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Which horse film is your favorite? This poll is closed. |
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| Black Beauty |
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2 | 1.06% |
| A Talking Pony!?! |
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4 | 2.13% |
| Mr. Hands 2x Apple Flavor |
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117 | 62.23% |
| War Horse |
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11 | 5.85% |
| Mr. Hands |
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54 | 28.72% |
| Total: | 188 votes | ||
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VitalSigns posted:Sure I agree that it's pretty much always better to arrange systems to make it easier for people to make the right choices versus just relying 100% on punishment especially since our cops are all power-tripping dickheads Yeah, exactly this. Buses in my area run until 10 on weeknights and maybe 11 on weekends? There's any number of ways you can attack drunk driving without "just throw more laws and cops at it," and the same is true for covid. There's so many ways our society could have been encouraged to come together to beat covid but our government wasn't up to the task. Somewhere in like May or June of 2020 I was kind of naively hopeful that this pandemic could potentially be a force of positive change and bringing society together to fight a common enemy, but the early politicization of masks and business closures didn't bode well, and when the miracle vaccines caused the Biden gov to go masks off it was like the nail in the coffin for our country even doing the bare minimum. At this point vaccine mandates and making anti-vaxxers complete societal pariahs might be our only way out and I'm skeptical of the ability of our society to do even that. My biggest concern re: covid at the moment is the massive strain that the unvaxxed are putting on our already hosed to death healthcare system. Holy poo poo the situation is much worse than people seem to acknowledge or realize. 
Professor Beetus fucked around with this message at 19:10 on Nov 22, 2021 |
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Nov 22, 2021 19:07
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Got my booster and threw a flu shot in for the hell of it. Moderna #2 kicked my rear end for days so I'm expecting to die tonight.
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Nov 22, 2021 19:36
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Platystemon posted:You totally misrepresented the statistics and were wrong even so. The most recent number I can find says there are about 20,000 breakthrough covid deaths in the US, the risk of which scales with age, with ~85% of the deaths occurring among people over 65. There are annually ~40,000 fall deaths which also scales with age, and 86% being people over 65. You're welcome to say how I'm "wrong" here about falling being more deadly than breakthrough covid. It's very clearly almost twice as deadly, with the same age group risk profile.
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Nov 22, 2021 19:38
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Anyone given their 5-11 kids shots yet? Any rough reactions? We're debating whether the flu shot and the COVID shot within a few days of each other is too much to handle.
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Nov 22, 2021 19:51
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enki42 posted:Anyone given their 5-11 kids shots yet? Any rough reactions? We're debating whether the flu shot and the COVID shot within a few days of each other is too much to handle. No side effects for either other than sore arms from getting both on the same night. I had to keep them up until a few hours past their normal bedtime and they had worse side effects from that.
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Nov 22, 2021 20:03
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enki42 posted:Anyone given their 5-11 kids shots yet? Any rough reactions? We're debating whether the flu shot and the COVID shot within a few days of each other is too much to handle. My kids are going for their second doses on Saturday morning. With the first shot, my 11 year old had some headache/fatigue/chills the Monday following, but my 8 year old was pretty much fine and just had some soreness at the injection site.
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Nov 22, 2021 20:04
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Xombie posted:The most recent number I can find says there are about 20,000 breakthrough covid deaths in the US, the risk of which scales with age, with ~85% of the deaths occurring among people over 65. There are annually ~40,000 fall deaths which also scales with age, and 86% being people over 65. You're welcome to say how I'm "wrong" here about falling being more deadly than breakthrough covid. It's very clearly almost twice as deadly, with the same age group risk profile. You’re flailing wildly with statistics. We’ve gone from roof falls to grandmas breaking hips. It’s like claiming that a person is more likely to die from lightning strikes and then saying “actually I’m including everything from kids sticking paper clips in sockets, copper thieves, and the electric chair”, and even then being wrong because electrocution deaths of all sorts remain several times rarer. Let’s actually do the arithmetic on this one, shall we?  One thousand one hundred and ninety‐nine persons between the ages of thirty and forty‐nine died in accidental falls in 2019, the most recent year for which data is available. That is three point two eight per day.  This is the most recent week for which data is available. It implies a death rate of thirteen point three per day in that same age group, or four times as great as falls. If you want to say that’s an acceptable loss, I can’t stop you, but it’s not even in the same time zone as your original claim. Besides which, if public policy was “non‐slip footwear is totally overkill. You can wear Crocs with the tread worn off in restaurant kitchens. It’s totally cool”, I would take issue with that. Platystemon fucked around with this message at 20:20 on Nov 22, 2021 |
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Nov 22, 2021 20:17
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Deaths are essentially a secondary metric with covid given how old they skew, especially in the vaccinated. Honestly they always have been, this was never going to gut the workforce directly by killing off workers. We can sit here and argue about deaths all day long and it doesn't do a thing to help us mitigate or understand the disease burden of covid. The action is all in reinfections, long-term sequelae, neurological impacts of covid, etc. as well as the mutation environment promoted by the uncontrolled spread. "Endemic Covid" can be just as much a disaster as "Pandemic Covid" for these reasons, look at the economic burden of malaria etc. even where therapeutics, leaky vaccines, etc. are available.
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Nov 22, 2021 20:33
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Overburdened hospitals suck, too
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Nov 22, 2021 20:35
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enki42 posted:Anyone given their 5-11 kids shots yet? Any rough reactions? We're debating whether the flu shot and the COVID shot within a few days of each other is too much to handle. My 8-year-old had his first shot about a week and a half ago. He had his flu shot back in October and had no problems with that. After his covid shot he complained about his arm being sore for about an hour but that was it.
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Nov 22, 2021 20:37
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brugroffil posted:Overburdened hospitals suck, too A lot of the overburden is from treating extreme long-shots. I understand and support why our society does it but there is certainly an "off-ramp" as we become more hardened. On-ramp to fascism, though. Edit: looks like Israel is spiking again, guess 6-month boosters were a pipe dream and it'll have to be more like 3.
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Nov 22, 2021 20:39
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Wang Commander posted:Edit: looks like Israel is spiking again, guess 6-month boosters were a pipe dream and it'll have to be more like 3. Where are you seeing that?
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Nov 22, 2021 20:43
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Nov 22, 2021 20:46
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Owlofcreamcheese posted:Where are you seeing that? Israeli ministry of health reports R>1 again.
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Nov 22, 2021 20:46
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Is there a specific twitter a bunch of people are following that is coordinating the "3 month" thing with a bunch of weird not real statistics people keep bringing up?
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Nov 22, 2021 20:46
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 i mean calling this a spike is completely disingenuous
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Nov 22, 2021 20:47
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 This is pretty much all that matters. If it's over 1, they're in exponential growth by definition. What is your proposed mechanism by which covid can sustain a slow linear growth? I don't think there have been many cases outside of reporting errors or going straight into extremely strict lockdowns (or China-style pausing to test whole cities and trace everything) where you see a slow growth that's not the beginning of a spike. It's just the nature of the math. Wang Commander fucked around with this message at 20:51 on Nov 22, 2021 |
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Nov 22, 2021 20:49
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When cases get that low people relax and results in more spread. Thats quite a leap to the 3 months vaccines. Im all for doom posting, but this seems akin to claiming "covid is over" every weekend when reporting dips. edit: Im sure it will go back up, that is inevitable. But like give it more than a week of not falling.
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Nov 22, 2021 20:52
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brugroffil posted:Overburdened hospitals suck, too There's more than one way to skin that cat
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Nov 22, 2021 20:53
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enki42 posted:Anyone given their 5-11 kids shots yet? Any rough reactions? We're debating whether the flu shot and the COVID shot within a few days of each other is too much to handle.
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Nov 22, 2021 22:36
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Xombie posted:This makes it an even better comparison for breakthrough Covid deaths than I thought. that seems like an awful lot of accidental poisoning deaths  are they counting, like, medication errors?
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Nov 22, 2021 23:31
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It’s overwhelmingly drugs.  Opioids alone killed almost fifty thousand. Much of the rest is cocaine. Platystemon fucked around with this message at 23:45 on Nov 22, 2021 |
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Nov 22, 2021 23:36
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Xombie posted:There are five times as many people dying of nephritis every day compared to breakthrough covid deaths. 85% of people who die from covid while vaccinated are over the age of 65. These people are more likely to die of a dozen other medical problems before they can get covid. They are 9x more likely to die of diabetes, 12x Alzheimers, 15x stroke. I wrote out a post along very similar lines to this yesterday. But I deleted it before I posted it because I thought I'd get prob'd again for supporting child death and anti-vax talking points. The pandemic is so clearly affecting the unvaccinated to a so much greater extent than the vaccinated I don't get the insistence that we must pretend that covid is cutting a terrifying swathe through the vaccinated population that will cripple the nation for years to come. Even more ridiculous if you're talking about anyone under the age of 50. Platystemon posted:If anything else were killing one hundred Americans per day, it would be a big deal, but because it’s a minor fraction of pandemic that everyone is already tired of, it’s not. What like sepsis? or car deaths? or drug overdose? or diabetes or strokes or kidney disease?
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Nov 23, 2021 01:01
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mod sassinator posted:I don't even know if full lockdowns are that necessary--look at Japan, they're down to near zero cases again and as far as I can tell they only are employing _very consistent and widespread high quality mask use_. It really might be that simple, that we just force people (at gunpoint if necessary) to wear N95 and FFP2 masks for 3-4 months and this is controlled enough to effectively be over.
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Nov 23, 2021 01:19
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Illuminti posted:What like sepsis? or car deaths? or drug overdose? or diabetes or strokes or kidney disease? Yeah I don't buy that line of Platystemon's argument considering that our gatekeeping of healthcare in this country leads to poo poo like people dying of lack of insulin. There is clearly a pretty large capacity for this country to let people die meaningless deaths out of spite or because they're afraid of the Boogeyman of socialism. Of course neither major party supports M4A or universal coverage, the best the Dems can do is "expanding access" and big rear end handouts to the parasitic insurance companies while the Republicans heartily endorse the position of letting the poor's die in the streets. Brace yourselves, if we could hit 90% vaxxed in the US, pretty sure most Americans wouldn't give a poo poo about those deaths either. Charles 2 of Spain posted:In Japan's case there's a variety of reasons for this that can't just be boiled down to universal masking. I was thinking of doing a bit of an effortpost about the Japanese situation since it's an outlier but a lot of it won't fit with the vibe of the thread. Honestly would love to see that because this thread gets way too bogged down into the uniquely lovely American perspective that it's been helpful to get other perspectives from time to time. I really appreciate anyone willing to step up and offer something beyond the (justified) anger and dismay at the US responses to Covid. Professor Beetus fucked around with this message at 01:25 on Nov 23, 2021 |
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Nov 23, 2021 01:21
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Illuminti posted:What like sepsis? or car deaths? or drug overdose? or diabetes or strokes or kidney disease? Yes. The odds of a “fully vaccinated” person between thirty and forty‐nine years old dying of COVID in the first week of October, the most recent week for which data is available, is comparable to their odds of dying as an occupant of a motor vehicle. We spend a lot of effort and resources adding and maintaining crash barriers rubble strips and cat’s eyes. Cars are constantly getting more safety features. People will spend thousands of dollars for a safer vehicle and no one bats an eye at that. With the pandemic, it’s like if we had installed knotted bed sheets as seatbelts in our cars in March of 2020 when there was a materials shortage and never bothered to upgrade to three‐point harnesses with nylon straps when they became available. The treasury cannot spare the expense of eighty‐cent N95s, and the public, even many medical professionals, consider them “overkill”.
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Nov 23, 2021 01:30
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100 Americans probably die per day just thinking about bees. If we're losing 100 vaccinated Americans each day, of a nation of 330+ million people, that sounds pretty darn OK to me. They're older folks with all the dangerous comorbidities. In the actual, real world that we live in right now what more can we do? This is the new normal. The anti-vax folks will eventually come around and get their shot, or they'll get walloped by covid over and over again until they croak. I don't like it, but it seems that's just how things are going to be. I wish and hope that they would take the free, widely available, miracle drug that would save their lives. e: it's ants, isn't it? thinking about ants. (USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST) How are u fucked around with this message at 01:37 on Nov 23, 2021 |
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Nov 23, 2021 01:31
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I’m going to get called to show the arithmetic for that car crash comparison, so here it is. That’s a little under seventeen motor vehicle occupants per day in that age range. This is the most recent date for which data is available. Figures are per hundred thousand per week Given the population of that age range, it works out to a little over thirteen deaths per day. There aren’t actually thirteen people of that age range dying because the fully‐vaccinated population is smaller, but for a per‐capita risk comparison, this shortcut works. If someone tells you that almost no fully‐vaccinated non‐elderly people are dying, you tell them that that’s as ridiculous as saying almost no one is dying in car crashes.
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Nov 23, 2021 01:34
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How are u posted:100 Americans probably die per day just thinking about bees. If we're losing 100 vaccinated Americans each day, of a nation of 330+ million people, that sounds pretty darn OK to me. jesus tittyfucking christ
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Nov 23, 2021 01:41
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Platystemon posted:
Yeah, and everyone has decided that that is an acceptable number of deaths for the ability to use roads in a car. Not sure what your point is here? for all intents and purposes, yes, almost no fully‐vaccinated non‐elderly people are dying. Wildy throwing out some numbers here that I think are in the ballpark. 30,000 deaths from 195 million vaccinated people in the US? 0.015%
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Nov 23, 2021 01:46
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How are u posted:If we're losing 100 vaccinated Americans each day, of a nation of 330+ million people, that sounds pretty darn OK to me. Lol this gimmick account (USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)
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Nov 23, 2021 01:53
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The US's acceptance of the death and suffering caused by a car dependent culture is just as bad as COVID acceptance imo
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Nov 23, 2021 01:54
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Professor Beetus posted:Honestly would love to see that because this thread gets way too bogged down into the uniquely lovely American perspective that it's been helpful to get other perspectives from time to time. I really appreciate anyone willing to step up and offer something beyond the (justified) anger and dismay at the US responses to Covid.  , but gimme some time because it's a holiday today and there's no way my kids will let me sit down for longer than 5 minutes.
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Nov 23, 2021 02:09
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How are u posted:100 Americans probably die per day just thinking about bees. If we're losing 100 vaccinated Americans each day, of a nation of 330+ million people, that sounds pretty darn OK to me. They're older folks with all the dangerous comorbidities. In the actual, real world that we live in right now what more can we do? This is the new normal. To give another example, the flu kills between 12k-52k Americans every year. It depends on the strain, but the average is 35,777 per year (between 2010-2019). If Covid is killing 100 Americans per day, then that is 36,500 people per year. https://www.cdc.gov/flu/about/burden/index.html Kaal fucked around with this message at 02:30 on Nov 23, 2021 |
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Nov 23, 2021 02:27
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Kaal posted:To give another example, the flu kills between 12k-52k Americans every year. It depends on the strain, but the average is 35,777 per year (between 2010-2019). If Covid is killing 100 Americans per day, then that is 36,500 people per year. Hypothetically, if we were 100% vaccinated. Given the protection offered and the huge reduction in spread would we be talking sub average flu numbers? If flu vaccination rates stayed at their average. But yeah...it's not a pandemic of the unvaccinated...
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Nov 23, 2021 02:43
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Charles 2 of Spain posted:OK I'll do it for you Lol yeah no I don't want you to feel obligated or anything, I just want to make sure people know that international perspectives are absolutely welcome and tbh the thread vibe can be whatever the posters want it to be as long as that's not "toxic" imo. Have fun with your kiddos and enjoy your holiday.
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Nov 23, 2021 02:45
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Professor Beetus posted:Honestly would love to see that because this thread gets way too bogged down into the uniquely lovely American perspective that it's been helpful to get other perspectives from time to time. I really appreciate anyone willing to step up and offer something beyond the (justified) anger and dismay at the US responses to Covid. I've often posted on Hong Kong's situation. It continues to be well managed relative to the rest of the world, but rather than addressing observable issues, the priority seems to increasingly be to please mainland authorities. Vaccine rates continue to be shameful. Something like 60% of the total population and less than 20% for people over 80, which is a sizable chunk of HK. They did approve vaccines for children, though. Ages 12+ can get BioNTech. Ages 2+ can get Sinovac. Public communications on the matter are confusing and contradictory. The language justifying zero Covid measures creates the impression that no one needs a vaccine. Transmission within quarantine facilities has been an ongoing problem. It's yet to snowball into a significant outbreak, but it's ridiculous that people are having to pay thousands of US dollars to to be quarantined in small rooms for 21 days and getting Covid from other people in the quarantine facility. This should be so easily addressed. Instead the response is bending over backwards to find other causes for the cases, to blame the infected, and to impose additional measures that don't address the actual problem. Gaps in entry quarantines for special groups, notably airline crews, continue to pose challenges. I don't know how you solve for this, though. My understanding is that HK-based airline crews quarantine at destination so that they do not have to do a full quarantine on return. There have been cases of crew members returning and testing positive, though, and the only policy suggestions I've seen would basically entail the end of airlines (including cargo) in HK, which are already on their last leg. It's not realistic to have airline crews in working in endless quarantines or extremely long rosters. Most of the attention has been to doing whatever it takes to reopen the border with the mainland, and that has consisted mainly of throwing poo poo at the wall and seeing what sticks. No one seems to actually know what mainland authorities want, or if they do, they're not talking. HK has a far better record over the last 6 (9?) months yet is still treated like the bigger risk. It does seem like mainland authorities want HK to share a lot more medical data, and HKers are understandably uneasy about handing over their personal data to mainland authorities. Things do seem to be moving towards opening up with the mainland. There's been talk of small-scale, no-quarantine travel (hundreds of people per day) starting in December. That's much sooner than I would have guessed. My guess was always that we wouldn't see it budge until after the Beijing Olympics. This week there is a mainland political mission visiting HK to assess its Covid situation and provide recommendations. Despite so many issues with outbreaks tied to privileged groups entering without quarantine, this mission naturally underwent no quarantine and is without irony suggesting tighter restrictions. Jamie Dimon was also able to visit without quarantine, so the rich and powerful continue to play by a different set of rules than the rest of us regardless of their professed ideological affiliation. Overall it seems like a lot of the policymaking is increasingly based on politics and not science, though at least the politics are for now aligned with non-"let 'er rip" outcomes.
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Nov 23, 2021 02:51
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The end of airlines is the only measure that actually makes sense for stopping the spread of disease by air crews and passengers.
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Nov 23, 2021 02:58
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How are u posted:The anti-vax folks will eventually come around and get their shot, or they'll get walloped by covid over and over again until they croak. I don't like it, but it seems that's just how things are going to be. I wish and hope that they would take the free, widely available, miracle drug that would save their lives. German health minister yesterday: "By the end of this winter pretty much everyone in Germany will have been vaccinated, recovered or dead." https://www.abc.net.au/news/2021-11-23/health-minister-tells-germans-get-vaccinated-or-get-covid-spahn/100641876
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Nov 23, 2021 03:07
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John_A_Tallon posted:The end of airlines is the only measure that actually makes sense for stopping the spread of disease by air crews and passengers. Considering that HK has done just fine so far without shutting down air travel, I'm not sure I agree. Yes, crews have tested positive on return, but so far there have been zero outbreaks or onward transmission associated with that. Testing and quarantining is working. The current issues with airline crews are marginal issues that we have the luxury of prioritizing because we got a lot of the bigger things right. They also only apply to HK-based airlines (well, Cathay Pacific), because other air crews do not stay in HK. Mainland has had continuous international and domestic air travel as well.
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Nov 23, 2021 03:36
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