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Trabisnikof posted:All these words and you still couldn’t come up with anything for us to do to actually help the climate. i've done more than many climate activist posters in the other thread just by getting a vasectomy before i had any children but they're still lecturing me because i think we're hosed anyway, it's great
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Dec 19, 2021 18:22
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splifyphus posted:well thanks for all stumbling over yourselves to prove my point. I'll try to provide an example of actually trying to combat nihilism rather than just mainlining it. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V9O94UTDAJQ
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Dec 19, 2021 18:24
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Cold on a Cob posted:i've done more than many climate activist posters in the other thread just by getting a vasectomy before i had any children but they're still lecturing me because i think we're hosed anyway, it's great actually sorry you can't count that lack of children as avoided emissions unless climate was the only reason you choose not to have kids  (im teasing because that's a trick coal companies use, where they want to claim emissions credits for not mining coal that they really were never going to mine because the coal was like too lovely or too hard to get etc.)
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Dec 19, 2021 18:29
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The only useful discussion leftists could have would be how to maintain a vanguard through the collapse. But no one knows the form it will take so even that is mostly navel gazing. Sometimes there really isn't a solution. When you have already gone over the cliff there is no point in talking about how to best flap our arms. Maybe you will survive the fall, but who knows if it will be your back or your legs that break.
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Dec 19, 2021 18:30
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Trabisnikof posted:actually sorry you can't count that lack of children as avoided emissions unless climate was the only reason you choose not to have kids look just give me some carbon credits i can sell to shell ok?
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Dec 19, 2021 18:31
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Cold on a Cob posted:look just give me some carbon credits i can sell to shell ok? legit surprised that's not on the market already tbh
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Dec 19, 2021 18:32
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Cloks posted:unless you're coming in here with any real suggestions as to how we can make things better, maybe criticizing the people in the thread for recognizing the crisis we're in isn't the best move “tens of thousands of dollars” isn’t a real look into how power responds to threats
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Dec 19, 2021 18:33
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Acelerion posted:The only useful discussion leftists could have would be how to maintain a vanguard through the collapse. But no one knows the form it will take so even that is mostly navel gazing. for real, people have trouble with accepting a no-win scenario the real kicker for me right now is i don't think the covid pandemic is a no-win scenario but the fact we're not winning is part of the reason i think we're hosed for climate change. lol. lmao.
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Dec 19, 2021 18:33
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splifyphus posted:well thanks for all stumbling over yourselves to prove my point. I'll try to provide an example of actually trying to combat nihilism rather than just mainlining it. 
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Dec 19, 2021 18:37
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having people lecture anyone presenting totally plausible zero-covid ideas as "unrealistic" because a hard 4 week lockdown might make NUMBER sad while turning around and calling people like me idiot nihilist doomers for thinking we won't be able to stop runaway climate change is real loving funny
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Dec 19, 2021 18:38
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Rime posted:https://mobile.twitter.com/YETICapital99/status/1471969771222618113/photo/1 things seem bad
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Dec 19, 2021 18:40
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Ruggan posted:“tens of thousands of dollars” isn’t a real look into how power responds to threats does power not respond to threats by using resources that the other side doesn't have to overwhelm them?
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Dec 19, 2021 18:40
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splifyphus posted:that's all true, and here's something else that's true: this mentality is a self-fulfilling prophecy. you share this mentality with oil execs, the big bourgeoisie, and p much all of liberaldom. the least you can do for yourself in your last gasping, meaningless moments is maybe try to differentiate your own viewpoint from the people responsible, right? Not really, who cares? Just do what makes you (and hopefully those around you) happy. That’s the point of life IMO. splifyphus posted:that's not at all what I said, but if you want something affirmative then how about this: if we're collectively powerful enough to cause a mass extinction event, we're collectively powerful enough to stop it. Uh, no. We have probably set something in motion that we are too small and powerless to reverse. I’m not saying it’s impossible but it doesn’t logically follow that just because we were the catalyst we can also stop what has started. splifyphus posted:it's not the recognition of the crisis that's the problem, it's that there's a hidden automatic decision already in how you're all recognizing the problem. you're all going "welp; we're totally hosed - > nothing matters and we're completely helpless" - in one smooth habitual gesture, which reproduces your social conditioning without remainder. it's liberalism. I maintain that being totally hosed at a broader scale does not prevent one from finding meaning, joy, and satisfaction in their lives. Local maxima in a big downward spiral. I also don’t think it’s worth just “giving up” either. Our chances of “fixing” things or even making it through may be slim (depending on what time scale we’re talking) but none of us know the real probability and unless it’s 0 why give up? But I totally understand the nihilism and can sympathize.
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Dec 19, 2021 18:43
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blatman posted:causing the problem and stopping the problem are two entirely different types of problem, think of it more like suggesting you can stop your house from having burned down because you started the fire said it better than I did
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Dec 19, 2021 18:44
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wow. nihilism is a helluva a drug, wouldn't want to get between you guys and ur fix. myself, i guess I'll continue to try to differentiate my perspective from the same poo poo that caused a mass extinction event in the first place. Trabisnikof posted:All these words and you still couldn’t come up with anything for us to do to actually help the climate. oh honey, when I post that poo poo I get banned. use your imagination, if you've still got one left. I'll give you one hint - the social contract itself is already obsolete.
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Dec 19, 2021 18:45
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Cloks posted:does power not respond to threats by using resources that the other side doesn't have to overwhelm them? sure, but the scale of that is about the same or less than me swatting a fly with a fly swatter
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Dec 19, 2021 18:48
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splifyphus posted:wow. nihilism is a helluva a drug, wouldn't want to get between you guys and ur fix. yes yes, virtue signaling is super important and you are totes the bestest of hoomons or whatever
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Dec 19, 2021 18:48
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splifyphus posted:wow. nihilism is a helluva a drug, wouldn't want to get between you guys and ur fix. i made recently a non-zero effort post in the mental health thread i feel applies here so maybe it helps Raine posted:every day i wake up and ask myself
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Dec 19, 2021 18:50
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splifyphus posted:oh honey, when I post that poo poo I get banned. use your imagination, if you've still got one left. I'll give you one hint - the social contract itself is already obsolete. if you want to traipsing around in minecraft there are some posters here that already agree with you, but you're still missing the point. it's too late and getting yourself jailed or murdered for loving with a pipeline won't help anything. feel free though, don't let us stop you.
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Dec 19, 2021 18:50
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it is perfectly possible to accept that we're irreversibly in a mass extinction event and still not be a nihilist about it, and the difference has nothing to do with optimism or pessimism. we're in a new geological epoch now. literally everything holocene is totally obsolete, and here you are all huffing this pathetic reactionary nihilism like it's the new hot poo poo. we're completely hosed and there's not a goddamn thing we can do about it - the situation is excellent.
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Dec 19, 2021 18:50
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Raine posted:i made recently a non-zero effort post in the mental health thread i feel applies here so maybe it helps good post
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Dec 19, 2021 18:51
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splifyphus posted:it is perfectly possible to accept that we're irreversibly in a mass extinction event and still not be a nihilist about it, and the difference has nothing to do with optimism or pessimism. Here this might clarify your thoughts https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hNjWOCdony4
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Dec 19, 2021 18:55
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splifyphus posted:myself, i guess I'll continue to try to differentiate my perspective from the same poo poo that caused a mass extinction event in the first place. whats funny is you're actually espousing the same classical liberalism take that got us here today. your posts are basically the same as a 1950s video about how we can turn the Sahara into a dope rear end lake. quote:oh honey, when I post that poo poo I get banned. use your imagination, if you've still got one left. I'll give you one hint - the social contract itself is already obsolete. so sure this defeats your own complaint about this thread. you're whining people aren't optimistic enough, while also being a coy coward about how "oh totally some sort of illegal actions would 100% save the climate, nope i am not listing them". because that's the other side of your hyper-individualist fantasy that you're espousing: no not even violent acts by Great Individuals will fix the climate. Did the colonial pipeline system being shut down by hackers reduce emissions? No. Did the time terrorists shot up a US power distribution station in a professionally planned attack reduce emissions? No. Did any number of pipeline failures including ones that killed people reduce emissions? No. Did the attack on the Saudi oil refining facilities at Abqaiq and Khurais reduce emissions? No. All those did was increase profits due to short term constricted demands, then increased emissions as replacing the broken infrastructure itself has embodied emissions.
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Dec 19, 2021 19:00
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Ruggan posted:sure, but the scale of that is about the same or less than me swatting a fly with a fly swatter i don't know what to tell you then, because that's the scale I'm working on "don't be a nihilist, do something!" okay here's what i did "not that, that's too small!"
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Dec 19, 2021 19:02
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We must immediately elect Ted Kaczynski as President
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Dec 19, 2021 19:03
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beginning to think i have no claim to moral superiority unless i stop climate change personally
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Dec 19, 2021 19:03
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splifyphus posted:it is perfectly possible to accept that we're irreversibly in a mass extinction event and still not be a nihilist about it, and the difference has nothing to do with optimism or pessimism. If you equate "nihilism" with giving up you should probably spend some serious time actually identifying both of those concepts and figuring them out instead of trying to tell other people online you are dying the exact same way we are but are more enlightening about it. That's a huge waste of time. This seems to be more about you and your fixation with the boogeyman of "Nihilism."
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Dec 19, 2021 19:06
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Car Hater posted:We must immediately elect Ted Kaczynski as President get tedpilled, america
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Dec 19, 2021 19:06
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Cloks posted:beginning to think i have no claim to moral superiority unless i stop climate change personally you can claim moral superiority if you believe you can stop climate change personally, if actually doing so involves hurting anyone in any way then you're retroactively a turbo fascist commie who's worse than the people causing climate change
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Dec 19, 2021 19:07
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Cold on a Cob posted:if you want to traipsing around in minecraft there are some posters here that already agree with you, but you're still missing the point. it's too late and getting yourself jailed or murdered for loving with a pipeline won't help anything. that's just the thing tho. you've decided in advance that it will do nothing, and so, you do nothing. we don't get to know the future. we don't get to know how things will play out. we don't know what will work, or not - and we will never know. even in a hypothetical timeline where capital has been smashed and a climate war command economy is being built and there's a real cultrev happening - those motherfuckers don't know if it'll work either. they won't know. their kids won't know. their kids won't know. their kids won't know. and so on. nobody will ever loving know! all we have, all we have ever had is try. 'it's too late' gently caress you. who are you, god? every concept of causality you have could be a bunch of stupid nonsense gibberish, and how would you know? you don't and you can't, because there's already a leap of faith built into every possible shred of knowledge you could possibly think you have. posad could swoop down tomorrow. it could all be a dream god is having of itself. the Bible could be literal loving truth. the DMT entities could be simulating all of this. there could be infinite multiverses with infinite outcomes. we could all live in completely different dimensions alone and just be hallucinating everyone else. you don't know. you don't know what will work and what won't. you don't know the future. you don't know poo poo.
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Dec 19, 2021 19:12
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Trabisnikof posted:Just look how many CIA officers we have in this forum, I’m sure we have someone working in the BLM or EPA too. Trying to be a "proactive force" in government is an exercise in courting self-inflicted depression and misery. I can suggest and theorize all I goddamned well like, I can write page after page of memos, studies, and assorted miscellany that ends up as a single page bullet-pointed synopsis on some policymaker's desk that they *still* never loving read even though it's been condensed from 500+ pages... ...but if I start being vocal and proactive rather than just doing my job, well, that's how you end up getting reassigned and progressively inconvenienced until you resign to go work at some also-ran non-profit that isn't afraid to take on "damaged goods," where you'll have even less of an impact on the sector of society you've cobbled out a career analyzing. This happens no matter whose privileged rear end sits behind the Resolute Desk. Stop waiting for Godot. He ain't coming. BIG HEADLINE has issued a correction as of 19:16 on Dec 19, 2021 |
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Dec 19, 2021 19:14
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lol lmao
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Dec 19, 2021 19:14
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splifyphus posted:that's just the thing tho. you've decided in advance that it will do nothing, and so, you do nothing. ah the "We can never know for certain so I can never be proven wrong" foundational bedrock of delusional denial if you ever break through that you'll be making progress
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Dec 19, 2021 19:16
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splifyphus posted:that's just the thing tho. you've decided in advance that it will do nothing, and so, you do nothing. haha gently caress me? no. gently caress you. lead by example or shut the gently caress up.
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Dec 19, 2021 19:16
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"you're a nihilist because you're not out doing direct action things i can't name because i'll get banned" so why the gently caress are you in here trolling a mutual cope thread instead of getting your rear end murked for gaia? if you're for real, you're the eco-fascist that other people have accused us of being lol
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Dec 19, 2021 19:18
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splifyphus posted:you don't know. you don't know what will work and what won't. you don't know the future. you don't know poo poo. Right back at ya friend.
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Dec 19, 2021 19:19
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a lot of us legitimately believe that direct action is the only thing that will do any good, but we've admitted we are unwilling or unable to take that step or we think it will still be like pissing in the wind until there is a mass awakening event (and when that happens it will happen, regardless of what we post) so really, seriously - what is your point for posting here, if not to just troll? we're not advocating people kill themselves in despair (quite the opposite) so i legitimately do not understand.
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Dec 19, 2021 19:21
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I know the future
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Dec 19, 2021 19:23
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The only time i ever vividly daydream of killing people is in traffic, so cars gonna be be important in this awakening imho.
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Dec 19, 2021 19:24
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BIG HEADLINE posted:Trying to be a "proactive force" in government is an exercise in courting self-inflicted depression and misery. I can suggest and theorize all I goddamned well like, I can write page after page of memos, studies, and assorted miscellany that ends up as a single page bullet-pointed synopsis on some policymaker's desk that they *still* never loving read even though it's been condensed from 500+ pages... oh certainly, but even those marginal changes matter. like forcing one BLM lease deal to be stopped or shutting down one coal plant due to inspected deficiencies to the mercury emissions controls actually does reduce emissions or whatever in a way that no other individual action can under our current sociopolitical system. its not going to save the climate, but it certainly has more positive impacts than anything else anyone in this thread can do
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Dec 19, 2021 19:25
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