Register a SA Forums Account here!
JOINING THE SA FORUMS WILL REMOVE THIS BIG AD, THE ANNOYING UNDERLINED ADS, AND STUPID INTERSTITIAL ADS!!!

You can: log in, read the tech support FAQ, or request your lost password. This dumb message (and those ads) will appear on every screen until you register! Get rid of this crap by registering your own SA Forums Account and joining roughly 150,000 Goons, for the one-time price of $9.95! We charge money because it costs us money per month for bills, and since we don't believe in showing ads to our users, we try to make the money back through forum registrations.
 
  • Post
  • Reply
Bottom Liner
Feb 15, 2006


a specific vein of lasagna
That may be true, but mostly stems from breaking previous concepts and habits from D&D players specifically. That guide pdf is mostly about telling you that DW is not D&D and here’s how it works instead.

For newcomers to RPGs as a whole, Dungeon World is a fantastic book for what a GM is and what they should do. The principals and moves are a great guidance for new GMs and give them a built in way to keep the game flowing and engaging. I think Dungeon World really does succeed in being “what people think D&D is” and has plenty of good onboarding to achieve that.

The guide also specifically quotes Something Awful posters by name multiple times :lol:

Also unrelated, Homebrew World is a much better take on the idea and cleans up a lot of DWs issues.

Adbot
ADBOT LOVES YOU

Vulpes Vulpes
Apr 28, 2013

"...for you, it is all over...!"

Bottom Liner posted:

Also unrelated, Homebrew World is a much better take on the idea and cleans up a lot of DWs issues.

This looks great, good looking out

Bottom Liner
Feb 15, 2006


a specific vein of lasagna

Vulpes Vulpes posted:

This looks great, good looking out

No problem. You might want to also look at Unlimited Dungeons, another free DW 2.0 take that’s not as geared towards one shots. The way it does Wizard spell lists is particularly good and really my only complaint of Homebrew World.

Bottom Liner fucked around with this message at 22:01 on Nov 13, 2021

Nuns with Guns
Jul 23, 2010

It's fine.
Don't worry about it.

KingKalamari posted:

I think there's also something to say about people's attachment to, for lack of a better description, the "D&D-like" genre that exists even outside of the baseline mechanics of the game. It's often been said on here that D&D isn't really a fantasy simulation game, it's a D&D simulation game, and I think extends even beyond the mechanics and into the types of stories you can tell and the expected set dressing you see in D&D games. The switch between Balance and Amnesty wasn't just a shift in system, it was also a broad shift in genre from D&D-like fantasy to rural, urban fantasy, which I can see being a turn off to fans of the former.

I'm not sure if it's "D&D as a genre" specifically people prefer, or more that it's just "the fantasy genre, as shaped by decades of D&D tropes" that people are wanting. Because it's pretty undeniable that D&D absorbed every other major English-language fantasy work picked through it, then regurgitated it back out in a way that's foundational to all video game RPGs, both in the West and in Japan. Then also a large number of post-D&D fantasy novels and comics shaped by it, in large part from the novels set in various D&D campaign settings.

It's got a kind of openness to the tone and expectations that I think is narrowed down when you're committing to "Urban Fantasy" as a genre instead. Kind of like how Star Wars appeals to people because it's a giant sci-fantasy space opera setting. Your gaming group gets to modulate the tone and premise down to something you want... kind of. It's the same kind of convenient little lie that "D&D can do anything!" when it comes to the kind of tone or genre the mechanics support, but applied to the game as a story setting.

KingKalamari posted:

It's definitely going to need a section that clearly outlines the broader philosophy of running the system to be successful. It reminds me of when Dungeon World was initially released and just how bad a job the book did of concisely communicating how you were supposed to run the system. Like, when the most common advice for new GMs looking for guidance is "Read this third party guide online that explains how the system is supposed to be run" you know the core book has missed the mark.

Yeah this is a big thing that worries me. I've looked over a number of Magpie Games books, and they get PBTA well, but I'm just not sure they get what you need to introduce new people to it well. And this is on top of all the little "indie publisher" quirks like not quite perfecting layouts or providing proper rules clarification in some spots that need it.

Bottom Liner posted:

That may be true, but mostly stems from breaking previous concepts and habits from D&D players specifically. That guide pdf is mostly about telling you that DW is not D&D and here’s how it works instead.

For newcomers to RPGs as a whole, Dungeon World is a fantastic book for what a GM is and what they should do. The principals and moves are a great guidance for new GMs and give them a built in way to keep the game flowing and engaging. I think Dungeon World really does succeed in being “what people think D&D is” and has plenty of good onboarding to achieve that.

I don't really like phrasing things as "breaking" someone from D&D habits, or the asinine "D&D causes brain damage" poo poo, but it's undeniable that people come to D&D with certain conceptions of what a tabletop RPG is, what effective problem solving in one looks like, and what kind of entertainment they expect to get out of one. It's not just D&D that does this but it's certainly part of the wider cultural "loop" of it. Like at this point the more direct influence is probably video games, especially open world ones and RPGs, and it's an apparent and ongoing problem/discourse there on the way violence is always an applicable solution to a problem in those games.

I'd say a big part of the problem is that as much as we decry the way "our society" does not train people to critically think, another thing that's even more neglected, or even shamed, is improvisational storytelling skills, either in the form of creative writing or acting. People gush about Critical Role and the like because they are some of the select few who are trained actors and comedians. The McElroys are media personalities, too, and huge part of the love for TAZ came out of them applying their McElroy banter to an ongoing story. It's hard, and intimidating, and it's kind of embarrassing to a lot of people to put on a persona and play out being someone else because we're trained to think that's baby poo poo or things only those sissy gay theater nerds do.

I think there's a lot of unspoken and under-discussed work that needs to go into making people feel relaxed and confident and willing to think beyond the obvious "answers" media everywhere tells them solves every problem.

Bottom Liner posted:

The guide also specifically quotes Something Awful posters by name multiple times :lol:

The guide was written by SA posters in the forum's Honeymoon Period with Dungeon World, iirc. There's also a lot of pretty good DW classes made by SA posters, too. Better, in a lot of cases, than the ones in the base game. And then other iterations of the conceits that evolved into even better fantasy PBTA games, like Fellowship.

Vulpes Vulpes
Apr 28, 2013

"...for you, it is all over...!"
Lovely, thanks! I'm going to run a game for some friends who want the D&D experience and I refuse to do D&D, but DW's tics annoy me (esp. with default playbooks) too much to use it, so these are great.

I do wish there was an Old School Fellowship or something, just a set of playbooks for Fighter, Thief, Wizard, etc. Which I guess wouldn't be too hard to kludge together, really.

Lumbermouth
Mar 6, 2008

GREG IS BIG NOW


Vulpes Vulpes posted:

Lovely, thanks! I'm going to run a game for some friends who want the D&D experience and I refuse to do D&D, but DW's tics annoy me (esp. with default playbooks) too much to use it, so these are great.

I do wish there was an Old School Fellowship or something, just a set of playbooks for Fighter, Thief, Wizard, etc. Which I guess wouldn't be too hard to kludge together, really.

You might want to check out Freebooters On The Frontier. It’s a West Marches murderhobo Dungeon World revamp designed by the guy who made The Perilous Wilds, one of the single best supplements for the original game.

Nuns with Guns
Jul 23, 2010

It's fine.
Don't worry about it.

Vulpes Vulpes posted:

Lovely, thanks! I'm going to run a game for some friends who want the D&D experience and I refuse to do D&D, but DW's tics annoy me (esp. with default playbooks) too much to use it, so these are great.

I do wish there was an Old School Fellowship or something, just a set of playbooks for Fighter, Thief, Wizard, etc. Which I guess wouldn't be too hard to kludge together, really.

There's World of Dungeons: https://johnharper.itch.io/world-of-dungeons, which is pretty compact and short but might be what you're looking for.

hyphz
Aug 5, 2003

Number 1 Nerd Tear Farmer 2022.

Keep it up, champ.

Also you're a skeleton warrior now. Kree.
Unlockable Ben

Nuns with Guns posted:

Yeah this is a big thing that worries me. I've looked over a number of Magpie Games books, and they get PBTA well, but I'm just not sure they get what you need to introduce new people to it well. And this is on top of all the little "indie publisher" quirks like not quite perfecting layouts or providing proper rules clarification in some spots that need it.

The sample adventure came across as a rather bad sign, but that's probably just for the KS backers. But using PBTA for a licensed property seems like it could be tricky.

quote:

It's hard, and intimidating, and it's kind of embarrassing to a lot of people to put on a persona and play out being someone else because we're trained to think that's baby poo poo or things only those sissy gay theater nerds do.

I think this can be a big deal: the idea of a tactical system or strategic problem solving can act as a legitimiser. Hey, we're playing basically a board game without a board. And it's not just putting on a persona in that way - it's doing it privately. Oddly, doing it publically is much more acceptable if it's done well. But acting as someone else privately has the whiff of those weird ERPers.

Also, another interesting find on 5e matters. The Level Up book, described as Morrus' add-ons to improve D&D 5e.. is not a D&D 5e add-on at all. It's blatantly a new d20 game. It rewrites practically everything, including all the class progressions, some parts of character generation, the whole spell list, and has its own monster manual. Yet it has no problem selling itself as "advanced 5th edition" (using the old trick of never using the trademarked "D&D"). I have no idea if that'll work to ride coat-tails.

Vulpes Vulpes
Apr 28, 2013

"...for you, it is all over...!"

Lumbermouth posted:

You might want to check out Freebooters On The Frontier. It’s a West Marches murderhobo Dungeon World revamp designed by the guy who made The Perilous Wilds, one of the single best supplements for the original game.

Nuns with Guns posted:

There's World of Dungeons: https://johnharper.itch.io/world-of-dungeons, which is pretty compact and short but might be what you're looking for.

Have both of those (and so much more) from my DW enthusiast phase some years ago, but thanks for reccs!

Arivia
Mar 17, 2011

Tendales posted:

PF1 essentially combined the Player's Guide and the Gamemaster's Guide into a single massive sometimes poorly bound book that cost slightly less than the PHB and DMG combined. Which is good if your group buys a single book for the entire group, bad if your group wants every player to have their own book.

The solution they came up with for a cheaper core book was kind of hilarious, too: Just take the pdf for the massive tome and print it out on cheaper paper at like 50% size, maybe cut out some of the fluff, soft bind it, job done. Magnifying glass not included.

This kind of bumps into one of the big unsolved problems in RPGs: designing a book as instruction guide and designing a book as convenient reference manual are different and largely contradictory goals, and I don't think this is a circle that's ever been squared in any really economically feasible way.

And for what it's worth, the shrunk Paizo pathfinder rulebooks (which aren't missing any "fluff" it's literally the exact same book at digest size in softcover) sell incredibly well, to the point Paizo is now selling both hardcover and softcover versions of new rulebooks at the exact same time (in addition to an obligatory ribbon bookmark cheap leather cover "collector's edition").

I think Paizo's Pathfinder 2e is pretty instructive about how to treat sacred cows of a D&D when preparing a new edition, as well. They clearly made a lot, a lot of choices to facilitate having a "classic D&D" experience right in the core rulebook ready to go, and if that's all you care about you can get by okay with just that and the Bestiary. The GameMastery Guide is a core rulebook (and they treat it like one) but the majority of the rules in it are actually the ways they suggest to make the system more interesting/tighter/play around with it in ways that aren't classic D&D - there's a whole other set of ability scores in there that's pretty obviously more equally balanced (in terms of how important each individual score is) but isn't classic Str/Dex/Con/Int/Wis/Cha, the inherent bonus system, and lots of little wink nod suggestions that are like "4e did this and it was good and you should do it too but it doesn't feel like classic D&D so it isn't the core rules") among tons of other stuff. The Advanced Player's Guide is the same, it's the book if you really want to crack open character building with a ribspreader and go "gently caress that poo poo, wizards wear armour in my game as a default option."

Doing it this way allowed them to have their cake and eat it too, because the whole system is incredibly grog-friendly if you don't look at Pathfinder and innately recoil (if you figure out dungeoncrawling procedures and a gold-for-XP system, it'd be a cinch to run Basic D&D adventures in), but you can make very small changes and keep it incredibly modern and character focused. So when they do adventure paths like "everyone is wizards or druids in the height of magical knowledge in the South", it's like a paragraph for them to go "yeah, you just use those rules we already showed you about how everyone can be a wizard or a druid on top of their existing classes."

Arivia fucked around with this message at 23:59 on Nov 13, 2021

Gao
Aug 14, 2005
"Something." - A famous guy

hyphz posted:

Also, another interesting find on 5e matters. The Level Up book, described as Morrus' add-ons to improve D&D 5e.. is not a D&D 5e add-on at all. It's blatantly a new d20 game. It rewrites practically everything, including all the class progressions, some parts of character generation, the whole spell list, and has its own monster manual. Yet it has no problem selling itself as "advanced 5th edition" (using the old trick of never using the trademarked "D&D"). I have no idea if that'll work to ride coat-tails.

Yeah, looking at how they're talking about it on their forums, it looks like their intent was to make a new system that still functioned with official WotC adventures as they were written and to let people who still wanted to make a proper 5e character still function with the group. And it'll probably work? But you will have to decide which version of the basic underlying mechanics you want, as those changed a little, too. Like flanking is no longer optional, but instead of giving advantage, it gives an "expertise die," which means you get an extra 1d4 on the attack roll. But if anything gives you more expertise dice, you increase that to 1d6, then 1d8, where it normally caps. And now crits are double damage, stat mod and all, but you can cancel a crit by sacrificing a shield or taking a level of fatigue. These new rules give you options to increase your crit range (berserkers and rogues now get an increase automatically as they level), so presumably that's balanced by monsters also being able to do that or something like that (I only have the player book). And now everyone has access to what's basically reckless attack, but the target can chose to fall back and not give advantage, but also get disadvantage on their own attacks until the end of their next turn. It really is a 5.5 more than an add on. It's one I like overall from what I've read, and it deals with why I got bored of 5e, but at the same time, I was hoping I could just be like "Hey, can I use this version of fighter?" or whatever in regular 5e games, and it looks like it would be a longer conversation with maybe a bit of adjustment than a flat approval or denial.

Eastmabl
Jan 29, 2019

Lumbermouth posted:

You might want to check out Freebooters On The Frontier. It’s a West Marches murderhobo Dungeon World revamp designed by the guy who made The Perilous Wilds, one of the single best supplements for the original game.

Worth noting that The Perilous Wilds is among the better supplements that you could use with any FRPG.

PoontifexMacksimus
Feb 14, 2012


Hey a Halo RPG, cool. Not sure about those Covenant designs though...

sasha_d3ath
Jun 3, 2016

Ban-thing the man-things.
RINGWORM

Bottom Liner
Feb 15, 2006


a specific vein of lasagna

Eastmabl posted:

Worth noting that The Perilous Wilds is among the better supplements that you could use with any FRPG.

This + Maze Rats is my go to for most anything fantasy now. Looking forward to Stonetop too to see how the town building/defending element is done.

dwarf74
Sep 2, 2012



Buglord
So what's everyone's thoughts on the Mike Selinker stuff going on now? It kinda got obscured by the interesting edition discussion we've been having.

It's gotten nowhere near as much attention as some other call-outs recently - and it's frankly not as sickening or shocking as, say, the Broken Token poo poo - but it's still disappointing.

https://twitter.com/ermahgerdgerby/status/1458877258144178178?t=_VUMXdX6kSeRRj6EjOtoxw&s=19

admanb
Jun 18, 2014

dwarf74 posted:

So what's everyone's thoughts on the Mike Selinker stuff going on now? It kinda got obscured by the interesting edition discussion we've been having.

It's gotten nowhere near as much attention as some other call-outs recently - and it's frankly not as sickening or shocking as, say, the Broken Token poo poo - but it's still disappointing.

I think it's just kind of... not that interesting. It sounds like a toxic work environment and Selinker definitely shouldn't be in charge of people, but I feel like everyone over the age of 25 has a similar or worse story about a job that we just ranted about to our friends rather than writing 5000 words of callout about?

Selinker replied and he’s taking a leave of absence + stepping away from leadership roles at Lone Shark (plus the usual boilerplate about therapy and doing better) so that’s good.

admanb fucked around with this message at 20:55 on Nov 14, 2021

dwarf74
Sep 2, 2012



Buglord

admanb posted:

I think it's just kind of... not that interesting. It sounds like a toxic work environment and Selinker definitely shouldn't be in charge of people, but I feel like everyone over the age of 25 has a similar or worse story about a job that we just ranted about to our friends rather than writing 5000 words of callout about?

Selinker replied and he’s taking a leave of absence + stepping away from leadership roles at Lone Shark (plus the usual boilerplate about therapy and doing better) so that’s good.
That's... Kind of my take on it too? I just don't want to dismiss it as minor since I'm a straight white dude in his forties.

Puppy Time
Mar 1, 2005


admanb posted:

I think it's just kind of... not that interesting. It sounds like a toxic work environment and Selinker definitely shouldn't be in charge of people, but I feel like everyone over the age of 25 has a similar or worse story about a job that we just ranted about to our friends rather than writing 5000 words of callout about?

Selinker replied and he’s taking a leave of absence + stepping away from leadership roles at Lone Shark (plus the usual boilerplate about therapy and doing better) so that’s good.

Sounds like we need more 5000 word callouts to me.

Andrast
Apr 21, 2010


Honestly, one of the biggest draws of pathfinder to me is that all the rules are available for free on the internet. It's just so nice to do a quick google/nethys search instead of looking at a bunch of pdfs/actual books.

Bottom Liner
Feb 15, 2006


a specific vein of lasagna

Puppy Time posted:

Sounds like we need more 5000 word callouts to me.

dwarf74 posted:

That's... Kind of my take on it too? I just don't want to dismiss it as minor since I'm a straight white dude in his forties.


Yeah, it's basically we have normalized this kind of behavior to the point that this seems mild compared to the over the top poo poo that's come to light in recently years.

EDIT: Not to say it shouldn't be aired publicly or stopped.

Bottom Liner fucked around with this message at 00:34 on Nov 15, 2021

Countblanc
Apr 20, 2005

Help a hero out!
e: this probably sounds ruder than intended. the callout is good and even if the injustice is less horrible than many that appear in this thread I hope that it leads to change

Countblanc fucked around with this message at 00:37 on Nov 15, 2021

Splicer
Oct 16, 2006

from hell's heart I cast at thee
🧙🐀🧹🌙🪄🐸

Gao posted:

Yeah, looking at how they're talking about it on their forums, it looks like their intent was to make a new system that still functioned with official WotC adventures as they were written and to let people who still wanted to make a proper 5e character still function with the group. And it'll probably work? But you will have to decide which version of the basic underlying mechanics you want, as those changed a little, too. Like flanking is no longer optional, but instead of giving advantage, it gives an "expertise die," which means you get an extra 1d4 on the attack roll. But if anything gives you more expertise dice, you increase that to 1d6, then 1d8, where it normally caps. And now crits are double damage, stat mod and all, but you can cancel a crit by sacrificing a shield or taking a level of fatigue. These new rules give you options to increase your crit range (berserkers and rogues now get an increase automatically as they level), so presumably that's balanced by monsters also being able to do that or something like that (I only have the player book). And now everyone has access to what's basically reckless attack, but the target can chose to fall back and not give advantage, but also get disadvantage on their own attacks until the end of their next turn. It really is a 5.5 more than an add on. It's one I like overall from what I've read, and it deals with why I got bored of 5e, but at the same time, I was hoping I could just be like "Hey, can I use this version of fighter?" or whatever in regular 5e games, and it looks like it would be a longer conversation with maybe a bit of adjustment than a flat approval or denial.
Does it have constitution and strength as separate stats?

Gao
Aug 14, 2005
"Something." - A famous guy

Splicer posted:

Does it have constitution and strength as separate stats?

Yes. It's not changed enough that you would even realize anything else about the core rules changed beyond the expertise dice if you just looked at one of the classes or at someone's character sheet or something. This isn't a game interested in killing sacred cows. It just wants to do 5e better, basically.

admanb
Jun 18, 2014

Puppy Time posted:

Sounds like we need more 5000 word callouts to me.

Yeah I guess the unwritten second half of my post is that the callout post is good because the nature of employee/employer relationships in America means that the power of public opinion is pretty much the only power an employee (or ex-employee) has.

But it's largely already accomplished that objective.

Kai Tave
Jul 2, 2012
Fallen Rib
Yeah, I've been sort of cynical about how so much "industry news" is just "guy turns out to be an abusive rear end in a top hat, maybe a sex pest too" but I don't want to make it sound like that stuff shouldn't be posted here, at the same time there isn't always a lot that can be said about beyond that they suck poo poo. It is good that more people are coming forward with stuff like this these days, because even as more abuses like this are brought to light there's still very much that sense of "if you speak out you can get blackballed" going around. It's that thing about the smaller the pond is the bigger the stakes, and RPGs are still a comparatively small pond unless your name is D&D. Twitter callouts from a distance can seem like a lot of weird drama but I'll take it over the days where people get to just endlessly fly under the radar until they die and then it turns out that oh yeah, this guy was actually a huge shitter for the last 30 years but I guess nobody spoke up about it, whoops.

TheDiceMustRoll
Jul 23, 2018
Well, here's some industry news.

In response to being blocked by two sub-1000 follower accounts, Razorfist, a 36 year old man, is calling for the Battletech community to start-a-gatekeepin'. For those who don't want to give him views, he basically is very, very mad that two accounts blocked him without talking to him first and somewhat blames the Warhammer 40k refugee influx(there is little to no evidence GW saw a massive drop in sales or that CGL saw a massive spike in sales) for this.


The classic "I had these interests and nobody else did and now that I'm older they want to take those things I like away from me :(":

https://twitter.com/LadsFire/status/1459936375642357761


Seething about a woman who let you put your pronouns to they/them in a game that came out four years ago:

https://twitter.com/EClownguard/status/1459426321755377665

Whatever the gently caress this is:

https://twitter.com/bigjim71/status/1460005908440760323


Hopefully this ends up being a storm in a teacup, but it could become a whole-rear end thing. It certainly won't work, you literally cannot prevent these people from buying the products and CGL isn't going to take your side, they want loving money lol

Arivia
Mar 17, 2011
why the gently caress did you make me watch a youtube video by a trump chud doing his worst heavy metal howard stern impression to understand the inciting event

TheDiceMustRoll
Jul 23, 2018

Arivia posted:

why the gently caress did you make me watch a youtube video by a trump chud doing his worst heavy metal howard stern impression to understand the inciting event

I didn't. :confuoot:

TheDiceMustRoll posted:

Well, here's some industry news.

In response to being blocked by two sub-1000 follower accounts, Razorfist, a 36 year old man, is calling for the Battletech community to start-a-gatekeepin'. For those who don't want to give him views, he basically is very, very mad that two accounts blocked him without talking to him first and somewhat blames the Warhammer 40k refugee influx(there is little to no evidence GW saw a massive drop in sales or that CGL saw a massive spike in sales) for this.

Arivia
Mar 17, 2011

were the two accounts official accounts/what were they involved in

you missed a lot of important info in terms of how big an issue it actually is, hence having to watch the video

the answer is that they are unofficial accounts, one of which calls itself the "Battletech Community" (with a queer flag icon) and the other one is a Battletech art account, so this guy is getting mad at other members of the larger Battletech community blocking him on social media as opposed to CGL staff or official accounts. this matters for comparing it to what happened to ArchWarhammer, for example. Not that I think this chud or any other chud should go unblocked, but it goes a long way to understanding the issue when you know what the accounts are, other than "small", because "small" can still mean an official or important account in small games/fan communities.

Dawgstar
Jul 15, 2017

The funny thing is the GW 'refugees' were supposedly flocking to BattleTech because they followed Arch out of 40K because of SJW-etc. Also there is little wisdom in trying to carve out your small and shrinking piece of the hobby (BattleTech is already kinda bad at bringing new people in) by trying to exclude harder, but far be it from me to argue with a nerd in Cool Hand Luke sunglasses and a leather jacket.

TheDiceMustRoll
Jul 23, 2018

Arivia posted:

were the two accounts official accounts/what were they involved in

you missed a lot of important info in terms of how big an issue it actually is, hence having to watch the video

the answer is that they are unofficial accounts, one of which calls itself the "Battletech Community" (with a queer flag icon) and the other one is a Battletech art account, so this guy is getting mad at other members of the larger Battletech community blocking him on social media as opposed to CGL staff or official accounts. this matters for comparing it to what happened to ArchWarhammer, for example. Not that I think this chud or any other chud should go unblocked, but it goes a long way to understanding the issue when you know what the accounts are, other than "small", because "small" can still mean an official or important account in small games/fan communities.

I don't see why you couldn't have opened with that and not your original post.


Dawgstar posted:

The funny thing is the GW 'refugees' were supposedly flocking to BattleTech because they followed Arch out of 40K because of SJW-etc. Also there is little wisdom in trying to carve out your small and shrinking piece of the hobby (BattleTech is already kinda bad at bringing new people in) by trying to exclude harder, but far be it from me to argue with a nerd in Cool Hand Luke sunglasses and a leather jacket.

I know of four people who were interested, went to stores, found out that it was sold out, is often sold out for months and months at a time because unlike GW, CGL needs to make all their stuff in China and can't keep up with demand, especially now.

Arivia
Mar 17, 2011

TheDiceMustRoll posted:

I don't see why you couldn't have opened with that and not your original post.

because if you're gonna make a post like that in this thread, creating a useful and informative summary so people don't have to engage with the chud poo poo is a minimum requirement. i raised a valid criticism of your post.

TheDiceMustRoll
Jul 23, 2018

Arivia posted:

because if you're gonna make a post like that in this thread, creating a useful and informative summary so people don't have to engage with the chud poo poo is a minimum requirement. i raised a valid criticism of your post.

You swore at me and accused me of forcing you to watch a video.

Arivia
Mar 17, 2011

TheDiceMustRoll posted:

You swore at me and accused me of forcing you to watch a video.

you do realize what forum this still is, right. "i swore at you" grow up

Nuns with Guns
Jul 23, 2010

It's fine.
Don't worry about it.
It was kind of lacking context but I'm really not interested enough in what the context is to click a link for more and pollute my social media algorithm settings with garbage.


What made Arch think Battletech was a better place to retreat to after being told to gently caress off by Games Workshop anyway?

TheDiceMustRoll
Jul 23, 2018

Nuns with Guns posted:

It was kind of lacking context but I'm really not interested enough in what the context is to click a link for more and pollute my social media algorithm settings with garbage.


What made Arch think Battletech was a better place to retreat to after being told to gently caress off by Games Workshop anyway?

This is a bit after Arch was called out in all but name last year.

It's old and the community is a fair bit smaller and less popular. It's not like he hasn't stopped making Warhammer content and recently, according to Majorkill, he went under a fairly extensive effort to de-list/delete a shitload of his older videos of him making rape jokes and using racial and homophobic slurs.

For GW, there was a brief period where people get extremely angry at Games Workshop this summer, because they clamped down fan projects (they were launching their own animation projects) and one of the most popular, TTS(Emperor Text to Speech Device) announced he was gonna do something different, mostly because he had a family and working with someone's IP is a very dodgy proposition. A lot of people announced they were "done and finished" with Games Workshop but that doesn't seem to have meant much in terms of product being sold since my FLGS tells me that Warhammer is still selling quite well in the way it always has.

Personally my hope is that people go "oh, I can like more than one thing at a time." because a lot of the posts from the Warhammer people being like "Wow, I didn't even know DUNE existed!" and other things makes me sad. There's such a rich and deep history of great sci-fi stories out there but the older I get the more it seems people just glom onto something they like when they're 12, ignore everything else and just kind of ride that train forever.

theironjef
Aug 11, 2009

The archmage of unexpected stinks.

Kai Tave posted:

Yeah, I've been sort of cynical about how so much "industry news" is just "guy turns out to be an abusive rear end in a top hat, maybe a sex pest too" but I don't want to make it sound like that stuff shouldn't be posted here, at the same time there isn't always a lot that can be said about beyond that they suck poo poo. It is good that more people are coming forward with stuff like this these days, because even as more abuses like this are brought to light there's still very much that sense of "if you speak out you can get blackballed" going around. It's that thing about the smaller the pond is the bigger the stakes, and RPGs are still a comparatively small pond unless your name is D&D. Twitter callouts from a distance can seem like a lot of weird drama but I'll take it over the days where people get to just endlessly fly under the radar until they die and then it turns out that oh yeah, this guy was actually a huge shitter for the last 30 years but I guess nobody spoke up about it, whoops.

My experience with the Battletech community is super super limited, but I know it's smaller, and the few times I have come across it it's almost always a thread that reads like "Whoa guys, did you know that some Battletech fiction author is a total fascist type?"

"So what, I'm smart enough to separate art from artist."

"Pointing out a facism? Methinks thou doth't implicate thineself as the fascist one!"

TheDiceMustRoll
Jul 23, 2018

theironjef posted:

My experience with the Battletech community is super super limited, but I know it's smaller, and the few times I have come across it it's almost always a thread that reads like "Whoa guys, did you know that some Battletech fiction author is a total fascist type?"

"So what, I'm smart enough to separate art from artist."

"Pointing out a facism? Methinks thou doth't implicate thineself as the fascist one!"

That was probably in reference to Blaine Pardoe, who is a trumper. A small but vocal amount of people have been having issues with him for years,(I am basing this off tweets from a few years back making GBS threads on him I found by namesearching him) but the community is seemingly uninterested in the drama(nobody seems interested in defending pardoe or attacking outside of a pretty small community), and it led to one of them getting a PPO against them for telling a different Battletech author she wanted to shoot him over a book he was writing. Mr Pardoe was overjoyed that someone cared enough about his "What if SJWs did a coup on the government" novel to threaten him over it and was able to advertise it as the book that antifa doesn't want you to read or something to that effect.

TheDiceMustRoll fucked around with this message at 06:37 on Nov 15, 2021

Adbot
ADBOT LOVES YOU

Puppy Time
Mar 1, 2005


I will always be confused by people whose reactions to a twitter block is anything other than "Oh. Huh," and maybe, "I wonder who I'm following that got me on a blocklist/blockchain and why?" followed by completely forgetting about it and doing whatever they had planned that day.

Even when I was actually on Twitter all day, it didn't matter to me enough to remember after a half hour, much less to make a youtube video about. And I have brain problems!

  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
  • Post
  • Reply