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Ershalim posted:Terminal Autist said, pretty directly, that they believed the average voter doesn't care about things that don't effect them, and then went on to say that as a non-transperson who wasn't diabetic, that they didn't care about those issues. Like, you're free to say that that makes them a lovely person and that you dislike them for saying that, but it's a very accurate way of seeing how most people view the world. If people just did the Right Thing because it was obviously correct and good, none of this would have ever been a problem. Understanding that all of your coalitions will be built with people who think like TA is a very useful thing to learn. To be clear I do care about all those issues and sincerely want everyone in the world to be happy and have nothing bad to happen to them, but thats not an actionable political belief system and exists entirely in the abstract. The point is im to busy stressed out on the daily about my own personal poo poo I don't have the time or energy to engage in these types of very specfic issues and causes regardless of how important and nessecary they are.
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Nov 3, 2021 19:48
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HonorableTB posted:The president cannot legalize marijuana with a stroke of a pen, it will require Congressional action to change the Controlled Substances Act to deschedule it from Schedule I. Descheduling probably requires congress to act but rescheduling to Schedule II could be possible without congress. It is worth trying, anyways. I mean, if we're talking about winning elections, what's going to resonate more: "We took action to fix [pain point x] but we were blocked by the republicans. Vote them out so we can finish the job" or "yeah we're not gonna even try though." Not saying the first one is a winner per se but the second one is demonstrably a loser. This goes for student debt, MJ rescheduling, or just about anything else they could try. The legislative agenda is dead at this point, might as well TRY and use the executive to help people and then litigate in public.
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Nov 3, 2021 19:49
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Lib and let die posted:Yeah, and I'm willing to give credit on state-level victories where we can get them - we managed to pass medical marijuana down here in Florida (on the same ballot year that got DeSantis elected lmao) but it certainly hasn't been pretty. Because of the way it's handled federally, it's still largely a cash-only operation except in places where they accept, I think it's called, CanPay which forces you to round your purchase up to the next $5 because of Reasons, and it's largely just a handful of privately owned, monopolistic dispensaries (all of which except one seem absolutely dedicated to that asinine inventory model where you count poo poo that's in transit as in stock), and it'd be nice if it was just recreational and it was federal, and didn't cost hundreds of dollars a year to maintain your license to toke but...we did it, in some capacity. I work at Corporate for one of said companies, and yeah cash-only is bad as hell. CanPay doesn't force you to round up, so whomever is checking you out is being a real rear end in a top hat. That said, the medical market down here is a RACKET and I tell people i work for a legal cartel.
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Nov 3, 2021 19:50
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You can literally just do whatever lmao. It's so insane to me watching people insist we can't do good things if the rules don't allow it after the Iraq war.
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Nov 3, 2021 19:52
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https://twitter.com/frankthorp/status/1455972957843595277 Guess SALT is back if Sanders is on board.
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Nov 3, 2021 20:00
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HonorableTB posted:Like, there's not really any room for argument about whether or not the president can legalize marijuana for recreational use. This is really interesting. Thanks for writing it. For the international treaties component, would you have to renegotiate those treaties, or would Congress be empowered to just amend the law and ignore them?
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Nov 3, 2021 20:00
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HonorableTB posted:If your expectations include the president doing things that the president cannot legally do then you're going to be in for a lot of disappointment in your life I thought we just got through 4 years of the president doing things he cannot legally do? Otherwise what was that impeachment thing about? That impeachment thing had no consequences, of course... Anyways, not just specifically about weed legalization, but if I told the power company that gosh, I just can't pay the bill this month, the House Parlimentarian said I couldn't, and yes, that's a made-up position, but unfortunately, the made-up rules of my house say that I can't change it, and yes I could change the rules of the house at a whim and there's no actual legal reason my house has these bizarre rules that prevent me from doing anything, but unfortunately that's what the rules are so I can't pay right now - they shut off my loving power. If Democrats say they can't do things because well you see, we made up these rules... then yeah they should get their power cut off too. is pepsi ok posted:You can literally just do whatever lmao. It's so insane to me watching people insist we can't do good things if the rules don't allow it after the Iraq war. Also this lol. Remember they conjured up how many trillions was it to help the stock market last year? I've been told that's just pretend money that doesn't count or something but hell if I could use it to take care of my financial obligations I'd like some too please. But  .
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Nov 3, 2021 20:01
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Thom12255 posted:https://twitter.com/frankthorp/status/1455972957843595277 I'm going to laugh (but also shake my head) if they end up giving back a big tax cut to the wealthy folks.
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Nov 3, 2021 20:03
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I know the general tenor of the thread is anti-president interfering with the DoJ and thus DEA and FBI but they could be leaned on to cease enforcement over certain drugs like LSD, Mushrooms/psilocybin and others that have a good safety profile. Cease enforcement over their analogues as well. Canada enforces their laws against psilocybin to a point but the stores remain open and selling. It's free flowing in a lot of places. Also, pardons of so many people.
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Nov 3, 2021 20:03
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Sharkie posted:Also this lol. Remember they conjured up how many trillions was it to help the stock market last year? I've been told that's just pretend money that doesn't count or something but hell if I could use it to take care of my financial obligations I'd like some too please. But You should have taken what you had, borrowed more, and then invested in stocks to take advantage of QE. You could have ridden the Powell Wave to SICK GAINZ. Dummy.
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Nov 3, 2021 20:04
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I would posit that the Democratic party exists to prevent stuff like that from happening and their entire platform is that they WON'T do anything so authoritarian and reckless with the public health
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Nov 3, 2021 20:05
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Gumball Gumption posted:He could reschedule it which would help decriminalize but not legalize. It would also blow up the existing market in places where weed is legal. Biden could absolutely start pardoning people and generally signaling that the admin wants this changed. At the least he could pardon people. The number of people in prison and allowed to stay there when something could be done is the truly horrible part. Most marijuana prosecutions are under state law, and the president cannot pardon state crimes.
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Nov 3, 2021 20:09
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Some good things that happened yesterday for the people that really need a talk from the edge: https://twitter.com/amandalitman/status/1455973374212071424?s=21
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Nov 3, 2021 20:10
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We don't technically know that he can cancel the debt, just that he's hiding a memo we would expect him to trumpet if it said literally anything else, but we know he doesn't have to make us start paying it and he's doing it anyway.
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Nov 3, 2021 20:14
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Democratic Party members when a Democratic President is in office: "He can't do anything! Don't you see the president is very weak and is trapped in an Iron Cage of Law?!" Decocratic Party members when a Repub is in office: "Oh no! Somehow the president has broken through the Iron Cage of Law?! And is doing all kinds of things! Gotta vote Democratic to help rebuild the Law Cage"
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Nov 3, 2021 20:14
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Cranappleberry posted:I know the general tenor of the thread is anti-president interfering with the DoJ and thus DEA and FBI but they could be leaned on to cease enforcement over certain drugs like LSD, Mushrooms/psilocybin and others that have a good safety profile. Cease enforcement over their analogues as well. You can buy shrooms in Canada?? At a store???
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Nov 3, 2021 20:16
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Sir John Falstaff posted:Most marijuana prosecutions are under state law, and the president cannot pardon state crimes. but he can do federal so he should, especially because federal time is longer. I'm sure there would be crowing about how it's releasing hardened criminals into our communities but a similar reaction will happen with anything he does. At the very least he should be doing what he can. gently caress meeting the pope, sit in his office all day signing pardons. Part of the issue is he believes that people in prison for drug crimes deserve to be there. The status quo that Joe Biden and the dems were supposed to return the US to, is and has always been, terrible. The normality was horrifying but behind a decorous veil. Beyond that, that status quo doesn't really exist anymore. Arguably, it hasn't existed in a long time yet democrats are still fighting to preserve it as if it matters.
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Nov 3, 2021 20:19
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Sharkie posted:Democratic Party members when a Democratic President is in office: "He can't do anything! Don't you see the president is very weak and is trapped in an Iron Cage of Law?!" Well, when the president does it, that means it is not illegal.
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Nov 3, 2021 20:21
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Harold Fjord posted:We don't technically know that he can cancel the debt, just that he's hiding a memo we would expect him to trumpet if it said literally anything else, but we know he doesn't have to make us start paying it and he's doing it anyway. He could just be waiting until the next election to sign that EO so he gets more votes.
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Nov 3, 2021 20:23
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skylined! posted:Some good things that happened yesterday for the people that really need a talk from the edge: My little Salt Lake City suburb rejected the mayoral and council candidates that relied on disgusting dog whistles as part of their campaign. They campaigned almost exclusively against a rapid bus transit line going through town, because it would "increase crime, increase population density, upend our family values, and destroy the rural character of our town." Bluntly and openly hostile to minorities and poor people. It's not much, and the mayor and new councilmen are almost certainly republicans (they're non-partisan positions, but come on, it's Utah). But man, it made me happy to see at least one thing in my sleepy town go right.
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Nov 3, 2021 20:23
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Sharkie posted:Democratic Party members when a Democratic President is in office: "He can't do anything! Don't you see the president is very weak and is trapped in an Iron Cage of Law?!" Ah yes, notoriously bad societal practice "The Rule of Law." What we really need is more Ceasars in modern politics.
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Nov 3, 2021 20:23
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camoseven posted:You can buy shrooms in Canada?? At a store??? Yeah, a lot of weed shops sell them, the biggest sellers are the online retailers. I've seen some of them selling straight LSD. The way I see it, the industry learned from operating unlicensed shops with virtual impunity that the crime is worth the time. snorch fucked around with this message at 20:27 on Nov 3, 2021 |
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Nov 3, 2021 20:24
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Sanguinia posted:Ah yes, notoriously bad societal practice "The Rule of Law." What we really need is more Ceasars in modern politics. * points to the scoreboard *
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Nov 3, 2021 20:25
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Sharkie posted:Democratic Party members when a Democratic President is in office: "He can't do anything! Don't you see the president is very weak and is trapped in an Iron Cage of Law?!" I mean…taking a look at the last Republican president, most of his illegal attempts at change were stopped and killed by the courts eventually after doing a bunch of damage and he attempted a coup. I wouldn’t say your example is a contradiction these days or that Democrats should be taking notes from Trump…
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Nov 3, 2021 20:26
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Sanguinia posted:Between this, Minneapolis voting down police reform and NYC electing a Pro-Cop Mayor, I just don't know what the way forward is on the cop problem. They've become as bullet-proof as the military thanks to American pop culture, and the judiciary is protecting them at every turn even as their abuses grow more blatant daily. I feel like the silver bullet is destroying Qualified Immunity, but anyone who tries to go after it will be painted as anti-cop, and even the cities with the most anti-cop sentiment and who have been most harmed by police apparently won't countenance anti-cop politicians. https://twitter.com/radleybalko/status/1455914694032637958?s=20 Overall, the law enforcement lobby or call it whatever didn't win last night. They mostly lost but not by that much and this is a impressive showing.
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Nov 3, 2021 20:27
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In general, it looks like there's no real correlation between what a politician or political party accomplishes and their electoral success because our society creates people who are utterly mind-poisoned. Not just recently by the internet and social media, but by the matrix of capitalist discourses and power that produces the ways people see themselves, their knowledge about the world, their desires, and their expectations for life. Expecting voters in this kind of a system to somehow reward good policies is pure Sorkin liberalism. So you get college students staying home when Sanders promised to abolish their student loans but the boomer masses voting for Biden who promised idk decorum and bipartisanship, people turning out in droves for Trump, who delivered nothing but culture war poo poo, lies, and an unpopular tax cut, because Dems are going to abolish the suburbs and operate an enormous child slavery ring
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Nov 3, 2021 20:28
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Lib and let die posted:I know I'm not a representative slice of the Average Florida Voter, but I would absolutely break my "I will never vote for a democrat again" oath if they ran Andrew Gillum again based solely on the fact that a meth-addicted, bisexual prostitute connoisseur would govern better than any democrat or republican that's electorally viable. Yeah until then I hope he posts some fun stories in TCC. He has to be a goon, right?
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Nov 3, 2021 20:40
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MixMasterMalaria posted:Yeah until then I hope he posts some fun stories in TCC. He has to be a goon, right? It sounds like he has sex, so... no?
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Nov 3, 2021 20:41
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Harold Fjord posted:We don't technically know that he can cancel the debt, just that he's hiding a memo we would expect him to trumpet if it said literally anything else, but we know he doesn't have to make us start paying it and he's doing it anyway. We know that there is a memo that is redacted and literally everything in this post is Harold Fjord fanfiction.
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Nov 3, 2021 20:42
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Eric Cantonese posted:It sounds like he has sex, so... no? I don't have any reason to believe this isn't the case, so my new understanding of Gillum is that he was an active participant in GLITBL, and that he was the goon who described his girlfriend as a shorter, thicker Jessica Alba. And for that reason alone, he should be president.
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Nov 3, 2021 20:44
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ElrondHubbard posted:I mean…taking a look at the last Republican president, most of his illegal attempts at change were stopped and killed by the courts eventually after doing a bunch of damage and he attempted a coup. I wouldn’t say your example is a contradiction these days or that Democrats should be taking notes from Trump… So it sounds like, by your description, some of them got through and even the ones that didn't get through had a bunch of real-world effects? Sounds like a reason to try good things, to me. Sanguinia posted:Ah yes, notoriously bad societal practice "The Rule of Law." What we really need is more Ceasars in modern politics. Lol do you really think the Rule of Law is a thing that exists and that it protects people? Look up Kalief Browder and then Robert H. Richards IV and then get back to me about the good and mighty rule of law. Sharkie fucked around with this message at 20:47 on Nov 3, 2021 |
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Nov 3, 2021 20:45
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Sanguinia posted:Ah yes, notoriously bad societal practice "The Rule of Law." What we really need is more Ceasars in modern politics. It's a logic trap the left are dealing with now. We see how the right is diving into getting their way by any means necessary, and we naturally are considering getting our way by any means necessary for several reasons. First, we don't want to be bringing a knife to a gun fight. Second, climate change is forcing our hand and the longer we take addressing it the more people will die, so drastic measures to avert that seem more and more necessary. Third, we've all seen what happens when the opposition lets an extreme right-wing party break the law and take control. But of course there's a catch 22, the left wants to follow the law. The left is trying to craft better laws that actually protect and support people, and are enforced safely. Hard to advocate for that when we have to break other laws to get anything done. And if the left tries to do a big illegal act to force the issue without enough support, it will be the same as January 6 and just kill the movement in the crib. It's impossible to know when the right time to move outside the law is, morally or practically. The law is of course not inherently moral, but deciding to break it for the sake of morality will always bring its own moral issues. So... you're concern is very valid for both moral and practical purposes. But at the same time, we are clearly zooming towards a red line where extra-legal action might be necessary to avert really, really bad stuff going down. It's going to hurt crossing that line, and it will be very easy to screw it up and cause even more damage. I hope it's not necessary, it might not be if the GOP manages to own-goal themselves as they have so often. But the current political environment says that this will be a long-term problem that probably won't have a clean solution.
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Nov 3, 2021 20:45
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Cranappleberry posted:but he can do federal so he should, especially because federal time is longer. I'm sure there would be crowing about how it's releasing hardened criminals into our communities but a similar reaction will happen with anything he does. I mean, you can say that he should do it because it's the right thing to do, but in the context of a discussion about what would win Dems elections it seems like a bit of a non-sequitur. Pardoning marijuana traffickers seems unlikely to be a real vote-winner, and arguably could be costly. Sir John Falstaff fucked around with this message at 20:48 on Nov 3, 2021 |
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Nov 3, 2021 20:45
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Hey folks I would like to plug again the new podcast series Offline, all about how the internet has poisoned our discourse both offline and on, and amplified the worst tendencies of humanity. This week's guest was Monica Lewinkski, who had a lot of real thoughtful things to say about it all. I'm really digging the conversations, I think it's all extremely applicable to our lives. https://crooked.com/podcast-series/offline/
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Nov 3, 2021 20:47
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Sharkie posted:Democratic Party members when a Democratic President is in office: "He can't do anything! Don't you see the president is very weak and is trapped in an Iron Cage of Law?!" It's obvious you are sprouting worthless trolling nonsense but many of the things Trump tried to do got shot down by courts specifically because the president does have limited powers.
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Nov 3, 2021 20:48
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I am fine ignoring the rule of law so long as it benefits the people I care about, and once that floodgate is open there is absolutely nothing bad that will happen as a result. Pendulums only swing one direction, after all.
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Nov 3, 2021 20:57
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Just think, if Obama had broken the law to get things passed, then that would have opened the floodgates for Trump to break the law while he was in office. Thankfully, we had the rule of law to keep Trump in check.
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Nov 3, 2021 20:58
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Delthalaz posted:In general, it looks like there's no real correlation between what a politician or political party accomplishes and their electoral success because our society creates people who are utterly mind-poisoned. Not just recently by the internet and social media, but by the matrix of capitalist discourses and power that produces the ways people see themselves, their knowledge about the world, their desires, and their expectations for life. Expecting voters in this kind of a system to somehow reward good policies is pure Sorkin liberalism. The correlation seems fairly substantive. Biden's current poll numbers are dipping precisely because his administration are somewhat justifiably seen as do-nothings, while Trump was actually clawing his approval back up via actively fighting for things he wanted(even if those things were all horrible) until the pandemic really hit and he nosedived again e: spouse posted:I am fine ignoring the rule of law so long as it benefits the people I care about, and once that floodgate is open there is absolutely nothing bad that will happen as a result. Pendulums only swing one direction, after all. A lot of things people are suggesting isn't even ignoring the rule of law, it's just being rude. When Trump was stumbling around breaking things we learned that a lot of rules are actually just established norms and there's no real punishment for breaking them. Yinlock fucked around with this message at 21:04 on Nov 3, 2021 |
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Nov 3, 2021 21:00
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The rule of law?
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Nov 3, 2021 21:00
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socialsecurity posted:It's obvious you are sprouting worthless trolling nonsense but many of the things Trump tried to do got shot down by courts specifically because the president does have limited powers. And had they been done by more competent lawyers, way more of them would have gotten through. See this, and the WP analysis it's leaning on. this article posted:The reporters present a pretty simple reason for the administration’s repeat defeats: “In case after case, judges have rebuked Trump officials for failing to follow the most basic rules of governance for shifting policy, including providing legitimate explanations supported by facts and, where required, public input.” That Trump failed does not mean the law would not have accommodated him had his administration made the slightest gesture towards following the niceties of the law. Also, many more of the judges that will be assessing these questions now are Trump appointees, so relying on the courts to uphold the rule of law (as people here understand it) moving forward seems unwise.
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Nov 3, 2021 21:03
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