|
One of the good quotes in that focus-group piece was from a former Harry Reid advisor:quote:Jones said her brother recently told her that “Build Back Better,” Biden’s legislative framework, “sounds like a f---ing fitness plan.” She said, “Nobody knows what it is.” eta: tbf, as I've said, even Senate Dems don't know what the final bill will include. But it's pretty scary that voters think it'll include things like free community college & student-loan forgiveness that were 86'd from the legislation months ago.
|
#
?
Nov 23, 2021 20:12
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 24, 2024 14:38 |
|
|
Willa Rogers posted:One of the good quotes in that focus-group piece was from a former Harry Reid advisor: Haven’t most of the popular portions of BBB been dropped at this point? Thought drug negotiation and paid family leave were also cut? BBB is gonna pass and then people are going to find out that nothing they want is in it but rich people got a massive tax cut.
|
|
#
?
Nov 23, 2021 20:21
|
|
|
Raccooon posted:Haven’t most of the popular portions of BBB been dropped at this point? Thought drug negotiation and paid family leave were also cut? And the GOP will be happy to continue to remind voters of that. eta: Also it looks like the House-passed BBB legislation snuck back in the provision about bank reporting to the IRS, albeit with some restrictions. The Republicans are salivating over running ads about giving richies a tax cut while siccing the IRS on working mopes. Willa Rogers fucked around with this message at 20:26 on Nov 23, 2021 |
|
#
?
Nov 23, 2021 20:24
|
|
|
CommieGIR posted:Things are changing, believe it or not, public perception of nuclear power is actually above 50% approval for the first time since the 80s. So hopefully that'll help. I sure hope so, though I'm personally concerned that the groundwork laid by the anti-vax FUD machine could end up being used against new reactor production and become a big stumbling block.
|
|
#
?
Nov 23, 2021 20:28
|
|
|
Willa Rogers posted:there was an rnc tweet a week ago or so that just listed poo poo voters want in four bullet points, like: In 2 days millions of Americans are going to sit at a dinner table with family they hate and have awkward conversations. If everyone's being polite it's going to be about how expensive the food was this year. If not it's going to be how Rittenhouse is a god drat hero and the schools are trying to make kids commie fags. And the Democratic Party's response is "nuh-uh". The Democrats have no message and again that failure comes from the top.
|
|
#
?
Nov 23, 2021 20:28
|
|
|
Old James posted:In 2 days millions of Americans are going to sit at a dinner table with family they hate and have awkward conversations. If everyone's being polite it's going to be about how expensive the food was this year. If not it's going to be how Rittenhouse is a god drat hero and the schools are trying to make kids commie fags. Only one half of that is even worth having a response to much less taking the effort to respond.
|
|
#
?
Nov 23, 2021 20:30
|
|
|
Raccooon posted:I mean I follow politics pretty closely and I am not really sure what the democrats want to do. Their messaging is convoluted and usually doesn’t match their actions at all. Yeah, again I don't know how you can reconcile these things. And what I can tell is that all the people saying them are going to be insulated from any effects their incoherent words and actions have. I don't know what other people people think but I just have to assume they're all just talking out of their asses. I've gotta be honest, I'm dumb but I pay attention to politics more than most people, I feel, and guess what. I don't know if Build Back Better is the pay for roads compromise bill that passed, or the one (that's supposed to be really good!) that hasn't passed yet, or what. And Biden is right now telling me he's the "small business" administration on twitter lol (while the tax cuts for rich people on the coasts get passed - so what message should I take from that?). Personally I wouldn't plan on running with "We must stop Trump at all costs" while saying "These Trump appointees and policies are good, though" but maybe I'm not enlightened or studious enough to understand why this is a good plan.
|
|
#
?
Nov 23, 2021 20:38
|
|
|
Kalit posted:Can’t say that it’s too surprising that 18 swing voters who voted for Biden in 2020 and are unsure who they are voting for in 2024 aren’t paying much attention to politics in general…. Link seems broken: https://thirdway.imgix.net/pdfs/override/Qualitative-Research-Findings-%E2%80%93-Virginia-Post-Election-Research.pdf Not sure how much weight to give a single focus group, but it's interesting how much more blunt an assessment this was than other Third Way pieces I've read. (It's also interesting in that it's linked on Third Way's website right next to a plug for a Jennifer Rubin WaPo opinion column from a few weeks back that's effectively arguing against several of its key conclusions.)
|
|
#
?
Nov 23, 2021 20:42
|
|
|
The only lesson that Dems take away from bad polling & focus-group feedback is "we need to sharpen our message" and "we need to be better at touting our accomplishments" rather than "we need to deliver tangible benefits based on what voters have said they need & what we promised to deliver if elected." I don't see how any effective messaging can be based on "this floor is actually the ceiling."
|
|
#
?
Nov 23, 2021 20:46
|
|
|
lil poopendorfer posted:He was the first president to not start any new wars or interventions in like 50 years, that counts for something Yeah because Guaido was poo poo and Iran was pretty calm and collected after he shredded a perfectly good diplomatic deal then later assassinated one of their generals. Also he had Cuba redesignated a state sponsor of terrorism (not that Biden seems to be in a rush to remove them). Like I guess his general incompetence minimized the harm, but I don't know if I'm ready to praise him for it. Kind of like congratulating a kid wildly swinging a bat for not breaking any vases while everyone else is pulling them away. edit: Or saying the kid definitely didn't want to break him some vases. -Blackadder- posted:By "Trump's Isolationism", I didn't mean that he was a pacifist "dove. I meant that we can safely assume that most other Republican candidates wouldn't have negotiated with the Taliban and pulled American troops out of Afghanistan, Syria, and even Germany. Even the Dems thought he was doing too much, and the rest of the GOP was foaming at the mouth. There's a good article I came across a while back that talked about how Trumps own chief staff and generals were doing crazy kabuki theater to get him not to go through with the Syria withdrawal. I mean, he turned on the Afghan troop withdrawal the moment it was publicly unpopular so I do really doubt he'd have followed through on it. Maybe he wouldn't have if Biden wasn't president who knows. TGLT fucked around with this message at 20:58 on Nov 23, 2021 |
|
#
?
Nov 23, 2021 20:54
|
|
|
Raccooon posted:I mean I follow politics pretty closely and I am not really sure what the democrats want to do. Their messaging is convoluted and usually doesn’t match their actions at all. I'm probably projecting my own work BS here, but it feels like a complete failure of leadership. I suspect that if I went to my House rep, she'd be like "dude we know, but try telling that to Pelosi" which is exactly how my corporation is handling existential challenges.
|
|
#
?
Nov 23, 2021 21:01
|
|
|
TGLT posted:Yeah because Guaido was poo poo and Iran was pretty calm and collected after he shredded a perfectly good diplomatic deal then later assassinated one of their generals. Also he had Cuba redesignated a state sponsor of terrorism (not that Biden seems to be in a rush to remove them). Also he expanded the drone campaigns after Obama was scaling them back, removed what oversight there was so we couldn't even find out how many civilians we were indiscriminately blowing up, etc. Like you said, just because he was incompetent doesn't make him a dove.
|
|
#
?
Nov 23, 2021 21:05
|
|
|
Jaxyon posted:I'm probably projecting my own work BS here, but it feels like a complete failure of leadership. No this is spot on. If anything it is because Pelosi’s and other Dem leadership have a completely different set of values and goals. virtualboyCOLOR fucked around with this message at 21:22 on Nov 23, 2021 |
|
#
?
Nov 23, 2021 21:09
|
|
|
I've tried to hold this in but I have to say it: does anyone else think the aviator shades are really fake and cringy? Before you answer, please consider your opines about Trump's fake and cringy spraytan. When I think about the Biden administration, here's what I think of: an old rich guy with aviators, eating an icecream cone, telling me to pay my student loans. As best I can tell that's been deliberately cultivated by the Democratic Party.
|
|
#
?
Nov 23, 2021 21:25
|
|
|
Is part of the reason why it is hard to brand poo poo in America or have anyone understand what the gently caress is in a bill because they have to stuff anything that gets through full of everything they want to get through because of the filibuster?Sharkie posted:I've tried to hold this in but I have to say it: does anyone else think the aviator shades are really fake and cringy? Before you answer, please consider your opines about Trump's fake and cringy spraytan. I used to think of Diamond Joe, but man he was way too cool, I used to think it was actually based on something back in the day when Biden was not in the spotlight. Funny thing is that I like Biden's outward mannerisms and way of talking, but the content is just boring as all gently caress. DarkCrawler fucked around with this message at 21:28 on Nov 23, 2021 |
|
#
?
Nov 23, 2021 21:25
|
|
|
nine-gear crow posted:It wasn't just a gun, it was some insane shotgun pistol thing made to skirt around sawed off shotgun laws. If he'd shot anyone with it, at pistol range... I don't even want to think about the damage it could have done. Sounds like a handgun chambered for .410 shotgun rounds. With 00 buckshot, that'll cause some damage. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a484VNz3umU E: beaten. 90s Solo Cup fucked around with this message at 21:41 on Nov 23, 2021 |
|
#
?
Nov 23, 2021 21:26
|
|
|
Sharkie posted:I've tried to hold this in but I have to say it: does anyone else think the aviator shades are really fake and cringy? Before you answer, please consider your opines about Trump's fake and cringy spraytan. like, you're literally repeating a rightwing meme while saying "i don't know where i got this impression from" not that you are wrong, i just know where you got that entire image from.
|
|
#
?
Nov 23, 2021 21:29
|
|
|
^^^ Before it was "pay your loans" it was an Obama-era meme about Cool Joe. But lol if the GOP is now running memes on student-loan payments.DarkCrawler posted:Is part of the reason why it is hard to brand poo poo in America or have anyone understand what the gently caress is in a bill because they have to stuff anything that gets through full of everything they want to get through because of the filibuster? I think it's more that it's hard to craft a powerful message on "tax cuts for richies & to hell with all the things for which you elected us." Democratic hyperbole about THIS BILL IS THE BIGGEST & MOST POWERFUL SINCE THE NEW DEAL; JUST SQUEEZE ITS BICEPS! doesn't really help, either. Maybe Dems think since they got elected on lies about what they'd prioritize it makes sense to lie about the effects of legislation. It all comes down to form over substance, and the Dems definitely prefer to think in terms of the former rather than the latter.
|
|
#
?
Nov 23, 2021 21:33
|
|
|
InsertPotPun posted:or it's a meme with a clip art biden wearing shades and eating ice cream while saying "pay your student loans, jack" 50% of post-2015 politics in a nutshell right there. The other 50% is Nazis finding some random minority person (first on Tumblr, later on Twitter) saying something that reactionaries would be offended by, and ragebaiting reactionaries to hold the whole identity group accountable for that rando's tweet and hoisting it as proof that talking about identity issues is always bad (be sure to ignore the nonstop "as a Christian" from the right).
|
|
#
?
Nov 23, 2021 21:36
|
|
|
InsertPotPun posted:or it's a meme with a clip art biden wearing shades and eating ice cream while saying "pay your student loans, jack" Are you suggesting that rightwing memes caused Biden to go on tv and wear aviators and eat ice cream?  Or that rightwing memes forced Biden to restart loan payments? It's literally a deliberate look/branding so like, "oh you must think that because of rightwing memes" doesn't make sense when it's literally just a thing he does (like restarting student loan payments).
|
|
#
?
Nov 23, 2021 21:39
|
|
|
https://twitter.com/notfakeonion/status/1462588495717974016?s=21 Also real news https://twitter.com/socialistdogmom/status/1463231523503722502?s=21
|
|
#
?
Nov 23, 2021 21:40
|
|
|
Honestly I'm not sure how the Onion can really top reality after 2016.
|
|
#
?
Nov 23, 2021 21:43
|
|
|
CommieGIR posted:That's not to say he didn't get really close to starting some, but its more because Trump is just a non-committal person rather than any sort of pacifist nature. I always got the sense too that people like Bolton kind of overplayed their hand in trying to convince Trump to start those wars and he just reflexively shut them down because he felt like they were trying to boss him around.
|
|
#
?
Nov 23, 2021 21:45
|
|
|
Willa Rogers posted:^^^ Before it was "pay your loans" it was an Obama-era meme about Cool Joe. But lol if the GOP is now running memes on student-loan payments. How much of the bills is new spending as opposed to tax credits or tax cuts? I feel like it's more "some of the things you elected us on" instead of "none of the things you elected us on". Though I honestly have very little belief in anyone in America electing them (or anyone else) based on things they want instead of people they hate, but they aren't really delivering on that either.
|
|
#
?
Nov 23, 2021 21:48
|
|
|
Sharkie posted:I've tried to hold this in but I have to say it: does anyone else think the aviator shades are really fake and cringy? Before you answer, please consider your opines about Trump's fake and cringy spraytan. both of those things suck, as does every outlet that tried to prop either of those things up as something cool
|
|
#
?
Nov 23, 2021 21:50
|
|
|
skylined! posted:Also real news Am I reading this right - the fuckers were found guilty and will have to pay? loving good. I had been hearing chatter about a hung jury. Shouldn't have taken the jury more than a minute to throw the book at these bastards.
|
|
#
?
Nov 23, 2021 22:03
|
|
|
Sharkie posted:Are you suggesting that rightwing memes caused Biden to go on tv and wear aviators and eat ice cream? there is literally no other explanation. you loving dolt.
|
|
#
?
Nov 23, 2021 22:10
|
|
|
Angry_Ed posted:Also he expanded the drone campaigns after Obama was scaling them back, removed what oversight there was so we couldn't even find out how many civilians we were indiscriminately blowing up, etc. yeah this is another good example of how constantly repeating lies makes people believe things, evne people who don't support a person. Trump's only claim to isolationist fame is not *technically* starting any shooting wars while in office, which while being a low bar, is a bar most presidents don't pass. But he did every other awful military thing the US loves to do, and expanded on it as much as he could.
|
|
#
?
Nov 23, 2021 22:14
|
|
|
F_Shit_Fitzgerald posted:Am I reading this right - the fuckers were found guilty and will have to pay? loving good. I had been hearing chatter about a hung jury. Shouldn't have taken the jury more than a minute to throw the book at these bastards.
|
|
#
?
Nov 23, 2021 22:16
|
|
|
Jaxyon posted:yeah this is another good example of how constantly repeating lies makes people believe things, evne people who don't support a person. The amount of time it takes to convince people on left-leaning forums (including this one) that Trump killed more people in four years through bombing than Obama in eight years is way too much.
|
|
#
?
Nov 23, 2021 22:17
|
|
|
Gosar and Gaetz tangle on the mat, a mass of sweaty, oiled limbs. Suddenly, a roar from the back of the crowd. A shadowy masked figure calmly climbs one of the posts, preparing to strike. The hapless combatants finally look up in unison, faces twisted in fear. Jim Jordan launches himself.
|
|
#
?
Nov 23, 2021 22:17
|
|
|
F_Shit_Fitzgerald posted:Am I reading this right - the fuckers were found guilty and will have to pay? loving good. I had been hearing chatter about a hung jury. Shouldn't have taken the jury more than a minute to throw the book at these bastards. Yes, note that most of the defendants are broke / in prison / were in prison so this trial was mostly about preventing them from getting funding in the future and publicly pantsing them. Blood from a nazi stone and all that.
|
|
#
?
Nov 23, 2021 22:21
|
|
|
InsertPotPun posted:yes. i'm saying exactly that. Then what are you saying? Why bring up rightwing memes when they have nothing to do with what the Biden administration chooses to do?
|
|
#
?
Nov 23, 2021 22:23
|
|
|
Jaxyon posted:Trump's only claim to isolationist fame is not *technically* starting any shooting wars while in office, which while being a low bar, is a bar most presidents don't pass. To be fair, I’m not aware of Trump drone striking his own citizens because they were on an extrajudicial kill list, but yeah he wasn’t great either.
|
|
#
?
Nov 23, 2021 22:27
|
|
|
Kalli posted:Yes, note that most of the defendants are broke / in prison / were in prison so this trial was mostly about preventing them from getting funding in the future and publicly pantsing them. It also works the other way around. You can get blood from Nazis with stones.
|
|
#
?
Nov 23, 2021 22:28
|
|
|
The Onion did more to promote the Diamond Joe thing than any right wing media or right wing talking point ever did. That image of him only exists because of the onion.
|
|
#
?
Nov 23, 2021 22:32
|
|
|
HonorableTB posted:The Onion did more to promote the Diamond Joe thing than any right wing media or right wing talking point ever did. That image of him only exists because of the onion. The writer responsible for those depictions has apologized profusely, and hates Biden.
|
|
#
?
Nov 23, 2021 22:33
|
|
|
Kalli posted:Yes, note that most of the defendants are broke / in prison / were in prison so this trial was mostly about preventing them from getting funding in the future and publicly pantsing them. Yeah, its also to warn other groups that if they try this, its not Freedom of Speech and you will pay in the wallet.
|
|
#
?
Nov 23, 2021 22:34
|
|
|
Kalli posted:Yes, note that most of the defendants are broke / in prison / were in prison so this trial was mostly about preventing them from getting funding in the future and publicly pantsing them. It's the least that someone like Kessler deserves, and the money won't bring Heather Heyer back but I'll take it for sure.
|
|
#
?
Nov 23, 2021 22:35
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 24, 2024 14:38 |
|
|
What’s the word on HR1/Voting Rights act? It passed the house in March I saw, but doesn’t seem to have passed the Senate since? I understand Republican opposition but with a dem majority in the senate, why hasn’t it been passed?
|
|
#
?
Nov 23, 2021 22:37
|
|
