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Khanstant posted:Man there are a lot more examples I had actually seen before but wasn't thinking of when I asked, plus some new things to check out. I think generally Three Body Problem should be my first stop since it seems to have many of the itchy things I want to see leaned into. The Culture series is generally mentioned for this question because (unlike things like the 3BP) it's a Federation-esque setting with an interventionist policy that's trying to be truly moral and ethical about it. Indeed, the core plots of many of the books relate specifically to the difficulty of that, and the segment of Contact division - Special Circumstances - that deals with the areas where the right thing to do is difficult to handle or figure out. (It's the basis of the whole series, really - the Culture is a civilisation that's achieved true post scarcity and largely effortless physical dominance, so most of the remaining plots concern the how they choose to wield their abilities) If you do pick up a Culture book I would suggest Player of Games, it's an excellent starting point and directly about many of these points. MikeJF fucked around with this message at 21:26 on Nov 1, 2021 |
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Nov 1, 2021 21:19
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For some reason I thought 3BP was the series Culture was from, but I've got it straightened out now.
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Nov 1, 2021 23:14
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Culture has a lot of orgies, so presumably they're all pretty good at 3-Body Problems
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Nov 2, 2021 00:55
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I really liked Consider Plebes because it’s written from the perspective of someone who is on the outside of the utopia of the Culture looking in. However the main character is a loving rear end in a top hat so be warned.
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Nov 2, 2021 02:08
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jeeves posted:I really liked Consider Plebes because it’s written from the perspective of someone who is on the outside of the utopia of the Culture looking in. Consider Phlebas is the title but I love Consider Plebes as a title because honestly it works just as well for the book.
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Nov 2, 2021 10:16
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jeeves posted:I really liked Consider Plebes because it’s written from the perspective of someone who is on the outside of the utopia of the Culture looking in.
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Nov 2, 2021 15:07
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The tiny AI Mind in my phone decided to maximize the unintentional comedy by auto-correcting to Consider Plebes. And I really thought it was interesting to have a book be based on the main character from the outside of a utopia looking in. Especially since life is pretty good for most people in the utopia of Culture. But drat are some parts of the book pretty gross (the island of cannibals, etc) and the Idirans are pretty vile. I do think that having the main character side with them against the Culture was pretty interesting writing, as most other shittier scifi writers would have just based a similar story on having the perspective be on fighting a society like the Idirans. It's crazy how I will always remember that poor shuttlecraft AI that Horza just straight up murdered after escaping from the cannibals. I guess almost everyone else in the story is just mostly shades of rear end in a top hat versus that poor shuttle AI.
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Nov 2, 2021 18:09
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most of the time I can shut off my brain and accept that there’s a universal translator that works for everything, but I was watching DS9’s Necessary Evil, and in a flashback Gul Dukat makes some remark to Odo about his learning about humanoid nature, being seen as distinct from both Bajorans and Cardassians. No humans being discussed obviously. I suppose we’re implicitly meant to understand when Dukat says “humanoid” he’s speaking in his native tongue where doubtless the term has zero connection with humans, but would it have killed the writers to use something like “vertebrates” or “bipeds” or something? (Hm, Diogenes would have a field day with Star Trek’s setting.) I feel like the only way to get around these issues of language in a setting with aliens is to redefine the word “human” to mean any person, and then invent “Terran” or something to mean “a person of genus Homo sapiens specifically” but it’s far too late for Star Trek to go for something like that.
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Nov 2, 2021 19:29
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Xibanya posted:most of the time I can shut off my brain and accept that there’s a universal translator that works for everything, but I was watching DS9’s Necessary Evil, and in a flashback Gul Dukat makes some remark to Odo about his learning about humanoid nature, being seen as distinct from both Bajorans and Cardassians. No humans being discussed obviously. I suppose we’re implicitly meant to understand when Dukat says “humanoid” he’s speaking in his native tongue where doubtless the term has zero connection with humans, but would it have killed the writers to use something like “vertebrates” or “bipeds” or something? (Hm, Diogenes would have a field day with Star Trek’s setting.) yeah, I think that's just the writer's room forgetting that the way they use "humanoid" (any Star Trek race played by a actor with forehead makeup) wouldn't make sense to come out of the mouth of someone who isn't using "human" as the default then again, he might not wanted to have implied Bajorans are "Cardassianic" or the inverse, so he could've deliberately picked a Federation term to describe the species umbrella
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Nov 2, 2021 19:33
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Especially since terran = mirror universe nazi.
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Nov 2, 2021 19:33
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Sebaceanoids
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Nov 2, 2021 19:33
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Xibanya posted:most of the time I can shut off my brain and accept that there’s a universal translator that works for everything, but I was watching DS9’s Necessary Evil, and in a flashback Gul Dukat makes some remark to Odo about his learning about humanoid nature, being seen as distinct from both Bajorans and Cardassians. No humans being discussed obviously. I suppose we’re implicitly meant to understand when Dukat says “humanoid” he’s speaking in his native tongue where doubtless the term has zero connection with humans, but would it have killed the writers to use something like “vertebrates” or “bipeds” or something? (Hm, Diogenes would have a field day with Star Trek’s setting.) "Inalien -- If only you could hear yourselves. Human rights -- the very name is racist." -Azetbur
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Nov 2, 2021 19:37
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Xibanya posted:most of the time I can shut off my brain and accept that there’s a universal translator that works for everything, but I was watching DS9’s Necessary Evil, and in a flashback Gul Dukat makes some remark to Odo about his learning about humanoid nature, being seen as distinct from both Bajorans and Cardassians. No humans being discussed obviously. I suppose we’re implicitly meant to understand when Dukat says “humanoid” he’s speaking in his native tongue where doubtless the term has zero connection with humans, but would it have killed the writers to use something like “vertebrates” or “bipeds” or something? (Hm, Diogenes would have a field day with Star Trek’s setting.) This is right about the point in the conversation where even the other nerds at the lunchroom table started looking at me like I spontaneously generated a pocket protector and taped-up cokebottle glasses
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Nov 2, 2021 19:51
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he could have just said solids, the female changeling says it enough that its a fuckin drinking game
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Nov 2, 2021 19:58
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Xibanya posted:most of the time I can shut off my brain and accept that there’s a universal translator that works for everything, but I was watching DS9’s Necessary Evil, and in a flashback Gul Dukat makes some remark to Odo about his learning about humanoid nature, being seen as distinct from both Bajorans and Cardassians. No humans being discussed obviously. I suppose we’re implicitly meant to understand when Dukat says “humanoid” he’s speaking in his native tongue where doubtless the term has zero connection with humans, but would it have killed the writers to use something like “vertebrates” or “bipeds” or something? (Hm, Diogenes would have a field day with Star Trek’s setting.) I remember getting into an argument once because I said the word "people" in reference to all of the sentient (primarily humanoid) species in that setting. Their reasoning was the dictionary defined "person" as a member of the human species, but like, we exist in a world with only one species like us and that's theh word we use for beings like that. I'd call other people "people" because to me the association with humans is one of default having no other species yet to include.
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Nov 2, 2021 20:01
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Paper Lion posted:he could have just said solids, the female changeling says it enough that its a fuckin drinking game Solids Hards Firmies Densers Rigiderinos
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Nov 2, 2021 20:02
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Brawnfire posted:Solids Hardy boys
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Nov 2, 2021 20:19
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Monoforms has a nice air of condescension to it.
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Nov 2, 2021 20:50
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Khanstant posted:I remember getting into an argument once because I said the word "people" in reference to all of the sentient (primarily humanoid) species in that setting. Their reasoning was the dictionary defined "person" as a member of the human species, but like, we exist in a world with only one species like us and that's theh word we use for beings like that. I'd call other people "people" because to me the association with humans is one of default having no other species yet to include. Star Trek’s usage follows that pattern (many nonhuman characters referring to their native culture as “my people.”) To be a little more tied to reality, given it appears that Neanderthals had intelligence, artistic inclinations, religion, abstract thought etc on par with Homo sapiens (and in fact most Europeans carry some Neanderthal DNA) if a band of heretofore unknown Neanderthals was suddenly rediscovered I can’t imagine not referring to them as people. since for a period in history Homo sapiens and Neanderthals lived at the same time, this had to have been an actual practical consideration at some point, even if it’s only a fantasy scenario now.
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Nov 2, 2021 20:58
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i miss the old people. not old-people, the ooooold peoples.
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Nov 2, 2021 21:01
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I feel like it gives Geordie an extra level of tragedy for him to have gotten kidnapped and brainwashed on his vacation to the sex planet so he never actually got to go there. Also what the heck, why are there no computer games in the future.
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Nov 2, 2021 21:20
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SlothfulCobra posted:why are there no computer games in the future. the ferengi made daddy turn off the main computer
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Nov 2, 2021 21:33
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SlothfulCobra posted:... Imagine how hard it is for a scifi show to come up with future music that isn't either laughably dated the second it's on screen or just sounds like random noise. Imagine trying to add interactive elements to it to make it look like something that people would actually want to interact with. Also imagine how bonkers half of the current mobile games would look to someone in the 80s. "So you just tap on the cookie?"
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Nov 2, 2021 21:41
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It's worse than that. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g7BNuFjSFKM
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Nov 2, 2021 23:12
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SlothfulCobra posted:It's worse than that. I like how the shuttle's shields just... fail without the warbird even shooting at it The Type 15 is the red shirt of shuttles
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Nov 2, 2021 23:33
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8one6 posted:Also imagine how bonkers half of the current mobile games would look to someone in the 80s. Disk into Funnel Orgasm Game was waaaaaaaaaay more prescient than I would have ever thought.
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Nov 3, 2021 01:05
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The holographic Data’s explanation in Future Imperfect for his inadequate performance - “I am experiencing sub-space interference which limits my abilities” - is a good one and I’m going to use it from now on.
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Nov 3, 2021 01:32
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SuperTeeJay posted:The holographic Data’s explanation in Future Imperfect for his inadequate performance - “I am experiencing sub-space interference which limits my abilities” - is a good one and I’m going to use it from now on. "Space poo poo is stopping my brain from working right. Check back later."
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Nov 3, 2021 01:52
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Astrology people get to do that already, I'm gonna have sciencey-sounding celestial malaise as well
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Nov 3, 2021 01:56
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SuperTeeJay posted:The holographic Data’s explanation in Future Imperfect for his inadequate performance - “I am experiencing sub-space interference which limits my abilities” - is a good one and I’m going to use it from now on. SHUT UP
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Nov 3, 2021 02:50
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A.o.D. posted:SHUT UP I should use this one more too
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Nov 3, 2021 03:38
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As in close your mouth and stop talking.
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Nov 3, 2021 03:49
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MikeJF posted:If you do pick up a Culture book I would suggest Player of Games, it's an excellent starting point and directly about many of these points. I'm working my way through "excession" as my first Culture series book. It's pretty enjoyable for many of the concepts it raises but it honestly makes me feel like a dummy trying to digest it. There are so many odd names, references to places and races I don't know anything about, and a super advanced vocabulary, not to mention all the tech talk and and gibberish code. Maybe I'm just a bad reader... But are the other books any more accessible than that one?
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Nov 3, 2021 05:38
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Bucswabe posted:I'm working my way through "excession" as my first Culture series book. It's pretty enjoyable for many of the concepts it raises but it honestly makes me feel like a dummy trying to digest it. There are so many odd names, references to places and races I don't know anything about, and a super advanced vocabulary, not to mention all the tech talk and and gibberish code. It's not a good one to start off with. I would quit out for now and start with Player of Games, which is much less convoluted. Once you're more familiar with how the universe works you'll find Excession easier
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Nov 3, 2021 07:15
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Edit: wrong thread. Teleporting it to the correct one.
AndyElusive fucked around with this message at 07:56 on Nov 3, 2021 |
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Nov 3, 2021 07:39
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Excession might be approachable for a Goon, as it's the one with all the spaceships shitposting with each other.
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Nov 3, 2021 08:46
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Player of Games, and Look to Windward are my go to "where do I start with The Culture" books.
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Nov 3, 2021 10:10
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SlothfulCobra posted:Also what the heck, why are there no computer games in the future. What do you think O'Brien and Bashir are doing in the holosuite and no wait don't answer
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Nov 3, 2021 10:21
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Excession is sort of good, but annoying. Player of Games is legitimately great.
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Nov 3, 2021 10:58
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8one6 posted:
Sorry but unless you are never click you are trash. https://cookieclicker.fandom.com/wiki/True_Neverclick
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