physical biology has changed since fallen down still seems to be an existing concept and graveyards don't mention bodies, but Susie would have been annihilated by the King if the same rules about murderous intent worked here.
|
|
#
?
Oct 2, 2021 04:50
|
|
|
Space Cadet Omoly posted:So could a human use a living monster to get through the barrier? Like, just grab Shyren or somebody and both go through together? iirc it's mentioned at some point in undertale that a key difference between human souls and monster souls is that human souls can exist outside of a human's body, while monster souls pretty much instantly evaporate
|
|
#
?
Oct 2, 2021 05:28
|
|
|
Araxxor posted:Murderous intent is pretty much enough to kill monsters, which is how you're able to kill them even though you're just a kid with a stick, and one-shot bosses on the bad times route. There is also the difference between Lightners and Darkners to consider for this on top of everything else being different from Undertale and Deltarune. Anyway, this might be the perfect environment for Akuma. If he fell down here, he might actually succeed in killing someone.
|
|
#
?
Oct 2, 2021 05:35
|
|
|
ikanreed posted:In fact the history carvings in waterfall say almost exactly that. Humans got paranoid that there could hypothetically be a dangerous monster and thrashed them all almost effortlessly. Undertale did go a bit too hard on making the monsters harmless and helpless, in retrospect. I do think they work differently in Deltarune, though.
|
|
#
?
Oct 2, 2021 05:57
|
|
|
I dunno. Unless you're at such a level of hyperviolent that you're literally hunting down more monsters to kill, you probably won't be one-shotting the cast. Humans have the upper hand by far in this analogy, but it isn't like the monsters are dropping dead at a glance. You know, now I'm curious. Assuming you kill all monsters you encounter, but never trigger the Genocide rum or stop to grind, what would your LV end up at? I figure that'd be the closest analogy for your average human participant in a human-monster war.
|
|
#
?
Oct 2, 2021 06:13
|
|
|
Where do you find the various human items in the game? It does seem implied that not all of them necessarily made it anywhere near Asgore. Hell, maybe at least one didn't even make it to Toriel's door.
|
|
#
?
Oct 2, 2021 06:53
|
|
|
Ghost Leviathan posted:Where do you find the various human items in the game? It does seem implied that not all of them necessarily made it anywhere near Asgore. Hell, maybe at least one didn't even make it to Toriel's door. Faded Ribbon + Toy Knife: Ruins Manly Bandanna + Tough Glove: Snowdin Old Tutu + Ballet Shows: Waterfall Cloudy Glasses + Torn Notebook: Gerson Stained Apron + Burnt Pan: Hotland Cowboy Hat + Empty Gun: Bratty and Catty
|
|
#
?
Oct 2, 2021 07:35
|
|
|
I do think it should mean something that the one item that is an actual weapon is the one closest to the end of the game. I imagine murderous intent channeled into bullets would be pretty effective. "HOW DO -YOU- LIKE IT?!" - Sheriff  EDIT: Why the gently caress do I keep saying it was a sheriff ignore me
|
|
#
?
Oct 2, 2021 09:06
|
|
|
Going to Mt Ebbot, maybe only had one bullet. I mean, I think you'd hear about the human that came into the underground and started shooting monsters. e;The fandom's reaction to Spamton https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ReLMPKhhRMs MariusLecter fucked around with this message at 09:23 on Oct 2, 2021 |
|
#
?
Oct 2, 2021 09:19
|
|
|
The Bee posted:You know, now I'm curious. Assuming you kill all monsters you encounter, but never trigger the Genocide rum or stop to grind, what would your LV end up at? I figure that'd be the closest analogy for your average human participant in a human-monster war. Around LV13, I think? The CORE monsters actually make up an overwhelming majority of your EXP available, so it can vary depending on how you get through there. The highest you can get on a neutral run is LV17, by the way. LV18 is impossible to achieve under any circumstances, and LV19-20 are Geno-exclusive. Neuronyx posted:I do think it should mean something that the one item that is an actual weapon is the one closest to the end of the game. I imagine murderous intent channeled into bullets would be pretty effective. Presumably literal bullets wouldn't actually do anything at all to monsters. You're only harming them by channeling your emotions into a physical strike, after all. so pistol-whipping is actually mandatory 
|
|
#
?
Oct 2, 2021 10:03
|
|
|
for your appraisal, here's jerma basically just doing his mr. green voice for spamton and nailing it e: also, https://twitter.com/MrMagicMan__/status/1444179507905171459
|
|
#
?
Oct 2, 2021 10:31
|
|
|
Kite Pride Worldwide posted:Presumably literal bullets wouldn't actually do anything at all to monsters. You're only harming them by channeling your emotions into a physical strike, after all. so pistol-whipping is actually mandatory Think I posted it already but IMO a human wanting to kill a monster could raise up a gun and yell Bang! and deal damage.
|
|
#
?
Oct 2, 2021 10:51
|
|
|
Kite Pride Worldwide posted:Presumably literal bullets wouldn't actually do anything at all to monsters. You're only harming them by channeling your emotions into a physical strike, after all. so pistol-whipping is actually mandatory if accurate, monsters could actually rack up a pretty decent bodycount on a human military (at least until someone realizes increasingly bigger guns are not the answer) small edit: I don't necessarily agree with the theory, but it's funny to think about incidentally I always suspected this is why the military couldn't stop monsters in Power Rangers--immune to ballistics and traditional ordnance, but susceptible to jump kicks and attitude
|
|
#
?
Oct 2, 2021 11:03
|
|
|
Spamton is trans and here's the proof: - wants a better body - is in a long distance relationship - lives in a garbage can (I live in poland) - big shot obviously refers to testosterone - the glasses
|
|
#
?
Oct 2, 2021 11:12
|
|
|
So, I was talking to a friend of mine, and they dropped some knowledge on me about the significance of the year 1997 with regards to Spamton. And it has nothing to do with Asriel's birthday:My friend posted:1997 - First SMTP hijacking. Simple Mail transfer Protocol (SMTP) is a sender push technology that delivered all messages without any sender requirement to provide an authentic return address. My friend posted:dudes, it's the year spam was invented
|
|
#
?
Oct 2, 2021 11:41
|
|
|
Just finished reading the entire thread over a couple days since I played Chapter 1 at launch but never sought out this thread And congrats to this prophet Space Cadet Omoly posted:We're going to turn Noelle into a homicidal maniac.
|
|
#
?
Oct 2, 2021 12:29
|
|
|
Just as a aside on the 'monsters suck at fighting lol' it is stated that killing intent is a big factor in how much a human can cause harm, but reverse is true too. If a monster doesn't want to fight it has no defense and dies easier. It's not hard to imagine Asgore or other monsters being a incredible force in a hypothetical war while still being too weak to do anything in UT. It's why the longer some fights go on in most cases you start doing more damage- see Toriel's sudden 'critical hit'
|
|
#
?
Oct 2, 2021 12:42
|
|
|
It’s possible that this phenomenon works in the reverse when it comes to fear. Maybe a terrified human becomes more susceptible to monster attacks that target their very soul, and only after humans saw that monsters can be beaten did the war start to become one-sided.
|
|
#
?
Oct 2, 2021 13:12
|
|
|
|
| # ? Jun 7, 2024 20:56 |
|
|
If anyone's interested, Laurentheflute is streaming the second chapter again.
|
|
#
?
Oct 2, 2021 17:25
|
|
