|
Wasn't the Steal gambit thing a deliberate design decision to attempt to prevent stealing from just being totally automatic like that?
|
#
?
Nov 18, 2021 12:43
|
|
|
|
| # ? Jun 3, 2024 15:09 |
|
|
Snow Cone Capone posted:Wasn't the Steal gambit thing a deliberate design decision to attempt to prevent stealing from just being totally automatic like that? Deliberate or not, all it does is just make me never use Steal until I got a smart steal mod installed.
|
|
#
?
Nov 18, 2021 12:46
|
|
|
It's using gameplay to teach you that Stealing is Wrong
|
|
#
?
Nov 18, 2021 15:03
|
|
|
Mega64 posted:It's using gameplay to teach you that Stealing is Wrong My steal from Walmart gambit always works
|
|
#
?
Nov 18, 2021 15:07
|
|
|
Gaius Marius posted:14 is the worst final fantasy Only when you have to play with other people.
|
|
#
?
Nov 18, 2021 15:13
|
|
|
Mega64 posted:It's using gameplay to teach you that Stealing is Wrong In FF12 it is actually Badong because the primary (only?) purpose of stealing is to get money and there’s a button that just gives you infinite gil in TZA
|
|
#
?
Nov 18, 2021 15:28
|
|
|
Barudak posted:FF12 is not a very good game, but its not the worst Final Fantasy, which we all agree is Final Fantasy Tactics, which itself, is better than Baldur's Gate. 
|
|
#
?
Nov 18, 2021 15:48
|
|
|
The one thing that lingered in my mind after I played 12 was: Why wasn't Ash or Basch the main character? Should probably play through Zodiac Age as everyone seems to praise it.
|
|
#
?
Nov 18, 2021 15:57
|
|
|
Ashe is the main character.
|
|
#
?
Nov 18, 2021 16:06
|
|
|
Yeah, Ashe is the protagonist. From the moment she joins the party she has the spotlight for the rest of the game. Vaan's the PoV character for the player, but he isn't the protagonist. He plays an important supporting role as a foil for Ashe, but he's not the main character by a long shot.
|
|
#
?
Nov 18, 2021 16:27
|
|
|
jokes posted:In FF12 it is actually Badong because the primary (only?) purpose of stealing is to get money and there’s a button that just gives you infinite gil in TZA I thought selling those items in a specific way unlocked new equipment? Because it’s a Matsuno game, of course.
|
|
#
?
Nov 18, 2021 16:36
|
|
|
Arist posted:Ashe is the main character. Harrow posted:Yeah, Ashe is the protagonist. From the moment she joins the party she has the spotlight for the rest of the game. Vaan's the PoV character for the player, but he isn't the protagonist. He plays an important supporting role as a foil for Ashe, but he's not the main character by a long shot. Should have played as her from the start 
|
|
#
?
Nov 18, 2021 16:37
|
|
|
But then you wouldn't get the commoner-level introduction to the world and its conflicts followed by being swept into adventure by a dashing sky pirate and his cool rabbit lady friend I dunno, I think I just like the way we're introduced to Ashe in FFXII and that wouldn't have happened if you played as her from the start. It's kinda fun just running into this apparently random resistance fighter lady who's super abrasive and then you find out she's the princess and she's pissed off she's stuck with your stupid group of idiots (and that one traitor) because you're the only ones who'll help her. I think it's like... I don't really know if I have much attachment to Vaan specifically as a character, but I do like the angle of approach into the main story he provides, if that makes any sense? Starting out controlling Basch or Ashe wouldn't have allowed for the really strong intro to play out how it does.
|
|
#
?
Nov 18, 2021 16:45
|
|
|
Ashe isn't the player avatar for a lot of reasons- she'd have no interest in anything resembling side quests or the hunting, and the plot of XII does not work as it exists if it was Ashe's head we were in- Vaan provides us a comparative viewpoint, being her foil as a character, without showing us what she's seeing or thinking at any given time and this preserving the core tension of the plot. The joke is that Vaan is Ishmael, and in that comparison Ashe very much is Ahab- the most compelling character in the story, but a large part of Moby Dick is learning just how far that bastard would go to finally overcome the whale, so you can't write Moby Dick from his point of view and get the same story. Ashe's role in XII is mostly the same, if not even more important to stay out of her head so we can learn over time how much the Occuria are loving with her. Basch, from what I recall, WAS the main character in early versions but they swapped him out for both plotline and audience appeal reasons to Vaan since he both fit the role the player viewpoint character needed to fit better, and FF is still as ever a series targeted primarily at Japanese teenagers. C'est la vie.
|
|
#
?
Nov 18, 2021 16:46
|
|
|
Mr. Locke posted:Basch, from what I recall, WAS the main character in early versions but they swapped him out for both plotline and audience appeal reasons to Vaan since he both fit the role the player viewpoint character needed to fit better, and FF is still as ever a series targeted primarily at Japanese teenagers. C'est la vie. IIRC it's not quite that simple. The original drafts of the story had a different PoV character who was older and more mature than Vaan and might've been similar to Ashley Riot from Vagrant Story, but ultimately that character was scrapped and some of his role (the PoV character, intro to the story part) was given to Vaan, while the other parts (older, mature, experienced fighter with a dark past) were given to Basch.
|
|
#
?
Nov 18, 2021 16:49
|
|
|
Vaan is the player character because Ashe would never run around the streets yelling I'm Basch fon Ronsenberg! Basch lives!
|
|
#
?
Nov 18, 2021 16:52
|
|
|
It’s amusing that even Balthier is confused as who the main character is.
|
|
#
?
Nov 18, 2021 16:56
|
|
|
Is Final Fantasy VIII good or bad
|
|
#
?
Nov 18, 2021 17:17
|
|
Tater Love 
|
zakharov posted:Is Final Fantasy VIII good or bad Yep.
|
|
#
?
Nov 18, 2021 17:18
|
|
|
zakharov posted:Is Final Fantasy VIII good or bad It depends, how do you feel about orphanages?
|
|
#
?
Nov 18, 2021 17:32
|
|
|
zakharov posted:Is Final Fantasy VIII good or bad Once it undergoes quality compression it's both good and bad simultaneously.
|
|
#
?
Nov 18, 2021 17:35
|
|
|
Balthier is not confused about who the main character is. It’s him. And also Ashe/Basch/Vaan. Truthfully with the exception of Fran and Penelo, they’re all the main character of the story they just aren’t doing things for the same reason. It’s very Baldur’s Gate in that sense, I guess. Ashe wants to kick out the imperials and be a good queen to her people, and is willing to do anything in service of that goal including defy space aliens/gods. She is the actual protagonist because without her poo poo, they’re just raiding caves looking for loot. Vaan wants to go on an adventure, any adventure, and be a sky pirate which is the most open-ended and accessible perspective which is what SE was going for. He’ll do whatever and is young and dumb, everyone else has Reasons For Doing Things. Balthier the sky pirate wants to get rich and powerful and being close to the queen is a good way to do that (also they want to be free to be sky pirates so they hate the empire). Balthier the defector wants to set things right with his family name (and daddy issues), which aligns his goals squarely with Ashe. Basch wants to be a good knight to his liegelord (and along the same vein get revenge), and as a consequence is set at odds with his brother. Since Ashe is his new boss, he is 100% on her team. Basch is FF4’s Cecil, if the king of baron didn’t go crazy. Each of the 4 (except Vaan, kinda) have their own compelling reasons to defeat Vayne and stop the Empire. They’re all working together, but they don’t really have a unified purpose— once Vayne is defeated and the Empire is stopped they all instantly split up. Fran is Balthier’s mystical and cool girlfriend. Penelo is Vaan’s boring girlfriend.
|
|
#
?
Nov 18, 2021 17:36
|
|
|
zakharov posted:Is Final Fantasy VIII good or bad Final Fantasy VIII's biggest issue is that it's right between 2 very good FF games.
|
|
#
?
Nov 18, 2021 17:45
|
|
|
zakharov posted:Is Final Fantasy VIII good or bad a question we have been asking ourselves since 1998
|
|
#
?
Nov 18, 2021 17:45
|
|
|
Cardboard Fox posted:Final Fantasy VIII's biggest issue is that it's right between 2 very good FF games. Same issue as FF7 and FF9
|
|
#
?
Nov 18, 2021 17:49
|
|
|
zakharov posted:Is Final Fantasy VIII good or bad https://twitter.com/rooneymcnibnug/status/1407723367638130691
|
|
#
?
Nov 18, 2021 18:07
|
|
|
Barudak posted:FF12 is not a very good game, but its not the worst Final Fantasy, which we all agree is Final Fantasy Tactics I didn't know revenantkioku had an account here. 
|
|
#
?
Nov 18, 2021 18:07
|
|
|
I just wish Ashe didn’t have those awful pants.
|
|
#
?
Nov 18, 2021 18:12
|
|
|
ManSedan posted:I just wish Ashe didn’t have those awful pants. What pants
|
|
#
?
Nov 18, 2021 18:14
|
|
|
Every monk should have a dolphin based attack Also https://twitter.com/cataerith/statu...ingawful.com%2F
|
|
#
?
Nov 18, 2021 18:47
|
|
|
Electric Phantasm posted:Every monk should have a dolphin based attack I bet things would've gone different in FF7 if Aeris had a gun.
|
|
#
?
Nov 18, 2021 18:49
|
|
|
I’m picturing a TFR goon shout to cloud when he lets her dead body float away into that water “this wouldn’t have happened if she had a gun” Barrett has a gun surgically attached to his arm and you know how many times he dies? Zero. And he becomes an oil baron!
|
|
#
?
Nov 18, 2021 18:51
|
|
|
jokes posted:Basch is FF4’s Cecil, if the king of baron didn’t go crazy. The king of baron stuff is really weird and I'm sure gets fleshed out more in the ds remake but uh.... So the real king of baron gets beaten up(killed?) and Cagnazzo shapeshifts into him while also I guess promising Baigan sweet power if you turn into a weirdo snake arm man? Also the (dead?) King of baron is also...Odin??? But even before this the real king of baron commissions a fleet of airships, but Cid says that they're now being used for war where as before they were used for...? Travel? It's just a weird plot point that even as a kid made me go "huh?".
|
|
#
?
Nov 18, 2021 18:52
|
|
|
Leal posted:I bet things would've gone different in FF7 if Aeris had a gun. This is why the remake is so different, she has been packing the entire time.
|
|
#
?
Nov 18, 2021 18:53
|
|
|
PneumonicBook posted:The king of baron stuff is really weird and I'm sure gets fleshed out more in the ds remake but uh.... The king of baron was a good dude, and Cecil decided to do dark knight poo poo on his behalf as a consequence, knowing the costs (and also he felt out of place and Baron/the King took him in). Then at some point the king of Baron was either killed/replaced or mind controlled (and then killed/replaced). The details probably are not important, because the idea is that The Bad Guys turned his homeland into Also The Bad Guys and he didn’t do anything to stop it, and just kept doing whatever he was told to do. That’s the source of his guilt— he knew what he was doing was wrong and went through with it anyways.
|
|
#
?
Nov 18, 2021 19:09
|
|
|
PneumonicBook posted:The king of baron stuff is really weird and I'm sure gets fleshed out more in the ds remake but uh.... I mean, I can at least buy that there were always monsters to kill even if iirc Zemus exerting his will made them more prevalent, and some of them fly so you’d want a ship fleet to handle the giant birds. And I think the king just reincarnates into a Norse god because he’s cool like that, Hiryu in V turns into a phoenix so I guess it’s just a thing.
|
|
#
?
Nov 18, 2021 19:11
|
|
|
PneumonicBook posted:The king of baron stuff is really weird and I'm sure gets fleshed out more in the ds remake but uh.... correct quote:Also the (dead?) King of baron is also...Odin??? he, like, dies and in death is granted an eidolon form because the real king was a cool guy quote:But even before this the real king of baron commissions a fleet of airships, but Cid says that they're now being used for war where as before they were used for...? Travel? the kingdom of baron was already a militaristic nation (having Cecil train as a dark knight, a dragoon corps, fledgling magic corps) but they weren't actively pillaging other nations until cagnazzo's usurpation
|
|
#
?
Nov 18, 2021 19:12
|
|
|
Hiryu becomes Phoenix and Syldra becomes a summon, too. What the gently caress was Syldra? Are there more of them out there? Is she related to Leviathan?
|
|
#
?
Nov 18, 2021 19:13
|
|
|
does anyone have that site with all the FF4 background stuff that didn't make it into the game the world is extremely fleshed out, it's just that there was nowhere near enough room in the script to include it all like, Mysidia is the home of a great conflict where people abused the power of light and dark in their magicks and all of their strongest stuff was sealed away after a cataclysm stemming from their unchecked power. where is that in the game?
|
|
#
?
Nov 18, 2021 19:16
|
|
|
|
| # ? Jun 3, 2024 15:09 |
|
|
jokes posted:Hiryu becomes Phoenix and Syldra becomes a summon, too. Syldra was... A true friend
|
|
#
?
Nov 18, 2021 19:17
|
|
