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Which horse film is your favorite? This poll is closed. |
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| Black Beauty |
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2 | 1.06% |
| A Talking Pony!?! |
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4 | 2.13% |
| Mr. Hands 2x Apple Flavor |
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117 | 62.23% |
| War Horse |
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11 | 5.85% |
| Mr. Hands |
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54 | 28.72% |
| Total: | 188 votes | ||
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Epic High Five posted:Anything out of Israel lately? They're super aggressive about vaccinations and tracking their effectiveness, and got cases almost immediately after it was discovered I think globally we are still at "no one has died of omicron". (where people have died in areas where omicron is common, meaning statistically it may have happened already, but no tracked case of omicron yet has lead to a specific death)
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Dec 9, 2021 19:39
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Fritz the Horse posted:I haven't seen any info and likewise my googling doesn't turn much up. It looks like the Phase 2/3 trials for 5-11 year olds happened this summer: https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMoa2116298 specifically starting mid-June for Pfizer Sure, I'm anticipating boosters (if they become available at all) would be somewhere around summer for the 5-11 age group. And my older daughter turns 12 in March anyway, so if 12-16 get boosters eventually she'd qualify then regardless. I'm just curious whether the child vaccine holds up against Omicron similarly to the 3 shots for adults, or at least a little better than 2 doses of the adult shot seems to. It's going to suck if I just got my kids the shot, and before they're even officially vaxxed a new strain comes along that escapes the vaccine enough for them that I have to keep stressing out. I get that some shots are better than none, but I really want my kids to be safe considering I can't guarantee they didn't inherit some of my terrible genes that make me more susceptible. Edit: https://www.cnn.com/2021/12/08/health/pfizer-omicron-vaccine-data/index.html This is the stuff I'm talking about, where two doses might not protect against infection whereas three doses is where it's at. While I appreciate and understand that hospitalization and death are lower risk for folks who have at least gotten the two dose regimen, I have a history of health issues that came about during my early teenage years which put me at higher risk for COVID. I'm concerned that my kids may have inherited some of those problems, though they have thankfully not been diagnosed as such yet. With that family history, I have concerns about making sure they're protected. Lager fucked around with this message at 20:51 on Dec 9, 2021 |
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Dec 9, 2021 20:42
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Owlofcreamcheese posted:I think globally we are still at "no one has died of omicron". Despite the deaths being attributed to B.1.1.529 by merit of it being the dominant strain and prior to admission and death, I don't have access to the same data that the quoted biostatistician has so no, I cannot provide what you require for "proof of a tracked case of omicron leading to a specific death." Can you actually say anything other spouting baseless pedantic denial? Can you actually prove your assertion that there have been no deaths, with actual data? I can tell you that between Dec 5th and Dec 8th in Gautang hospitals, some 76 patients have died and the number of patients on ventilators in has more than doubled in the last 4 days from 29-58, roughly matching the doubling interval of cases. I guess if you want to be fanciful you can imagine that they'll all get off the ventilators alive, or you can pretend the recent deaths are previous delta infections or whatever. See NICD Daily Reports for yourself, if you're interested. There are also other confounding factors to estimating the severity this early in a wave, given that we have various degrees of immunity in the omicron naive population and a variant that is re-infecting: https://twitter.com/nataliexdean/status/1468988174693289994 Does this rate of hospitalizations look mild enough to be unremarkable as well? https://twitter.com/rid1tweets/status/1468686815158808587 I'm sure you'll hand wave this all away, with no backing whatsoever but I loving loathe the idea that anyone reads your consistently poo poo posts and takes them as creditable, when mostly it's because engaging with you is a largely pointless exercise.
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Dec 9, 2021 20:55
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Lager posted:Sure, I'm anticipating boosters (if they become available at all) would be somewhere around summer for the 5-11 age group. And my older daughter turns 12 in March anyway, so if 12-16 get boosters eventually she'd qualify then regardless. you'd probably want to look up antibody titers after 2-shot regimen for 5-11 year olds and compare that to 2+booster in adults, that might give you a ballpark idea https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMoa2116298 Table 2 there I can't find the boosted adult Pfizer numbers offhand, I'm sure they're readily available I'm at work and don't have more than a couple min edit: also not sure how accurate a direct comparison of antibody titers in kids vs. adult is but it's a start? Fritz the Horse fucked around with this message at 21:10 on Dec 9, 2021 |
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Dec 9, 2021 21:04
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Fritz the Horse posted:you'd probably want to look up antibody titers after 2-shot regimen for 5-11 year olds and compare that to 2+booster in adults, that might give you a ballpark idea That is a good start, and thank you for getting me started on that road. I'll do some reading and try to nail down some information to see.
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Dec 9, 2021 21:16
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Blitter posted:Despite the deaths being attributed to B.1.1.529 by merit of it being the dominant strain and prior to admission and death, I don't have access to the same data that the quoted biostatistician has so no, I cannot provide what you require for "proof of a tracked case of omicron leading to a specific death." Can you actually say anything other spouting baseless pedantic denial? Can you actually prove your assertion that there have been no deaths, with actual data? So you said the same thing I said but more angry? "people have died in areas where omicron is common, meaning statistically it may have happened already, but no tracked case of omicron yet has lead to a specific death"
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Dec 9, 2021 21:58
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Blitter posted:I'm sure you'll hand wave this all away, with no backing whatsoever but I loving loathe the idea that anyone reads your consistently poo poo posts and takes them as creditable, when mostly it's because engaging with you is a largely pointless exercise. Why does pointing out all the reports from South Africa still say nobody has *yet* been shown to have died from Omicron make you so angry? I mean they may be wrong, but that's the statements being reported. I've seen no reports of a death attributable to Omicron in spite of your insistence. Rust Martialis fucked around with this message at 22:04 on Dec 9, 2021 |
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Dec 9, 2021 22:02
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Rust Martialis posted:Why does pointing out all the reports from South Africa still say nobody has *yet* been shown to have died from Omicron make you so angry? I mean they may be wrong, but that's the statements being reported. I've seen no reports of a death attributable to Omicron in spite of your insistence. Maybe not specifically yet, but I’d hold my breath a little longer https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2021-12-08/s-african-weekly-excess-deaths-almost-double-amid-omicron-wave quote:
Maybe it’s only a coincidence, though.
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Dec 9, 2021 22:08
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Owlofcreamcheese posted:So you said the same thing I said but more angry? There is an awful lot of tone-policing going on in pandemic discussion online.
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Dec 9, 2021 22:09
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Also, that region apparently has a high rate of resistant genetics, so if it's getting bad there...
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Dec 9, 2021 22:13
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mawarannahr posted:Maybe not specifically yet, but I’d hold my breath a little longer The question was if Israel had more specific data yet, the answer is that they do not, as not one who is doing a close enough tracing to provide that sort of data has not yet seen a death, let alone established a rate of deaths.
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Dec 9, 2021 22:22
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I'm really not sure why noting that there are no official death counts attributed to Omicron raises so much ire. Is the assumption that people who are observing that fact are dogwhistling that "Omicron isn't a threat"? That's not the impression I've gotten, but I'm also not combing through people's posting history in order to assign motives to their statements. For the record, I am 100% certain that the Omicron variant has killed people and will continue to kill people. Noting that there are no officially recorded deaths from the variant yet doesn't contradict that.
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Dec 9, 2021 22:28
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Castaign posted:I'm really not sure why noting that there are no official death counts attributed to Omicron raises so much ire. Is the assumption that people who are observing that fact are dogwhistling that "Omicron isn't a threat"? That's not the impression I've gotten, but I'm also not combing through people's posting history in order to assign motives to their statements. The entire mainstream media and Chise and co. credulously and endlessly reporting "zero deaths" in forums with comments where we can see the audience interpreting that as zero risk is definitely going to inform the conversation!
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Dec 9, 2021 22:39
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I am sure omicron *will* result in deaths, to be clear. But right now the limited data we have does not seem to support a worst-case scenario, and may be guardedly optimistic.
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Dec 9, 2021 22:42
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"Zero confirmed deaths so far from the particular variant" is not the same as "it's perfectly safe and won't kill anyone ever", and refusing to recognize that difference doesn't really make sense. If you want to yell at COVID denialists, you can find plenty of them on Twitter, you don't need to make massive leaps It is extremely silly to insist that people can't say things that are currently correct on an internet forum because those things superficially resemble lies people told a year ago.
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Dec 9, 2021 22:48
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Wang Commander posted:The entire mainstream media and Chise and co. credulously and endlessly reporting "zero deaths" in forums with comments where we can see the audience interpreting that as zero risk is definitely going to inform the conversation! I guess my media exposure is different. I don't follow Chise, and everything that I've been seeing from the MSM is literally "we still don't know how the severity stacks up to other variants." Main Paineframe posted:It is extremely silly to insist that people can't say things that are currently correct on an internet forum because those things superficially resemble lies people told a year ago. 
Castaign fucked around with this message at 22:51 on Dec 9, 2021 |
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Dec 9, 2021 22:48
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Wang Commander posted:The entire mainstream media and Chise and co. credulously and endlessly reporting "zero deaths" in forums with comments where we can see the audience interpreting that as zero risk is definitely going to inform the conversation! I mean, even Feigl-Ding is backpaddling to try to explain what's happening. He went from hyperbolic "the vaccines you knew are basically useless, natural immunity to this won't exist, this is a whole new pandemic" to "uhh, uhh, deaths and hospitalization are rising at a slower rate because vaccines are working so well" over the last two weeks. He's still spinning it as ultimate doom, but even the doomer messiahs is admitting he didn't get the megadeath he promised and having to revise downwards.
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Dec 9, 2021 22:50
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I've been using KN95 masks for grocery shopping (or whenever I go in a building that's not my house) because they're cheap, not prioritized for health care personnel, and better than cloth masks. Since Omicron may be more contagious - that preliminary study from Japan is worrying - I've been looking into N95s. I found a Huffington Post article, updated October 14, with some recommendations: https://www.huffpost.com/entry/best-n95-kn95-masks-delta_l_61265f29e4b0f562f3d98ba2 Key quote: "The CDC doesn't recommend that the general public wear N95 respirators that are prioritized for health care workers. But some manufacturers that started producing N95s at the onset of the pandemic were unable to secure contracts with the health care system due to "ingrained purchasing habits," so they sell masks to the general public." Essentially, it recommended a couple N95 mask brands that NIOSH-approved, and I can buy them "guilt-free" (the article's choice of words) because the companies making them couldn't land a contract with the medical industry and are selling to the public instead. I'm not taking away any masks that someone putting their life on the line to save other lives might need. The price on N95s is much higher than the price for KN95s. I live on a budget, so I ordered a box of Protective Health Gear N95 masks, but I plan to use them specifically for the situations that worry me the most - when I'm donating blood to the Red Cross (every 2 months) or when I'm at a hospital (hopefully this will not be often, but when someone in my household needs a trip for whatever reason, including routine checkups, I'm their transportation). I won't be eligible for my Pfizer booster until mid-January because my own limited form of vaccine hesitancy is biting me on the rear end (I didn't get my 2nd Pfizer dose until mid-July). That's 100% on me. At the time I made the excuse to myself that I should let everyone else who needed the vaccine more get theirs first, but I definitely delayed longer than I should have, and relented only when it became blinding obvious that YES EVERYONE ELSE IN YOUR PART OF THE USA CAN EASILY GET VACCINATED NOW YOU'RE OUT OF EXCUSES, IDIOT.
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Dec 9, 2021 22:58
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StratGoatCom posted:Also, that region apparently has a high rate of resistant genetics, so if it's getting bad there... What? Is this in reference to APOBEC3
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Dec 9, 2021 22:58
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Victar posted:or when I'm at a hospital (hopefully this will not be often, but when someone in my household needs a trip for whatever reason, including routine checkups, I'm their transportation). Heads up that if it's anything like Canada (Ontario specifically), you'll most likely be told to take off your N95 and put on a surgical mask when you're screened at the entrance. 95% of the time you can usually convince them to allow you to put the surgical mask over the N95.
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Dec 9, 2021 23:16
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enki42 posted:Heads up that if it's anything like Canada (Ontario specifically), you'll most likely be told to take off your N95 and put on a surgical mask when you're screened at the entrance. 95% of the time you can usually convince them to allow you to put the surgical mask over the N95. I've never heard of that practice. In my part of the USA, the hospital requires masks but I think they allow plain cloth masks. They never had any problem with my KN95 masks. Hospitals here also restrict entry to the patient and one accompanying person, or two accompanying people if the patient is a child. Our local hospitals haven't been completely overwhelmed, although they have come worrisomely close at times. I am convinced that is at least partly because of the local mask mandate. Lots of places in the USA either have no mandate or watered-down mandates; here, pretty much every business requires a mask when inside, at the risk of a hefty fine.
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Dec 9, 2021 23:28
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Got the booster yesterday evening, Pfizer variant. Nothing till today, just sore joints.
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Dec 9, 2021 23:34
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Denmark ICUs getting slammed. They should've been in lockdown a while ago.
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Dec 9, 2021 23:55
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Victar posted:I've been using KN95 masks for grocery shopping (or whenever I go in a building that's not my house) because they're cheap, not prioritized for health care personnel, and better than cloth masks. Those N95s in the HuffPost article are expensive. Is there any reason not to use construction masks? Something like the 3m 8210+ N95s? 28ish dollars for 20 at Home Depot. There are also the 3m aura 9205+ that seem great if you wear glasses but are on the smaller side. 22 for 10. As far as I understand it, they’re functionally the same as medical N95s, but marketed for non medical uses. That was the impression I got on one of the mask testing sites that has been linked in the thread. I’ve been teaching in them this semester, and I’ve been much happier with them compared to any kn95s I’ve tried. Here are the ones I’m using. https://www.homedepot.com/p/3M-N95-Particulate-Performance-Disposable-Paint-Prep-Respirator-20-Pack-8210PP20-DC/304748236
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Dec 10, 2021 00:14
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Victar posted:Hospitals here also restrict entry to the patient and one accompanying person, or two accompanying people if the patient is a child. Yeah, we don't even get that. You can get an exemption for a support person if you need it, but it's a written thing that needs to be arranged beforehand by your clinic, otherwise it's just you (if you're admitted you're allowed two people to visit, they get written exemptions as well).
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Dec 10, 2021 01:12
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Owlofcreamcheese posted:So you said the same thing I said but more angry? You should read the thread by Natalie E. Dean, PhD, Asst Professor of Biostatistics at @EmoryRollins, specializing in emerging infectious diseases and vaccine study design. It’s good.
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Dec 10, 2021 01:14
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Boonoo posted:Is there any reason not to use construction masks? Something like the 3m 8210+ N95s? 28ish dollars for 20 at Home Depot. There are also the 3m aura 9205+ that seem great if you wear glasses but are on the smaller side. 22 for 10. They have the same filtration abilities, but the lack a fluid-resistant outer layer. Because of that, they’re not FDA-approved class II medical devices, suitable for use in operating room. That’s what separates them from medical N95s. If they’re on the shelves at Home Depot, you can buy them without guilt. They are made and marketed to protect your body from everyday hazards like drywall dust.
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Dec 10, 2021 01:20
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Boonoo posted:Those N95s in the HuffPost article are expensive. The 8210 and 9210s are CSPAM-thread approved! I just ordered a bunch of them, myself. Only trust your respirator.
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Dec 10, 2021 01:24
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"only trust your respirator" Are there other folks itt who just kind of assume that they're going to get covid at some point? I understand that some people are immune compromised or have other conditions that make infection way more dangerous, so I get that, I really do. But I don't and I figure that since this is going to be with us for years and years to come I will eventually catch it, probably multiple times. I guess I'm trading off the sense of anxiety for a sense of inevitability, which may or may not be a fair trade at all. Curious if anybody else feels similarly.
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Dec 10, 2021 01:31
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Just because we all have to die sometime doesn’t mean I should take up smoking, drinking to excess and unprotected sex with strangers.
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Dec 10, 2021 01:34
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How are u posted:"only trust your respirator" It's always sort of a balancing act when a lot of people treat it as binary. I don't think anyone here is in the position where absolutely any risk whatsoever is completely unacceptable and they won't leave their house under any circumstances, and similarly no one is just open mouth kissing everyone they see for fun. I check off most places criteria for "severely immunocompromised" for 4 separate medications I'm on, and even my transplanted kidney is not in awesome shape (a less than ideal surgery). If I got COVID my odds are probably not amazing, even with vaccination. I still have activities I'm willing to take a risk on (sending my kids to school, seeing close family, distanced outdoor visits with friends, outdoor dining at well spaced out places when it's warm out and cases are low), because my situation isn't getting any better, I almost certainly don't have the most amazing life expectancy anyway, and it would be depressing as gently caress if I wasted time on absolutely zero social or family contact, or caused my family to suffer in a misguided attempt to protect me. That's my personal risk calculus, I understand that people have different ones (most much more risk-tolerant than mine, some more). I'm not going to expose myself to unnecessary risk, and I realize "unnecessary risk" is different for each person, but I think anyone who says "no risk whatsoever" is either not being honest with themselves and is taking some risks, or is overly fixated on COVID when they wouldn't take risks they'd happily take in more normal contexts.
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Dec 10, 2021 01:47
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How are u posted:"only trust your respirator" The less times you gamble with being disabled by that virus, the better for all of us, and the less likely you are to be a source that gives it to others.
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Dec 10, 2021 01:54
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How are u posted:
Yes. I completely assume I'll get it. But a) I'm not going to let that bother me too much and b) take every possible precaution re: masking and social distancing as well as boosters the second they are availible to me and c) stay informed. So when I get it, I'll be as well protected as possible and more importantly try to limit the initial exposure so my immune system has as much chance as possible to deal with it. Maybe with the masks and social distancing (I like social distancing, I've always disliked crowds) I'll never get it after all and with booster shot I'll never notice I've had it...? I dont know but I'm just simply going to do the right things and if it happens, it happens.
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Dec 10, 2021 02:03
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enki42 posted:It's always sort of a balancing act when a lot of people treat it as binary. I don't think anyone here is in the position where absolutely any risk whatsoever is completely unacceptable and they won't leave their house under any circumstances, and similarly no one is just open mouth kissing everyone they see for fun. I just wanted to say that I appreciated hearing this well-considered viewpoint on how personal circumstance impacts risk assessment. I wish you the very best and hope that you are able to enjoy life as much as possible while keeping yourself safe.
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Dec 10, 2021 02:19
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I agree that it's likely that I (and pretty much everyone else who lives long enough) will get it eventually. However, that doesn't necessarily mean that your risk calculus now should be the same as it might be "eventually." Given that treatment options are improving, vaccination options are improving, knowledge about the virus is increasing, etc., the consequences for you of getting it now, and for other people if you give it to other people, are probably still more significant now than they may be later. So while going to unreasonable lengths to protect yourself may not be entirely healthy either, that doesn't mean it's time to go "back to normal," whatever that means for you (and, of course, that's not even considering the current state of healthcare services).
Sir John Falstaff fucked around with this message at 02:49 on Dec 10, 2021 |
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Dec 10, 2021 02:47
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The case was better for “you’ll catch it someday. Why not tomorrow?” before Omicron came along. At this point, isn’t dodging Delta looking like a good play?
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Dec 10, 2021 02:52
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On an individual level you should take as many precautions as you're comfortable with as long as they don't start to negatively affect your mental state. Of course this doesn't account for unavoidable stuff that's above your tolerance threshold.
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Dec 10, 2021 02:52
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Oracle posted:Just because we all have to die sometime doesn’t mean I should take up smoking, drinking to excess and unprotected sex with strangers. Most people do end up having sex and drinking sometimes though. Even though there is always some level of risk.
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Dec 10, 2021 02:52
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How are u posted:"only trust your respirator" A few years back I had to travel frequently for my job and didn't have kids. If that were still the case I'd be much more invested in respirators.
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Dec 10, 2021 03:58
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StratGoatCom posted:Also, that region apparently has a high rate of resistant genetics, so if it's getting bad there... Surely what South Africa has is a high rate of people with HIV/AIDS, which is the exact opposite? How are u posted:"only trust your respirator" Yes. This is a dramatic change to where I was mentally six months ago, corresponding to Australia's COVID-zero dam being breached, and it wasn't an easy adjustment to make. But in some senses I think it might have been easier for me than for Americans or Europeans who were more or less abandoned by their governments from the get-go: I know that we tried, we really, really did, but in the end it just wasn't possible to keep it out forever. I'm still worried about my immunocompromised partner and my elderly relatives, but I know that they're all vaccinated, and again, that we live in a country that's doing everything it takes to try to minimise and control spread so that hospitals never get overloaded. Which, again, I think probably makes a lot of difference in accepting the inevitable.
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Dec 10, 2021 04:38
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