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Really you could just remove ground combat entirely. We own this planet now because we are in orbit around it, don’t make us drop rocks on you.
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Nov 19, 2021 21:55
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Roadie posted:I feel like a lot of Stellaris' problems come from the basic design choice of building everything around the custom empire system instead of making real factions to work with. Of course they could never fix that now without just throwing out a lot of the game and starting over. Paradox is working on an unannounced nonhistorical grand strategy game, it could very well be Stellaris 2.
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Nov 19, 2021 22:07
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goatsestretchgoals posted:Really you could just remove ground combat entirely. We own this planet now because we are in orbit around it, don’t make us drop rocks on you. I think Endless Space had a neat take on it where ships had an invasion power, and you could sacrifice combat module space to add more invasion power at the cost of space combat efficiency. You would occupy a planet by staying in orbit for long enough, based on some factor between the planet's defensiveness and the fleet's invasion power (where too little invasion power would fail to do anything, like putting a single corvette in orbit of a capital). Putting something similar in Stellaris would be amazing, and would really cut down on the amount of micro needed in the late game to get armies where you need them. As a temporary fix though, please for the love of god put in a loving army builder so I don't have to click through to build armies on every goddamn planet in my empire if I want to be optimal.
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Nov 19, 2021 22:13
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Splicer posted:Link to this bit? Was it a "so it'll never happen" or "don't hold your breath but..." It was in their discord server and I have no idea how to post a screenshot from the iOS sa mobile app ☹️ Here’s a link to the message: https://discord.com/channels/689816016363978763/910681193824006225/910931374062596106
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Nov 19, 2021 22:21
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Splicer posted:Link to this bit? Was it a "so it'll never happen" or "don't hold your breath but..." IIRC it was something like “what’s something you’d remove from the game if you could snap your fingers and have it done with no other side effects”. So, like, maybe for Stellaris 2. They also said at least once that overhauling the system would be a lot of work for no real payoff. Anno fucked around with this message at 22:25 on Nov 19, 2021 |
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Nov 19, 2021 22:22
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Armies don't even bother me much anymore, except when I am Xenophile and I have to scroll through 50 options to find the type I want to build!
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Nov 19, 2021 22:30
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Firebert posted:Armies don't even bother me much anymore, except when I am Xenophile and I have to scroll through 50 options to find the type I want to build! This is why I make a dedicated military planet that houses a species with a bunch of army modifiers. Then they are the only option!
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Nov 19, 2021 22:35
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Firebert posted:Armies don't even bother me much anymore, except when I am Xenophile and I have to scroll through 50 options to find the type I want to build! Yeah, like many bits in ground combat, army recruitment needs some work. I always employ heavy genetic engineering and strategic terraforming to keep problems down for my xenophiles, but even then some random 1 species planet in the boonies tends to become main producer of armies. Simply because that huge central government Gaia planet has two dozens species living on it and army recruitment is a nightmare. 
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Nov 19, 2021 22:51
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I'm kind bummed by that one honestly because I feel like armies are an important aspect of both the game and sci fi in general and no one is even considering trying to replace them with a new mechanic, let alone salvage them. On the other hand, practically speaking, armies ARE a pain to manage and a lot of the stuff that made them a fun concept also made the pain exponentially worse (remember attachments?) so I don't exactly have a good answer either.
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Nov 19, 2021 23:12
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I mean you could literally have armies the way they are right now except they're ON YOUR FLEET instead of separate and it'd be infinitely better.
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Nov 19, 2021 23:13
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Yami Fenrir posted:I mean you could literally have armies the way they are right now except they're ON YOUR FLEET instead of separate and it'd be infinitely better. Okay yeah that's a fair point.
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Nov 19, 2021 23:20
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Anno posted:IIRC it was something like “what’s something you’d remove from the game if you could snap your fingers and have it done with no other side effects”. So, like, maybe for Stellaris 2.
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Nov 19, 2021 23:32
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Splicer posted:Extremely strong disagree Elaborate?
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Nov 19, 2021 23:36
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Yami Fenrir posted:I mean you could literally have armies the way they are right now except they're ON YOUR FLEET instead of separate and it'd be infinitely better. NSC2 tries to do this and its just kinda awkward and doesn't quite work the way you'd think. Then again, Juggernauts are also incredibly awkward so that clearly isn't a limit for first party content.
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Nov 19, 2021 23:40
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I would love if ground troops could make ship boarding a thing. Ground combat being expanded beyond what it is would be nice.
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Nov 19, 2021 23:49
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Just give me a way to build 10 units without clicking 10 times and it'll solve 90% of my problems with ground combat in the game.
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Nov 20, 2021 00:06
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OddObserver posted:Just give me a way to build 10 units without clicking 10 times and it'll solve 90% of my problems with ground combat in the game. This. Also extend this multibuild in 1 click option to moving pops across planets. It aint fun when you capture a capital and intend to abandon it
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Nov 20, 2021 00:08
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Firebert posted:Armies don't even bother me much anymore, except when I am Xenophile and I have to scroll through 50 options to find the type I want to build! that's when you pick quantity over quality and just build the max for one species at a time weak adorable butterflies will get the job done eventually
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Nov 20, 2021 00:16
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scaterry posted:Elaborate? In return I get ... ... ... ... I kind of like the alien monsters terraforming result.
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Nov 20, 2021 00:24
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Dirk the Average posted:I think Endless Space had a neat take on it where ships had an invasion power, and you could sacrifice combat module space to add more invasion power at the cost of space combat efficiency. You would occupy a planet by staying in orbit for long enough, based on some factor between the planet's defensiveness and the fleet's invasion power (where too little invasion power would fail to do anything, like putting a single corvette in orbit of a capital). I think you'd just be switching 'army' micro to 'fleet with army power' micro tbh. It'd let you use that fleet designer which is nice (unless they add an army builder), but it's not the sweeping change I'd like. feller fucked around with this message at 00:59 on Nov 20, 2021 |
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Nov 20, 2021 00:56
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Leal posted:This. Also extend this multibuild in 1 click option to moving pops across planets. It aint fun when you capture a capital and intend to abandon it I would just be happy if, especially while paused, pops didn't automatically promote to a job you seriously just emptied while moving guys between planets. Yes I know the Medical Administrator or whatever job is more prestigious than mailroom clerk. gently caress off and stop refilling it. This job isn't going to exist in 5 minutes anyway. I swear it's actually easier to just fire everyone from their jobs first so they don't try and move up before they move out.
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Nov 20, 2021 01:05
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3.2 patch notes are pretty good. Lots of AI work, bug fixes, and quality of life improvements. I might be playing Stellaris over the holidays!
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Nov 20, 2021 01:16
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DoubleNegative posted:I would just be happy if, especially while paused, pops didn't automatically promote to a job you seriously just emptied while moving guys between planets. Yes I know the Medical Administrator or whatever job is more prestigious than mailroom clerk. gently caress off and stop refilling it. This job isn't going to exist in 5 minutes anyway. I’d like to see some sort of minimum time in job modifier to demotion time. Pops take NUM_DAYS_IN_NEW_JOB to demote up to the current limit. It could also fix a bug I’ve seen where I get an unemployed specialist when I upgrade the capital building. I’m guessing that workers fill the new jobs before the existing specialist moves laterally. There would need to be some logic to rearrange the “newest” specialist to being unemployed first…and as I type this out, I realize it breaks down with multiple species. Maybe just move workers laterally before promoting. 
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Nov 20, 2021 01:31
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goatsestretchgoals posted:I’d like to see some sort of minimum time in job modifier to demotion time. Pops take NUM_DAYS_IN_NEW_JOB to demote up to the current limit. goatsestretchgoals posted:It could also fix a bug I’ve seen where I get an unemployed specialist when I upgrade the capital building. I’m guessing that workers fill the new jobs before the existing specialist moves laterally. There would need to be some logic to rearrange the “newest” specialist to being unemployed first…and as I type this out, I realize it breaks down with multiple species.
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Nov 20, 2021 01:53
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I haven’t tried the employment shuffle when that happens (usually because I’m constructing a new building that employs specialists next) but I’ll give it a shot next time I notice it.
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Nov 20, 2021 01:56
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Splicer posted:There is, if you've been promoted less than a year then you can demote without going through unemployment first.
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Nov 20, 2021 02:01
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yikes! posted:I think you'd just be switching 'army' micro to 'fleet with army power' micro tbh. It'd let you use that fleet designer which is nice (unless they add an army builder), but it's not the sweeping change I'd like. What I want is something like this: Splicer posted:I say ditch ground combat and give every ship a "bombardment" module. If you wipe out all the ground forces you own the planet, if you wipe out all the pops it reverts to uncolonised but with buildings, and if you wipe out all the buildings then it's just a kind of horrible place to live. Troops a just one of many possible bombardment modules and they specialise in taking out other troops. Or you can put in "extra munitions" and just blow up all the buildings and pops. Or "Bioweapons" and wipe out the pops at the cost of seriously bad longterm issues. Then the galactic community can ban the weirder stuff.
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Nov 20, 2021 02:14
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Stellaris 2: now with extra genocide!
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Nov 20, 2021 02:28
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hobbesmaster posted:Stellaris 2: now with extra genocide! Extra?! I thought it was already full up!
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Nov 20, 2021 02:31
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AAAAA! Real Muenster posted:I run a tiny amount of mods so they could be the culprit but I've heard this is a thing (and of course the game doesnt tell you anywhere that I've seen) but in my experience you have like... 4 days for them to demote immediately otherwise they are stuck in their new job tier. goatsestretchgoals posted:I haven’t tried the employment shuffle when that happens (usually because I’m constructing a new building that employs specialists next) but I’ll give it a shot next time I notice it.
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Nov 20, 2021 02:36
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Splicer posted:Extremely strong disagree I agree insomuch as there’s probably no reason to overhaul the system - it’ll always be vestigial at best - so they shouldn’t put time into trying to fix it. I would absolutely be on board with time invested to remove it, though.
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Nov 20, 2021 02:54
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quote:2.2.4 What the christ.
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Nov 20, 2021 02:59
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I believe it was one of the checks that was running way too often causing performance issues.
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Nov 20, 2021 03:05
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Splicer posted:So I did some checking with old versions and this was removed sometimes between 2.2.4 and... 2.2.7. It was in the game for maybe a month and then quietly removed. lmao I think Stellaris is better shape than its been in a long time and I am actually looking forward to the new DLC but come the gently caress on.
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Nov 20, 2021 04:33
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hobbesmaster posted:I believe it was one of the checks that was running way too often causing performance issues. "stop modeling your economy by simulating hundreds of discrete pops with individual jobs and ideology and happiness and all that" okay there I optimized it edit, as an example of things the game doesn't really need: if you start as Driven Assimilator with Resource Consolidation origin, your cyborgs are kinda not so good at doing anything (as they cannot have habitability above 70% on the machine world, and even that requires giving them the Extremely Adaptive trait) and the low habitability really wrecks their output. But for some reason the game really wants to assign them to be researchers and alloy fabricators because for all of the randomized-weighted tables that factor into deciding who does which job, "do I have a massive penalty due to low habitability?" is apparently not one of them. silentsnack fucked around with this message at 05:49 on Nov 20, 2021 |
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Nov 20, 2021 05:34
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Yeah I don't think any player would even notice if those things were represented on a per world basis instead of every pop.
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Nov 20, 2021 06:25
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I understand why they went the route they did with pops because the idea of having this huge vibrant empire of a bunch of different populations living in harmony, or being able to stratify things so you've got different castes, or genetically engineering your slaves and stuff, is both pretty core to a lot of sci-fi settings and very neat. However, I really hope they can find some better ways to implement it both for gameplay purposes and for performance reasons, in a hypothetical Stellaris 2.
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Nov 20, 2021 07:25
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Dirk the Average posted:I think Endless Space had a neat take on it where ships had an invasion power, and you could sacrifice combat module space to add more invasion power at the cost of space combat efficiency. You would occupy a planet by staying in orbit for long enough, based on some factor between the planet's defensiveness and the fleet's invasion power (where too little invasion power would fail to do anything, like putting a single corvette in orbit of a capital). Every time this discussion comes up I get a little happier I found and pulled apart a mod from like 1.2 that made planets flip control, or ownership if it's total war, when they hit 100% devastation.
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Nov 20, 2021 07:47
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Ms Adequate posted:I understand why they went the route they did with pops because the idea of having this huge vibrant empire of a bunch of different populations living in harmony, or being able to stratify things so you've got different castes, or genetically engineering your slaves and stuff, is both pretty core to a lot of sci-fi settings and very neat. However, I really hope they can find some better ways to implement it both for gameplay purposes and for performance reasons, in a hypothetical Stellaris 2. stellaris 2 needs to just be built directly on top of victoria 3 is the thing. everything about it from pops to politics to goods to warfare being based on fronts and missions is better suited for what stellaris has always wanted to be, than any game growing directly out of the stellaris branch of the clausewitz engine ever could be. i feel like you could transplant all of that stuff into a more 4X-y setup and it would still work. you could have giant space wars that aren't a huge pain in the rear end to micromanage! meaningful pirate fleets and other internal armed unrest that can't just be crushed by your enormous navy in a straight-up battle! differences in internal political structure between democracies, empires, hive minds, machines, etc. that dramatically change how you play the game!
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Nov 20, 2021 07:57
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Yami Fenrir posted:I mean you could literally have armies the way they are right now except they're ON YOUR FLEET instead of separate and it'd be infinitely better. That wouldn't work because the small contingents warships carry around normally are sufficient for repelling borders and similar tasks, not planetary invasions. Those small marine armies landing on a planet trying to occupy it would get absolutely bodied. You'd still need dedicated military transports for the amount of military ground hardware a proper invasion needs, and I'm sure as hell not putting all my eggs into the frontline fleet basket
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Nov 20, 2021 08:42
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