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Why would the night king ever go into winterfell while the battle still rages, he controls an army of undead which he can continuously raise, like why even get off your dead horse or whatever until they're all dead except for bran.
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Oct 11, 2021 17:30
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emanresu tnuocca posted:Why would the night king ever go into winterfell while the battle still rages, he controls an army of undead which he can continuously raise, like why even get off your dead horse or whatever until they're all dead except for bran. Because otherwise Theon won't get his ridiculous redemption. I still don't get why Theon had to die when Arya was already being yeeted towards the NK
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Oct 11, 2021 17:41
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Any time I try to watch early episodes, I watch Harry Lloyd kill it as Viserys and remind myself of the monotone performances across the board in the later seasons.
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Oct 11, 2021 18:26
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uber_stoat posted:crazy bad sunk cost fallacy here thinking you can resurrect this property after the Boys took a big fat poo poo on it and made it so stinky no one wants to be near it. And this show probably doesn't have to become the water cooler show the last one was to be viable, but yeah. Gonna' be an uphill battle after we all decided the original never happened. Toxic Fart Syndrome posted:Also what a total disaster that was for poor Emilia Clarke and all the poo poo she had gone through. After everything else, it really feels like they ruined the character just to spite the actress.
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Oct 11, 2021 19:54
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I was always surprised by how many average liberal fans I know, even self proclaimed feminists, who tended to gloss over the gratuitous rapes and poor treatment of women in general in the show.
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Oct 11, 2021 20:08
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LividLiquid posted:I'm so happy people aren't Skylar Whiting the poor gal. None of this is her fault and the show failed her spectacularly. Yeah, the cast seems like a great, likeable group of people, and I think most of the people who watched the show appreciated them for putting so much of themselves into the characters. It's pretty obvious that the failures were on a level far removed from any individual actor's performance. emanresu tnuocca posted:Why would the night king ever go into winterfell while the battle still rages, he controls an army of undead which he can continuously raise, like why even get off your dead horse or whatever until they're all dead except for bran. you see, the night king kinda forgot about his unrelenting army of the dea--dogg, none of it made any sense, start to finish. they planned out a handful of cool scenes that they wanted to shoot and jotted the rest down on a bar napkin the night before.
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Oct 11, 2021 20:51
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iamsosmrt posted:I was always surprised by how many average liberal fans I know, even self proclaimed feminists, who tended to gloss over the gratuitous rapes and poor treatment of women in general in the show. I think a lot of us thought that it was going to lead to something poignant on Dany’s arc and gave them the benefit of the doubt. By season 4 that goodwill was pretty much gone when it became apparent that D&D are masochists who hate their audience and employees. Pattonesque posted:And in similarly-named Netflix TV shows, "The Last Kingdom" is what happens when commanders on both sides of a military conflict are generally not morons, and if they do dumb things it's for explicable reasons. This is a good post. 
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Oct 11, 2021 21:15
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iamsosmrt posted:I was always surprised by how many average liberal fans I know, even self proclaimed feminists, who tended to gloss over the gratuitous rapes and poor treatment of women in general in the show. Yeah, I never need to see a pregnant woman stabbed in her womb again.
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Oct 11, 2021 21:54
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One thing about rape and marital rape in the show is that the universe the show depicts doesn't consider marital rape a crime and I think it's a relevant difference when watching the interaction between characters. For instance, Edmure Tully welcomed the bedding whereas Catelyn Stark tells us Ned wouldn't allow it and neither would Tyrion. Dany while abused, those in the universe wouldn't call that rape despite our good guys knowing it to be. I get that it's gross but it's effective in showing the social dynamism. It's important to know that despite Ramsay being heinous the rest of the world still accepts what he's doing as lawful. Just when we see the sex crimes in the show it's important to know that they specifically differentiate these real life crimes. In a better show it could be legitimate commentary but as it was shown... it wasn't. Super Deuce fucked around with this message at 22:23 on Oct 11, 2021 |
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Oct 11, 2021 21:56
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I'm bored and thumbing through my Steam library and playing the Telltale Game of Thrones title that came out around the same time as Season 4. The game has issues, but it's made me wistful for the "good days" when GoT was soaring 
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Oct 11, 2021 22:18
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Super Deuce posted:One thing about rape and marital rape in the show is that the universe the show depicts doesn't consider marital rape a crime and I think it's a relevant difference when watching the interaction between characters. For instance, Edmure Tully welcomed the bedding whereas Catelyn Stark tells us Ned wouldn't allow it and neither would Tyrion. 1) the modern ideas about medieval marriage and romance are almost entirely invented. 2) the show exists in a fictional universe and these acts serve only to shock the audience. 3) even if you accept that rape was much more prevalent in medieval times, this ignores that it was also considered a serious personal affront to the male family members. In the GoT tv show: the male family members essentially ignore when a family member is raped and sometimes take up the producers sentiment of “oh that’s just what happens” which is an absolutely insane position for a supposedly honor-obsessed society. Like, the idea that Dany’s brother wouldn’t care about her mistreatment by others for the simple provocation of it being an affront to his person is just bizarre.
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Oct 12, 2021 00:19
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I mean, Ridley Scott has a new movie opening up on the 15th about a duel being fought over a man being accused of raping his best friend's wife the movie looks to be better than all of GoT. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OgUp8IPS7YA
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Oct 12, 2021 00:34
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PeterCat posted:I mean, Ridley Scott has a new movie opening up on the 15th about a duel being fought over a man being accused of raping his best friend's wife the movie looks to be better than all of GoT. It's based on a real story, too.
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Oct 12, 2021 02:52
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Toxic Fart Syndrome posted:Like, the idea that Dany’s brother wouldn’t care about her mistreatment by others for the simple provocation of it being an affront to his person is just bizarre. Yeah, there are plenty of psychotic cartoon character bad guys on GoT. Who just want power and love killin' and have no particular moral philosophy outside of that. Viserys or Joffrey barely had inner lives, but Ramsay or Karl Tanner or Euron Greyjoy are pretty much smirking demon figures as the show goes on. "Rape 'em till they're dead," and what-not. Kind of just evil for the sake of evil. That said, GoT characters being totally dismissive of marital rape tracks. Marital rape wasn't actually criminalized in most nations IRL until the late 20th century. I'm sure there are plenty of people to this day who believe a husband cannot rape his wife, so it's not a stretch to assume that outlook of a medieval society.
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Oct 12, 2021 02:55
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Toxic Fart Syndrome posted:1) the modern ideas about medieval marriage and romance are almost entirely invented. Evil characters should have evil traits, though. It’s fiction, exactly. This is what we think of their actions from our perspective and we see the difference from the characters’ perspectives which I think is important. I think showing what they showed to varying degrees is important to convey the... depravity of some characters, and how they get away with it. I understand not wanting it in the show for triggering and other trauma but as a narrative trait for characters to have one way or the other... it seems sort of important when marriage is how power is brokered.
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Oct 12, 2021 04:19
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Toxic Fart Syndrome posted:This is a good post. He would have sent Finan or Sihtric out scouting a week beforehand, they would have had a detailed overview of the army of the dead's numbers and composition, there would have been overlapping trenches funneling everyone toward the gate, the Dothraki (imagine giving Uhtred horse archers!) would have been playing headhunter with dragonglass arrow, the catapults would have been firing nonstop from inside the walls from minute one, Uhtred probably would have killed a red priest, etc.
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Oct 12, 2021 19:41
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Pattonesque posted:He would have sent Finan or Sihtric out scouting a week beforehand, they would have had a detailed overview of the army of the dead's numbers and composition, there would have been overlapping trenches funneling everyone toward the gate, the Dothraki (imagine giving Uhtred horse archers!) would have been playing headhunter with dragonglass arrow, the catapults would have been firing nonstop from inside the walls from minute one, Uhtred probably would have killed a red priest, etc. I mean, this was supposed to be Tyrion on some level but [insert footage of Dinklage saying he thought Tyrion was smart but I guess not that smart].
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Oct 12, 2021 22:46
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An insane mind posted:An arc where a very sympathetic protagonist becomes an unhinged antagonist could have been amazing. But it ended up being an idiotic rush job. I feel like this would be incredibly probalamatic if they only did with the girl who was abused and sold by her brother. Because the show also ignored how all the starks are slowly turning into monsters too.
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Oct 12, 2021 23:16
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Strom Cuzewon posted:I feel like this would be incredibly probalamatic if they only did with the girl who was abused and sold by her brother. Because the show also ignored how all the starks are slowly turning into monsters too. I mean Arya kills two men, bakes them into a pie, tricks their dad into eating it, then achieves orgasm when slitting his throat, shortly before committing mass-murder of his entire family. But Dany wasn't sad once when her abusive brother was killed after threatening to murder both her and her unborn child which CLEARLY is more of a RED FLAG.
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Oct 13, 2021 00:13
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Sky Shadowing posted:I mean Arya kills two men, bakes them into a pie, tricks their dad into eating it, then achieves orgasm when slitting his throat, shortly before committing mass-murder of his entire family. Honestly, it’s insane the poo poo that they said and HBO just aired for those After Credits BTS clips. The insight into their complete apathy and borderline hatred of the show, it’s audience, and their cast and crew is just wild. Presenting the entire vignette like any of it let them be seen in a positive light is just  .
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Oct 13, 2021 00:20
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“Dany just kind of forgot about the Iron Fleet.”
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Oct 13, 2021 00:21
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Toxic Fart Syndrome posted:“Dany just kind of forgot about the Iron Fleet.” I wrote (am still writing) a fanfic where every time I have to call out something that was really dumb in the later seasons, I say they "kind of forgot." Yara didn't declare independence? She got back to the Iron Islands and then did, sending a letter saying she "kind of forgot." Dany never got to meet Ghost at Winterfell? Jon "kind of forgot" to introduce him to her. The entire plan to hide in the crypts? They "kind of forgot" the Night King could raise the dead. My favorite one though was Davos saying seven years ago he "kind of forgot" that bells don't mean surrender.
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Oct 13, 2021 00:29
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Phenotype posted:Yeah, the cast seems like a great, likeable group of people, and I think most of the people who watched the show appreciated them for putting so much of themselves into the characters. It's pretty obvious that the failures were on a level far removed from any individual actor's performance.
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Oct 13, 2021 00:42
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Sky Shadowing posted:Dany never got to meet Ghost at Winterfell? Jon "kind of forgot" to introduce him to her. What would've been interesting about that? Other than, "oh, I have a cool monster pet, too." I said this way upthread, but I'd say the most upsetting thing they "kind of forgot" is that Dany and Cersei never actually share a scene alone. Never have an interaction where they discuss ruling as women and the compromises they had to make to do so, or to discuss Cersei's hatred of Dany because of prophecy, or Dany's hatred of Cersei as the wife and daughter of the men who destroyed her family. There's so much interesting poo poo going on between the two of them, and it's all left unstated.
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Oct 13, 2021 01:02
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Toxic Fart Syndrome posted:“Dany just kind of forgot about the Iron Fleet.” you know the thing that gets me about this is that if they really wanted Euron to kill off a dragon they could have had Dany see the Iron Fleet, dive to attack it, and have her other dragon get lit up at close range by like a hundred ballistas covered with tarps. The intended story beat is accomplished, Dany doesn't look like a complete loving moron, it establishes Euron as a savvy enemy who is willing to sacrifice however many ships Dany burns in order to land a killshot on a valuable asset. An awful lot of their basic story beats were more or less fine, just executed in the stupidest way possible.
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Oct 13, 2021 01:21
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Sky Shadowing posted:I wrote (am still writing) a fanfic where every time I have to call out something that was really dumb in the later seasons, I say they "kind of forgot." Why
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Oct 13, 2021 02:19
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Sure, but that doesn’t have the total shock value of your dragon getting shot in the head while flying at 5,000 feet by a guy on a rocky boat. Now that I think about it, did those ballista ever hit anything again after they killed the dragon? I recall King’s Landing being ringed by them and doing jack poo poo.
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Oct 13, 2021 02:19
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ALFbrot posted:Why Because it's fun. Honestly, that's it. It's just fun for me.
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Oct 13, 2021 02:39
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moosecow333 posted:Now that I think about it, did those ballista ever hit anything again after they killed the dragon? I recall King’s Landing being ringed by them and doing jack poo poo. After the first dragon got murked by a handful of ballista bolts with unerring accuracy, I remember turning to my dad and saying, "All those ballistas defending King's Landing? You watch - they won't land a single shot on Dany." Show was nothing if not predictable by that point.
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Oct 13, 2021 02:40
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moosecow333 posted:Now that I think about it, did those ballista ever hit anything again after they killed the dragon? I recall King’s Landing being ringed by them and doing jack poo poo. They blasted Dany's boats and it was shown that they hit with the force of explosive cannon shot. Xealot posted:What would've been interesting about that? Other than, "oh, I have a cool monster pet, too." Frankly, all of the "character interactions" were the fuel behind the badness of the last two seasons. I got tired of wondering what the next permutation of characters spouting their motivations would be.
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Oct 13, 2021 15:48
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I mean, "what would be interesting about that" is kind of like asking "what's interesting about Arya being Tywin's wine servant" but that was honestly some of the best scenes in the entire series AND original material to the show. I just wish they had put that kind of effort into everything after the Red Wedding. From early interviews, it seems like they never thought they'd even make it to the Red Wedding; and making it to that story beat was their big hope for the show (which is really a glimpse into their whole filmmaking id). I think they figured they would get cancelled either before or immediately after. When the show became increasingly successful, they were the dog that caught the car and just didn't know what to do, and seemingly resented the success because it kept them from moving onto their real passion project: white supremacist fanfic.
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Oct 13, 2021 16:31
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Toxic Fart Syndrome posted:I mean, "what would be interesting about that" is kind of like asking "what's interesting about Arya being Tywin's wine servant" but that was honestly some of the best scenes in the entire series AND original material to the show. The Arya/Tywin scenes were entertaining and well-acted by both of them, but weird in retrospect. Even at the time when I liked the show, I still wondered what Tywin was thinking when after acknowledging that Arya was likely a runaway highborn Northerner, he just passed her off to the eight foot tall psycho murderer rapist without a second thought. But it's also different from the vapid character interactions of later seasons in that Arya was supposed to be in Harrenhal, and then after a time escape from Harrenhal, so she needed something to do so they may as well have written some engaging scenes. In the character interactions of late GoT, characters were teleported and smooshed together for fan service as each them tried to out-monologue each other. The scripts of the last few seasons read like they were written by every hack Gen X screenwriter who thought dialogue was two characters trying to "out-profound" one another while talking about cocks and balls, or by every hack Millenial screenwriter who writes all humor as either "Deadpool snarkiness" or awkward "Well, that was a thing that happened!" scenes. The character interactions just wouldn't have fixed anything at all with the writing staff they had. By the end, they were already rushing the story, trying to solve a zombie apocalypse before they took on Wine Mom for control of the Big Metal Chair. Characters were already forgetting their basic histories and motivations, so I don't think it would do any good to just tell more drama. God, I just remembered a part of the show where Dany, a sexually experienced young woman who had been married twice had a scene where she and Missandei were talking about Jon like they were teenagers in an old CW drama. Coquito Ergo Sum fucked around with this message at 17:22 on Oct 13, 2021 |
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Oct 13, 2021 17:18
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“You know what they say about boys from the north”
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Oct 13, 2021 18:11
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Toxic Fart Syndrome posted:I mean, "what would be interesting about that" is kind of like asking "what's interesting about Arya being Tywin's wine servant" but that was honestly some of the best scenes in the entire series AND original material to the show. I wasn't being a dick, I was genuinely curious what they found interesting about that idea. For lore reasons I missed, or something. Coquito Ergo Sum posted:The character interactions just wouldn't have fixed anything at all with the writing staff they had. By the end, they were already rushing the story, trying to solve a zombie apocalypse before they took on Wine Mom for control of the Big Metal Chair. Characters were already forgetting their basic histories and motivations, so I don't think it would do any good to just tell more drama. Fair. I just have rose-colored glasses from the early seasons, where even original moments like the Cersei and Robert conversation ("I don't even remember what she looked like") were excellent. Extremely good bits of acting. But you're right, the later seasons completely threw out all that nuance, so whatever that conversation looked like would still probably have been garbage. Though, I think the last "good" conversation scene was Olenna's last scene in S7, so there were occasional gems later on.
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Oct 13, 2021 19:26
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Xealot posted:Though, I think the last "good" conversation scene was Olenna's last scene in S7, so there were occasional gems later on. 99% of the good memorable lines are from S1-4.
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Oct 13, 2021 20:27
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Xealot posted:I wasn't being a dick, I was genuinely curious what they found interesting about that idea. For lore reasons I missed, or something. Sorry, wasn’t trying to imply you were being dickish or come off as hostile. It’s just wild how far the quality in this show slipped and how obvious, to me, that D&D’s apathy is behind a lot of the decline.
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Oct 13, 2021 21:57
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When Bran repeated "chaos is a ladder" to Littlefinger was the look on his face shock that Bran knew something he said once or that he said something that stupid?
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Oct 13, 2021 22:08
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It's so easy to slip into yelling about this show to the point where anyone around you gets scared.
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Oct 13, 2021 22:51
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Coquito Ergo Sum posted:It's so easy to slip into yelling about this show to the point where anyone around you gets scared. A friend at work offhandedly mentioned "whatever happened to the guys who made game of thrones" todsy and I monologued at him for a full ten minutes. Most of what I said I was interesting I think. Because they're entertaingly dumbasses.
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Oct 13, 2021 23:33
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Strom Cuzewon posted:A friend at work offhandedly mentioned "whatever happened to the guys who made game of thrones" todsy and I monologued at him for a full ten minutes. it really is amazing how badly they hosed up, like they're not screwed financially or anything but you'd expect the people who created probably the most popular series ever would be more in demand.
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Oct 14, 2021 00:10
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