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Bremen posted:snip Thanks! Seems totally fine then, the distinction you noted between body and mind control is absolutely relevant. Sounds more like the Mind-Body Transfer in Naruto, only better. Will probably read it in a week or two. I mainly asked because I keep coming across weird mind control stuff in quest/webnovel stuff when I'm not expecting it.
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Oct 3, 2021 20:22
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SerSpook posted:On the Fates Parallel talk--I actually really hate mind control content for the most part. I've not read the story but it might be up my alley. I've got a few questions though. Don't mind spoiling me, I don't care about them. Do use spoiler tags though! My biggest problem with mind controllers in stories is when they invalidate characterization: if any character can be a sleeper double agent against their will and without their knowledge, what even is the point of the story. Fates parallel does not have this problem, but another RR story I've been reading, Calamity Mandate, sort of does. SerSpook posted:1. Like, what goes down with the mind control stuff? What prompted it in the first place? What sort of consequences result from it, for the controller and the controlled? A new character (Yue) comes in, who is significantly stronger than the main characters, and mind controls them with plans to kill them if she can't get what she wants. It does get to the point where Yue can pilot the main character's body around like a meat puppet while the MC is aware the whole time but unable to act. It's well beyond being a short-term combat technique. Then, because the MC and her dual-cultivation partner weren't being obedient enough, Yue severs their connection, permanently crippling both of them as far as anyone but the audience is aware. Permanently crippling them wasn't intentional but it felt more like a toddler breaking their toys rather than feeling real remorse. The "screams worse than the dying" were specifically mentioned, but she still goes ahead with forcing them to do her bidding and later flip-flops between both sides in the conflict with no loyalty or remorse at all. As for consequences? For the controlled they eventually get better, but they're forced to live and work with Yue because one of their masters isn't actually interested in teaching his disciples, so if they don't learn techniques from Yue they aren't learning anything. This is the whole forced "kiss and make up" that I dislike more than anything. Their master could have prevented everything or stepped in at any time, but chose not to because master-disciple bonds - supposedly stronger than all other social bonds - are not stronger than the desire to play political games. I'd almost be fine with it if the controller died, but Yue is given a slap on the wrist (dispersing her spiritual cultivation but not her mental or body cultivation) that, I predict, will turn out to be a blessing because she can re-cultivate the new "better" way going forward. Then, because the MCs are forced to live with her, she eventually becomes part of the main cast of friends (not that I've read all of arc 3, but I have skimmed it enough to confirm this). SerSpook posted:2. What sort of position does mind control as a thing occupy in the narrative? Is it portrayed as something acceptable and understandable in many cases? Always wrong? Somewhere in between? I mean no one seems to care when disciples kill each other, so none of the authority figures bat an eye at it. Not even their master, who was aware the whole time. The instructors probably would have been fine if the controller was killed in retaliation. Unfortunately one of their masters took that off the table, otherwise the author would have no way to force the main characters to get along with their mind-rapist, and the author already had arc 3 planned out, so he needed to force this through. There's another character (Eunae) with a short term mind-control/befuddlement gaze that's really only used as a combat technique. She doesn't like using it, after abusing it as a child, and she doesn't have great control over it, but I'm at least perfectly fine with how that one is portrayed and handled. SerSpook posted:3. How common is mind control content in the story in general? And, as part of number 2 I guess, how is it normally presented? Probably not very much going forward, but the author doesn't seem to appreciate what they wrote so I don't really have faith something similar won't happen. SerSpook posted:Sorry for the questions but I had this down as a thing I might read soon, and if I should just drop it now it'd be good to know. And I'd rather not just run face first into something that'd cause me to just drop it, because I honestly have a really low tolerance for certain types of mind control content. I don't especially care if the protagonist swore to some noble or whatever, so long as the noble wasn't the one that mind controlled her. Which it seems like isn't the case? To be honest I don't think you'll enjoy it but I think you can at least give it a try, some other readers are clearly more charitable to it than I am. At least the noble was not the one doing the mind controlling. e: Another point is that the author seemed surprised by the blow-back to the various events in arc 2, but rather than really addressing them he locked the comments to chill the conversation and told people to trust him. Then the end of arc 2 happened and it would have betrayed my trust even more if I had any left. I can probably get over arc 2 in and of itself but I have little faith in the author going forward. Desuwa fucked around with this message at 20:50 on Oct 3, 2021 |
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Oct 3, 2021 20:42
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Silynt posted:Arrogant Young Master Template A Variation 4 is dumping 71(!) chapters on Royal Road as I post this, almost as many as had previously been available. This story hasn’t been updated in almost 2 years and I personally don’t really remember where it left off, but I remember enjoying its satirical take on cultivation. I’ll probably try to start over and see if it holds my attention up to the new content. this one has succeed where numerous others have failed: in making me actually laugh Chapter 37 posted:*clap* *clap* *clap*
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Oct 3, 2021 21:11
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tbf so far even the real-rear end mind control ability in fates parallel isn't the 'secret sleeper agent that hears a code phrase and changes completely' type. it's more of the 'forced, extremely strong emotional state' kind. it's less control and more domination, I guess.
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Oct 4, 2021 04:09
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Desuwa posted:My biggest problem with mind controllers in stories is when they invalidate characterization: if any character can be a sleeper double agent against their will and without their knowledge, what even is the point of the story. Fates parallel does not have this problem, but another RR story I've been reading, Calamity Mandate, sort of does. This is like an astoundingly bad faith take on most of the elements of the story you're responding to. I understand you don't like the story but it isn't necessary to just continuously poo poo all over it with the most negative takes you could possible have.
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Oct 5, 2021 14:52
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Sampatrick posted:This is like an astoundingly bad faith take on most of the elements of the story you're responding to. I understand you don't like the story but it isn't necessary to just continuously poo poo all over it with the most negative takes you could possible have. My impression was that they really didn't like what happened, and therefor felt all the justification for why it happened could only be explained by the author making a mistake and desperately trying to come up with reasons to justify it, instead of the author just planning a different sort of story than they wanted to read. And to be fair, this isn't the first time I've seen someone have a far, far worse reaction to mind/body control in a story than I do, and use the term "mind rape" which I tend to regard as appropriate for a wholly different sort of thing. I get the idea some people just really hate the idea, and that's fine, I think it's just a difference of opinion I (and apparently the author of Fates Parallel) don't share. Honestly it's probably best they stopped where they did because (Patreon spoiler) their friend Dae ends up nearly severing their bond again with a spell in the pairs tournament while trying to interfere with their freaky battle coordination. They're upset but accept he didn't actually realize it was anything worse than some temporary disruption. Bremen fucked around with this message at 16:09 on Oct 5, 2021 |
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Oct 5, 2021 15:17
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Honestly that spoiler doesn't sound nearly as bad. For me it's not a single hot-button issue but this confluence of bad turns for the story that has me convinced the author didn't expect the reaction he got and instead of looking at it, finding what was wrong, and fixing it he just decided to force his plan through even though it paints characters in a really bad light. E: the author also locked those comments pretty quickly to shut down all conversation, and when they take an action like that I'm not required to like it. Desuwa fucked around with this message at 17:39 on Oct 5, 2021 |
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Oct 5, 2021 17:31
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who's even reading or even posting in the comments on web serials tbh. well, I did post a lengthy comment once but it was to make fun of the author having an existential crisis when they thought Biden might lose. im just here to read the story; sometimes i might be moved to make a technical critique but it's really hard to tell on an unfinished work what's a creative mistake and what just isn't something I'm going to enjoy. it feels like you're less invested when you're 100-200 pages into a regular book and get turned off, somehow.
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Oct 5, 2021 18:18
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Larry Parrish posted:who's even reading or even posting in the comments on web serials tbh the sickest and most degenerate freaks on the planet
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Oct 5, 2021 18:29
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i don't think r/rapist exists, so webnovel comment sections are where you can post about how rape and slavery are good, actually.
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Oct 5, 2021 18:40
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In this case the author called out that they locked comments on their author's note and asked people to go to their discord instead to provide feedback. Though I was wrong in my last comment and the comments were open a lot longer than I thought they were. I usually try to drop these stories early (often before even starting them when I see the author has 20 previous stories on hiatus) to avoid feeling invested. The last ship in Suzhou is one where the opening couple of chapters were so uncompelling to me I bounced off it but I'll give it another chance later based on this thread.
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Oct 5, 2021 18:40
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Desuwa posted:In this case the author called out that they locked comments on their author's note and asked people to go to their discord instead to provide feedback. Though I was wrong in my last comment and the comments were open a lot longer than I thought they were. I wouldn't bother if you already bounced off, the gimmick of "we're better at everyone else in the world because we got handed incredible power for doing nothing and saying things we read on a fortune cookie" has not yet changed. The actual writing is good, the storyline is bad Piell fucked around with this message at 19:03 on Oct 5, 2021 |
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Oct 5, 2021 18:55
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gimme the GOD drat candy posted:i don't think r/rapist exists, so webnovel comment sections are where you can post about how rape and slavery are good, actually.
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Oct 5, 2021 19:06
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Piell posted:I wouldn't bother if you already bounced off, the gimmick of "we're better at everyone else in the world because we got handed incredible power for doing nothing and saying things we read on a fortune cookie" has not yet changed Maybe, but I'll give it another shot. My biggest problem with the opening chapters was just how over-written they were. I can only take so much in the way of flowery "it was not X but it was X, Y but not Y" descriptions before my eyes roll terminally into my skull and I cough up blood, especially in the first couple of chapters. It's another thing if it comes up later during a sequence of enlightenment where the author is trying to demonstrate some kind of deeper understanding reached by the character that doesn't actually exist in reality, but these are two normal teens right now. I nearly laughed when it made a huge deal of saying "I'm not convinced" to a thunderstorm in chapter 5 (just went to confirm that).
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Oct 5, 2021 19:07
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90s Cringe Rock posted:/r/rapist was banned 11 years ago. /r/apist was banned 2 years ago. Reddit is still a great place to post about how rape and slavery are good, actually. Never go on reddit. Given that the incel "community" still loves to use reddit, I have to agree.
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Oct 5, 2021 19:58
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Katreus posted:Re: Fates Parallel - The thing that I remember the most about this story was that the author basically had to figure out how to undo his own plot point when the MC swore herself to that foreign noble because of the amount of screaming and bad reviews from rr readers who wanted their independent, OP main character. Too bad; that noble seemed interesting, and there are few stories with a subordinate protagonist. I was pleasantly surprised when the readers had Ling Qi choose to go with Cai instead of tutoring under Jiao (which, to be fair, would have also been cool, but I think less interesting because she would have become less involved with the politics of the setting).
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Oct 6, 2021 07:21
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Ytlaya posted:I was pleasantly surprised when the readers had Ling Qi choose to go with Cai instead of tutoring under Jiao (which, to be fair, would have also been cool, but I think less interesting because she would have become less involved with the politics of the setting). gu tai 4 lyfe
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Oct 6, 2021 15:18
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Can anyone recommend some good novels with a lesbian main character most web-novels I find are either male leads or female but don't have any romance. It doesn't have to be romance focused and I don't have any preference whether its originally in English or translated as long as it isn't clunky and reads well. Separately any good novels that have a strong main character but doesn't realize that what they do is amazing I really like the contrast of having another character think the mc is something like a master mind who thinks 10 steps ahead when in reality they have no idea what they are doing.
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Oct 6, 2021 20:51
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Drashin posted:Can anyone recommend some good novels with a lesbian main character most web-novels I find are either male leads or female but don't have any romance. It doesn't have to be romance focused and I don't have any preference whether its originally in English or translated as long as it isn't clunky and reads well. Katalepsis is a really fun urban fantasy/cosmic horror, and it’s written by a goon! Silynt fucked around with this message at 21:18 on Oct 6, 2021 |
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Oct 6, 2021 21:15
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Drashin posted:Can anyone recommend some good novels with a lesbian main character most web-novels I find are either male leads or female but don't have any romance. It doesn't have to be romance focused and I don't have any preference whether its originally in English or translated as long as it isn't clunky and reads well. Huh, honestly, my experience is the opposite; most webnovels seem to have either straight male or lesbian female leads. If you're not drawn to fantasy specifically, Stray Cat Strut has a very lesbian main character. It's cyberpunkish, pseudo-litrpg story (aliens are invading, and friendly aliens are busy but set some AIs to help by "selling" supertech gear to locals for points gained from killing aliens.) The second question really makes me think of Beware of Chicken.
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Oct 6, 2021 21:58
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Drashin posted:Can anyone recommend some good novels with a lesbian main character most web-novels I find are either male leads or female but don't have any romance. It doesn't have to be romance focused and I don't have any preference whether its originally in English or translated as long as it isn't clunky and reads well. I dunno, it's not my thing. From what I've seen on the release lists, there seems to be a decent amount of YA with lesbian romance published these days. Might want to search for those. As for webnovels specifically, try sifting through this I suppose: https://www.novelupdates.com/series-finder/?sf=1&gi=851,922&mgi=or&sort=srank&order=asc quote:Separately any good novels that have a strong main character but doesn't realize that what they do is amazing I really like the contrast of having another character think the mc is something like a master mind who thinks 10 steps ahead when in reality they have no idea what they are doing. Beware the Chicken fits, I guess? Also, there's I’m Really Not The Demon God’s Lackey and It Turns Out I am a Dao Ancestor, but I am not gonna go so far as to say they're good.
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Oct 6, 2021 22:09
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Drashin posted:Separately any good novels that have a strong main character but doesn't realize that what they do is amazing I really like the contrast of having another character think the mc is something like a master mind who thinks 10 steps ahead when in reality they have no idea what they are doing. to be a power in the shadows gets way too slapstick for my tastes but is exactly that as far as the main character is concerned he is just being a big silly chuuni but accidentally's his way into worldly influence
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Oct 6, 2021 22:23
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I feel in To be a power in the shadows it is less that the mc doesn't know he's amazing, and more that he has no idea what the plot is.
MatteusTheCorrupt fucked around with this message at 23:02 on Oct 6, 2021 |
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Oct 6, 2021 23:00
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SerSpook posted:gu tai 4 lyfe Yeah this was actually my favorite option, lol. Would have been great. Also meant we wouldn't have lost Ling Qi's coolest friend.
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Oct 6, 2021 23:09
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Bremen posted:Huh, honestly, my experience is the opposite; most webnovels seem to have either straight male or lesbian female leads. If you're not drawn to fantasy specifically, Stray Cat Strut has a very lesbian main character. It's cyberpunkish, pseudo-litrpg story (aliens are invading, and friendly aliens are busy but set some AIs to help by "selling" supertech gear to locals for points gained from killing aliens.) that's by the straight guy who always has underage lesbian sex scenes in his works. so, uh, no.
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Oct 7, 2021 03:16
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Silynt posted:Katalepsis is a really fun urban fantasy/cosmic horror, and it’s written by a goon! Katalepsis is super good and has a whole house full of lesbians.
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Oct 7, 2021 06:26
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gimme the GOD drat candy posted:that's by the straight guy who always has underage lesbian sex scenes in his works. so, uh, no. which is, stray cat strut or beware of chicken
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Oct 7, 2021 06:42
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the former.
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Oct 7, 2021 09:14
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i like to think of the stray cat strut guy as merely being terminally french rather than a pedophile. however, ive only read stray cat and part of cinnamon bun. cinnamon bun, somehow, came off 10000x creepier, and I can't explain why or how.
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Oct 7, 2021 10:29
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i'd be fine with it if it wasn't every time or if they weren't always underaged. taken together, just ugh.
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Oct 7, 2021 10:55
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gimme the GOD drat candy posted:i'd be fine with it if it wasn't every time or if they weren't always underaged. taken together, just ugh. im pretty sure he lives in a place where it's merely young and not underage but it doesn't really help. it's definetly weird in any case. i would really not like to know wtf the dude thinks about anything.
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Oct 7, 2021 11:08
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gimme the GOD drat candy posted:i'd be fine with it if it wasn't every time or if they weren't always underaged. taken together, just ugh. I mean, I haven't read all of his stuff, but I'm pretty sure that's straight up not the case. I got curious, so I downloaded some epubs and quick-searched through, just in case. (Man, this guy writes a lot. I haven't even seen some of these.) Cinnamon Bun - teenage girl, straight. There's a very closeted teen lesbian character, but there is zero sexual content. Level Action - adult woman, bangs a dude. Stray Cat Strut - deffo lesbians. couldn't actually find the age on a cursory glance, though, but I got the vibe he went 18+ just to protect his bacon Dead Tired - the MC is an evil wizard skeleton. probably not a teenage lesbian Agartha Loop - I think they're in, like, magical Heart of Dorkness - teenage girl becomes adopted by a Goddess of Darkness, no romance or sexual content as far as I can tell Fluff - I actually read some of this one. College girl gets a superpower where she spawns superpowered siblings, no romance or sexual content I think? Eh, I think that's most of them and I am bored. In conclusion, a dude just cranking out story after story about cute teenage girls is pretty amusing/eyebrow raise worthy but, tbh, I don't know if I wouldn't do the same if it was making me money.
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Oct 7, 2021 11:30
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That is not how I would describe Cinnamon Bun.
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Oct 7, 2021 11:44
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Cinnamon Bun has a running gag that the naive protagonist found a 'Wand of cure hysteria' and doesn't realise it's a dildo. Otherwise it doesn't get any more sexual than sharing a bed/tent and waking up spooning. At least not as far as I've read in the last couple days. Protagonist could be bi? She wants kids eventually but some magic mirrors of temptation showed her men and women. And because the whole point is an isekai protagonist remaining a sweet innocent Cinnamon Bun, if anyone actually just straight up offered sex, she'd probably be a useless spluttering blushing mess until they left.
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Oct 7, 2021 17:22
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gimme the GOD drat candy posted:i'd be fine with it if it wasn't every time or if they weren't always underaged. taken together, just ugh. Stray Cat Strut does have sex scenes (in specifically marked and skippable chapters) but the characters aren't underage. I haven't read many of the author's other stories but I don't recall explicit stuff in them (to be fair, I dropped Cinnamon Bun early, not because I found it creepy but because I found it boring). I also remember when the author ran a fanart contest and specifically asked for nothing racy of Cinnamon Bun's protagonist because she was underage, unlike Stray Cat Strut's, so they're definitely aware of the difference. I believe Ravensdagger got their start writing Worm fanfiction so that might at least partially explain why they tend to have female, and sometimes teen, protagonists. I don't have a problem with it, whatever the reason, as long as they keep explicit stuff and underage characters separate and it seems like they do. Bremen fucked around with this message at 18:31 on Oct 7, 2021 |
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Oct 7, 2021 17:25
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Larry Parrish posted:cinnamon bun, somehow, came off 10000x creepier, and I can't explain why or how. And the way the author keeps focusing on lesbian protagonist makes me want to link them the "you might be a transbian if..." meme, before accusing them of any other motivations. VictualSquid fucked around with this message at 17:35 on Oct 7, 2021 |
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Oct 7, 2021 17:32
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I think the author is just into cute girl anime. Not my thing, but it's a very popular genre I guess.
Megazver fucked around with this message at 18:13 on Oct 7, 2021 |
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Oct 7, 2021 18:11
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Bremen posted:I believe Ravensdagger got their start writing Worm fanfiction so that might at least partially explain why they tend to have female, and sometimes teen, protagonists. I don't have a problem with it, whatever the reason, as long as they keep explicit stuff and underage characters separate and it seems like they do. nah, he doesn't, or at least didn't used to. maybe he's changed, but after awhile he 100% creeped me out and i wasn't at all surprised when i came across him linking a "bonus" scene he wasn't allowed to post on the usual worm fanfic spaces
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Oct 7, 2021 20:55
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Larry Parrish posted:i like to think of the stray cat strut guy as merely being terminally french rather than a pedophile. a distinction without a difference when it comes to the arts
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Oct 9, 2021 07:26
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atelier morgan posted:a distinction without a difference when it comes to the arts it's always fun to think about how epic and cool I thought Leon the professional was as a kid and then being older and remembering that yes that movies kind of creepy and luc besson is a serious for real pedophile lol.
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Oct 9, 2021 07:29
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