[BOOK SPOILERS] Robert Jordan's Waste of Time -- so cheesy but so good

The Something Awful Forums > The Finer Arts > The Book Barn > [BOOK SPOILERS] Robert Jordan's Waste of Time -- so cheesy but so good

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jng2058: Jul 17, 2010; We have the tools, we have the talent!

Hopefully the giant [SPOILERS] on this thread will be enough to get those of us in the know to post HERE like we should, while leaving the TV thread to the newbies. :shrug:

Though maybe the other thread needs a [NO SPOILERS] tag?

# ? Oct 22, 2021 20:53

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# ? May 20, 2024 09:34

ONE YEAR LATER: Apr 13, 2004; Fry old buddy, it's me, Bender!; Oven Wrangler

People have been good about not spoiling anything in the tviv thread so far but if it starts being an issue I'll lock that poo poo up faster than an Aiel outrunning a horse at 40 paces.

# ? Oct 22, 2021 20:53

CainsDescendant: Dec 6, 2007; Human nature

Are we gonna get another actual trailer?

# ? Oct 22, 2021 20:53

Hieronymous Alloy: Jan 30, 2009; Why! Why!! Why must you refuse to accept that Dr. Hieronymous Alloy's Genetically Enhanced Cream Corn Is Superior to the Leading Brand on the Market!?!; Morbid Hound

ONE YEAR LATER posted:

I'm just waiting for people to make some gang tags. DRAGONSWOON what up

I'm happy to do a wheel of time gang tag for the books thread but it'll have to be genuinely funny and not be a spoiler etc so i'm not sure if we can find one that navigates everything successfully

CainsDescendant posted:

Are we gonna get another actual trailer?

There's a new 30 second ish trailer on Amazon Prime as of today but you gotta log in

# ? Oct 22, 2021 20:59

Libluini: May 18, 2012; I gravitated towards the Greens, eventually even joining the party itself.

The Linke is a party I grudgingly accept exists, but I've learned enough about DDR-history I can't bring myself to trust a party that was once the SED, a party leading the corrupt state apparatus ...; Grimey Drawer

The Notorious ZSB posted:

Most of the Gawyn dream fantasies just melt away in the narrative, there is almost no actual descriptive text about whats going on only that she recognizes getting lost in that kind of dream is *bad*

That's because Robert Jordan is a Southern US Puritan who has Ideas about proper conduct and what to show. We're talking about someone who was convinced his fantasy world had no brothels because with the sexes being equal in Randland, there was no prostitution.

With that worldview, the chance of him writing out full-on dream sex scenes was always zero

it's spanking and the occasional naked lady, but that's it, the rest just ~fade to black, post ends~

# ? Oct 22, 2021 20:59

Johnny Joestar: Oct 21, 2010; Don't shoot him?

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as obvious as it is to us hopefully we can avoid spoiling stuff about rand early on

# ? Oct 22, 2021 20:59

Torrannor: Apr 27, 2013; ---FAGNER---
TEAM-MATE

The Babylon 5 new watchers thread has been pretty great about not spoiling things, so I hope we can be as disciplined for WoT.

# ? Oct 22, 2021 21:02

Libluini: May 18, 2012; I gravitated towards the Greens, eventually even joining the party itself.

The Linke is a party I grudgingly accept exists, but I've learned enough about DDR-history I can't bring myself to trust a party that was once the SED, a party leading the corrupt state apparatus ...; Grimey Drawer

Torrannor posted:

The Babylon 5 new watchers thread has been pretty great about not spoiling things, so I hope we can be as disciplined for WoT.

Do you have a link?

I always like to see what people think who see something I liked the first time

# ? Oct 22, 2021 21:03

Calenth: Jul 11, 2001

Johnny Joestar posted:

as obvious as it is to us hopefully we can avoid spoiling stuff about rand early on

My brother got real mad about the cover to The Dragon Reborn when it came out because he felt the cover and title together were a spoiler.

I remember between Eye and Hunt, begging Harriett to tell me whether Thom was alive or not and she told me that that was the only thing she'd been able to get Jim to tell her, and despite that she wouldn't tell me !

# ? Oct 22, 2021 21:05

jng2058: Jul 17, 2010; We have the tools, we have the talent!

Libluini posted:

Do you have a link?

I always like to see what people think who see something I liked the first time

It's been a little quiet recently, but there is at least one full watch chronicled in there if you start from the beginning. https://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=3925635

I also chanced upon a YouTube channel doing a first time watch. She's in late season two on YouTube, and it's a lot of fun seeing the show through her eyes. https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLbldZn582hop794seQdEnsnAU_OoXhfTO

# ? Oct 22, 2021 21:14

Libluini: May 18, 2012; I gravitated towards the Greens, eventually even joining the party itself.

The Linke is a party I grudgingly accept exists, but I've learned enough about DDR-history I can't bring myself to trust a party that was once the SED, a party leading the corrupt state apparatus ...; Grimey Drawer

jng2058 posted:

It's been a little quiet recently, but there is at least one full watch chronicled in there if you start from the beginning. https://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=3925635

I also chanced upon a YouTube channel doing a first time watch. She's in late season two on YouTube, and it's a lot of fun seeing the show through her eyes. https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLbldZn582hop794seQdEnsnAU_OoXhfTO

Thanks! More fuel for my backlog reactor

# ? Oct 22, 2021 21:29

Jaxyon: Mar 7, 2016; I’m just saying I would like to see a man beat a woman in a cage. Just to be sure.

CainsDescendant posted:

Yeah I hope we as wot fans can not poo poo up the tviv thread as bad as the got fans did.

As bad? No

Worse? :getin:

Also:

DarkHorse posted:

Manic pixie dream churl

Jaxyon fucked around with this message at 21:59 on Oct 22, 2021

# ? Oct 22, 2021 21:53

DarkHorse: Dec 13, 2006; Nap Ghost

buffalo all day posted:

im jeff bezos, thank you for your feedback

Please give me 0.001% of your wealth. Like whatever you have in your couch cushions is probably fine

# ? Oct 22, 2021 22:04

Hieronymous Alloy: Jan 30, 2009; Why! Why!! Why must you refuse to accept that Dr. Hieronymous Alloy's Genetically Enhanced Cream Corn Is Superior to the Leading Brand on the Market!?!; Morbid Hound

One neat thing:

it looks from the new Amazon trailer like people can be reborn as the opposite gender, which at least helps with the gender essentialism of the setting. I hope.

# ? Oct 22, 2021 22:22

Gwaihir: Dec 8, 2009; Hair Elf

Really trying to maintain the mystery of who the Dragon actually is out of the Emond's fielders feels like a thing that will actually work a lot better in the show compared to the books, just by virtue of not being able to get pov chapters from inside each of the character's heads.

# ? Oct 22, 2021 22:24

th3t00t: Aug 14, 2007; GOOD CLEAN FOOTBALL

Calenth posted:

My brother got real mad about the cover to The Dragon Reborn when it came out because he felt the cover and title together were a spoiler.

I remember between Eye and Hunt, begging Harriett to tell me whether Thom was alive or not and she told me that that was the only thing she'd been able to get Jim to tell her, and despite that she wouldn't tell me !

You met Harriet? Or knew her?

# ? Oct 22, 2021 22:25

Comrade Blyatlov: Aug 4, 2007; should have picked four fingers

If we're doing a gang tag it needs to be something related to the Band of the Red Hand, and possibly dice.

Or maybe Darkfriend Social?

# ? Oct 22, 2021 22:27

Johnny Joestar: Oct 21, 2010; Don't shoot him?

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Hieronymous Alloy posted:

One neat thing:

it looks from the new Amazon trailer like people can be reborn as the opposite gender, which at least helps with the gender essentialism of the setting. I hope.

oh for real? it'd be cool if they tamp down on some aspects and make it like. better? in various respects? i guess? i've never gotten a malicious vibe off of jordan in any way but there's absolutely some details that the show 100% has a chance to smooth out and i'd be all for it if so.

# ? Oct 22, 2021 22:28

ONE YEAR LATER: Apr 13, 2004; Fry old buddy, it's me, Bender!; Oven Wrangler

Listening to Wheel Talks episode about Shadow Rising chapter where Rand goes through the glass columns and Gus just said "Make Aiel Ji Again" and hahahah

# ? Oct 22, 2021 23:08

ONE YEAR LATER: Apr 13, 2004; Fry old buddy, it's me, Bender!; Oven Wrangler

th3t00t posted:

You met Harriet? Or knew her?

Not to step on toes but Calenth posted this back years ago in the previous version of this thread:

Calenth posted:

When I was a kid, I read everything I could lay my hands on. At some point after I�d worked through The Hobbit but before I�d moved up to The Lord of the Rings -- so, maybe third grade? -- I found a bunch of my brother�s old Conan the Barbarian comic books and read them over and over again till they came apart.

My brother wasn�t too happy about that, obviously, but my dad took the opportunity to tell me �you know, you�ve got a cousin who writes those things.� It took me a little while to realize that �your crazy cousin who writes Conan novels� was the same guy who�d completely blown my little-kid mind at a party a few years previously by taking the time to explain what a Mobius strip was and even making me one to play with out of a bit of torn napkin.

I don�t think I saw or heard of said crazy cousin till a few years more had passed and some friends of ours loaned us a VCR for a few weeks. We knew the cousin in question had a �huge� library of VHS tapes, and somehow or other it got arranged that we could borrow some, so we went over for the evening and they let me pick over the tape library; I remember grabbing a complete set of Rocky and Bullwinkle. While we were there, I remembered and asked if I could read any of his Conan novels. They told me I was too young for them but then he started telling me about the book he was working on right then. He said it was about a world where all the male wizards had gone crazy and blown up everything, so only female wizards could handle magic safely.

I went back and forth a few more times borrowing different videos and asked more questions about the book. I remember one time he said something about the idea of ages repeating and the same stories getting told over again, slightly differently each time; I remember asking if each version was different like a funhouse mirror and he said, no, more like looking at two tapestries next to each other, and thinking they were the same, but the longer you look, the more details you�d pick out that were different, and more differences with each new version of the tapestry. One time I was talking with his wife about Zork and she told me about how she was editing the new book and putting in a passage where a main character gets a second cloak, because he lost his cloak once crossing a river and once at another point later on. One time he showed me the map and explained how the mountains up near the top go down into the ocean and how he�d put that in deliberately because it was something that couldn�t happen naturally.

Anyway, y�all know where all that was going. A year or two later (this would be 1989, over summer break; I guess I was twelve?) that same crazy cousin called me up and said come on over to his house; I walked the few blocks over and he gave me an Advance Reading Copy of Eye of the World. I walked home holding the book up in front of me and reading my way down the street, sat down, and kept going straight through till I finished it.

I�ve been waiting for the next book ever since. When the last one comes out, that�s gonna be weird.

Anyway, just had to get the above out of my system, and this seemed as good a place as any. Not trying to go emo or one-up or anything (and no, I don�t get advance copies any more, that basically all stopped when the internet came along and they had to start really worrying about leaks). It�s just . . .twenty-three years of my life ago, this series. So strange thinking of it as something that�s going to come to an actual end. I�m thirty-five years old now and I can barely even remember a time when I wasn�t looking forward to the next book.

# ? Oct 22, 2021 23:12

jng2058: Jul 17, 2010; We have the tools, we have the talent!

Gwaihir posted:

Really trying to maintain the mystery of who the Dragon actually is out of the Emond's fielders feels like a thing that will actually work a lot better in the show compared to the books, just by virtue of not being able to get pov chapters from inside each of the character's heads.

RJ certainly could have made that more of a mystery if he'd tried, but having the entire beginning and like 2/3 of the whole first book be from Rand's POV pretty much gives the game away. Just writing the book from Moraine's POV would have helped that immensely, but RJ wasn't really interested in it being a mystery. Making the show, at least initially, be from Moraine's perspective at least makes it possible that people won't guess who the Dragon Reborn is immediately.

# ? Oct 22, 2021 23:18

Rarity: Oct 21, 2010; ~*4 LIFE*~

Tbf assuming they still have the stuff about Rand being an outsider and Tam not being his real dad it'll still be pretty obvious

# ? Oct 22, 2021 23:22

Zore: Sep 21, 2010; willfully illiterate, aggressively miserable sourpuss whose sole raison d�etre is to put other people down for liking the wrong things

jng2058 posted:

RJ certainly could have made that more of a mystery if he'd tried, but having the entire beginning and like 2/3 of the whole first book be from Rand's POV pretty much gives the game away. Just writing the book from Moraine's POV would have helped that immensely, but RJ wasn't really interested in it being a mystery. Making the show, at least initially, be from Moraine's perspective at least makes it possible that people won't guess who the Dragon Reborn is immediately.

Part of that is also that he wanted Moiraine to have more secrets that were revealed over the course of the series and its much harder to do so if she's the constant POV character and we're in her head. TV solves this because you don't see the actor's thoughts so you can center things more around her without giving away things you want to save for later on.

# ? Oct 22, 2021 23:48

DarkHorse: Dec 13, 2006; Nap Ghost

Zore posted:

Part of that is also that he wanted Moiraine to have more secrets that were revealed over the course of the series and its much harder to do so if she's the constant POV character and we're in her head. TV solves this because you don't see the actor's thoughts so you can center things more around her without giving away things you want to save for later on.

Yeah moiraine basically clocked Rand instantly but three ta'veren plus powerful channeling girls were an insane bonus

# ? Oct 22, 2021 23:55

Johnny Joestar: Oct 21, 2010; Don't shoot him?

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'you literally looked like an aiel in the middle of bumfuck nowhere how could i not know it'

# ? Oct 23, 2021 00:07

Nitrousoxide: May 30, 2011; do not buy a oneplus phone

Kinda wild how like a redhead, who would presumably be super pale, is the archetype for the Aiel who inhabit the super hot and dry wastes.

They probably get some mad bad sunburns.

# ? Oct 23, 2021 00:12

Jaxyon: Mar 7, 2016; I’m just saying I would like to see a man beat a woman in a cage. Just to be sure.

Nitrousoxide posted:

Kinda wild how like a redhead, who would presumably be super pale, is the archetype for the Aiel who inhabit the super hot and dry wastes.

They probably get some mad bad sunburns.

For real, though I assumed that was because they had only relatively recently settled there and it wasn't long enough for skin color adaptations to take place.

But also I have no idea how long it takes for skin color adaptations to happen.

# ? Oct 23, 2021 00:20

thrawn527: Mar 27, 2004; Thrawn/Pellaeon
Studying the art of terrorists
To keep you safe

CainsDescendant posted:

Are we gonna get another actual trailer?

https://twitter.com/thewheeloftime/status/1451654556601892864?s=21

# ? Oct 23, 2021 00:20

Barreft: Jul 21, 2014

thrawn527 posted:

https://twitter.com/thewheeloftime/status/1451654556601892864?s=21

Perrin's dopey mouth is still killing me, but like Rarity said it worked for Jon Snow

# ? Oct 23, 2021 00:35

ONE YEAR LATER: Apr 13, 2004; Fry old buddy, it's me, Bender!; Oven Wrangler

Yoo those dead sheep are placed in the shape of the dragon's fang so I'm expecting lots of little details like that throughout the series and I can't loving wait to scrub every episode frame by frame.

Also if this show ever gets to the rhuidean parts I will sob like a baby, I get choked up just listening to people talk about the memories, haha

# ? Oct 23, 2021 00:50

Johnny Joestar: Oct 21, 2010; Don't shoot him?

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ONE YEAR LATER posted:

Yoo those dead sheep are placed in the shape of the dragon's fang so I'm expecting lots of little details like that throughout the series and I can't loving wait to scrub every episode frame by frame.

Also if this show ever gets to the rhuidean parts I will sob like a baby, I get choked up just listening to people talk about the memories, haha

also right after the fang is a shot in the shape of the flame of tar valon, lol

# ? Oct 23, 2021 00:51

mossyfisk: Nov 8, 2010; FF0000

The easiest way to finish the whole series would be to follow Moiraine, and just skip ~8 books.

# ? Oct 23, 2021 00:55

ChubbyChecker: Mar 25, 2018

mossyfisk posted:

The easiest way to finish the whole series would be to follow Moiraine, and just skip ~8 books.

this could work

# ? Oct 23, 2021 01:00

Jaxyon: Mar 7, 2016; I’m just saying I would like to see a man beat a woman in a cage. Just to be sure.

mossyfisk posted:

The easiest way to finish the whole series would be to follow Moiraine, and just skip ~8 books.

The character so obviously knows what's going on that she had to get sidelined for 50% of the books.

# ? Oct 23, 2021 01:00

thrawn527: Mar 27, 2004; Thrawn/Pellaeon
Studying the art of terrorists
To keep you safe

mossyfisk posted:

The easiest way to finish the whole series would be to follow Moiraine, and just skip ~8 books.

Spend some time with the Snakes and Foxes, then come back for the Last Battle with poo poo having gone crazy while we were gone?

I mean, it would be funny, but pretty confusing for TV watchers. But I�m someone who liked the Dark Tower ending, because I read them once they were all out, had no investment, and was just laughing through the whole ending.

# ? Oct 23, 2021 01:04

DarkHorse: Dec 13, 2006; Nap Ghost

thrawn527 posted:

Spend some time with the Snakes and Foxes, then come back for the Last Battle with poo poo having gone crazy while we were gone?

I mean, it would be funny, but pretty confusing for TV watchers. But I�m someone who liked the Dark Tower ending, because I read them once they were all out, had no investment, and was just laughing through the whole ending.

Moiraine comes back wondering wtf and asks for an explanation. Everything is just an extended flashback narrated by that guy from Marvel movies like Ant Man

Edit: one thing that bugged me in the trailer was "the Last Dragon" - makes it sound like a recurring title instead of a nom de guerre, like a lost herald from a previous age or something

Not sure how I feel about it honestly

# ? Oct 23, 2021 01:08

Gully Foyle: Feb 29, 2008

Jaxyon posted:

The character so obviously knows what's going on that she had to get sidelined for 50% of the books.

Eh, Moiraine knew a lot but not all, and was often wrong. At the start of The Shadow Rising, for instance, she's pretty insistent on getting Rand to go after Illian/Sammael, partly due to one of the prophecies speaking of a "forsaken city". Of course, Rand decides to travel to Rhuidean and the Waste, which of course is required to get the Aiel on his side (and get the access key, and get Asmodean teaching him, and so on).

Moiraine thought it was dangerous for Rand to study the Dragon prophecies, but at the same time made extremely faulty assumptions on what she herself thought the prophecies meant.

# ? Oct 23, 2021 01:13

Barreft: Jul 21, 2014

Gully Foyle posted:

Eh, Moiraine knew a lot but not all, and was often wrong. At the start of The Shadow Rising, for instance, she's pretty insistent on getting Rand to go after Illian/Sammael, partly due to one of the prophecies speaking of a "forsaken city". Of course, Rand decides to travel to Rhuidean and the Waste, which of course is required to get the Aiel on his side (and get the access key, and get Asmodean teaching him, and so on).

Moiraine thought it was dangerous for Rand to study the Dragon prophecies, but at the same time made extremely faulty assumptions on what she herself thought the prophecies meant.

She did her best! :comeback:

# ? Oct 23, 2021 01:15

VAGENDA OF MANOCIDE: Aug 1, 2004; whoa, what just happened here?; College Slice

Barreft posted:

She did her best!

Losers whine about doing their best, winners go home and gently caress the court bard

# ? Oct 23, 2021 01:22

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# ? May 20, 2024 09:34

Jedit: Dec 10, 2011; Proudly supporting vanilla legends 1994-2014

DarkHorse posted:

one thing that bugged me in the trailer was "the Last Dragon" - makes it sound like a recurring title instead of a nom de guerre, like a lost herald from a previous age or something

Not sure how I feel about it honestly

I don't think that the "last" is capitalised, but you're right that it feels like something there was more than one of. It's a significant thing in WOT that when Lews Therin Telamon took the title "Dragon", nobody knew what the gently caress he was talking about or what that firebreathing serpent thing he was using as his emblem was.

# ? Oct 23, 2021 01:25

The Something Awful Forums > The Finer Arts > The Book Barn > [BOOK SPOILERS] Robert Jordan's Waste of Time -- so cheesy but so good

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