I think it's explicitly said to be Agincourt in the next chapter or two
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# ? Sep 28, 2021 20:14 |
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# ? May 27, 2024 02:59 |
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Kind of impressive that anyone attempting to reverse engineer a fascist America would be confident enough to begin tinkering with things as early as the Hundred Years War. I guess... French dominance could result in common law and a marginally freer English society never coming into being? The Magna Carta was already around by then wasn't it?
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# ? Sep 28, 2021 22:58 |
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There’s a reason they’re in the Hundred Years War that is revealed later, it’s worth waiting for.
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# ? Sep 28, 2021 23:21 |
ANOTHER SCORCHER posted:There’s a reason they’re in the Hundred Years War that is revealed later, it’s worth waiting for. OK that I don't remember, buckling up.
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# ? Sep 28, 2021 23:23 |
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freebooter posted:Kind of impressive that anyone attempting to reverse engineer a fascist America would be confident enough to begin tinkering with things as early as the Hundred Years War. I guess... French dominance could result in common law and a marginally freer English society never coming into being? The Magna Carta was already around by then wasn't it? Almost precisely two centuries earlier, yes.
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# ? Sep 28, 2021 23:57 |
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Chapter 8 Jake quote:It was not a good situation. First off, Jake is right that the former Visser 4 isn't the only one who can change history. If the Animorphs go around killing people, that would be bad. And yes, this is Agincourt. Also, Marco paid less attention in French class than Cassie. Chapter 9 Marco quote:The sun was barely up. Gray dawn. Honestly, "Look for the healthy guy" is a good plan.
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# ? Sep 29, 2021 04:05 |
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I vaguely recall reading that the idea of the filthy Middle Ages is a modern notion, and they were actually super clean and bathed multiple times a day - until the Black Death, when they got some idea that it was unhealthy and stopped doing that, or just tried to cover their smells up with perfume etc. So the Middle Ages were clean and the Renaissance (which I guess this is heading towards, or is at least well after the Black Death) was filthy. Although I guess what your ordinary habits are like is irrelevant when you're a campaigning soldier out in the mud. Ax and Marco's back and forth makes me wonder whether the Andalites used to have some sick horse-like suits of armour in their own medieval times. Did we ever figure out if they waged war among themselves?
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# ? Sep 29, 2021 05:15 |
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I think a lot of the "filthy middle ages" stuff derives from the Victorians looking around at their own rapidly-industrialising cities, thinking "we're the pinnacle of civilisation, so logically everything earlier must have sucked" and drawing their conclusions from there.
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# ? Sep 29, 2021 06:16 |
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Epicurius posted:These humans have all the parasites they could possibly support.> When did Ax get so savage?
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# ? Sep 29, 2021 09:52 |
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Just more evidence Ax is the best character in the series (I was about to write about another great Ax Responding to Human History Moment in this book but actually we can wait until we get to it. It's a moment I loved as a kid but look at as an adult and think hmmmm.)
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# ? Sep 29, 2021 14:24 |
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freebooter posted:I vaguely recall reading that the idea of the filthy Middle Ages is a modern notion, and they were actually super clean and bathed multiple times a day - until the Black Death, when they got some idea that it was unhealthy and stopped doing that, or just tried to cover their smells up with perfume etc. So the Middle Ages were clean and the Renaissance (which I guess this is heading towards, or is at least well after the Black Death) was filthy. Although I guess what your ordinary habits are like is irrelevant when you're a campaigning soldier out in the mud. Yeah, the 90s saw a resurgence of the idea that the Middle Ages were absurdly filthy. People did in fact have a decent understanding of basic hygiene. Personally, I blame A World Lit Only By Fire. A compellingly written, engaging book all the rage in the 90s that happens to be complete and utter nonsense.
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# ? Sep 29, 2021 14:58 |
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Chapter 10 Marco quote:I was staring down at about two thousand arrow tips, and two thousand guys squinting up at me along the arrow shaft. Not too much to say in this chapter, other than that Marco was basically in the worst position on the battlefield. Chapter 11 Rachel quote:I saw him stick, literally stick, in the mud. I was high above and to the right, off the main field. I was in bald eagle morph - the only one of us nearly big enough to drag an osprey up out of the mud. Any of them CAN die.
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# ? Sep 30, 2021 03:50 |
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If you die in morph you die in real life
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# ? Sep 30, 2021 05:21 |
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Hope she opted for the thoroughbred racehorse rather than her regular ol' horse.
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# ? Sep 30, 2021 11:02 |
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Chapter 12 Ax quote:<Cassie!> Prince Jake cried. Tobias is in pretty much an impossible position here. He can try to save Rachel, or he can try to stop Visser Four, but not both. Also, how did Visser Four become a longbowman? It's not easy. Chapter 13 Tobias quote:<Rachel!> I yelled. Yep. They've been made.
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# ? Oct 1, 2021 02:38 |
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Another great tense chaotic scene. (Good luck doing anything with a longbow as an amateur other than injuring yourself horribly.)
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# ? Oct 1, 2021 03:34 |
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Ax really demonstrating here that he's the only professional soldier of the bunch. I wonder how the personal time travel works here? Visser Four has clearly been here longer than they have, but how long?
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# ? Oct 1, 2021 03:37 |
freebooter posted:Ax really demonstrating here that he's the only professional soldier of the bunch. It would seem as long as the plot needs. That Time Matrix sure has a sense of humour.
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# ? Oct 1, 2021 06:28 |
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I'm imagining a scenario where V4 spends a couple years or more seeing up each time-changing attempt, and by the end of this story, the Animorphs are dealing with a crotchety old man with a variety of eclectic skills and knowledge.
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# ? Oct 1, 2021 08:37 |
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Epicurius posted:Tobias is in pretty much an impossible position here. He can try to save Rachel, or he can try to stop Visser Four, but not both. Also, how did Visser Four become a longbowman? It's not easy. Yeah, isn't that one of those skills, like mounted archery, that you need to literally train from childhood?
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# ? Oct 1, 2021 08:39 |
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Bobulus posted:I'm imagining a scenario where V4 spends a couple years or more seeing up each time-changing attempt, and by the end of this story, the Animorphs are dealing with a crotchety old man with a variety of eclectic skills and knowledge. That could actually be such a fun and engaging plot for a video game: each time you reach the end he presses a reset button and you play back through against someone who's learned all your tricks and retained all their own
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# ? Oct 1, 2021 10:07 |
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Bobulus posted:I'm imagining a scenario where V4 spends a couple years or more seeing up each time-changing attempt, and by the end of this story, the Animorphs are dealing with a crotchety old man with a variety of eclectic skills and knowledge. Visser Four spending the entirety of David Michod's 'The King' as a scheming advisor only for the Animorphs to show up in the last five minutes and ruin it
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# ? Oct 1, 2021 10:42 |
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Fuschia tude posted:Yeah, isn't that one of those skills, like mounted archery, that you need to literally train from childhood? Wikipedia tells me longbows have a draw weight of over 50kg. That's just drawing the thing, not even aiming it. There's a shipwreck called the Mary Rose from 1545 which was found to contain a heap of longbows and longbow arrows. A few of the skeletons found in the wreck were somewhat deformed from a lifetime of drawing longbows.
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# ? Oct 1, 2021 12:00 |
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I was going to say V4 probably can’t have been hanging around any longer than 3 days. Or less, really, as the kandrona starvation fugue state seems to hit pretty hard at the end of the third. But I guess with the time matrix they can just keep jumping back to a few months before the “present” day to feed, at least unil their host body noticeably ages. Maybe it’s easier to learn the longbow if you have access to advanced computers and you can manipulate the body and muscles like a tool?
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# ? Oct 1, 2021 15:08 |
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Maybe V4's host body did some archery as a hobby and had a bit of a head start.
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# ? Oct 1, 2021 20:09 |
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pile of brown posted:That could actually be such a fun and engaging plot for a video game: each time you reach the end he presses a reset button and you play back through against someone who's learned all your tricks and retained all their own This is roughly the core gameplay concept of Shadow of Mordor, but being not quite dead instead of time travel.
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# ? Oct 2, 2021 02:33 |
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Chapter 14 Cassie quote:I was in agony. I was lying on my side, with Marco and Rachel half-hidden beneath me. The spear had penetrated deep into my side and all I could do was to try and remember my horse anatomy. It's been a while since I studied the battle of Agincourt, but I don't remember this part. Chapter 15 Ax quote:Visser Four ran. But he was merely a human-Controller. So there was very little chance of him outrunning me. I was still in harrier morph. I swooped through the trees as he ran. If you don't know French, "Tuez-le" means "Kill him" Also, "a Yeerk does not rise to Visser rank by being a complete fool"? I feel like I have a good counterargument for Ax here. Ok, to be fair, Visser Three is not actually a complete fool. He's intelligent and clever, and has a good sense of tactics. He's just arrogant, violent, and impatient. Really, the biggest problem is that he's in the wrong job. If this were an outright conquest of Earth, he might be a good commander. He's just not fit for conquest by infiltration.
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# ? Oct 2, 2021 04:35 |
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Pwnstar posted:This is roughly the core gameplay concept of Shadow of Mordor, but being not quite dead instead of time travel. Or Planescape: Torment, except being repeatedly dead.
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# ? Oct 2, 2021 08:41 |
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Chapter 16 Tobias quote:<Prince Jake!> It's a wash, I guess. Visser Four escaped, but he failed to kill Henry V. Chapter 17 Jake quote:“Where’d that dang horse come from?” Fun fact. Washington didn't wear a wig. His hair was his actual hair, just powdered white (his hair was naturally light brown), Also, regarding accents, there's an interesting theory that the modern standard American accent is probably closer to the 18th century standard British accent than modern British accents. In other words, the accent changed more in the UK than the US.
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# ? Oct 3, 2021 03:29 |
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When foreigners say "English accent" they usually mean "received pronunciation" (i.e. BBC newsreader voice) but there's probably more accent variation on that one island than across the rest of the Anglosphere put together.quote:We were in a church. I was a seven-foot-tall creature with horns and a spiked tail holding a pitchfork. And I was in a church. This is a classic funny moment but now that I think of it, I wonder if spiky monster with a pitchfork had yet been popularised as the idea of what the devil looks like?
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# ? Oct 3, 2021 06:34 |
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Epicurius posted:Chapter 17 This is the bit I was remembering. This hopping around through time and wars has a bit of a Time Bandits feel, huh?
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# ? Oct 3, 2021 06:49 |
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It reminds me of the first half of Lost season 5 which more specifically dates me as a nerd. Out of curiosity, is the Crossing of the Delaware a curriculum flashpoint for American kids? Obviously I'd heard of George Washington by primary school in Australia, but I would've had only the vaguest notions of the American Revolution when I read this book.
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# ? Oct 3, 2021 09:55 |
There's that really famous painting. I think even not specifically knowing the importance of it, it comes across as A Big Deal.
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# ? Oct 3, 2021 10:06 |
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freebooter posted:It reminds me of the first half of Lost season 5 which more specifically dates me as a nerd. Comrade Blyatlov posted:There's that really famous painting. I think even not specifically knowing the importance of it, it comes across as A Big Deal. Yup, that painting is in every history textbook for American kids. The usual version of the American Revolution taught in school, as a kid who went to school in the 90s when these books were made, is Tea Party -> Lexington and Concord -> Valley Forge -> Crossing the Delaware -> Victory. If I'd read this as a kid, this would have read as a very obvious shorthand for the turning point of the Revolution.
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# ? Oct 3, 2021 13:17 |
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Now that I think of it (spoilering but not really a spoiler) one of the kids specifically references the painting and jokes about how unrealistic it is. I dunno if the Crossing itself would be a turning point but if V4 wants to assassinate Washington (which would probably be a turning point regardless of when or where it happened...? Or would some other general just fill his shoes...?) this is as good a moment as any to pinpoint the exact time and place where he'd be. edit - OK having read the Wikipedia article introduction, and thus now having a better understanding of it than any American elementary school pupil, apparently (and it feels weird to spoiler a historical event but appropriate when the actual characters are unsure of its relevance) it led to their surprise success in a critical battle and so it possibly really was one of those pivotal moments in history. Hence the painting, I guess. freebooter fucked around with this message at 13:38 on Oct 3, 2021 |
# ? Oct 3, 2021 13:32 |
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Also, it's not like Visser 4 needs to actually assassinate him (but knowing when and where he will be probably helps). He just needs to raise the alarm and get the hessians to do it for him/at least not lose.
Ravenfood fucked around with this message at 13:50 on Oct 3, 2021 |
# ? Oct 3, 2021 13:39 |
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Ahh, history... Will your homeland be remembered for its magnificent soldiers? Or for a scratchy ugly fabric? e: hold on, wikipedia tells me that our American cousins call hessian "burlap." Also Hessians Auxiliaries (not mercenaries!) made up a quarter of the British army at one point-? Wow, learning is fun! Tree Bucket fucked around with this message at 14:24 on Oct 3, 2021 |
# ? Oct 3, 2021 14:05 |
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freebooter posted:I dunno if the Crossing itself would be a turning point but if V4 wants to assassinate Washington (which would probably be a turning point regardless of when or where it happened...? Or would some other general just fill his shoes...?) this is as good a moment as any to pinpoint the exact time and place where he'd be. Well, America didn't have many other great generals in the war. Washington's skill wasn't really winning, which he rarely did, so much as being able to consistently and efficiently retreat. Which, when you're fighting a largely guerrilla war against the toughest army in the world and your main goal is to wear them down and cause enough war weariness for the major power to withdraw, is usually the best you can hope for in any given engagement. That said, Washington dying before becoming the first president a couple decades later would have changed US history to an almost unimaginable degree. As president of the Constitutional Convention, and advocate for a much stronger federal government than the Confederation it was replacing, he was a major reason the Constitution turned out the way it did; in refusing to rule as a king or military dictator after the war, and then emulating Cincinnatus by stepping down and allowing a successor to take over after two terms as US president, he set a lot of norms that those who followed were loath to break, ensuring stability and continuity of government in the delicate first decades of independence.
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# ? Oct 3, 2021 17:10 |
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Chapter 18 Rachel quote:Protect George Washington. Whenever you think there's nothing to worry about, there's something to worry about. Especially when you're listening to the only trained soldier among you. Chapter 19 Marco quote:We got into a boat. Turned out not to be all that hard. No one was all that anxious to climb on board for the trip across an icy, raging river in the middle of a sleet storm. Can’t imagine why. There goes Jake. Also, it's a good look at the reality of the crossing of the Delaware vs the painting.
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# ? Oct 4, 2021 03:29 |
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# ? May 27, 2024 02:59 |
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Epicurius posted:There goes Jake. Also, it's a good look at the reality of the crossing of the Delaware vs the painting. I sort of got the impression that history was already a little effed up at this point by their collective meddling and that it wasn't actually *quite* this bad? But yeah I'm sure the historical perspective is a lot more idealized than the reality.
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# ? Oct 4, 2021 04:31 |