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This is the power of math, people. 6 team members minus 1 is 5 team members left.
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Dec 10, 2021 01:32
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Cojawfee posted:This is the power of math, people. 6 team members minus 1 is 5 team members left. They got Lieutenant Liability out of the way early!
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Dec 10, 2021 01:40
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LOL Discovery is written by sociopaths. Incredible.
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Dec 10, 2021 02:14
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How many Star Trek episodes has some red shirt died in? Of that population, how many ended with some sort of somber reflection on the fact that a red shirt had died? It's a lot smaller than 100%. And it happens in every Star Trek series. Lower Decks even made a joke about it in the Ren Faire episode, with Rutherford being like "I even got 'blown up!' Haha!" It's like Starfleet people pretty much expect to die. What better way to train your cadets then to kill off one of 'em and power on with smiles? I know there's a theory out there that Starfleet contains the most gung-ho, go for it, gonna-walk-into-radiation-that-will-kill-me-to-save-everyone-else people and it's a tiny, tiny subsection of everyone who is in the population of every planet. Kinda makes putting families on the D seem pretty psychotic. ashpanash fucked around with this message at 02:28 on Dec 10, 2021 |
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Dec 10, 2021 02:20
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OK, better episode structure overall, It had some diplomacy and an away mission full of recruits gone wrong very TNG. But god drat the writing is just painfully dumb. I can't believe there's anyone who looks at this script and goes "that's acceptable" It's like Dr who levels of bad at this point. Burnham saying she will represent both the federation and Nivar because she understands both places (and she's "trained in logic" LMAO) but like the last time she was around any Vulcans was 1000 years ago before Nivar was even formed. It would be like electing Cnut the great as British PM. She still sucks as a character and she's a terrible actor also. Tilly stuff: OK random gamma ray burst, lazy but whatever. I can't figure out if this is written by children or just for them. Hey gang teamwork is good, have you tried talking to each other? Oh that solved all your racial prejudice problems immediately? cool. The characters just plainly announce their feelings. I imagine the direction is like "ok in this scene your motivation is you need to read these line from the script and point sometimes" Why was Adira even there? did it develop the character in any way? why just immediately volunteer to do all the dangerous parts of the mission? I don't remember the character being reckless/ overly brave before. Oh and the CGI creature things were a visual mess. Book stuff was ok comparatively and I enjoyed Greys mullet, bring back the space mullet.
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Dec 10, 2021 02:44
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ashpanash posted:How many Star Trek episodes has some red shirt died in? Of that population, how many ended with some sort of somber reflection on the fact that a red shirt had died? Is this really true? There's a TNG episode where the A-plot is just, "An away-team member died, here's the crew dealing with the aftermath."
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Dec 10, 2021 05:52
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ashpanash posted:How many Star Trek episodes has some red shirt died in? Of that population, how many ended with some sort of somber reflection on the fact that a red shirt had died? There's also an episode where an accident happens in a training mission, nobody dies, but it's taken very seriously and it comes back up later in another episode when one of those cadets tries to redeem herself and ends up fuckin dying, Picard makes note of it but like still room to give him and the writers some flak for how that's resolved/not. The issue really isn't that this rando character died in isolation, even if they want to be dripping in emotion stuff and somehow dodged that one, the issue is every episode so far has featured somebody needlessly dying, even when they're being Good for Disco, it's just Something that they keep tossing lives away. Also their medical tech can't help some of these victims, ffs, they took picard's corpse, scraped his brain, dumped him into a computer with another dude, scraped him out of that, then plopped him in someone else's robot body XXX years ago! programmable matter cant program the shape of a body, replicators just cant sort out guts? gimme a break why are people dying, you can solve mortality ezpz.
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Dec 10, 2021 07:20
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The Starfleet response to a training exercise leaving someone dead is giving the instructor a permanent position training new cadets.
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Dec 10, 2021 07:20
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Nichael posted:The Starfleet response to a training exercise leaving someone dead is giving the instructor a permanent position training new cadets. The pilot (who wasn’t a cadet) was killed by a freak anomaly and the instructor managed to get all of her cadets safely back to the ship after a crash landing on an inhospitable planet.
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Dec 10, 2021 08:41
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I truly thought that Tilly's exchange with the female cadet -- "I'm a trained pilot, I can help!"/"Stay in your seat, that's an order!" -- would end up being relevant. Tilly would spend the episode kicking herself for not listening, for not properly utilizing the skills of those under her command, a decision that resulted in someone's death. She would learn that part of command is delegating. Nope. Completely forgotten. I truly thought that part of the cadets' survival would hinge on their unique skills, and they'd learn ~a lesson about working together~. Nope. They trudge up a mountain, spend most of it bickering, they have one conversation about one character's grievances, then they shoot at the thing Tilly told them not to shoot at. The female cadet added nothing. The conflict between the Andorian and Tellarite was paper-thin. And if someone's legs are encased in ice, why is pulling forward on them the solution? Adira's knees would have snapped. And I'm annoyed by how in episodes 1-2, Tilly was on a mission where someone (the station commander) was killed, and everyone felt the need to console her. "I'm so sorry for what you went through!" says Saru. Waaahh, someone I just met died. But in this episode, Tilly literally commanded a mission where her bad call got someone killed -- and everyone yukked it up. "Just another day at the office!" At least we didn't get the ridiculous PATIENT DECEASED tricorder display this time. The show is getting better. But it's got a long drat way to go, and it's still very much "first draft writing." Really, the Federation President needed to resort to complex subterfuge and hoping Michael would get her veiled hints, just to propose a committee? Really, all the cadets had to do was hike up a hill with their tech turned off? These are the OMG AWESOME solutions the writers come up with? Feh.
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Dec 10, 2021 09:51
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Khanstant posted:There's also an episode where an accident happens in a training mission, nobody dies, but it's taken very seriously and it comes back up later in another episode when one of those cadets tries to redeem herself and ends up fuckin dying, Picard makes note of it but like still room to give him and the writers some flak for how that's resolved/not. Typical Pubbie posted:I laughed out loud when the Tellerite stopped everything to blame the Orion for slavery, and Adira was like, "Hey, don't you know that guy's dad was ABRAHAM LINCOLN?" 
DaveKap fucked around with this message at 12:17 on Dec 10, 2021 |
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Dec 10, 2021 11:25
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I laughed out loud when the Tellerite stopped everything to blame the Orion for slavery, and Adira was like, "Hey, don't you know that guy's dad was ABRAHAM LINCOLN?"
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Dec 10, 2021 12:00
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Typical Pubbie posted:I laughed out loud when the Tellerite stopped everything to blame the Orion for slavery, and Adira was like, "Hey, don't you know that guy's dad was ABRAHAM LINCOLN?" Wait did this actually happen? Like discovery's writing has often been so dire I seriously can't even tell if it's a joke. Like I think it is... but ah man I don't know.
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Dec 10, 2021 13:10
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Typical Pubbie posted:Is this really true? There's a TNG episode where the A-plot is just, "An away-team member died, here's the crew dealing with the aftermath." Even in TOS usually when a Red Shirt dies Kirk gives his sad but stoic, I didn't want this to happen face. Or Sito Jaxa where the whole announcement is made to the crew.
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Dec 10, 2021 14:46
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There’s definitely a couple TOS episodes where a bunch of dudes die and nobody cares at all, but the opposite pops up in the weirdest places. Like Kirk gets all glum thinking about the man he lost at the end of the loving Halloween episode with the witches and the giant cat, seriously.
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Dec 10, 2021 15:23
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The ending of Voyager was very much of a "We need to go back in time and make sure that none of the main characters die." Janeway never thinks about trying to find a way to go back in time to stop them from entering the Delta Quadrant, which killed almost half of the Voyager crew, and she doesn't try to go back in time to fix the Caretaker Array without getting them stuck there, which would have saved the lives of all her crew who died in the Delta Quadrant.
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Dec 10, 2021 15:36
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Epicurius posted:The ending of Voyager was very much of a "We need to go back in time and make sure that none of the main characters die." Janeway never thinks about trying to find a way to go back in time to stop them from entering the Delta Quadrant, which killed almost half of the Voyager crew, and she doesn't try to go back in time to fix the Caretaker Array without getting them stuck there, which would have saved the lives of all her crew who died in the Delta Quadrant. Would have to solve the problem left in the Alpha Quadrant where Torres, Chakotay, and the rest of the Maqui would be imprisoned then. "Oh no wait, Torres becomes my chief engineer!" "No I don't STARFLEET!" *Original Chief Engineer* "What the gently caress I die?"
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Dec 10, 2021 15:50
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Epicurius posted:The ending of Voyager was very much of a "We need to go back in time and make sure that none of the main characters die." Janeway never thinks about trying to find a way to go back in time to stop them from entering the Delta Quadrant, which killed almost half of the Voyager crew, and she doesn't try to go back in time to fix the Caretaker Array without getting them stuck there, which would have saved the lives of all her crew who died in the Delta Quadrant. Although weren't Voyager's initial casualties surprisingly light? Basically the First Officer, the CMO, the head nurse, the chief engineer and the pilot. Conveniently opening up vacancies that could be filled perfectly by newcomers...
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Dec 10, 2021 15:54
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Typical Pubbie posted:Is this really true? There's a TNG episode where the A-plot is just, "An away-team member died, here's the crew dealing with the aftermath." One of my favorite Trek episodes, Civil Defense, has a couple of people being vaporized and it's just like, "oh well!"
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Dec 10, 2021 16:28
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dr_rat posted:Wait did this actually happen? Like discovery's writing has often been so dire I seriously can't even tell if it's a joke. Like I think it is... but ah man I don't know. Yes, this happened. Then the next scene has the Tellerite literally patting the Orion on the back. They are friends now see!
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Dec 10, 2021 17:34
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DaveKap posted:I'm pretty sure I know which episodes you're talking about and I want you to know that someone actually does die in the training mission episode. It's a Wesley episode and Tom Paris's actor is the lead of his elite squadron, making for some hilarious Tom Paris conspiracy theories. They're practicing a banned flying formation for their graduation ceremony and one of the kids dies. The episode the cadet tries to redeem herself in is actually called Lower Decks and is a hugely impactful, tear-jerking episode by the end. Picard announces her death to the entire ship and it's weighty as gently caress. Go watch both episodes again, the first one is called "The First Duty" and has a great Picard monologue, and as a pair they're fantastic. I watched em a couple months ago and commented about them, upset at Picard and tbh I still 1% hold it against him, my brain is just full of holes so I forgot someone died not that they almost did.
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Dec 10, 2021 17:34
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Epicurius posted:The ending of Voyager was very much of a "We need to go back in time and make sure that none of the main characters die." Janeway never thinks about trying to find a way to go back in time to stop them from entering the Delta Quadrant, which killed almost half of the Voyager crew, and she doesn't try to go back in time to fix the Caretaker Array without getting them stuck there, which would have saved the lives of all her crew who died in the Delta Quadrant. Janeway was very specifically going back in time to save her pet Borg. Everything else is ancillary to that.
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Dec 10, 2021 17:43
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ashpanash posted:One of my favorite Trek episodes, Civil Defense, has a couple of people being vaporized and it's just like, "oh well!" This is one of my favorite Trek episodes as well. The phrase 'Attention Bajorian Workers!' will always be in the back of my mind.
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Dec 10, 2021 18:07
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Khanstant posted:I watched em a couple months ago and commented about them, upset at Picard and tbh I still 1% hold it against him, my brain is just full of holes so I forgot someone died not that they almost did. Hey now, she could still be alive. In a Cardassian prison camp right before they ended up on the wrong side of Galaxy War 2 and got stomped by the entire Alpha Quadrant 
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Dec 10, 2021 18:30
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skasion posted:Hey now, she could still be alive. In a Cardassian prison camp right before they ended up on the wrong side of Galaxy War 2 and got stomped by the entire Alpha Quadrant I will forgive Picard when she shows up with an eyepatch and bionic arm and a ship clearly cobbled together from federation shuttle debris and cardassian vessels, and they have an adventure together or maybe a season long arc. If Picard can get that worked up over a planet of assholes nobody cares about and that he only cared about off-screen so the show could happen poorly, then he can care about the ensign he was a dick too and sent on a suicide run.
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Dec 10, 2021 18:42
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FlamingLiberal posted:I looked it up and apparently Mary Wiseman has said that she is in another episode this season "Oh no, Michael's not going to reach the big button in time because the redacted are shooting at her! She's defenseless in that space suit!" In swoops a new vessel. Who could it be? "Answering incoming hail from a Captain... Killy?" "Just kidding you guys. It's me Tilly. Um... Acting Captain Tilly." The camera spins around 30 times in all orientations showing her crew of... the cadets? Wait, no. In one frame you can see they have become ensigns. Insert 15 minute scene where she says hi and bye to everyone. The ship fires a single phaser blast, completely disabling the attacking ship. Micheal saves the universe.
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Dec 10, 2021 19:35
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That is exactly what will happen.
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Dec 10, 2021 20:33
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Butternubs posted:It would be like electing Cnut the great as British PM To be fair this might be an improvement. dr_rat posted:Wait did this actually happen? Like discovery's writing has often been so dire I seriously can't even tell if it's a joke. Like I think it is... but ah man I don't know. You know the answer in your heart.
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Dec 10, 2021 21:19
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ashpanash posted:One of my favorite Trek episodes, Civil Defense, has a couple of people being vaporized and it's just like, "oh well!" https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jZa84PAZQeg
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Dec 10, 2021 21:53
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It's crazy that they did a multi-episode buildup to giving Grey a real physical body, but then didn't have him interact with any of the other characters but Adira.
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Dec 10, 2021 23:48
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Actual Satan posted:It's crazy that they did a multi-episode buildup to giving Grey a real physical body, but then didn't have him interact with any of the other characters but Adira. Gray will be the big sacrifice at the half way or finale of the season.
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Dec 10, 2021 23:59
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I thought they were going to grow some conflict out of Gray changing how he looks after going corporeal, as though being inside Adira's mind forced him to be viewed from the perspective Adira wanted and not the one Gray wanted. Could have written some solid Trek morals out of that. But yeah, I didn't even think about the fact Gray doesn't interact with anyone but Adira. I'm, for some reason, gonna give them the benefit of the doubt and say this was a Tilly/Burnham episode and they couldn't think of any way to make Gray's C-Plot interact with any of it, so next episode is when Gray chills with the crew. Like I said before, we're 2 episodes without the bridge even being shown, so the entourage episode has to be coming next. (I'm sure I'll eat these words.)
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Dec 11, 2021 00:24
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I kind of agree with the Greatest Gen guys that Grey may end up leaving the show this season to go back to Trill to train as a Guardian or something like that
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Dec 11, 2021 01:27
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Grand Fromage posted:You know the answer in your heart. Oh.  Burning_Monk posted:Yes, this happened. Then the next scene has the Tellerite literally patting the Orion on the back. They are friends now see! Oh....
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Dec 11, 2021 02:42
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DaveKap posted:But yeah, I didn't even think about the fact Gray doesn't interact with anyone but Adira. I'm, for some reason, gonna give them the benefit of the doubt and say this was a Tilly/Burnham episode and they couldn't think of any way to make Gray's C-Plot interact with any of it, so next episode is when Gray chills with the crew. Like I said before, we're 2 episodes without the bridge even being shown, so the entourage episode has to be coming next. (I'm sure I'll eat these words.) I agree. Adira was a main point-of-view character and it would seem really odd to show an Adira-focused episode without some view of their partner, whose stories are very closely entwined. That said, DS9 wouldn't have cared. And as you say...I'm sure I'll eat these words. Nonetheless, it was the right choice. Burning_Monk posted:Yes, this happened. Then the next scene has the Tellerite literally patting the Orion on the back. They are friends now see! Yeah, while I'll defend a lot of the episode's choices because I think it was a much more competently constructed episode of Star Trek than we have grown to expect out of Disco, it sure as hell wasn't amazing, and it had moments like these that served to remind you that this is still, indeed, Discovery, and thus we don't have any reason to expect it to really get that much better. Credit where credit is due (and no further) is all I'm saying. ashpanash fucked around with this message at 03:35 on Dec 11, 2021 |
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Dec 11, 2021 03:32
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Yeah it was definitely an episode of star trek. Parts were still a little awkward like you'd expect from a first season episode, but it was sufficiently treky. Miles ahead of Picard.
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Dec 11, 2021 03:45
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Can we talk about how, according to the latest episode, membership in the Federation isn't voluntary?
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Dec 11, 2021 05:23
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Typical Pubbie posted:Can we talk about how, according to the latest episode, membership in the Federation isn't voluntary? what
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Dec 11, 2021 05:25
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Typical Pubbie posted:Can we talk about how, according to the latest episode, membership in the Federation isn't voluntary? They aren't forcing people to join the federation, they are just saying that you can't just have an exit clause for whenever things get too tough for you. The president was right when she said that allowing people to quit whenever they wanted would lead to a weak federation that would fall apart whenever things got difficult.
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Dec 11, 2021 05:28
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The federation is like one of those services where you can join on line with a simple form, but to leave you have to actually have to call up and spend like three hours on the phone. Now I'm not saying the federations can be jerks but...
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Dec 11, 2021 05:32
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