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Toxic Fart Syndrome posted:Because they didn't have to write any of it themselves? Maybe, I don’t know. And how do we know they ever had a talented room of writers?
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Oct 15, 2021 18:30
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than come up with something interesting.
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bobjr posted:It is pretty funny how each year Martin says he’s had his best year writing Winds of Winter, when it’s been a decade and people reasonably thought it would have come out around season 3-4 of the show. When will the book be done? When the sun rises in the west. When the mountains crumble to dust. When the Jets win a Super Bowl... Shimrra Jamaane posted:Maybe, I don’t know. And how do we know they ever had a talented room of writers?  Someone wrote all that dialogue in the early seasons.
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Oct 15, 2021 18:33
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Toxic Fart Syndrome posted:They had a super talented writers room at one point Yeah dude, they had Dave Hill. THE Dave Hill!
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Oct 15, 2021 18:42
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Toxic Fart Syndrome posted:When will the book be done? When the sun rises in the west. When the mountains crumble to dust. When the Jets win a Super Bowl... Monkeys on typewriters.
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Oct 15, 2021 19:29
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DnD could also have maybe turned the show over to someone else and let them run it?
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Oct 15, 2021 19:30
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Shimrra Jamaane posted:Maybe, I don’t know. And how do we know they ever had a talented room of writers? Toxic Fart Syndrome posted:Someone wrote all that dialogue in the early seasons. And if you go back to season 1, you start noticing cracks. For every few scenes of good dialogue and characterization, there's usually one cringe scene that wasn't in the books where a character talks about butts and balls and cocks and whores. As time goes on, the ratio shifts more in favor of "cockwhore" dialogue to the point where those original well-written scenes are nearly gone while the Hound introduces Tormund to the idea of the word "dick."
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Oct 15, 2021 19:40
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They wrote that beetle speech to make fun of a review or something,
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Oct 15, 2021 19:57
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Shimrra Jamaane posted:I hate to defend D&D because they suck and are jackasses. But it wasn’t some lazy decision. Why would they want to deal with the bullshit of having to write two more seasons of plot and character development from scratch for a gigantic sprawling series that they never expected to have to do anything but adapt to the screen? Sydney Bottocks posted:DnD could also have maybe turned the show over to someone else and let them run it? Yup. If they didn't think they could do a good job of it, they should've delegated to people with a more specific vision. That's the issue: not only are they bad at it, their egos wouldn't let anyone else get in the way. I can definitely see Disney, a very risk-averse company, backtracking on D&D because of how critically reviled late GoT became. Disney dropped over $1B making and marketing the Star Wars sequels, to fairly middling reviews and a room temperature reception from audiences. They need a massive hit to justify the money they're throwing into Star Wars, so why would they trust two guys with a reputation for making GBS threads the bed on a different lore-heavy fantasy project? They can be as picky as they want, and get pretty much anyone.
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Oct 15, 2021 20:06
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I really do hope every single show D&D pitch for basically goes like this: D&D: "Oh we'd love to work on Star Wars/ Marvel/ Your new series" Execs: "What so you can leave before it's done/ half rear end it and completely kill another franchise? gently caress off" But of course that's not how the world works and they'll continue to fall upwards. Just Chamber fucked around with this message at 21:28 on Oct 15, 2021 |
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Oct 15, 2021 20:29
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Xealot posted:Yup. If they didn't think they could do a good job of it, they should've delegated to people with a more specific vision. That's the issue: not only are they bad at it, their egos wouldn't let anyone else get in the way. Disney correctly views Star Wars as a unique, once-in-a-lifetime golden goose decades in the making. Therefore they are very sensitive about who gets to touch the IP. There was a tremendous fan backlash to episodes 8 and 9 for various reasons (the people who hate 8 can be fairly distinct from those who hate 9), but frankly D&D and Trevorrow (whose other big project is Jurassic World, woof) could have given us an even worse timeline quite easily.
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Oct 15, 2021 20:41
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Case in point between GRRM and his loose plot threads vs D&D and their lovely writing is Euron. Euron catches a ton of well deserved poo poo in the show because he’s a comically lame loser who contributed nothing to the story. In the books he’s much more interesting. But a huge part of that is because in the books he’s currently a giant JJ Abrams mystery box and over the last decade fan theories for him have gotten completely out of control. And worse, his arrival into the story and now large sideplot is a incredibly weird detour away from the actual main story and has added an incredible amount of feature creep into everything for no logical reason aside from GRRM just writes random poo poo and drat the consequences. So D&D had no idea what to do with Euron aside from “he’s important trust me” so he became the worlds most stupid pirate.
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Oct 15, 2021 20:51
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bobjr posted:They wrote that beetle speech to make fun of a review or something, Specifically Orson Scott Card. Which, I don't mind someone making GBS threads on him, but GoT was a weird instance of TV/movie execs actually being huge fans of a show, especially a fantasy one, so I have a feeling that poo poo is going to haunt D&D for the rest of their lives. I remember when even the concern trolls of op-ed sections and entertainment blogs could no longer work up the effort to keep writing their "sexists only hate season 8 so far because they hate powerful women!" articles. Even those people immediately switched to the hate train because they'd also become heavily invested in the show. It was so interesting to see across-the-board hatred from even the most cynical, nihilistic people. Coquito Ergo Sum fucked around with this message at 21:25 on Oct 15, 2021 |
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Oct 15, 2021 21:12
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Sky Shadowing posted:I tried to watch Game of Thrones over again once but I had to tap out at the end of the first episode when I realized that this poor scared little girl who we watch get abused by the only family she has, forced into a marriage she doesn't want, and gets violently raped... is the bad guy, according to D&D. lol i thought you meant sansa
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Oct 16, 2021 00:46
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Shimrra Jamaane posted:So D&D had no idea what to do with Euron aside from “he’s important trust me” so he became the worlds most stupid pirate. Whoa, whoa, whoa he’s the guy that kills Jammie Lannister! Lol wait, never mind that was some random rocks.
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Oct 16, 2021 03:14
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That DICK! posted:lol i thought you meant sansa Hey, atypically of the people still in Team Daenerys, I don't view Sansa as being Evil.
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Oct 16, 2021 03:22
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bobjr posted:It is pretty funny how each year Martin says he’s had his best year writing Winds of Winter, when it’s been a decade and people reasonably thought it would have come out around season 3-4 of the show. quote:”As a child I looked up to my grandfather. I loved visiting him at his house in the country, spending a weekend during summer helping him with the yard and the chickens, and in return he would cook up a grand feast and tell me stories of his adventurous youth. As I nibbled on a piping hot lemoncake he would tell me about his days in the military. He flew fighter jets, even as technology was moving towards drones. The last generation of sky cowboys. He was proud of his exploits, even though he tried to hide it, like the tattoo on his upper bicep. Every time the ace the words 'wild cards' was visible he would pull down his sleeve. I always assumed it was the name of his squadron. Instead of Maverick he was Ace, his wingman was Joker, King, and so on. I wondered if they skipped Queen but I never asked.
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Nov 23, 2021 05:32
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just read the dark tower or something. yea the last third is weak but it's an ending nonetheless
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Nov 23, 2021 17:20
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In any event, seven years is less time than fans of George RR Martin have been holding on for the sixth Game of Thrones novel; Gabaldon has, incidentally, included a chapter in her latest doorstopper called The Winds of Winter – a “nod or a dig, depending on how you want to interpret it” at Martin’s writing speed. “Poor George, I feel very sorry for him,” she says. “What happened is that his show caught up with him, and he then met with the showrunners and he told them what he was planning to do in that book, so that they could then write accordingly. Only they didn’t write accordingly, they took his stuff, and distorted it and wrote their own ending, which wasn’t at all what he had in mind but used all the elements that he told them.”
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Nov 23, 2021 19:33
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TOOT BOOT posted:“Poor George, I feel very sorry for him,” she says. “What happened is that his show caught up with him, and he then met with the showrunners and he told them what he was planning to do in that book, so that they could then write accordingly. Only they didn’t write accordingly, they took his stuff, and distorted it and wrote their own ending, which wasn’t at all what he had in mind but used all the elements that he told them.” Big surprise, that.
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Nov 24, 2021 03:15
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Remember when they spent seasons making Margaery and the faith being the most beloved rulers of the people of King's Landing, then no consequences happened when the king killed himself in grief after his mom murdered them all and said she was ruler now?
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Nov 24, 2021 04:20
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Edgar Allen Ho posted:Remember when they spent seasons making Margaery and the faith being the most beloved rulers of the people of King's Landing, then no consequences happened when the king killed himself in grief after his mom murdered them all and said she was ruler now? No, actually, I did not. Completely forgot about it.
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Nov 24, 2021 07:11
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I kind of wish they'd kept the (possibly fake) Aegon from the books. I think Danerys going crazy would have played better if, during the war against the others, he ends up taking King's Landing and become the new Targaryan monarch. That way, when she comes back she finds that someone's already done what she set out to do only with a stronger claim to the throne than she had and that it only happened because she chose to focus on the other, bigger, threat. Like everything she's gone through, all the people that died for her, that's all suddenly been for nothing because she did the right thing. I think it works better than the bells, anyway.
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Nov 24, 2021 08:34
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Edgar Allen Ho posted:Remember when they spent seasons making Margaery and the faith being the most beloved rulers of the people of King's Landing, then no consequences happened when the king killed himself in grief after his mom murdered them all and said she was ruler now? I remember this because it allowed Lena Headey to show up and collect a check for drinking wine and glowering or looking pensive for the rest of her time on the show and doing very little else, so at least some good came out of it 
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Nov 24, 2021 12:59
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Edgar Allen Ho posted:Remember when they spent seasons making Margaery and the faith being the most beloved rulers of the people of King's Landing, then no consequences happened when the king killed himself in grief after his mom murdered them all and said she was ruler now? I do because it felt like they were going to go back to the earlier seasons where actions had consequences and then uh I guess not. christmas boots posted:I kind of wish they'd kept the (possibly fake) Aegon from the books. I think Danerys going crazy would have played better if, during the war against the others, he ends up taking King's Landing and become the new Targaryan monarch. That way, when she comes back she finds that someone's already done what she set out to do only with a stronger claim to the throne than she had and that it only happened because she chose to focus on the other, bigger, threat. Like everything she's gone through, all the people that died for her, that's all suddenly been for nothing because she did the right thing. They either had to keep him in or totally change how the story ended. And they decided to do neither.
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Nov 24, 2021 15:18
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Calling my shot now. Dany's attack on King's Landing comes before she ever sets foot North ("to go north you must journey south"), and the city goes up in flames and she's blamed for it (perhaps unfairly given the amount of wildfire related foreshadowing associated with Cersei). During the attack Aegon dies and Jon blames Dany for killing his "brother", and in order to avenge Aegon, Jon kills Dany for it. The big twist being Aegon was a great big phony and Jon has now committed an act of unjustified kinslaying. It's a second Blood Betrayal and the event that causes the second Long Night to really kick off in earnest. Dany gets resurrected ("to touch the light you must pass beneath the shadow") when this mistake comes to light and helps fight off the Others, and then either settles down in a new House with the Red Door, or heads back to Essos to rule the people who actually do offer secret toasts to her and sew Targaryen banners in secret (and in my hopes either reestablish Valyria or the Great Empire of the Dawn). Dany being resurrected is directly implied even in the ShowVerse by the song "Pray (High Valyrian)", the last song on the "For the Throne" album released alongside S8, which samples Melisandre's prayer to resurrect Jon but the lyrics are "we can bring her back." Not to mention Sam is confirmed to be saying Drogon was seen flying towards Volantis, where Kinvara and the largest temple of the Red Priests is. And to bring my (f)Dany stuff into it, the first Blood Betrayal was the Bloodstone Emperor murdering his elder sister the Amethyst Empress and seizing her throne. Believing as I do that the Bloodstone Emperor is also known as "Azor Ahai" and the Amethyst Empress is known as "Nissa Nissa", because in a setting that prominently features families that practice dynastic incest is it really so unthinkable that she is both his sister and his wife, Jon and Dany are manipulated directly into re-enacting history.
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Nov 24, 2021 19:10
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We find ourselves in a dark timeline where it’s harder to write something worse than what we got as opposed to the opposite.
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Nov 24, 2021 20:51
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what lead a sizable amount of people to name their children Khaleesi, and not Arwen or Galadriel when LoTR was released? was GoT bigger than LoTR during it's earlier seasons?
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Nov 24, 2021 21:28
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lezard_valeth posted:what lead a sizable amount of people to name their children Khaleesi, and not Arwen or Galadriel when LoTR was released? was GoT bigger than LoTR during it's earlier seasons? GoT had more mainstream appeal because there was swearing and loving. I say this as a person who named their daughter Eowyn. Also I laugh at the Khaleesi parents because you should *never* name a kid after a book series that isn't finished yet. Imagine if the Bible had come out in installments and folks named their kid Judas because he seemed pretty rad 🤣
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Nov 24, 2021 21:52
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Plenty of people named their kids Anakin even after he killed a room full of children
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Nov 24, 2021 22:50
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Stairs posted:GoT had more mainstream appeal because there was swearing and loving. I say this as a person who named their daughter Eowyn. It's not even her loving name!!! That still really annoys me
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Nov 25, 2021 00:40
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lezard_valeth posted:what lead a sizable amount of people to name their children Khaleesi, and not Arwen or Galadriel when LoTR was released? was GoT bigger than LoTR during it's earlier seasons? Millennials weren't having children yet. At least not many of them.
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Nov 25, 2021 00:49
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Stairs posted:GoT had more mainstream appeal because there was swearing and loving. I say this as a person who named their daughter Eowyn. I remember reading a quote from some Beyonce interview where she was talking about how something she did made her feel all empowered "like Khaleesi" I bet she feels pretty darn silly now after the last season of GoT
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Nov 25, 2021 01:20
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Here’s one fact that works in D&Bs defense though. George doesn’t have a loving ending. He had a few bullet points like “uhh bran is king. And Hodor means Hold the Door and we discover this through Bran tree magic I guess. Also Jon kills Dany because that’s poetic right? Oh you want to know where I’m going with with Lady Stoneheart and FAegon? Uhhh idk yet. But you’re gonna spend 4 seasons in AFFC and ADWD right? Trust me I’ll have it figured out by the time you’re done with that material.” Everything has been in flux and what he imagined for an ending in 1997 isn’t what it was in 2011 and isn’t what it is now. Shimrra Jamaane fucked around with this message at 03:08 on Nov 25, 2021 |
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Nov 25, 2021 03:05
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Sky Shadowing posted:Calling my shot now. The year 2178 is going to be loving sick. Just wait, you'll see
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Nov 25, 2021 04:59
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Shimrra Jamaane posted:Here’s one fact that works in D&Bs defense though. George doesn’t have a loving ending. The ending of the show, as described to another person is loving great. But it's a funny joke you tell an unfunny person who butchers it in the retelling.
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Nov 25, 2021 17:39
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The Dani’s corpse being pelted with poo poo ending would have been funnier.
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Nov 26, 2021 00:44
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Shimrra Jamaane posted:The Dani’s corpse being pelted with poo poo ending would have been funnier. I wonder if Emilia Clarke could even pretend to like the last season if that happened
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Nov 26, 2021 23:30
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bobjr posted:I wonder if Emilia Clarke could even pretend to like the last season if that happened She barely was able to pretend she liked the existing final season. Her voice said "best season ever" but her eyebrows said "ABANDON HOPE ALL YE WHO ENTER."
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Nov 27, 2021 03:43
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Sky Shadowing posted:She barely was able to pretend she liked the existing final season. The tone of her voice also gave it away. Seriously it’s amazing how incredibly awkward the entire interview is now knowing what happened. https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Vxh4hnFKaHs Emila’s face immediately changing at 48 second when the woman asks her if she’s happy with how things ended should be put in a museum. Shimrra Jamaane fucked around with this message at 05:13 on Nov 27, 2021 |
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Nov 27, 2021 05:07
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That author's anecdote about GRRM in context crystallizes my read on what happened to the show. DnD probably got the ending info from Martin on the ending following or during S4 production. It's also apparent that despite some of its narrative accelerated changes, S5 was still an attempt by DnD to see if they could more loosely adapt parts of the books going forward while mostly maintaining the similar languid pacing. Then when the tepid reaction to S5 became apparent they did a massive overcorrection and spent S6 wrapping up most of the the preceding season's storylines instead of just trudging forward with them. This left S7 and S8 with just the collision course plot between Jon, Dany, Cersei, and White Walkers, told in an abbreviated way, with hardly anything character wise to properly support that story, or anything narratively that could be a proper supplement to the main plot. There are lots of other things to point to but I can't think of a more succinct way to summarize what happened. CPFortest fucked around with this message at 08:45 on Nov 27, 2021 |
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Nov 27, 2021 08:41
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