|
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jd2i666sCOUProfessor Wayne posted:Was the Monkey Punchy rum a strained Lupin III reference? Arc Hammer posted:It has to be. Hell in the original show during the Green Bird montage Spike pills a Lupin grin. The United States posted:Bebop isn't a carbon copy of Lupin as in "these characters are just Lupin characters renamed" but it's a riff on Lupin, such that it really could not exist without Lupin having come first. Spike's not exactly Lupin and Jet's not exactly Jigen and Faye's not exactly Fujiko and Vicious isn't exactly (early, antagonistic) Goemon, and there's no Zenigata because the gang is on the side of the law, but the whole general vibe and how it is able to effortlessly include both charming, irreverent slapstick comedy and hardcore ultraviolent action thriller and have both feel like the same show is extremely Lupin.  
Assepoester fucked around with this message at 04:55 on Dec 17, 2021 |
#
?
Dec 17, 2021 04:52
|
|
|
|
| # ? Jun 7, 2024 16:48 |
|
|
I was rewatching the original series before I watched the remake. Glad I did so I was able save myself time of watching it after it getting panned.
|
|
#
?
Dec 17, 2021 14:17
|
|
|
The United States posted:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jd2i666sCOU That's it! The adaptation should have been mostly faithful except that there is a Zenigata figure. And then at the end of the series Spike is saved by the timely arrival of Pops. christmas boots fucked around with this message at 19:45 on Dec 17, 2021 |
|
#
?
Dec 17, 2021 19:43
|
|
|
christmas boots posted:That's it! The adaptation should have been mostly faithful except that there is a Zenigata figure. And then at the end of the series Spike is saved by the timely arrival of Pops. 
|
|
#
?
Dec 17, 2021 20:13
|
|
|
So that is a legit pilot. I thought I'd just come across some bizarre fan project when I first saw it.
|
|
#
?
Dec 17, 2021 20:16
|
|
|
Arc Hammer posted:So that is a legit pilot. I thought I'd just come across some bizarre fan project when I first saw it. What's even crazier IMO (and this is mentioned in the article) is that the failure of this project directly led to the creation of Inspector Gadget.
|
|
#
?
Dec 20, 2021 19:48
|
|
|
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mjzYr1ewy7wchristmas boots posted:What's even crazier IMO (and this is mentioned in the article) is that the failure of this project directly led to the creation of Inspector Gadget.   
|
|
#
?
Dec 20, 2021 20:59
|
|
|
The Omar Sy show was really good.
|
|
#
?
Dec 20, 2021 22:35
|
|
|
Wait there's a Lupin show!?!
|
|
#
?
Dec 21, 2021 00:31
|
|
|
Jerusalem posted:Wait there's a Lupin show!?! It has nothing to do with the long running Lupin III anime but yeah: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lupin_(French_TV_series)
|
|
#
?
Dec 21, 2021 00:51
|
|
|
That looks pretty interesting, thanks! Edit: Watched the first episode, it's really good! Jerusalem fucked around with this message at 09:31 on Dec 21, 2021 |
|
#
?
Dec 21, 2021 01:34
|
|
|
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XCABiqeWCrU
|
|
#
?
Dec 30, 2021 13:03
|
|
|
Did you post this here so people could laugh at it? Because it's called 'The Evil Within Cowboy Bebop', so I'm expecting either divine proof of Satan or high quality humour. Edit: yeah this is crap. Nostalgia driven fidelity criticism. Open Source Idiom fucked around with this message at 16:34 on Dec 30, 2021 |
|
#
?
Dec 30, 2021 16:26
|
|
|
I'm not going to watch that but the synopsis seems spot on? "What at first appears to be yet another failure to adapt an anime to the live-action format is actually indicative of something more troubling. Not only is Netflix's Cowboy Bebop an incompetent product that misunderstands the appeal of the original anime, it's also yet another beloved work cynically made to cash-in on our nostalgia. This show doesn't just disrespect the animation medium and its fans, however. Underneath this deeply corporate show is a hateful product that erases the anime's themes and replaces them with loathsome depictions of real-world marginalized groups. "
|
|
#
?
Dec 31, 2021 02:24
|
|
|
The United States seems to only exist to drive by post random videos tangentially related to threads.
|
|
#
?
Dec 31, 2021 03:48
|
|
|
Yeah it's good
|
|
#
?
Dec 31, 2021 04:07
|
|
|
Kaedric posted:This show doesn't just disrespect the animation medium and its fans " It just reads as post hoc justification of reactionary nonsense, particularly the above quoted part. The idea that an adaptation should "do justice" to the work it's adapting is, tbh, ludicrous, and it throws hundreds of years of Shakespeare (and theatre generally) out the window for completely arbitrary and indefinable -- basically fundamentally essentialist -- reasons. What about The Office, or Robin Hood: Men In Tights, or half the Disney animated canon, or pretty much anything by Baz Lurhman, or Requiem For A Dream (which is probably the most pertinent here, given that it was incredibly loosely adapted from Satoshi Kon film)? The video talks about Hollywood adapting properties like its some recent trend, but he's so myopic that he can't see that Hollywood has so very rarely told original films. He praises Del Toro in his "essay" (I use scare quotes because it's, honestly, poorly researched and mostly conjecture). Del Toro's most recent film is an adaptation of an adaptation! It's just poor.
|
|
#
?
Dec 31, 2021 06:39
|
|
|
Open Source Idiom posted:It just reads as post hoc justification of reactionary nonsense, particularly the above quoted part. "Reactionary" is the wrong word to use given that the main reason he says the adaptation is "evil" rather than just "bad" is that the adaptation is reactionary - reducing Fay to another quippy Whedonesque girlboss character and completely removing her motivation in the original (she is in enormous debt and is trapped within patriarchal power structures), drawing attention to Jet's race in weird, fetishistic ways while totally eliding the implications of his relationship with the police, using badly written and acted domestic violence as a cheap dramatic hook (if you can even call it that), its shallow treatment of trans and NB characters, etc., etc. It's just more shallow, cheaply-made, right-wing/liberal capital C Content, pushed out by mediocre white male writers who at best have no understanding of these issues and at worst produce actively, well, reactionary takes on them. I don't even think the original Cowboy Bebop is all that, really, but he is absolutely right that its far more nuanced and sensitive and subtle. It isn't that he has a problem with adaptations! Like, he makes the point over and over again that he isn't arguing against the idea of adaptation as a whole! He even talks about adaptations he likes, and how necessary it is for adaptations to change their source material to work in new formats! Did you actually watch more than the first ten minutes of the video?
|
|
#
?
Dec 31, 2021 11:56
|
|
|
Barry Foster posted:"Reactionary" is the wrong word to use given that the main reason he says the adaptation is "evil" rather than just "bad" is that the adaptation is reactionary - reducing Fay to another quippy Whedonesque girlboss character and completely removing her motivation in the original (she is in enormous debt and is trapped within patriarchal power structures), drawing attention to Jet's race in weird, fetishistic ways while totally eliding the implications of his relationship with the police, using badly written and acted domestic violence as a cheap dramatic hook (if you can even call it that), its shallow treatment of trans and NB characters, etc., etc. It's just more shallow, cheaply-made, right-wing/liberal capital C Content, pushed out by mediocre white male writers who at best have no understanding of these issues and at worst produce actively, well, reactionary takes on them. I don't even think the original Cowboy Bebop is all that, really, but he is absolutely right that its far more nuanced and sensitive and subtle. I was concerned with a reactionary denial of change, rather than liberal progressivism. I don't really buy that the arguments this guy are leveraging are sincerely held (or, if they are sincerely held, then well considered). It's been some time since I've seen the 90's Cowboy Bebop in full, but I had the diatinct memory of it also not being a particularly progressive text -- I'm working my way through spiritual successor Samurai Champion and it certainly doesn't pass. So criticism of Bebop 2021, under the guise of fidelity criticism, reads a little dishonest. I've no great love for either version of the show, but I do strongly dislike poor qualitity criticism, and the whole cottage industry that's been built out of it (see: all those links about adaptation posted here or in the Witcher thread that just blatantly made up quotes to spark outrage). Maybe this guy isn't deliberately platforming himself through the cynical appropriation of outrage, but he's certainly using a lot of stale talking points. That said, you're completely right in that I only properly watched the first ten minutes of the thing. Is there material in the back forty minutes that's likely to change my mind? Genuinely, have I misjudged this man?
|
|
#
?
Dec 31, 2021 12:29
|
|
|
The good stuff is about half way in, when he starts talking about the characters in more depth. Like, it's not an hbomb video or anything, you can tell it's the first time he's done it and most of his analysis isn't particularly deep, but there's definitely way more to it than just "I'm mad because it wasn't a slavishly accurate recreation/was made by baka gaijins". And I'm in agreement that the original isn't exactly massively progressive, especially by today's standards, but in comparison to the newest one...
|
|
#
?
Dec 31, 2021 14:26
|
|
|
Open Source Idiom posted:The idea that an adaptation should "do justice" to the work it's adapting is, tbh, ludicrous, and it throws hundreds of years of Shakespeare (and theatre generally) out the window for completely arbitrary and indefinable -- basically fundamentally essentialist -- reasons. What about The Office, or Robin Hood: Men In Tights, or half the Disney animated canon, or pretty much anything by Baz Lurhman, or Requiem For A Dream (which is probably the most pertinent here, given that it was incredibly loosely adapted from Satoshi Kon film)? He does specifically make reference to Requiem. He never says an adaption has to do justice in faithfully recreating it. He says adaptions can take their own take on things. The overall point seems to be that this Cowboy Bebop was just a cynical cash grab wherein the themes of the original were discarded and the characters were flattened for no reason.
|
|
#
?
Dec 31, 2021 14:29
|
|
|
drat this is a really good video.
|
|
#
?
Dec 31, 2021 21:34
|
|
|
Is it wrong to expect better?
|
|
#
?
Jan 3, 2022 07:15
|
|
|
I started rewatching the anime again, just to better appreciate what it does well. One of my favorite things I've noticed is how they reference Faye being older a few times in the series before the big reveal. In episode 3, the guy references Poker Alice and says Faye doesn't look 200 years old. In Jamming With Edward, Jet says hey vision of a hacker is outdated, and you can't really tell how old someone is. It's a minor thing that doesn't stick out too much, but it's great how they set up these other things.
|
|
#
?
Jan 9, 2022 21:36
|
|
|
Or how she doesn't understand hyperspace theory and thinks she's going to get hit by the missiles trapped in subspace. She never would have gone to school to understand that particular science.
|
|
#
?
Jan 9, 2022 21:40
|
|
|
Arc Hammer posted:Or how she doesn't understand hyperspace theory and thinks she's going to get hit by the missiles trapped in subspace. She never would have gone to school to understand that particular science. Yeah, they're literally like "every highschool student learns this" and I guess when you first watch the show, you don't put two and two together.
|
|
#
?
Jan 9, 2022 21:57
|
|
|
When I first watched it when I was a kid, I always thought that Faye's accident and the moongate accident were one in the same. Only realized they were two different things in one of my recent rewatches.
|
|
#
?
Jan 10, 2022 08:26
|
|
|
It's easy to assume they were the same incident given the visuals of Faye's accident show the window on the shuttle cracking, splitting the moon in two. Her accident in 2014 was just prior to the gate disaster, though.
Arc Hammer fucked around with this message at 18:39 on Jan 10, 2022 |
|
#
?
Jan 10, 2022 16:18
|
|
|
I also thought that on first watch. Crazy that Faye is the passenger from the intro of Planetes! 
|
|
#
?
Jan 10, 2022 18:00
|
|
|
Oxxidation posted:the only bebop episode that comes within the same zip code as “bad” is Boogie Woogie Feng Shui. every other one is its own breed of classic, and Black Dog Serenade especially is among the best i just watched the anime for the first time ever and, yeah, that's the only episode i thought was bad I've just started the live-action series and it's absolute trash. the actors are good choices for the big three but everything else is a joke. the writing is awful. like, the anime wasn't a quippy comedy. the banter is terrible. using the same music and recreating the opening titles -- it's so bad. they gave jet an absentee daughter thing lmao. edit: FEARLESS LMFAO AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA Horizon Burning fucked around with this message at 12:03 on Jan 27, 2022 |
|
#
?
Jan 27, 2022 11:36
|
|
|
That opening fight scene in the casino is a great example of what the show gets wrong. It takes twice as long, but it's half as interesting. In the movie, they use the environment. This feels like a fight in a convenience store. Spike sets off a popper in the guys face, someone gets thrown over a shelf, Spike grabs a doughnut, pours coffee on a guy's face - this is an environment. In the casino fight, they might as well be fighting in an empty room. There's no sense of space. I've actually become obsessed with this show. Digging in deep has helped me better understand how good movies and tv shows work. It's helped me understand concepts that I didn't think about too much before. So I'm getting something out of it. Also, I didn't hate Boogie Woogie Feng Shui. But I can see how people don't enjoy it.
|
|
#
?
Jan 27, 2022 17:08
|
|
|
The end where she finally meets up with her dad and can't bring herself to hate him for leaving is good. The two thugs based on the Blues Brothers are also good. Faye and Spike making comments about Jet maybe being a pedophile for helping out a teenager are not good what the gently caress were they thinking.
|
|
#
?
Jan 27, 2022 17:17
|
|
|
The Cowboy Bebop comic came out yesterday and it was pretty good. Anyone else read it? I mean visually it's obviously taking cues from the Netflix series, but it feels more like the anime in tone.
|
|
#
?
Jan 27, 2022 20:17
|
|
|
Cemetry Gator posted:That opening fight scene in the casino is a great example of what the show gets wrong. It takes twice as long, but it's half as interesting. It's truly amazing how bad the opening scene of the live action series is When they got to the point where there was exactly one big lever that closed the exact part of the wall that was shot causing the vacuum, that broke me on the show
|
|
#
?
Jan 28, 2022 00:59
|
|
|
I got thinking about an alternate Netflix Bebop that kept John Cho as Spike but replaced the Julia actor with Donna Burke. Her English cover of Real Folk Blues is gorgeous.
|
|
#
?
Feb 6, 2022 19:40
|
|
|
Things got super busy around the holidays, but I finally caught up. You can tell they struggled with tone from episode to episode, and I blame that on shifting between writers with very different takes, but not giving them all any sort of consistency. They absolutely nailed what the show should've been like in episode 5, with Jet's noir story and some good banter between Spike and Faye. If the whole show was in that tone, it would've been really good, and way more in line with the anime. Instead it wildly shifted between that and the quippy snarky stuff people hated. The other thing that episode 5 really highlighted was that it looked better than most of the rest of them, because it played with color tones. The rest of the episodes were lit very flatly and the colors were all muted. A show like that needs colors that pop, deep black shadows in high contrast, and stylish transitions and framing. Every planet should've had a different distinct palette and color saturation. It's entirely possible to achieve that, so the cinematography choices in this show were baffling.
|
|
#
?
Feb 11, 2022 00:06
|
|
|
Arc Hammer posted:I got thinking about an alternate Netflix Bebop that kept John Cho as Spike but replaced the Julia actor with Donna Burke. Her English cover of Real Folk Blues is gorgeous. I misread that as Faye's actress and was confused for a second. I mean, I don't think anybody was really miscast, it's just the writing was all over the place. sticklefifer posted:Things got super busy around the holidays, but I finally caught up. You can tell they struggled with tone from episode to episode, and I blame that on shifting between writers with very different takes, but not giving them all any sort of consistency. They absolutely nailed what the show should've been like in episode 5, with Jet's noir story and some good banter between Spike and Faye. If the whole show was in that tone, it would've been really good, and way more in line with the anime. Instead it wildly shifted between that and the quippy snarky stuff people hated.
|
|
#
?
Feb 12, 2022 23:15
|
|
|
When does Spike (I think) say You'll be sorry. I think maybe to ein even. He says it kinda weird. I think he pauses briefly before sorry
|
|
#
?
Feb 14, 2022 03:49
|
|
|
Milo and POTUS posted:When does Spike (I think) say You'll be sorry. I think maybe to ein even. He says it kinda weird. I think he pauses briefly before sorry It was a 4th wall break to the viewer
|
|
#
?
Feb 14, 2022 04:36
|
|
|
|
| # ? Jun 7, 2024 16:48 |
|
|
I've just finished the 5th "Noir" episode and I'm actually kinda enjoying it. It's not a particularly good show, but it's got its own feel to it that I appreciate. It's very campy, exaggerated, and silly in a way the original wasn't. Anything involving Vicious and the Syndicate is out and out bad though. I haven't seen the movie in a very long time, but having come off from a rewatch of the anime I don't mind that this is different. I watch shows very slowly (only during lunch on vacation) so I'll be lucky if I finish this is two weeks because otherwise it'll be put off until April and eventually the summer.
|
|
#
?
Feb 21, 2022 13:07
|
|
