|
ninjewtsu posted:ok so actually about halfway through the dub becomes a 9 out of 10. honestly the later episodes are some of the best dubbing i think i've ever heard Eh it's more like they noticed that certain people were getting close to the end of the "service term" and since that can never actually happen everyone has to die. There is not even a chance that they don't know who and how many of them are alive since otherwise someone could theoretically slip through the cracks and hit that service time. Not that they would honor it even if someone did.
|
#
?
Sep 10, 2021 17:57
|
|
|
|
| # ? Jun 8, 2024 19:40 |
|
|
I dunno man I'm pretty sure that's also why Henrietta criticizes lena for not slacking off. Her "because you didnt just slack off and not care they're being given the order to die" makes very little sense on its own, but if she's referring to how lena's diligent attempts to get spearhead reinforcements just alerted the proper authorities that it's about the right time to get them all killed it's a much more cutting criticism and makes lena's pained reaction make a lot more sense. I'm sure they were going to get the order fairly soon anyways for the reason you've stated but I think there's a compelling case that lena was the catalyst for that specific timing, and if lena had just kept her head under the radar then spearhead might've gotten another month or two ninjewtsu fucked around with this message at 23:27 on Sep 10, 2021 |
|
#
?
Sep 10, 2021 22:54
|
|
|
My read of that scene was Henrietta saying "if you hadn't put effort into supporting them, they just would have died where they are instead".
|
|
#
?
Sep 10, 2021 23:34
|
|
|
LibrarianCroaker posted:My read of that scene was Henrietta saying "if you hadn't put effort into supporting them, they just would have died where they are instead". I'm pretty sure it's this. I don't think the intent of the author was to undermine Milize's efforts by saying she actually reduced their rate of survival. Rather that everyone in the Republic's military would have just preferred she have not tried because now so many have survived to reach their end of enlistment they'll have to send them on their final mission. They generally would have preferred to keep their hands "clean" by letting things take care of themselves rather than "dirty" them with handling the 86. They can more easily pretend they are not monsters when they are not directly ordering the 86 on a death march.
|
|
#
?
Sep 10, 2021 23:49
|
|
|
i don't understand why lena would give 2 shits about that
|
|
#
?
Sep 11, 2021 00:03
|
|
|
ninjewtsu posted:i don't understand why lena would give 2 shits about that Because it's her longtime friend telling her that it would be better if the people she's fought for for so long to keep alive had just died in a ditch. It's what more or less obliterates any remaining rose tinted glasses Milize had about Henrietta's outlook and what pushes her to start trying to manipulate Henrietta to get her to help the 86 rather than convince her of the righteousness of the cause.
|
|
#
?
Sep 11, 2021 00:09
|
|
|
On the other hand I have a hard time imagining their so efficient at keeping track of the 86 that they would have remembered that there's one specific unit that's still kicking around and almost at the end of their time. Why can't it be both?
|
|
#
?
Sep 11, 2021 00:14
|
|
|
Nitrousoxide posted:Because it's her longtime friend telling her that it would be better if the people she's fought for for so long to keep alive had just died in a ditch. It's what more or less obliterates any remaining rose tinted glasses Milize had about Henrietta's outlook and what pushes her to start trying to manipulate Henrietta to get her to help the 86 rather than convince her of the righteousness of the cause. i don't think that particular line was the moment lena realized that, there was a lot of conversation before that line and a lot of emphasis was put on specifically that line and lena's reaction to it. that entire conversation started with lena telling henrietta she's a bad person, you could remove that line entirely and come to that same takeaway. henrietta's lead into the line is saying the lena is no better than she is, it's very clearly supposed to be a point she's making on lena's hypocrisy in her actions and "they would have died but now they are going to be given an order that makes them die" is just incredibly weak and bizarre for the framing around it.
|
|
#
?
Sep 11, 2021 00:14
|
|
|
lena might have sped things up or made them happen in a slightly different way, but her requests for reinforcements didn't really make much of a difference.
|
|
#
?
Sep 11, 2021 00:17
|
|
|
also again the new juggernauts arrive immediately after she's told that reinforcement command has heard her request and made their plans. like it's the same episode. this show gets a little funny with time so i'm having trouble placing it specifically on a timeline but the new juggernauts seem to come either the same day or the day after she's told that, there's no way those two things aren't relatedgimme the GOD drat candy posted:lena might have sped things up or made them happen in a slightly different way, but her requests for reinforcements didn't really make much of a difference. that's what i'm saying yeah
|
|
#
?
Sep 11, 2021 00:18
|
|
|
To add to this, in retrospect going with ninjewtsu's theory I think you also have the sense that Spearhead also always knew this was going to happen because of Lena's meddling, but eventually come to resignedly accept it; but come around on Lena's help and intentions as genuine and not just a busybody sticking her nose where it doesn't belong.
|
|
#
?
Sep 11, 2021 00:29
|
|
|
i think my question is if lena didn't have any effect on that timing, why did her uncle send her requests up at all? he knows they wouldn't care and he doesn't really care either. he'd only tell them if they did care, and the only reason they'd care is "oh good time to ship them off" like he never did anything for any of her other requests for help. he didn't go talk to anyone about the possibility of using the mortars when she made a big deal about it. but her reinforcement requests are the one time he sends them up just to see what happens? and coincidentally shortly after he does that the new juggernauts arrive for the next batch?
|
|
#
?
Sep 11, 2021 00:31
|
|
|
I’m pretty sure someone did the math and they got sent off after exactly the 129 days written on the board, so the timetable was 100% fixed. Also I’ve been working my way through the light novels, and drat the Republic has some real current events energy. Their hosed up handling of a crisis causes the legion to mutate into dangerous new forms TWICE just in the first four books.
|
|
#
?
Sep 11, 2021 02:08
|
|
|
Raenir Salazar posted:On the other hand I have a hard time imagining their so efficient at keeping track of the 86 that they would have remembered that there's one specific unit that's still kicking around and almost at the end of their time. Why can't it be both? Spearhead unit is where they send the 86 that are surviving too long to die. It's the purpose of the unit.
|
|
#
?
Sep 11, 2021 02:32
|
|
|
i'd wager that a few of the previous iterations of spearhead all died before the time ran out.
|
|
#
?
Sep 11, 2021 03:04
|
|
|
Trailer 2 is out. I'd recommend anime only people avoid unless you'd like some reveals in the first episode spoiled for you. Spoilered link below. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SvvyFAj5Fuw
|
|
#
?
Sep 15, 2021 16:10
|
|
|
Looking forward to this soon.
|
|
#
?
Sep 30, 2021 04:54
|
|
|
That first episode was really good. The OP was great too. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p6jduQ_Jy5c
|
|
#
?
Oct 2, 2021 18:47
|
|
|
Ah yes, Empress Frederica was everything I'd hoped for.
|
|
#
?
Oct 2, 2021 19:03
|
|
|
That's one hell of a retcon.
|
|
#
?
Oct 2, 2021 21:24
|
|
|
Paracelsus posted:That's one hell of a retcon. I'd say it's more a fakeout than a retcon, since they knew they were going to do this right from the start.
|
|
#
?
Oct 2, 2021 21:35
|
|
|
chiasaur11 posted:I'd say it's more a fakeout than a retcon, since they knew they were going to do this right from the start. Still you'd think they'd save it for a big end of the episode reveal.
|
|
#
?
Oct 2, 2021 21:50
|
|
|
chiasaur11 posted:I'd say it's more a fakeout than a retcon, since they knew they were going to do this right from the start. The First LN is also consistent with this in its epilogue, so it definitely not a retcon. So what did the anime only folks think was going on in that dream sequence in the start of second half?
|
|
#
?
Oct 2, 2021 22:14
|
|
|
Also from what was talked about here, the Legion never actually became self aware and turned on its masters.
|
|
#
?
Oct 2, 2021 22:25
|
|
|
drat that was a hell of an opening episode. I'm glad I didn't just go read the manga and spoil it for myself.
|
|
#
?
Oct 2, 2021 22:46
|
|
|
Highlights: That black uniform looks spiffy. Demoted to Captain oh no! But she also appears to have gained a following of other young officers who seem to want to do more than just to complacently sit back and twiddle their thumbs; probably convinced that the Legion are a larger threat than the higher ups say they are. I wonder why she seems to be able to continue wilfully disobey orders and seems to be influencial enough to do what she wants; maybe she struck a bargain with her uncle to give her free reign on one hand in exchange to somewhat not make too big of a fuss because actually punishing her would raise uncomfortable questions? Maybe she got some backers from the other part of the government now as well and she's learned to pull strings; in addition to her cohort of new allies maybe being all well positioned to let her act somewhat freely? I figured the little girl with the mouth had to be royalty given how she talked, being the current/surviving Empress ala a sort of Anastasia sort of role is going to be fun I imagine, especially since she seems a little wiser than her age suggests. Interesting that Giad seems to also seems to be fighting the legion from the other side so that would explain why the Legion didn't just crush San Magnolia like a grape already; if they push too far than they risk being pincered from the other side. Also interesting the silver haired people also seem to exist in Giad as well but only in San Magnolia did they decide to setup a silver hair ethnostate. MonsterEnvy posted:Also from what was talked about here, the Legion never actually became self aware and turned on its masters. A what now? I thought we all generally knew this when the show was originally airing?
|
|
#
?
Oct 2, 2021 23:21
|
|
|
Raenir Salazar posted:
What we were told in San Magnolia is that the Empire of Giad was destroyed by the Legion turning on them. But from what the President said, the Empire was overthrown and made into a Federal Republic. But because the Federacy overthrew the Empire the Legion started targeting them as well. MonsterEnvy fucked around with this message at 23:41 on Oct 2, 2021 |
|
#
?
Oct 2, 2021 23:39
|
|
|
Raenir Salazar posted:
Basically, she gets results, so her boss looks great whenever he's talking to his bosses. He punishes her, his results get worse and then people stop giving him perks. She's gotten better at playing politics. Raenir Salazar posted:Interesting that Giad seems to also seems to be fighting the legion from the other side so that would explain why the Legion didn't just crush San Magnolia like a grape already; if they push too far than they risk being pincered from the other side. Also interesting the silver haired people also seem to exist in Giad as well but only in San Magnolia did they decide to setup a silver hair ethnostate. I think part of it is that San Magnolia has been working under the assumption that they're the only ones the Legion is attacking, so keeping things stable and cleaning up the evidence vis a vis genocide is priority one. Meanwhile, Giad wasn't sure if anyone else was still alive, so they treated it like every survivor was in the same foxhole.
|
|
#
?
Oct 2, 2021 23:44
|
|
|
Something to remember from the first season are the Eintagsfliege which are a small legion unit that fly and which block all radio comms across legion controlled territory. Their existence was the impetus for creating the mind linking tech which is unaffected by their jamming.
|
|
#
?
Oct 2, 2021 23:55
|
|
|
Someone just pointed out to me, that the Federacy Military said that the Dinosauria wreckage they found with the Spearhead kids was an old version. Meaning the Legion was not even tossing it's up to date stuff at San Magnolia.
|
|
#
?
Oct 2, 2021 23:58
|
|
|
MonsterEnvy posted:What we were told in San Magnolia is that the Empire of Giad was destroyed by the Legion turning on them. But from what the President said, the Empire was overthrown and made into a Federal Republic. But because the Federacy overthrew the Empire the Legion started targeting them as well. I got a very different impression, namely cause and effect are reversed here. What I got was because the legion turned against Giad, there was a civil war/rebellion to replace the Empire with something more effective to save and piece together whats left of their country to more effectively face off the Legion because the Empire got their clocks cleaned by their creations. chiasaur11 posted:Basically, she gets results, so her boss looks great whenever he's talking to his bosses. He punishes her, his results get worse and then people stop giving him perks. She's gotten better at playing politics. This was something that didn't quite follow for me, why would the top brass care about results when everyone seems to be largely uncaring about what happens because the war doesn't matter and the Legion, as far as they're aware are going to be a non-issue in two years? Raenir Salazar fucked around with this message at 00:46 on Oct 3, 2021 |
|
#
?
Oct 3, 2021 00:43
|
|
|
They still need to last those two years, and at least someone has to be aware that their old rear end minefield and dilapidated static defenses won't cut it if it comes down to that.
|
|
#
?
Oct 3, 2021 01:05
|
|
|
Good Success still looks good to your bosses, no matter how useless your job is.
|
|
#
?
Oct 3, 2021 01:10
|
|
|
Ahhhhhhhhhh, god I'm so happy. I missed this show. Big "What are you gonna do, fire me?" energy
|
|
#
?
Oct 3, 2021 01:50
|
|
|
I didn't realize just how much I missed this show until after I finished the first episode of this season and sat there feeling real satisfied. I had no idea they were all gonna make it out alive, so it was interesting to see that in all likelihood the only reason they did is because some remnant of Shin's brothers brain kept the Legion from outright killing all of them cause the president said they were found "captured" by the Legion. That in itself raises some pretty interesting questions about the Legion to me.
|
|
#
?
Oct 3, 2021 02:42
|
|
|
Overlord K posted:I didn't realize just how much I missed this show until after I finished the first episode of this season and sat there feeling real satisfied. (joke speculation) Maybe they're all robots now. 
|
|
#
?
Oct 3, 2021 03:07
|
|
|
Raenir Salazar posted:(joke speculation) You kid but The way the Giad people were concerned that spearhead were a form of smallpox blanket, combined with them being captured by the legion and Shins weird decapitation imagery, and the focus on the para-raids, makes me wonder if Shin wasn’t brainwashed with some Legion kill command that will activate at the worst possible time.
|
|
#
?
Oct 3, 2021 03:49
|
|
|
Raenir Salazar posted:I got a very different impression, namely cause and effect are reversed here. What I got was because the legion turned against Giad, there was a civil war/rebellion to replace the Empire with something more effective to save and piece together whats left of their country to more effectively face off the Legion because the Empire got their clocks cleaned by their creations. I got the other impression because of how he said it. 'We defeated the Giad "Empire" that created the Legion, and we changed it into a Federal Republic. Well, because of that, we're still fighting the remaining Legion, though.' Which implies to me they would not be fighting with the Legion had they not overthrown the Empire.
|
|
#
?
Oct 3, 2021 04:17
|
|
|
I mean, we are presumably watching something that's been translated, and Japanese can be weird when it comes to subjects; maybe they elaborate more in the LN? We basically have two possibilities: 1. Giad had a coup/rebellion to stop them from building killbots, which then turned against them once the Legion no longer recognized them as being the same "nation" as before as their masters. 2. Giad had a coup/rebellion because the Empire built killbots which proceeded to turn against them and crippled them as a nation; likely killing the Imperial Family in the initial skirmishes; and the rebellion was to basically restore the nation to something that can function and effectively resist the Legion. It's interesting because Giad de facto seems to be more of a Regency, the current government is ruling provisionally likely as a result of the emergency, but they took the additional steps of also reforming their government into a federation and also seem to have taken the liberty of safe guarding the Empress-in-Exile as a ward of the state. We know how this went in formerly Imperial Russia. Raenir Salazar fucked around with this message at 05:32 on Oct 3, 2021 |
|
#
?
Oct 3, 2021 05:26
|
|
|
|
| # ? Jun 8, 2024 19:40 |
|
|
this direction for the show doesn't impress me as much as i was hoping it would. it's interesting enough though if the legion didn't turn on the empire, what was the deal with that brainbot at the end of season one who was all about protecting the princess? this possibility requires that this guy got killed and had his brain jacked by the legion for some additional unknown reason.
|
|
#
?
Oct 3, 2021 07:59
|
|