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Seemlar posted:I can let stuff like the revised version of The Gathering having Kosh say "Hello, Ranger One Valen" to Sinclair the first time he meets him slide because nobody will know what those words mean for years, but In The Beginning shows way too many cards to be watched first You say "cards" I say "hooks". Babylon 5 has prophecy as a major component and "this was all planned out" as a meta-component. Seeing how Mollari and G'Kar end doesn't cheapen the journey. Seeing how Mollari's faustian bargain is faustian doesn't cheapen the journey. The (illusion of a) clockwork nature is what makes B5 good. If it was just the Babylon 5th Sense we wouldn't still be talking about it.
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Oct 9, 2021 07:22
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OnlyBans posted:Spoilers can ruin things that rely on a twist. B5 isn't that though. B5 gets better the more you know. Giving people more to know helps draw them in. Literally the first time we see Mollari he says "yeah, G'Kar is going to strangle me to death. That's how I die."
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Oct 9, 2021 10:06
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OnlyBans posted:Spoilers can ruin things that rely on a twist. B5 isn't that though. B5 gets better the more you know. Giving people more to know helps draw them in. Are you …. Watching the same show as us? E: I saw your next post, and you are completely correct that the show calls the hits, but the spoilers are how they get there. In the Beginning reveals A LOT of how they get there.
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Oct 9, 2021 13:14
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I think having portents and prophecies are what make B5 unique. When I was watching it and saw Molari's dream I was surprised to learn that almost all of it was going to come true. Same thing with Sheridan's visions.
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Oct 9, 2021 15:35
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I mean fantasy has been doing that for a while. It happens a lot in wheel of time and man it sucks
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Oct 9, 2021 15:38
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I was really surprised about Londo and G'Kar. I thought for sure that Sheridan had changed the future, but nope! In the beginning was good because it had that ending where it was the night right before Londo died at G'Kars hands. The funniest thing about In the Beginning was Ivanova showing up in that really bad haircut and explaining why she wears one earing. Did G'Kar and Sheridan ever acknowledge that they knew each other before Bablyon 5 that was a serious retcon .
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Oct 9, 2021 15:42
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Hollismason posted:I think having portents and prophecies are what make B5 unique. When I was watching it and saw Molari's dream I was surprised to learn that almost all of it was going to come true. Same thing with Sheridan's visions. Agreed. And there’s a difference between the show offering a prophecy and someone who watched the show offering a spoiler. JMS sometimes (not always) makes in-show prophecies misleading. More to the point, those “spoilers” are planned and deliberate and for effect: we see Londo’s death vision and draw conclusions about G’Kar, for example. Whereas real spoilers offered by those who watched the show by definition do not work with the pacing of reveals the show itself provides. Some people are OK with spoilers or actively seek them out, but it’s not an act of kindness to deliberately spoil someone against their will, and especially not with a show like this.
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Oct 9, 2021 15:47
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Hollismason posted:that really bad haircut I mean, how would you tell the difference between a good haircut and a bad one in this show.
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Oct 9, 2021 15:50
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Alhazred posted:I mean, how would you tell the difference between a good haircut and a bad one in this show. Theres s2-5 Garibaldi vs season 1 Totally not Balding.
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Oct 9, 2021 15:54
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Doctor Zero posted:Are you …. Watching the same show as us? That account belongs to user "shbobdb", who also posted here and in the blind watch thread as "incelshock na" until that one got banned. Draw your own conclusions from there.
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Oct 9, 2021 16:26
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Narsham posted:Agreed. And there’s a difference between the show offering a prophecy and someone who watched the show offering a spoiler. JMS sometimes (not always) makes in-show prophecies misleading. More to the point, those “spoilers” are planned and deliberate and for effect: we see Londo’s death vision and draw conclusions about G’Kar, for example. On top of which, Londo is told that he can still avert his prophesied death. So the question posed by the show is not if it will happen, but if Londo will change. In the end he does, but that's why he dies. His last chance to avoid his fate is to allow the Keeper to take him over fully; it would have stopped G'Kar killing him. But if he did it would also learn that he helped Sheridan and Delenn to escape, and the retribution would have been his worst fear - the destruction of Centauri Prime.
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Oct 9, 2021 17:11
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Doctor Zero posted:Are you …. Watching the same show as us? So what? Again, do you think B5 is worth rewatching? Like, there are twists and such and watching it the first time is a ride but you have to watch it in order to enjoy that ride. Gotta hook people somehow.
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Oct 9, 2021 18:23
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OnlyBans posted:So what? Again, do you think B5 is worth rewatching? Like, there are twists and such and watching it the first time is a ride but you have to watch it in order to enjoy that ride. Gotta hook people somehow. Yep. It’s called season 1 episode 1. (And a promise it gets better )
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Oct 9, 2021 18:37
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Nah, that's a terrible way to get people to watch B5 unless they have massive amounts of free time.
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Oct 9, 2021 18:43
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The pilot episode is just good enough to hook people. Its got some sore points but overall its really good.
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Oct 9, 2021 19:52
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I got the remaster yesterday just in time for me convincing my wife that we should watch B5. We had already started, got up to and including Believers before we fell off the wagon. But now we've seen By Any Means Necessary and Signs and Portents and she's invested.  I have to say, the future is loving stupid. Why is the remaster of a quarter century old TV show region locked and almost impossible to get a hold of in Scandinavia? I just want to give you my money for gently caress's sake. The number of hoops I had to jump through to get ahold of the remaster is ridiculous. Sidenote, I don't care as who or what, but I would like to see Jason Isaacs in the reboot.
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Oct 9, 2021 20:51
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Groetgaffel posted:I got the remaster yesterday just in time for me convincing my wife that we should watch B5. We had already started, got up to and including Believers before we fell off the wagon. But now we've seen By Any Means Necessary and Signs and Portents and she's invested.  
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Oct 9, 2021 21:03
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Groetgaffel posted:I have to say, the future is loving stupid. Why is the remaster of a quarter century old TV show region locked and almost impossible to get a hold of in Scandinavia? I just want to give you my money for gently caress's sake. The number of hoops I had to jump through to get ahold of the remaster is ridiculous. I can't speak to this particular case, but when I was working in the TV industry, we often had to do lock out parts of Europe because the local channels/distributions in various countries in Europe insisted on a lot of protectionist clauses.
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Oct 9, 2021 23:31
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Groetgaffel posted:I have to say, the future is loving stupid. Why is the remaster of a quarter century old TV show region locked and almost impossible to get a hold of in Scandinavia? I just want to give you my money for gently caress's sake. The number of hoops I had to jump through to get ahold of the remaster is ridiculous. For what it's worth, HBO Nordic will be replaced by HBO Max on October 26, and it will very likely include B5 (though depending on the subtitles situation not necessarily at launch). So I would think that particular problem is about to be fixed.
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Oct 10, 2021 00:43
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Wasn't B5 shot in widescreen. I think I recall reading somewhere that it was shot in widescreen.
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Oct 10, 2021 00:54
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Hollismason posted:Wasn't B5 shot in widescreen. I think I recall reading somewhere that it was shot in widescreen. It was shot widescreen-safe, but framed for 4:3.
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Oct 10, 2021 00:57
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Hollismason posted:Wasn't B5 shot in widescreen. I think I recall reading somewhere that it was shot in widescreen. It was shot intending to be shown at 4:3 because that's all TV was at the time, but JMS wanted to future-proof it so everything was framed and filmed in such a way it could be shown widescreen. However, the computer VFX were only done for 4:3, so they looked lovely on the widescreen version. The HD returns it to all being 4:3 for the sake of the effects.
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Oct 10, 2021 01:09
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Zat posted:For what it's worth, HBO Nordic will be replaced by HBO Max on October 26, and it will very likely include B5 (though depending on the subtitles situation not necessarily at launch). So I would think that particular problem is about to be fixed. Which I now do, annoying as it was to make an iTunes account registered to a US address and then buy the show with gift cards.
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Oct 10, 2021 01:59
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https://twitter.com/thegeeksreviews/status/1446981922069094402
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Oct 10, 2021 02:43
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Thanks for the heads up. It’s rewatch time.
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Oct 10, 2021 11:38
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Hollismason posted:
Don't they get their memories wiped? I assume it took enough that Sheridan doesn't remember meeting G'Kar or that it was all really fuzzy.
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Oct 10, 2021 21:20
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V-Men posted:Don't they get their memories wiped? I assume it took enough that Sheridan doesn't remember meeting G'Kar or that it was all really fuzzy. They do not get mindwiped. Sheridan should indeed know G'kar, and no, they never mention it. The only thing they do cover is making sure that Delenn is fully hooded in the scene where she spares Sheridan and Franklin so that he doesn't recognize her when he first meets her in early season two.
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Oct 10, 2021 21:36
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jng2058 posted:They do not get mindwiped. Sheridan should indeed know G'kar, and no, they never mention it. The only thing they do cover is making sure that Delenn is fully hooded in the scene where she spares Sheridan and Franklin so that he doesn't recognize her when he first meets her in early season two. I'm not sure what they would have said to each other. "Nice to see you again, glad your species didn't get wiped out"? It isn't like they were best friends.
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Oct 10, 2021 23:49
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I mean they were on a mission together. I figure they at least talked. I dunno it was kind of inconsistent and a little retconny.
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Oct 11, 2021 03:46
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If humans have racial face blindness within their own species, it makes sense to think that races would also have similar difficulty telling individual members apart. If memory serves, it was also before Sheridan became famous. So, some human named "John" (an extremely common name) and some Narn named G'Kar (no idea how common it is but since they choose their names based off their patron saint and G'Quon is *huge* it's also probably "John" level common) did a mission together. By the time they get to B5, they both know that "John" and "G'Kar" are common names and that not all humans/narns know each other. Sure, they look like the John/G'Kar they met during the war but they want to avoid committing a space racism.
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Oct 11, 2021 03:51
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Yeah I guess. I dunno it still doesn't really make any sense that they never acknowledge their past relationship. Otherwise In the Beginning is incredibly good.
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Oct 11, 2021 15:23
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Narsham posted:I'm not sure what they would have said to each other. "Nice to see you again, glad your species didn't get wiped out"? You would expect John to treat G'kar exactly like he treated Ta'lon when they met again after the Streib rescue. "Hey man, good to see you again. I'm glad you're doing well, thanks for trying to save my species, I'm sorry your ship full of Narns got blown up trying to help us. Let's get a drink."
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Oct 11, 2021 16:43
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Alhazred posted:Literally the first time we see Mollari he says "yeah, G'Kar is going to strangle me to death. That's how I die."
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Oct 11, 2021 17:18
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The Name of the Pod is back with our ill-informed, lukewarm takes on the prospect of the reboot! https://www.ilinxilinx.com/nameofthepod/2021/10/11/rebooted?fbclid=IwAR1bYVf4sBTYHFv30Ke8K5PkABS18fx7-ZUS-mPNYo5Hm_jAT_GTUXNYJzQ
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Oct 11, 2021 18:00
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jng2058 posted:You would expect John to treat G'kar exactly like he treated Ta'lon when they met again after the Streib rescue. "Hey man, good to see you again. I'm glad you're doing well, thanks for trying to save my species, I'm sorry your ship full of Narns got blown up trying to help us. Let's get a drink." Obviously, this is a retcon, so JMS didn't plan for it, and equally obviously he did it because he had access to a subset of the cast for each of the TV movies and anyone he didn't use didn't get paid, so he wanted to use Katsulas where he could. Out of curiosity, I checked the script books for S2: G'Kar is initially off the station when Sheridan arrives, investigating the rumors of Shadows returning. He comes back in "Revelations" and first encounters Sheridan in the council chambers. G'Kar: Captain Sheridan, I take it? Ambassador G'Kar, Narn Regime, third circle. Sheridan: Ambassador. I've been looking forward to meeting you for some time. But I didn't expect the opportunity to come quite so suddenly. The first Franklin-Sheridan scene makes clear they've already met and talked off-screen, so there's little data there. These lines could be read as being cagey as the conversation is taking place in front of Londo (and is presumably being recorded, too), but there's no on-screen private conversation afterward that addresses this history. There is an easier retcon of the retcon, if you like: Londo is narrating the "In the Beginning" stories. It's possible G'Kar told him about being a part of this mission. It's also possible Franklin or Sheridan mentioned it. Or he might have received intelligence reports establishing who attended after the fact. But the last possibility is that he doesn't know the names of the representatives present at this meeting, and is therefore putting these three people into the story at this point when it wasn't them at all. That does seem like something the guilty-feeling Londo could potentially do.
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Oct 11, 2021 20:05
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Narsham posted:There is an easier retcon of the retcon, if you like: Londo is narrating the "In the Beginning" stories. It's possible G'Kar told him about being a part of this mission. It's also possible Franklin or Sheridan mentioned it. Or he might have received intelligence reports establishing who attended after the fact. But the last possibility is that he doesn't know the names of the representatives present at this meeting, and is therefore putting these three people into the story at this point when it wasn't them at all. That does seem like something the guilty-feeling Londo could potentially do. Oh, that's right. I forgot about that. 'Unreliable Narrator' was my head-canon fix.
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Oct 11, 2021 20:33
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Narsham posted:It's possible G'Kar told him about being a part of this mission. It's also possible Franklin or Sheridan mentioned it. Or he might have received intelligence reports establishing who attended after the fact. But the last possibility is that he doesn't know the names of the representatives present at this meeting, and is therefore putting these three people into the story at this point when it wasn't them at all. That does seem like something the guilty-feeling Londo could potentially do. Or that Londo was drunk, which is the most plausible explanation.
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Oct 11, 2021 20:37
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Alhazred posted:Or that Londo was drunk, which is the most plausible explanation. Ironic that what used to be his vice is now his only path to virtue.
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Oct 11, 2021 22:39
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Absurd Alhazred posted:Ironic that what used to be his vice is now his only path to virtue. A little bit of justice, perhaps? Just like Emperor Cotto apparently finding a lot of different ways to get to six. Even if he does get interrupted sometimes. “WHAT?!”
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Oct 12, 2021 15:22
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I was thinking that i'm excited to at least hear the thoughts of the original cast members once the reboot finally comes out, and then I remembered they are basically all dead. :/
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Oct 12, 2021 15:54
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