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Geisladisk posted:Don't worry, a 100 point FOW army is extremely quick to print. 15mm models don't take a lot of space on print plates. Yes 15mm WW2 minis are very suitable for a quick tabletop quality paintjob. Imho if you just put down some drybrushing on the uniforms, dab on some flesh colour, apply some washes and then spend some time on the bases rather than the minis, you’ll have a great looking force in no time.
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Dec 13, 2021 06:27
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Post results!
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Dec 13, 2021 12:55
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lilljonas posted:Yes 15mm WW2 minis are very suitable for a quick tabletop quality paintjob. Imho if you just put down some drybrushing on the uniforms, dab on some flesh colour, apply some washes and then spend some time on the bases rather than the minis, you’ll have a great looking force in no time. Contrast paints are also basically cheating on 15mm infantry models
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Dec 13, 2021 15:07
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Geisladisk posted:Contrast paints are also basically cheating on 15mm infantry models Got a list of good contrast mixes/paint equivalents for historical uniform colors?
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Dec 13, 2021 16:07
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This one uses 28mm but it's the same idea.
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Dec 13, 2021 16:44
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You can also prime with a flat khaki and use contrasts and inks to effectively tone and tint it. Contrasts seem to work better as a wash+ when applied to a different color.
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Dec 13, 2021 16:48
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Oh my god this is amazing thank you
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Dec 13, 2021 19:08
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Saw this 100% pure distilled grognard post on facebook today:grognard in a napoleonic facebook group posted:I have been on this page for awhile now and been gaming since I was 16. I am now 70 and a retired curator of military collections and a working as a military uniform consultant for sculptors and published author on Civil War Uniforms. I prefaced what I said for one reason. I have seen a growing lack of research as to the proper (not the box art) that the soldiers wore during the time period they represent. I find the worse offenders of this being two of the major plastic makers. I do not know what has happened to researching out your project and coming up with the right dress for the period. Even to the point of a different dress for different stages of the wars. Research is a prime player in our hobby and it seems to be losing the following it once had. Now we go by what is on the box as gospel and that is where it ends. But it is not the new guys in this hobby but some of the older ones who I would not have expected it out of. One fellow told me that the Russian Cossacks wore blue uniform pants. Now this guy is a Air Force Major (that may be the problem) and you would expect more. I asked why do you say that? He replied ! Because the box showed it! Oh well you can not fix stupid. But what I am saying is stop looking at TV or the movies for your color guides. Go to the internet and research out what you are doing. I had to grab my grandson by the ears and make him look at my library to get the right information and then back that up with more research. Research that unit you are building. Find the Brigade or Division or Army. Find the quirks of the unit in it's uniform. And do not use Sharpes Rifles for anything but a good laugh at what is presented as history on TV. Anyway if your knickers go bunched up so be it. Been at this to long to think other wise.
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Dec 13, 2021 22:33
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The pants seem pretty blue to me.
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Dec 13, 2021 22:52
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Hook that post up to my veins Edit: even though I don’t actually bother with that degree of accuracy. I do the research and then decide what looks best lenoon fucked around with this message at 23:20 on Dec 13, 2021 |
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Dec 13, 2021 23:00
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moths posted:You can also prime with a flat khaki and use contrasts and inks to effectively tone and tint it. Class Warcraft posted:quote
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Dec 13, 2021 23:31
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Pierzak posted:
Please don't feed the grogs.
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Dec 13, 2021 23:35
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Noted, I will paint all of my uniforms the one standard color they were in real life.
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Dec 13, 2021 23:35
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Everybody knows Air Force Majors are a loving trash source for cossack pant colours anyway.
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Dec 14, 2021 00:20
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long-rear end nips Diane posted:Noted, I will paint all of my uniforms the one standard color they were in real life. Paint your dudes black & white or shades of sepia and cite period photos as reference.
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Dec 14, 2021 00:23
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Child Abuse For Accurate Trouser Shade
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Dec 14, 2021 00:26
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Springfield Fatts posted:Child Abuse For Accurate Trouser Shade
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Dec 14, 2021 00:30
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Pierzak posted:Paint your dudes black & white or shades of sepia and cite period photos as reference. This is hilarious and I want to do it now
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Dec 14, 2021 00:51
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Class Warcraft posted:Saw this 100% pure distilled grognard post on facebook today: Ah yes, go to the internet for your research, where sizeable groups of grogs parrot the same “facts” back and forth that usually originated somewhere in the imagination of a forms poster in 1998. Also Cossacks are one of the most wildly variable units in terms of uniform, both due to lack of standardisation and because they stole poo poo constantly from the enemy, probably including their pants.
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Dec 14, 2021 06:50
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Class Warcraft posted:Saw this 100% pure distilled grognard post on facebook today: Pierzak posted:Paint your dudes black & white or shades of sepia and cite period photos as reference.
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Dec 14, 2021 11:34
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quote:And do not use Sharpes Rifles for anything but a good laugh at what is presented as history on TV You mean it's not a documentary? 
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Dec 14, 2021 14:20
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JcDent posted:You mean it's not a documentary? I'm sure they just mean that the TV show spiced up some stories and missed a few characters from Sharpe in real life history.
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Dec 14, 2021 15:10
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Pierzak posted:Paint your dudes black & white or shades of sepia and cite period photos as reference. Several years ago someone did a demo game based on the movie Nosferatu in black and white:  Link. I've also seen WWI minis done like this, but can't find pics quickly.
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Dec 14, 2021 16:30
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Every time I start a new Bolt Action army and they get to the zenithal stage, I always tell myself I should leave them like that for a B&W army.
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Dec 14, 2021 17:19
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Edgar Allen Ho posted:Everybody knows Air Force Majors are loving trash.
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Dec 14, 2021 17:52
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Cessna posted:Several years ago someone did a demo game based on the movie Nosferatu in black and white: Yeah I tried that nosferatu game at a con many years ago, it was amazing.
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Dec 14, 2021 18:44
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I feel like the point of doing all that research is also so you can make an informed decision about how to paint your little mans. Imagine how embarrassing it is to use Russians equipped with British Brown Bess muskets when playing before the Russians had access to those if you do it by mistake?? We have a club member who will never stop hearing about Bessgate. Using British tanks painted in Caunter camouflage for the battle of Gazala because it is the coolest thing ever, but you know it’s wrong because you bought all of those spiral bound books on British tank camouflage with handmade paint swatches from the author that still accepts payment by mailing cash in an envelope. That’s just a choice to be respected!
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Dec 14, 2021 18:59
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zokie posted:I feel like the point of doing all that research is also so you can make an informed decision about how to paint your little mans. This but unironically
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Dec 14, 2021 19:24
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For my part, it continues to be a wonder to me that someone can possess enough imagination to look at a couple dozen identical toys mounted atop an unchanging rectangle of terrain and see a Napoleonic battalion, but be unable to move past the odd mispainted epaulette. Why is it that tabletop gaming, a hobby absolutely chock full of abstraction, seems to cultivate a community utterly devoted to simulation?
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Dec 14, 2021 20:54
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Class Warcraft posted:For my part, it continues to be a wonder to me that someone can possess enough imagination to look at a couple dozen identical toys mounted atop an unchanging rectangle of terrain and see a Napoleonic battalion, but be unable to move past the odd mispainted epaulette. If I don't uphold absurd standards, how will I feel superior to others?
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Dec 14, 2021 21:02
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zokie posted:Using British tanks painted in Caunter camouflage for the battle of Gazala because it is the coolest thing ever, but you know it’s wrong because you bought all of those spiral bound books on British tank camouflage with handmade paint swatches from the author that still accepts payment by mailing cash in an envelope. That’s just a choice to be respected! I just got a 1/2 dozen vehicles for a Bolt Action army for Libya/Greece/Crete - I need that book. I can't find out what the trucks/ Bren Gun Carriers and tanks used in Greece were painted. The 1 or 2 movies I can find don't really show them. The German photo's of destroyed tanks inevitably don't show much beyond it being a pale sandstone and blacked metal. Also, can someone explain how Caunter camouflage was supposed to work? Was the idea that the enemy would be so distracted by the colour scheme that they couldn't actually identify the tank they were shooting at? "What tank is that Fritz? I can't tell, but it can't be a tank because whoever saw a blue tank with green go faster stripes on it"?
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Dec 15, 2021 01:34
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It’s meant to break up the silhouette of the vehicle at a distance and make it hard to identify, rather than invisible.
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Dec 15, 2021 01:45
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Yeah, from my understanding camouflage is usually designed to work so that a scout scanning the horizon with binoculars is less likely to spot your tank and call in dive bombers. Once combat has begun, no camo pattern will save you.
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Dec 15, 2021 02:41
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The author is Mike Starmer, I got all of the books  The authors email can be found here
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Dec 15, 2021 07:08
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Jobbo_Fett posted:This but unironically Yes absolutely. I feel like this with the victrix old guard I’m chewing through. Yes the grenadiers and chasseurs had slightly different hats. No I am not getting another box of 60 virtually identical guys to the 60 I’m slowly and painfully painting so that I have perfectly accurate models. I’ll just paint the top of the epaulettes green or red. Same with my Soviets as well, I did the research and yes you probably didn’t often have female soldiers organically scattered through a standard platoon based on which models look best for each army list choice. But Svetlana Alexeivich’s book made me weep buckets and Annie Norman is generally great, so these particular Soviets are. This level of grog research never seems to apply to the wehraboos as well, I’ve had several conversations along the lines of well that looks like a t34 model 1941 and this game is set in 43 with guys who play SS divisions as hard bastard ultra warriors rather than mewling war criminal pieces of poo poo.
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Dec 15, 2021 08:33
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For me the line goes between being hard on myself for painting my first Nappy french jackets in a much too bright blue, and being hard on others for painting their Nappy french jackets in a much too bright blue. The second we might do in jest at the club, but typically only after that person has identified the issue themself and told everyone. Like Bessgate. After all, if you're a bunch of dudes doing separate armies you'll quite quickly reach a point where you have done waaaaay more research into your army than your clubmates have, so the one that'll notice any mistakes will be you. I have no idea if, say, a Russian battalion is deployed on the table with an officer with the wrong epaulette crescents for that specific division or whatever. But I can spot a dodgy Vistula legion sculpt or paint job after painting and reading a lot on them myself. There's also a line between going into groggy button counter discussions when the OP asks for help or advice, and to go into groggy button counter discussions when the OP just wants to show everyone the cool toys they've just painted up and enjoy.
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Dec 15, 2021 11:30
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This has been beaten to death in this thread before, but the idea that there is a "correct" color to paint any historical uniform or vehicle is daft. For one, colors would vary immensely depending on the time and location of their production, manufacturing methods differed slightly, the same dye was not always used, things would quickly be weathered in different ways, and so on. Someone dig up wehrmacht-jacket-rainbow.jpg. And manufacturing methods were probably even more standardized in the 20th century than they were in Napoleonic times. Second, we are not recreating the thing in our miniatures. We are painting a stylized, miniature artwork version of the thing. We deliberately exaggerate features and colors, because the goal is never to create Thing But Small, because this is impossible, and even if it was possible, it would not look good. A 15mm pewter model on a dining room table does not interact with light and it's environment in the same way that a real human person wearing clothes and equipment in real sunlight does. Finally... maybe you don't want to go for a hyper realistic representation of the thing. Maybe you are going for something else stylistically - Maybe you want to exaggerate the colors and make them more vibrant, or maybe you want to do something weird like that black and white WW1 table. Research is part of the fun, but someone who thinks that there is one "right" answer to these questions and berates others for getting them "wrong" is just a dick who doesn't understand what they are doing when painting on a fundamental level.
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Dec 15, 2021 12:02
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Small aside but a T-34 model 1941 in 1943 is not impossible  .The real answer is play what makes you happy and enjoy it for what it is, a game to spend your time on.
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Dec 15, 2021 12:23
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Comstar posted:I just got a 1/2 dozen vehicles for a Bolt Action army for Libya/Greece/Crete - I need that book. I can't find out what the trucks/ Bren Gun Carriers and tanks used in Greece were painted. The 1 or 2 movies I can find don't really show them. The German photo's of destroyed tanks inevitably don't show much beyond it being a pale sandstone and blacked metal. Pink would probably have been a better choice TBH.
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Dec 15, 2021 13:37
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Yeah I think a better example than the feldgrau discussion is, say, the case of Carabiniers-a-cheval in the French army. They are super stylish heavy cavalry that are fun to paint, and they are a bit snowflakey but not Guard, with only two regiments created, so lots and lots of people like to paint them for their French napoleonic armies.  Just looking at them makes me want to order them but I have way too much cavalry to paint already. That said, these regiments were previously thought to have switched from the earlier white jackets to a blue jacket when Napoleon was kicked out the first time, so every Waterloo-centric gamer would paint them up with light blue jackets. Because there were some books that said so, and they wore blue jackets in the later 2nd Empire so people just assumed they switched at that time. So the "common wisdom" in the hobby said that if you want to do Waterloo, you need to do your carabiniers with blue jackets instead of white, it was a whole big thing for grognards to gleefully point out when they saw it. But well, turned out that a guy who loves archival research and writing books about them actually went to check their regimental records, and there were no blue jackets mentioned at all in the inspections at the time. They didn't even buy any blue cloth to make said jackets until much later, in the 2nd Empire, where they obviously had switched to blue jackets. So all evidence says they wore white jackets for Waterloo as well. So in this case, it's quite clear that when a beginner asks about the jackets, you can say that no, don't do the blue jackets. There's no reason ever to do blue jackets if you're starting out. However, if you meet a napoleonic veteran who has painted their carabiniers with blue jackets, there's no reason to be an rear end about it. It was the perceived view that was spread at the time they painted them. I might personally go back and repaint my minis when I find such mistakes, but it's insane to expect others to do it. However, if said veteran tries to convince a beginner to paint the jackets blue, you can courteously get involved in the conversation and mention that more modern research has debunked the infamous Waterloo jacket swap. So long story short, you want to start a French Napoleonic army and paint some awesome cool carabiniers and excitedly make horse noises while charging around with a heavy cavalry brigade. lilljonas fucked around with this message at 13:50 on Dec 15, 2021 |
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Dec 15, 2021 13:41
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