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Souls games are the most tedious, joyless, stockholm-syndrome pieces of garbage ever to worm their way into some kind of perverse popularity.
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Nov 14, 2021 09:17
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AcidCat posted:Souls games are the most tedious, joyless, stockholm-syndrome pieces of garbage ever to worm their way into some kind of perverse popularity. Counterpoint: I've played Elden Ring and it owns
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Nov 14, 2021 09:20
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fridge corn posted:Counterpoint: I've played Elden Ring and it owns Realtalk yeah I'm going to give it a chance and if I hate it it's just another thing I can beat myself up about because I should have known better.
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Nov 14, 2021 09:23
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AcidCat posted:Souls games are the most tedious, joyless, stockholm-syndrome pieces of garbage ever to worm their way into some kind of perverse popularity. Generally those games are actually pretty easy. in fact the perceived difficulty is just internal on the players part the game itself isn't harder than most 3rd person action games going in you, just gotta learn the combat, understand that the world's basically always dangerous, don't try to brute force unless you know what you're doing.
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Nov 14, 2021 10:32
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AcidCat posted:Realtalk yeah I'm going to give it a chance and if I hate it it's just another thing I can beat myself up about because I should have known better. lol you posted this literally 6 minutes after describing the entire lineage as "the most tedious, joyless, stockholm-syndrome pieces of garbage" just lol
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Nov 14, 2021 10:45
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Every time that I play a Ubisoft game I grow an enormous brain tumor and fall into a coma until the doctors can remove it but if they release another game I'll probably give it a try, what am I going to do stop buying Ubisoft games?
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Nov 14, 2021 10:54
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Souls games aren’t so much difficult in the I Wanna Be The Guy sense as they 1: ask you to pay attention, which isn’t always fun for the kind of people who play games to just zone out after work. 2: I don’t know how exactly to say this but it’s like they ask you to play different? Like you’re supposed to play very reactive instead of proactive like every game for the last 20 years has been teaching us and that throws a lot of people off? Like in a souls game you’re not supposed to always activate your biggest combo even if you can and games have been training us to do the opposite? As I said I don’t know the right words. I love em though.
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Nov 14, 2021 11:01
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The #1 problem with the older Souls games especially is that there's a bunch of dumb crusty RPG jank gumming everything up. The games instantly become appropriately challenging and fun if you learn how to build your character correctly, which the games do a pretty poo poo job of. The #2 problem is that the reputation the games have makes people think they're I Wanna Be The Guy so they spend the whole game shield up, creeping through areas one step at a time, constantly paranoid about From throwing anti-gravity apples at them. Except playing that way is exhausting and ineffective to boot. Not to say every twist of difficulty is 100% clearly communicated and fair, but From actually telegraphs poo poo pretty heavily. Even the most gotcha-y of gotchas, the first mimic, is actually telegraphed. I always smh when people claim the games are trial and error. You can forcibly play them that way I guess, but you really don't have to? AcidCat posted:Souls fans are the most tedious, joyless, stockholm-syndrome pieces of garbage ever to worm their way into some kind of perverse popularity. There, fixed it. Souls games are good, the fandom surrounding them is atrocious. The truth is that DS1 is an old, janky RPG full of dumb bullshit and instead of accepting that weirdos will instead shout about how it's all Miyazaki-san's galactic brained 5000 IQ genius design and you'd have to be a baka gaijin to not see that!!!! galagazombie posted:Souls games aren’t so much difficult in the I Wanna Be The Guy sense as they 1: ask you to pay attention, which isn’t always fun for the kind of people who play games to just zone out after work. 2: I don’t know how exactly to say this but it’s like they ask you to play different? Like you’re supposed to play very reactive instead of proactive like every game for the last 20 years has been teaching us and that throws a lot of people off? Like in a souls game you’re not supposed to always activate your biggest combo even if you can and games have been training us to do the opposite? As I said I don’t know the right words. I love em though. The term I've concocted for how to play Souls games is "guarded confidence". If you just blunder into situations and mash your attack buttons you will die. If you try to play hyper-defensively you will hate the game and also still die a lot anyway. You gotta dial in being confident enough to say "I need to run over there and kill that skeleton right now" but guarded enough to realize there's probably another skeleton just around that blind corner waiting to ambush you once you do, so don't get greedy or complacent. For as many dummies who just DSP their way through things, I've seen just many if not more people freeze up and just have no answer at all to the game going "okay but what if there were actually TWO skeletons??" so they clamp down the shield button and hem and haw about finding an opening while being whittled down and then die. Also like a lot of RPGs an easy answer to the game playing dirty is to play dirty right back. See a fair few people get it into their head that Dark Souls is about totally fair 1v1 honorable duels and lol no. Cheese poo poo with arrows or magic. Pull enemies into unfavorable positions and chokepoints and poo poo. Play tactical. John Murdoch fucked around with this message at 15:04 on Nov 14, 2021 |
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Nov 14, 2021 15:00
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Vic posted:Generally those games are actually pretty easy. They aren't easy, you die in two or three hits a from a lot of enemies and bosses and they're very aggressive and fast. People who are usually like "These games aren't hard" have played like five of them and forget how many times they got hosed up in their first run through Demon's Souls.
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Nov 14, 2021 15:16
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Every texture in the Souls games is some shade of brown because the games are poo. It's like being back in Quake except without the awesome level design, soundtrack, and fast paced action. The Souls series is one of the worst things to happen to gaming in decades, right up there with real-time with pause combat.
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Nov 14, 2021 15:50
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real time with pause sounds like a good idea
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Nov 14, 2021 15:53
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Real time with pause is acceptable only if theres a record scratch sound and a "you might be wondering how I got myself into this situation.." speech every time you use it. And it's the same speech every time
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Nov 14, 2021 15:59
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I've always had a dream of a game where it's like a third person action story game like Last of Us or something, except the dialogue and narrator treat it like an 80s family sitcom, with freeze frames, pauses so the protagonist can explain background and poo poo like that. But contrasted with the usual extreme violence of video games. Make them like a sciFi space opera smuggler or something, which starts with them running from folks trying to kill them. Escape sequence and as they vault over some ledge the freeze and "yeah that's me. You're probably wondering how I got here..." And then smash cut to them violently beating some poor bastard for an ounce of change for their old mob boss. Or something. I'm losing my train of thought. Video game violence sincerely treated like 80s sitcom fell goodness is the point.
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Nov 14, 2021 16:03
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Caesar Saladin posted:They aren't easy, you die in two or three hits a from a lot of enemies and bosses and they're very aggressive and fast. People who are usually like "These games aren't hard" have played like five of them and forget how many times they got hosed up in their first run through Demon's Souls. They aren't hard in the sense that if you can handle literally any Platinum game or God of War or w/e you have a pretty good chance of being able to figure out Dark Souls. They're not super easy baby games, but they're also not at the insanely over-exaggerated, mythical level of difficulty they have a reputation for either.
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Nov 14, 2021 16:28
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John Murdoch posted:They aren't hard in the sense that if you can handle literally any Platinum game or God of War or w/e you have a pretty good chance of being able to figure out Dark Souls. They're not super easy baby games, but they're also not at the insanely over-exaggerated, mythical level of difficulty they have a reputation for either. I don't really hear anyone say they're the hardest games ever or anything. They are challenging but more than that, they are punishing, where you can lose a lot of progress if you die and a lot of resources if you die again on the way. They are challenging games, much more challenging than most, saying otherwise is silly.
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Nov 14, 2021 16:31
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William Henry Hairytaint posted:Every texture in the Souls games is some shade of brown because the games are poo. It's like being back in Quake except without the awesome level design, soundtrack, and fast paced action. The Souls series is one of the worst things to happen to gaming in decades, right up there with real-time with pause combat. Dark Souls was pretty much just following the AAA aesthetic of the time mind, literally everything being brown smudges is something we're only barely starting to emerge from
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Nov 14, 2021 16:43
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John Murdoch posted:Even the most gotcha-y of gotchas, the first mimic, is actually telegraphed. I always smh when people claim the games are trial and error. You can forcibly play them that way I guess, but you really don't have to? I would point to the Capra Demon fight is a counter example. That one didn’t feel especially fair going in blind.
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Nov 14, 2021 16:55
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AcidCat posted:Souls games are the most tedious, joyless, stockholm-syndrome pieces of garbage ever to worm their way into some kind of perverse popularity. I played 1, beat those boss gargoyle(s) on that rooftop and rang a bell and went "drat this isn't fun at all". Props to those that get good at it tho cause it def wasn't my thing.
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Nov 14, 2021 17:08
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pro starcraft loser posted:Unpopular opinion: the new Xcom game is really, really weak. Wait what new xcom I know you're not talking about chimera squad Also enemies spotting you was a big fuckin hassle when you triggered a second pod of em so who knows
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Nov 14, 2021 17:59
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The coolest "pause" feature is where the world lives around you still, like saving your game in Alien: Isolation or when you're hacking something in system shock 2
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Nov 14, 2021 18:05
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Bionic Commando: Rearmed (the side scrollers remake, not the bad 3D one) is a hella legit remake and I wish it got more credit Besides being a remake of one of the nest NES games ever made, it also upgrades the already-rad music and also adds some creative boss fights, it's awesome
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Nov 14, 2021 18:07
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John Murdoch posted:They aren't hard in the sense that if you can handle literally any Platinum game or God of War or w/e you have a pretty good chance of being able to figure out Dark Souls. They're not super easy baby games, but they're also not at the insanely over-exaggerated, mythical level of difficulty they have a reputation for either. No they're pretty loving hard and the most annoying poo poo is everyone going "they're very easy actually" or "well you see actually they're not hard, because you can keep practicing and" no poo poo that's every game. No one's saying they're literally impossible, just that they're hard. The only games I can think that were more painful than Dark Souls are the I wanna be the __ games, even beating Super Hexagon was easier. I legit don't know what is the mythical actually hard games are to people who think Dark Souls is easy. Elentor fucked around with this message at 18:12 on Nov 14, 2021 |
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Nov 14, 2021 18:09
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Elentor posted:No they're pretty loving hard and the most annoying poo poo is everyone going "they're very easy actually" or "well you see actually they're not hard, because you can keep practicing and" no poo poo that's every game. No one's saying they're literally impossible, just that they're hard. Every single boss has some devastating move with a tell you can only figure out through trial and error and dying so I don't really know what he's talking about. You either study up before you play or you get rocked multiple times by the bosses and learn their patterns, there is no "learning how to play" that makes you good enough to beat bosses blind in Dark Souls.
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Nov 14, 2021 18:22
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I got some real good hackers and the faction order that makes enemies vulnerable to hacking, the result is loving hilarious
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Nov 14, 2021 18:26
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It's called Dark SOuls because it's the most apt description of the miserable people who enjoy those things.
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Nov 14, 2021 18:42
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I really liked Dark Souls but every other game of Froms output in the oeuvre from Kings Field to Bloodborne has some real dogshit stuff to it and even Dark Souls isn't immune. Im glad yall enjoy em.
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Nov 14, 2021 18:55
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chglcu posted:I would point to the Capra Demon fight is a counter example. That one didn’t feel especially fair going in blind. The first time you fight him it isn't, but the entire road down to his arena is a cramped alleyway with lots of nimble enemies that can quickly overwhelm you, which teaches you to control the terms on which you engage the enemy and to always have an escape route available at all times. Then Capra administers a test on how well you understood this lesson. Elentor posted:The only games I can think that were more painful than Dark Souls are the I wanna be the __ games, even beating Super Hexagon was easier. I legit don't know what is the mythical actually hard games are to people who think Dark Souls is easy. beatmania IIDX  (for the record though I don't think fromgames are easy)
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Nov 14, 2021 19:26
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Floodixor posted:Wait what new xcom They're talking about firaxcom in general I think Caesar Saladin posted:I don't really hear anyone say they're the hardest games ever or anything. They are challenging but more than that, they are punishing, where you can lose a lot of progress if you die and a lot of resources if you die again on the way. They are challenging games, much more challenging than most, saying otherwise is silly. Huh? Dark souls let's you recover the poo poo you picked up if you die and have to go back to a checkpoint. That's way less punishing than 90% of games where you just start at the checkpoint as you were or with some (usually weak) default loadout. nvidiagouge posted:Every single boss has some devastating move with a tell you can only figure out through trial and error and dying so I don't really know what he's talking about. You either study up before you play or you get rocked multiple times by the bosses and learn their patterns, there is no "learning how to play" that makes you good enough to beat bosses blind in Dark Souls. You're not describing difficulty. Difficulty is something you can overcome with good play. What you're describing are obnoxious gotchas and lousy game design.
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Nov 14, 2021 19:27
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I don't think there's any fanbase as obnoxious and hellbent as correcting others and explaining their special definition of what "difficulty" is as the dark souls fanbase, good lord. I don't think I've ever seen people umm actually, difficulty is... for any other franchise even.
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Nov 14, 2021 19:34
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There's nothing really wrong with Skyrim getting constant ports to newer systems and people have way overblown it to try and make an issue where there isn't one. If anything more devs should be more willing to port their titles over to newer systems.
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Nov 14, 2021 19:36
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Dark Souls is not an easy series but I think many people make things harder for themselves than they need to be. The impression I got from video reviews and forums posts is that there are a lot of tryhards who don't use ranged abilities or shields in these games and try to melee and dodge through everything. If you do that then of course the game's hard and frankly a little tedious in places. But if you're willing to use all the tools the game gives you, it becomes a lot more manageable, though of course not trivial. However, if you do want to trivialize a tough battle or area, you can always summon another player and often even a NPC. That's the not-so-hidden easy mode of Dark Souls. The enemy AI just isn't equipped to deal with that.
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Nov 14, 2021 19:42
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Vandar posted:There's nothing really wrong with Skyrim getting constant ports to newer systems and people have way overblown it to try and make an issue where there isn't one. It's probably more about there being no sequel released yet and it's been 10 years and 2 console generations.
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Nov 14, 2021 19:47
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i was having trouble with part of dark souls iii, i looked up a walkthrough, here's what it said: "there are two knights on the staircase. they are fast, so be careful. then a ranger and two more knights. then a fire caster. he's powerful, so be careful. then a general with six zombies, two more casters, and two more knights. Defeat the enemies and turn left."
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Nov 14, 2021 19:53
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it's become an evergreen joke between me and mine. in any game, having trouble one tells the other "I know this part. you have to defeat the enemies."
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Nov 14, 2021 19:54
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X JAKK posted:How many more Wolfensteins until they let us fight disembodied Hitler-head robot One of Laz Rojas' Astrostein mapsets ends that way.
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Nov 14, 2021 19:59
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Mescal posted:it's become an evergreen joke between me and mine. in any game, having trouble one tells the other "I know this part. you have to defeat the enemies." One of my teammates, well that person I referenced earlier in the dumb LoL story, is an ex-CS pro and he's had a lot more rank 1s in games than I do and that's essentially his approach to answering game-related questions and he's entirely earnest. "You just walk to the other player and kill them" then he proceeds to demonstrate that in whichever game you're talking about sort of effortlessly, like that's his guide, really. How do you get Apex Predator in Apex Legends, you just walk to the other players and kill them. "But we don't have godlike reflexes like you" and then he replies "it's not about reflexes, it's just about walking to the enemies and killing them".
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Nov 14, 2021 20:00
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chglcu posted:I would point to the Capra Demon fight is a counter example. That one didn’t feel especially fair going in blind. That's less of a trap and more of a "oops we didn't finish designing this area, have a rushed boss fight against 2 dogs and some demon guy". Even if you know it's coming it's easy to get unlucky with the dogs and get boxed in and murdered instantly. I can't imagine the sheer awfulness of approaching Bed of Chaos totally blind. Elentor posted:I don't think there's any fanbase as obnoxious and hellbent as correcting others and explaining their special definition of what "difficulty" is as the dark souls fanbase, good lord. I don't think I've ever seen people umm actually, difficulty is... for any other franchise even. It's funny that you've lumped me in with them because I'm talking about exactly the same thing just from a different angle. John Murdoch fucked around with this message at 20:35 on Nov 14, 2021 |
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Nov 14, 2021 20:25
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Sapozhnik posted:The first time you fight him it isn't, but the entire road down to his arena is a cramped alleyway with lots of nimble enemies that can quickly overwhelm you, which teaches you to control the terms on which you engage the enemy and to always have an escape route available at all times. Then Capra administers a test on how well you understood this lesson. That's actually a really good point. I think if you could just retry boss fights immediately no-one would think souls games are hard, it's the five minute run from the bonfire that raises the stakes
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Nov 14, 2021 21:13
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Mescal posted:i was having trouble with part of dark souls iii, i looked up a walkthrough, here's what it said: "there are two knights on the staircase. they are fast, so be careful. then a ranger and two more knights. then a fire caster. he's powerful, so be careful. then a general with six zombies, two more casters, and two more knights. Defeat the enemies and turn left." Every walkthrough/FAQ from the '90s was basically this, some completely misinformed speculation about game mechanics, and ASCII art.
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Nov 14, 2021 21:35
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sebmojo posted:I think if you could just retry boss fights immediately no-one would think souls games are hard, it's the five minute run from the bonfire that raises the stakes You can pretty much retry Ornstein and Smough immediately, the corpse run is very quick and it did not make me take any less time in it which was a shitload of time to kill one boss. In fact I thought that fight was so hard that after beating it I stopped DS1, I thought the game could either go downhill or get harder and in both scenarios I wasn't really looking forward to any of it.
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Nov 14, 2021 21:48
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