|
CoolCab posted:i suspect you can find it a bit cheaper if you look. yeah
|
#
?
Nov 3, 2021 00:21
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 31, 2024 11:32 |
|
|
Lazyhound posted:I finally came up in the EVGA queue, this is the system I’m looking at building (for gaming, in Canada): You could probably save a good chunk on RAM if you went with Crucial or Corsair. G.Skill Trident Z's tend to have a more premium price compared to other brands that have the same speed and timings.
|
|
#
?
Nov 3, 2021 06:50
|
|
|
Also make sure you got real Kryonaut. It sounds ridiculous, but amazon and newegg are rife with counterfeits. Real tubes of Kryonaut come with a certificate of authenticity with a code printed on it that you can input on Thermal Grizzly's site to check if it's legit. If it didn't come with that, then you could have fake thermal paste. The MemoryC seller on Newegg sells the legit stuff. This is where I got mine from. Dr. Video Games 0031 fucked around with this message at 07:29 on Nov 3, 2021 |
|
#
?
Nov 3, 2021 07:02
|
|
|
Ended up with this prebuilt. https://www.newegg.com/abs-ali581/p/N82E16883360216?item=N82E16883360216 Can I get a cpu cooler recommendation? Ideally an easy installation one, since I am not used to working on computers at all.
|
|
#
?
Nov 3, 2021 18:18
|
|
|
Cretin90 posted:Ended up with this prebuilt. I bought a similar PC from them and was frankly quite nervous about replacing the cooler with a Hyper 212. While I don't know how it rates on the difficulty scale overall all, I found it easy as someone who's previous hardware experience was plugging in a new graphics card and its cable. If anything, removing the old one gave me a harder time because I didn't look at it closely enough and ended up partly disassembling it when I didn't need to. I read the instructions, a couple articles and watched a video or two and it went really well. Hopefully you'll have a similar experience with whatever one you get recommended.
|
|
#
?
Nov 3, 2021 19:19
|
|
|
Butterfly Valley posted:I wouldn't go for the 5600G, and I'm not really sure why AM4 being end of life (ish, there's still one more upgrade to come) means you should get worse components now, because those are still what you'll be using for the foreseeable future. The monitor, SSD, and thermal paste are all things I already own. I’ll keep an eye out for good NVMe deals on Black Friday, though. I’m going to give the stock cooler a shot for now since I wear noise-cancelling headphones anyway. CoolCab posted:a 5600g is fine but you're paying for functionality you may not use (the iGPU) and it isn't quite as fast as a 5600x because of that. a little better than a 3600 tho. It was a $20 more expensive than a 3600 so I went for it for the modest performance bump. Dr. Video Games 0031 posted:Also make sure you got real Kryonaut. It sounds ridiculous, but amazon and newegg are rife with counterfeits. Real tubes of Kryonaut come with a certificate of authenticity with a code printed on it that you can input on Thermal Grizzly's site to check if it's legit. If it didn't come with that, then you could have fake thermal paste. They have a list of authorized distributors in each country on their website. Probably my final part list, with downgraded PSU and RAM: PCPartPicker Part List CPU: AMD Ryzen 5 5600G 3.9 GHz 6-Core Processor (Purchased For $289.99) Thermal Compound: Thermal Grizzly Kryonaut 5.5 g Thermal Paste (Purchased For $0.00) Motherboard: MSI B550M PRO-VDH WIFI Micro ATX AM4 Motherboard ($136.74 @ Amazon Canada) Memory: Crucial Ballistix 16 GB (2 x 8 GB) DDR4-3600 CL16 Memory ($103.99 @ PC-Canada) Storage: Samsung 860 Evo 1 TB 2.5" Solid State Drive (Purchased For $0.00) Video Card: EVGA GeForce RTX 3070 8 GB XC3 ULTRA GAMING Video Card (Purchased For $892.68) Case: Fractal Design Meshify 2 ATX Mid Tower Case (Purchased For $199.99) Power Supply: Fractal Design Ion+ 660 W 80+ Platinum Certified Fully Modular ATX Power Supply (Purchased For $99.98) Monitor: LG 32QK500-C 32.0" 2560x1440 75 Hz Monitor (Purchased For $0.00) Total: $1723.37 Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available Generated by PCPartPicker 2021-11-04 02:28 EDT-0400
|
|
#
?
Nov 4, 2021 09:07
|
|
|
benchmarks are hitting like a hurricane - the 12600k is considerably better than the 5600x, and can be run at nearly the same speeds on a ddr4 platform negating some of the additional cost. that might inform your decision making, we only had confirmation today.
|
|
#
?
Nov 4, 2021 14:57
|
|
|
Considerably better in productivity, slightly better in gaming during cpu-bound scenarios (up to 10% or so in some games that lean hard on single-core performance like far cry 6, and much less for games that don't). It's worth being specific. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UMBLCv54JPw Dr. Video Games 0031 fucked around with this message at 15:23 on Nov 4, 2021 |
|
#
?
Nov 4, 2021 15:10
|
|
|
Dr. Video Games 0031 posted:Considerably better in productivity, slightly better in gaming during cpu-bound scenarios (up to 10% or so in some games that lean hard on single-core performance like far cry 6, and much less for games that don't). It's worth being specific. I was about to post this exact video! Optimum Tech doesn't miss. I think one of the better benchmarks in this video is the mixed workload performance, while gaming and simultaneously recording it was faster/smoother than a 5950x. His final conclusion is literally "this is the best choice CPU for gaming you can buy right now". Linus' video is also somewhat of a sleeper 12600K plug because its what really shined there. Given the lower power draw and clocks I wonder if it would actually be worthwhile overclocking the i5, we know the architecture can happily run +500MHz over what it's boosting to stock.
|
|
#
?
Nov 4, 2021 15:44
|
|
|
Any key takeaways for those of us currently in the market for a new gaming system, or who recently purchased and are still in the return window? I.e. worth waiting for a 12th gen, will it even be available, will it be worth a price premium with most gaming, will it significantly (or slightly) reduce pricing of 11th/10th gen Intel and AMD 5XX0 series processors, etc? Well aware this is crystal balling especially since it’s preliminary, but I’m sure there are those of us wondering. 
|
|
#
?
Nov 4, 2021 15:51
|
|
|
yeah im ready to pull the trigger on a 5900x build due to my current machine falling apart at the seams, but i can apply some band aids for now if i need to.
|
|
#
?
Nov 4, 2021 15:55
|
|
|
Cretin90 posted:Any key takeaways for those of us currently in the market for a new gaming system, or who recently purchased and are still in the return window? I think some of the hyperbole is reserved for new buyers coming from older systems. No-one should be upgrading from 11th/5000, and it's not "drop everything and grab them" levels of upgrade because CPU performance is still not the most critical factor for gaming right now. I would definitely wait however if you're building new, and tentatively consider a return/exchange if the outlay is low and you are partway through a build. Versus the 5600x you are seeing a massive increase in multi-threaded performance, upwards of 50%, so if you have a mixed use case and value productivity it's a large step up. Gaming performance is mostly iterative, really a maximum of 20% (outliers), and an average closer to 7-10%. Keep in mind this is only in CPU limited scenarios which, again, isn't always unless you've got a 3080+. Price drops on existing gear are definitely coming, in Australia a lot of Z590/11th Gen products are on firesale (50% or more off motherboards) as they have no real market anymore. The 5600x will likely see price pressure, while the top end with the 5950x will budge a lot less, AMD still has niches that will prevent total firesale. Intel has mostly bitten the middle out of the market in terms of sure-buys. The 11400/10400 are still relevant as the only sub $200 option, and the 5950x is still relevant for many workstation workloads, but the 5600/5800/5900x have all been logically supplanted by the 12600/12700/12900K as they all punch one above their tier from AMD (the 12600K contests the 12700K, and so on). Too Many Birds posted:yeah im ready to pull the trigger on a 5900x build due to my current machine falling apart at the seams, but i can apply some band aids for now if i need to. I would price up a 12900K/DDR4 system and see if it's tenable for you, it's really a 5950x competitor at not much more than the 5900x. You can even run it at the lower power target and still have it beat the 5900x, especially in games/ST. BurritoJustice fucked around with this message at 16:11 on Nov 4, 2021 |
|
#
?
Nov 4, 2021 16:08
|
|
|
It all mostly depends on the games you choose to use to test. OptimumTech chose a handful of games only unfortunately (i imagine there's a lot of time crunch involved with testing different memory configurations and also windows 11 throwing a wrench into everyone's testing setups), and they didn't show the 12600K in an amazing light (though it was still good, obviously). The games LTT tested showed it in a much better light. The games TomsHardware tested show it as just a few percent better than the 5600x at 1080p gaming, while TechPowerUp show it as a 7% better. I would expect most benchmarks to be like this. Since these are averages, you may find that the types of games you prefer are generally much better on the 12600k, or you may find there's no difference. The main benefit of the 12600k is, well, everything else outside of gaming, at which it's a big leap forward beyond the 5600X. So you have to weigh your options carefully. The 5600X is $310 at newegg, and the 12600K is $320 everywhere I'm checking. The cheapest Z690 DDR4 motherboard worth using is probably the MSI Z690 Pro for $220. Do NOT get the ASRock Phantom Gaming 4, no matter how cheap it is, it blows. Meanwhile, the cheapest B550 motherboard worth getting is the $120 MSI B550-A Pro (hey, there's a trend here). So that's about $110 extra to get the 12600K. Whether it's worth it or not is not depends on your use case. Ultimately, waiting is the best choice, which is the drum I've been beating all along. There will be budget-tier LGA1700 motherboards eventually, but none exist currently. There will also be cheaper CPUs eventually. And there will be new Zen CPUs in a few months. I think people who don't need a new PC right now should probably wait, and those who do... I don't know, man. If you want something cheap, get an 11400 if you can find one. If you want something better right now, get a 12th gen CPU I guess. Z690 comes with other benefits too over AMD's chipsets. There are lots of M.2 slots on most boards, for instance. That's nice to have. Dr. Video Games 0031 fucked around with this message at 16:14 on Nov 4, 2021 |
|
#
?
Nov 4, 2021 16:09
|
|
|
Cretin90 posted:Any key takeaways for those of us currently in the market for a new gaming system, or who recently purchased and are still in the return window? The 12th gen is out right now, and it's even available, depending on where you look (like B&H Photo Video: https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1663645-REG/intel_bx8071512600k_core_i5_12600k_8_core_lga.html) Like I said though, it's probably worth waiting. It will go out of stock before the day ends, but give it a few months and it'll be easily available again, F SKUs will be available probably, the B660 chipset motherboards will be available for sub-$200, and there will be better options all around compared to what's currently available. You have to really want to be on the bleeding edge to jump in now. Nothing wrong with that, but it's not the pragmatic option. Dr. Video Games 0031 fucked around with this message at 16:17 on Nov 4, 2021 |
|
#
?
Nov 4, 2021 16:11
|
|
|
BurritoJustice posted:I would price up a 12900K/DDR4 system and see if it's tenable for you, it's really a 5950x competitor at not much more than the 5900x. You can even run it at the lower power target and still have it beat the 5900x, especially in games/ST. I've never not had an Intel system so I guess I could keep that trend going. Currently on the i5-4570.  Should I still be looking at 3600 MHz for the DDR4? Or is that all kind of muddy right now with the new architecture?
|
|
#
?
Nov 4, 2021 16:17
|
|
|
Dr. Video Games 0031 posted:Ultimately, waiting is the best choice, which is the drum I've been beating all along. Wait how long? I would've liked an upgrade a while ago (from an i5-6400) but I don't strictly need to if it'd be prudent to wait a little longer.
|
|
#
?
Nov 4, 2021 16:18
|
|
|
LGA1700 is also buying into a platform with some upgrade legs, while AM4 is effectively dead for now. Z690 is guaranteed to get Raptor Lake, coming around Zen4 with higher core counts and other improvements, and leakers are split on whether it'll go one further than that. All the platform features are also the latest. You get PCIE 5.0, way more M.2 bandwidth due to the larger chipset link (8x lanes of PCIE 4.0 to share), USB 3.2 Gen 2x2, 2.5Gbe as standard, WiFi 6E/BT5.2, etc. More about the total package than just a gaming perf improvement.
|
|
#
?
Nov 4, 2021 16:22
|
|
|
edit: ^^^^ I'd say those legs aren't very long for DDR4 boards. We don't know what Intel's plans are, but I Rinkles posted:Wait how long? I would've liked an upgrade a while ago (from an i5-6400) but I don't strictly need to if it'd be prudent to wait a little longer. "However long it takes" would be my answer, though I know it's a poo poo one. We don't know when exactly the B-series motherboards or non-iGPU CPUs are coming, nor do we know what exactly AMD is doing with zen3d or when that's coming. So there's a lot of stuff still up in the air. I'd wait a few more months if possible, unless you really like what you're seeing and want to be an early adopter. Dr. Video Games 0031 fucked around with this message at 16:31 on Nov 4, 2021 |
|
#
?
Nov 4, 2021 16:22
|
|
|
the other incentive to waiting would be the reasonable expectation that this will cause price pressure on the 5000 series just before black friday, which in my experience can lead to sales. the 5000 series has been stubbornly resistant to any kind of promo so that could be significant
|
|
#
?
Nov 4, 2021 16:36
|
|
|
Welp, the 5600X / B550 upgrade I made a few weeks ago is looking a little less hot now compared to the i5-2600K benchmarks. But maybe I still come out a bit ahead on price/performance terms. I paid $131 for the MSI Tomahawk B550 board and $280 for the 5600X (total $411) vs. Z690 Tomahawk DDR4 for $290 / i5-12600K is $320 (total $610) I could see the argument for more M.2 slots, faster USB, etc. along with better CPU performance being worth the extra $200. I am still in my return window for the CPU and mobo, and I bought DDR4-3600 RAM that I could carry over. Should I think about moving over to Alder Lake or just ride this out and maybe swap in a Zen 3D chip next year? I'm just 4K gaming with a 3080 and probably not CPU limited in most things anyway, so my instinct is to not go through the hassle of returning and rebuilding stuff.
|
|
#
?
Nov 4, 2021 17:28
|
|
|
You're not being gimped at that resolution, don't lose your head over it. At 4k you will see literally no difference at all.
|
|
#
?
Nov 4, 2021 17:40
|
|
|
Anyone who built strictly for gaming above 1080p should not be considering returns/rebuilds if they went 5600x/11400. The gains just aren’t there as the likelihood you’re CPU bound is very very low. If you bought a prebuilt and you’re still in return window, you should be checking prices daily as that may change and you may want to try and get that cash back or do an exchange. If you built, also pay attention to price changes as you can usually get that cash back in return windows. Once more details and reviews and such come out I’ll get some OP updates going.
|
|
#
?
Nov 4, 2021 17:58
|
|
|
Zedsdeadbaby posted:You're not being gimped at that resolution, don't lose your head over it. At 4k you will see literally no difference at all. If you want to go for a more budget oriented pick for 4k gaming, a 3600 will give you the essentially the same frame rates as a 5600x on the vast majority of games: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PSxuiWih_Z8&t=627s
|
|
#
?
Nov 4, 2021 18:08
|
|
|
Is there an easy-to-read source (manufacturer or third-party) for what the “upgradeability” of certain motherboards (I have an ASUS mb) are capable? I have a bit of trouble coming up with search terms specifically for finding stuff like this because of word/usage links in 22 years of Schizophrenia. My mobo is an ASUS 460(-ish?) or so and I can’t seem to find this information-type through Google or DDGo. I don’t know any other way to explain it, and I do know that cutting-edge products get the flashy presentations, but it’s harder (for me, apparently) to find even on the support pages. I haven’t tried YouTube or bing yet, but it’s 99% my fault I’m sure and not any specific search’s algorithms.
|
|
#
?
Nov 4, 2021 19:15
|
|
|
So that 460 sounds like a chipset specification, which won't tell you what you really want, which is exactly what your exact motherboard can do. Assuming you're running Windows, open up System Information, and checkout what it shows under Baseboard Product. So in my case it's an MSI MAG B550 Tomahawk, which is what you can then easily google for spec sheets and such. What exactly are you trying to figure out whether you can upgrade?
|
|
#
?
Nov 4, 2021 19:23
|
|
Yes, it's like a lava lamp.
|
DerekSmartymans posted:I haven’t tried YouTube or bing yet, but it’s 99% my fault I’m sure and not any specific search’s algorithms. You need to check the socket type to see which CPUs physically fit in the board, and then see what chipset the motherboard is and what generation of processors those support. For Intel this isn't as much of an issue as they seem to change sockets every generation or two, but Ryzen have had the AM4 socket for a while so there are older boards that could physically fit a Zen3 chip but don't have the chipset to run it. Also now we're on the cusp of DDR5 so there's going to be a period of RAM compatibility issues to consider. Either way, just tell us what specific model of motherboard you have and we can tell you what your upgrade options are.
|
|
#
?
Nov 4, 2021 19:24
|
|
|
DerekSmartymans posted:Is there an easy-to-read source (manufacturer or third-party) for what the “upgradeability” of certain motherboards (I have an ASUS mb) are capable? If you're asking if you can upgrade to the new Intel chips, the answer is no no matter what board you have.
|
|
#
?
Nov 4, 2021 19:28
|
|
|
Butterfly Valley posted:You need to check the socket type to see which CPUs physically fit in the board, and then see what chipset the motherboard is and what generation of processors those support. For Intel this isn't as much of an issue as they seem to change sockets every generation or two, but Ryzen have had the AM4 socket for a while so there are older boards that could physically fit a Zen3 chip but don't have the chipset to run it. Thanks, you two. Like I said, I just didn’t have the knowledge of words to use in order to search for myself! I’ll post all the specs after I get home and login. I don’t have any money for upgrades (my sister’s husband did drop 64GB 3200 DDR4 RAM as “e-waste” on me a week or so ago), but I’m able to save and my PC is running everything with no trouble, but my GTX970 system is, too, and it was piecemeal’d over a six-year period. I don’t care about TotL capabilities or anything, but enjoy tinkering and upgrading gear over time, and I’m able to wait an extra month or two apiece to upgrade (over a long-rear end upgrade period!) to get the money.
|
|
#
?
Nov 4, 2021 19:37
|
|
|
Pilfered Pallbearers posted:If you're asking if you can upgrade to the new Intel chips, the answer is no no matter what board you have. I usually don’t upgrade beyond a generation or even two below MAXIMUM POWER anyways, but I know my processor is an i7 10xxx and won’t take a 12xxx at all, but I couldn’t afford the prebuilt with the i7 (i9?) 11xxx for instance and didn’t know if I was even capable of a slight upgrade two years from now or even how to tell!
|
|
#
?
Nov 4, 2021 19:42
|
|
|
CoolCab posted:benchmarks are hitting like a hurricane - the 12600k is considerably better than the 5600x, and can be run at nearly the same speeds on a ddr4 platform negating some of the additional cost. that might inform your decision making, we only had confirmation today. I think I’ll stick with the Ryzen for now. I eventually want to go hog-wild with a high-end CPU and a custom watercooling loop, but I’m content with this minimum viable build until AM5 stuff ships and DDR5 trickles down into the mainstream. I just want a home for the 3070 so I can yank the Windows drive out of my current desktop, a 2010 Mac Pro. I might return the PSU and go for the 760W or 860W after all, it looks like higher-end cards like the 3080 recommend 750+ and it would one more thing I’d have to upgrade later.
|
|
#
?
Nov 4, 2021 21:05
|
|
|
Man, what an awkward time to be in the market for a new build. Between new CPU sockets here or on the horizon, Intel popping it's head up after a long hiatus, and the GPU market being madnes with ETH 2.0 sorta on the horizon there is so much uncertainty and pain. Mostly pain.
|
|
#
?
Nov 4, 2021 21:58
|
|
|
absolutely optimal time to buy last gen secondhand on good deep discount (particularly if you're patient and quick), the 3000 series is starting to show up in numbers on facebook market and such. i'm waiting for DDR5 early adopters to start selling me their high end DDR4 kits for nowt 
|
|
#
?
Nov 4, 2021 22:11
|
|
|
gay_crimes posted:Thanks, I'll scoop up a 5600x and report back The lags entirely gone now with the 5600x in my rig and everything feels buttery smooth, fps more than doubled in the chuggiest areas
|
|
#
?
Nov 4, 2021 22:45
|
|
|
noice!
|
|
#
?
Nov 4, 2021 22:46
|
|
|
Pvt. Parts posted:Man, what an awkward time to be in the market for a new build. Between new CPU sockets here or on the horizon, Intel popping it's head up after a long hiatus, and the GPU market being madness with ETH 2.0 sorta on the horizon there is so much uncertainty and pain. Mostly pain. Although I haven't got the money to buy a new PC yet, and my i7 920 is still chugging along, I had scoped out an AMD system (pre-built from SCAN), however the idea of the new Intel i5 12600k is interesting.
|
|
#
?
Nov 4, 2021 23:00
|
|
|
If I were in the market for a new PC right now and I had needs beyond gaming, I'd definitely be after one of the new Intel chips. However the power and cooling needs, price of the motherboards and the whole DDR4/5 thing add a lot of cost to the build that for a user just wanting to game at 1440p/4k aren't worth it. In that situation I'd wait for either prices to come down on Zen3 or for more reasonable Intel motherboards to come out to build around a 12600 DDR4 board, or for AMD to release their 3D cache chips to see how they stack up. As I said though for 1440p and 4k gaming no-one should be upset about their Zen3 platforms as there will be no appreciable difference. All of those Alder Lake review videos are based on 1080p gaming and productivity work.
|
|
#
?
Nov 4, 2021 23:08
|
|
|
CoolCab posted:absolutely optimal time to buy last gen secondhand on good deep discount (particularly if you're patient and quick), the 3000 series is starting to show up in numbers on facebook market and such. i'm waiting for DDR5 early adopters to start selling me their high end DDR4 kits for nowt Holy gently caress, that happened a lot faster than I thought it would. mom and dad fight a lot fucked around with this message at 23:42 on Nov 4, 2021 |
|
#
?
Nov 4, 2021 23:39
|
|
|
CoolCab posted:absolutely optimal time to buy last gen secondhand on good deep discount (particularly if you're patient and quick), the 3000 series is starting to show up in numbers on facebook market and such. i'm waiting for DDR5 early adopters to start selling me their high end DDR4 kits for nowt dang i didnt even think of that. how is warranty coverage on secondhand cpus? i'm guessing nonexistent?
|
|
#
?
Nov 5, 2021 00:52
|
|
|
Shear Modulus posted:dang i didnt even think of that. how is warranty coverage on secondhand cpus? i'm guessing nonexistent? CPUs almost never fail. It’s super rare and I’d be unconcerned about this. Even if it came to it, it’s possible you could convince them.
|
|
#
?
Nov 5, 2021 02:25
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 31, 2024 11:32 |
|
|
the ideal is to find someone who just upgraded when something new and shiny comes out and is trying to liquidate their old stuff to recoup some of the cost/get rid of it. they're motivated to sell (because it lessens the sting of expensive new gear) but probably don't care enough to haggle if you make a fair offer- if the money really mattered to them they'd not be upgrading so soon. i got a 3600, x570 mobo and a cooler for 140 quid this way from an older gentleman who clearly just upgraded. i didn't haggle at all - protip for local sales: if someone says "oh someone else has said they want it" on a great deal respond with "fair enough but if they're at all funny about price i can pay full in cash and collect today". facebook is full of scammers, flakes and chancers and this type of seller wants it done ASAP, worked in this instance. after selling the excess parts my upgrade might even have a slight profit, lol.
|
|
#
?
Nov 5, 2021 03:04
|
|