|
I've been away from gaming for a while, but I just dusted off my ancient Saitek Cyborg Evo that I've had for as long as I can recall and tried to get it going. It was squeaky and rough where the disk/collar thing kind of slides over the shaft, so I tried a little light lubrication which naturally made it much worse, basically unusable now.  I'm really disappointed because it held up so well to many many hours of IL2, Falcon 4, MSFS, etc. I'm not thrilled with any of the "comparable" products I can find now (meaning, $50-ish flight sticks). The lower-end Thrustmasters seem to have many complaints about the twist axis failing early, and the Logitech Extreme 3D Pro doesn't look too solid. I don't need force feedback or a really fancy HOTAS, I'm just looking for smoothness of operation and good build quality and longevity. Plus something that will work on Windows 11. Are there any other good options in the sub-$60 bracket?
|
#
?
Dec 24, 2021 08:58
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 26, 2024 23:36 |
|
|
The pricing is wack now. T16000s and 3D pros are near 100 bucks. Not really worth it when you could buy this: https://vkbcontrollers.com/?product=gladiator-nxt-space-combat-edition Sometimes you can find T16000s on Ebay for 50 or so dollars, but it is dicey.
|
|
#
?
Dec 24, 2021 09:13
|
|
|
The T16000 pricing isn't too bad, really. The joystick alone is $70 on amazon right now, which is below its regular MSRP. I think that's really the best you'll get at this price point. Otherwise spending $120 on a VKB isn't a bad idea at all—those things are very solidly built and feel excellent in your hands. $50 or cheaper is budget-tier, though. Nothing that cheap is going to be well-built or long-lasting, and it hasn't been that way since the Cyborg Evo was discontinued, sadly. Dr. Video Games 0031 fucked around with this message at 10:14 on Dec 24, 2021 |
|
#
?
Dec 24, 2021 10:09
|
|
|
The T16000 is very good and I recommend it. Its gimbal mechanism is better than any Saitek stick I've used.
|
|
#
?
Dec 24, 2021 18:36
|
|
|
Vahakyla posted:The pricing is wack now. T16000s and 3D pros are near 100 bucks. Not really worth it when you could buy this: Get the vkb 100% worth it, there should be zero doubt, the vkb owns and is very similarly priced
|
|
#
?
Dec 24, 2021 19:09
|
|
|
ethanol posted:Get the vkb 100% worth it, there should be zero doubt, the vkb owns and is very similarly priced Just in general, in the last year or three, there's been a pretty big inversion in this: the boutique stuff has become much more available, far more sensibly priced, and it was always better (just more modern if nothing else) than the old big-name manufacturers. Even in the cases where there's a bit of a premium on the price (or a hell of a lot of premium, like with Virpil), you get your money's worth and then some. Logitech and TM have name recognition and ubiquity, but their stuff is old, often questionably built, and stuck in an era where an annoying and intrusive software layer was the norm. They're not bad, as such, just… behind.
|
|
#
?
Dec 25, 2021 01:09
|
|
|
Dr. Video Games 0031 posted:The T16000 pricing isn't too bad, really. The joystick alone is $70 on amazon right now, which is below its regular MSRP. I think that's really the best you'll get at this price point. Otherwise spending $120 on a VKB isn't a bad idea at all—those things are very solidly built and feel excellent in your hands. Can confirm the T.16000 is very good and a solid upgrade from the Hotas X
|
|
#
?
Dec 25, 2021 02:35
|
|
|
Tippis posted:Just in general, in the last year or three, there's been a pretty big inversion in this: the boutique stuff has become much more available, far more sensibly priced, and it was always better (just more modern if nothing else) than the old big-name manufacturers. Even in the cases where there's a bit of a premium on the price (or a hell of a lot of premium, like with Virpil), you get your money's worth and then some. Started off with the x52 and drat that thing did not age well now that I'm on the TCA airbus pack as well as the VKB Gladiator
|
|
#
?
Dec 25, 2021 04:15
|
|
|
Shipon posted:Started off with the x52 and drat that thing did not age well now that I'm on the TCA airbus pack as well as the VKB Gladiator I'm in a similar situation. I started out with whatever the precursor to the Hotas X was called, aeons ago, and these days, it's all Virpil + an old TM Warthog throttle. And even the Warthog stuff is feeling the burden of age because, again, it's from that old software-layer era compared to the Virpil bits where everything is done in the programmable firmware — I program the stick bases what the buttons should do, how the switches should behave, how lights should come on, and they do that no matter what without the need to have any drivers or software running on the computer. Once you leave the programmable-in-software idea behind, it feels so antiquated to have to have some silly interpretation layer running in the background and having to faff around with profiles to change anything away from the default.  It's 💸💸💸, for sure, but also very easy to rationalise as somehow being sensible and a good idea…
|
|
#
?
Dec 25, 2021 05:23
|
|
|
I don’t use any profiles with my TM Warthog HOTAS. In DCS all modules have a a ready made control setup for it, too, which I just slightly tweak. I’m always a Warthog believer. X52 had great buttons but its precision sucks. Logitech 3D pro was actually a pretty decent stick back in the day.
|
|
#
?
Dec 25, 2021 07:58
|
|
|
X52 is drat near unusable. Push/pull the throttle and it springs back 10% in the direction from whence it came. The stick part works decently, although it's pointlessly large for some reason. The USB connector attaches the throttle though so the throttle is non-optional.
|
|
#
?
Dec 25, 2021 21:25
|
|
|
Thanks for the feedback on control setups. While I'm asking noob-type questions, I'll also ask...are there any "survey" or middle-ish-realism combat flight sims anymore, with good gameplay? In olden times I really enjoyed sims like EAW and early IL-2, EECH, Longbow 2, etc. which duplicated some of the tactics, weapons, and general experience of air combat without making you learn every checklist, switch, and MFD button that the real aircraft would use. The box versions of Falcon 4 were about my limit, and after the various realism patches it got to the point where I wasn't having much fun anymore.
|
|
#
?
Dec 25, 2021 21:33
|
|
|
Sapozhnik posted:X52 is drat near unusable. Does it have any issues with making small motions with the joystick? I had an older saitek and the stiction made it impossible to make delicate movements. Every movement pretty much required yanking the stick to break the friction and then being able to move it. A lot of flying is making small corrections, so it was pretty much useless for anything. I don't know why Saitek thought to was a good idea for the stick to right itself by having a spring push one piece of plastic onto another piece of plastic. No amount of lubrication works because it would quickly just rub the lube off the contact surface and be back to plastic on plastic.
|
|
#
?
Dec 25, 2021 21:34
|
|
|
Sapozhnik posted:X52 is drat near unusable. This is probably heretical, but I still use the X52 throttle with my VKB joystick. I don't get nearly as much spring-back, though it is admittedly a little imprecise. I really should replace it, but it's still functional, so... meh Cojawfee posted:Does it have any issues with making small motions with the joystick? I had an older saitek and the stiction made it impossible to make delicate movements. Every movement pretty much required yanking the stick to break the friction and then being able to move it. A lot of flying is making small corrections, so it was pretty much useless for anything. I don't know why Saitek thought to was a good idea for the stick to right itself by having a spring push one piece of plastic onto another piece of plastic. No amount of lubrication works because it would quickly just rub the lube off the contact surface and be back to plastic on plastic. The X52's joystick wasn't bad in regards to friction, though the sensor was kinda poo poo. Mine eventually started giving phantom inputs, and the precision was low. I think it was hall effect, but badly implemented/too weak. Some users modded their joystick by adding extra magnets, and that apparently worked pretty well.
|
|
#
?
Dec 25, 2021 21:47
|
|
|
Number_6 posted:Thanks for the feedback on control setups. While I'm asking noob-type questions, I'll also ask...are there any "survey" or middle-ish-realism combat flight sims anymore, with good gameplay? In olden times I really enjoyed sims like EAW and early IL-2, EECH, Longbow 2, etc. which duplicated some of the tactics, weapons, and general experience of air combat without making you learn every checklist, switch, and MFD button that the real aircraft would use. The box versions of Falcon 4 were about my limit, and after the various realism patches it got to the point where I wasn't having much fun anymore. The current IL2 fits that description in my opinion. It's become very good since it released. Haven't played the multiplayer in ages though. DCS with the free plane or the Flaming Cliffs panes kind of fits as well. If you stick to, say, a Mig29 with missiles it feels really no different than the old Jane's combat simulators: fly around, select weapon, lock on, shoot.
|
|
#
?
Dec 26, 2021 01:45
|
|
|
Cojawfee posted:Does it have any issues with making small motions with the joystick? I had an older saitek and the stiction made it impossible to make delicate movements. Every movement pretty much required yanking the stick to break the friction and then being able to move it. A lot of flying is making small corrections, so it was pretty much useless for anything. I don't know why Saitek thought to was a good idea for the stick to right itself by having a spring push one piece of plastic onto another piece of plastic. No amount of lubrication works because it would quickly just rub the lube off the contact surface and be back to plastic on plastic. I have this issue on my older Saitek X52 also. The default spring is too stiff and the plastic piece below the spring has too much friction. I have put a couple of zip ties to the spring to ease the tension (zip tie a section of the spring together so that it essentially just makes the spring a bit shorter) and it makes it better. It still annoys me from time to time but not as bad as the default. I have also done the magnet mod inside the joystick. I also modded out the detent in the throttle. I have messed my X52 more than any piece of hardware in ages.
|
|
#
?
Dec 26, 2021 08:15
|
|
|
Does anybody know how to bind keys to adjust the F-18's autopilot heading indicator? I'm having trouble figuring out what the binding name is called. There seems to be a ton of possible options.
|
|
#
?
Dec 26, 2021 22:10
|
|
|
GreatGreen posted:Does anybody know how to bind keys to adjust the F-18's autopilot heading indicator? I'm having trouble figuring out what the binding name is called. I assume you're talking about this switch?  I have that bound to "Heading Set Switch - Left" and "Heading Set Switch - Right" under the "Instrument Panel" category.
|
|
#
?
Dec 27, 2021 21:14
|
|
|
plester1 posted:I assume you're talking about this switch? Hah oh man I'm sorry, I should have been more specific. I should have specified that I was talking about the new F-18 recently added to Microsoft Flight Sim 2020. Thank you for the reply though! For what it's worth, that is the control I'm talking about, but it's in a slightly different place in the MS202 F-18 cockpit, it's on the panel just to the left of there.
|
|
#
?
Dec 27, 2021 22:09
|
|
|
use the search feature I. the binding menu, it may be called a heading bug.
|
|
#
?
Dec 27, 2021 22:45
|
|
|
GreatGreen posted:Hah oh man I'm sorry, I should have been more specific. I should have specified that I was talking about the new F-18 recently added to Microsoft Flight Sim 2020. Haha, I totally forgot that exists now. I should fly over my house in MSFS later.
|
|
#
?
Dec 28, 2021 00:52
|
|
|
skooma512 posted:use the search feature I. the binding menu, it may be called a heading bug. I did that and none of the bindings worked. I searched "heading" and "hdg" which is what you see when you mouse over the switch, but no dice. I assumed I was just being a big umb idiot and thought maybe somebody here might know exactly what to look for. Google doesn't seem to be super helpful either.
|
|
#
?
Dec 28, 2021 01:13
|
|
|
GreatGreen posted:I did that and none of the bindings worked. I searched "heading" and "hdg" which is what you see when you mouse over the switch, but no dice. The MSFS settings search is rear end. It defaults to showing you assigned keys. So you may need to change the filter under the search field to show all instead of assigned. These are the names the heading things are. 
|
|
#
?
Dec 28, 2021 10:24
|
|
|
Increase / decrease heading bug is what I bind on my gamepad to adjust direction in HDG mode, so I'm pretty sure that's what you want. (Unless the F-18 has a completely separate system that didn't show up in that list).
|
|
#
?
Dec 28, 2021 12:06
|
|
|
I found some easy-to-follow channels on YouTube containing a bunch of real-world flight instruction that can also be helpful in civilian sims ERAU SpecialVFR covers the basics of VFR flying with lots of helpful animations and diagrams (this one is fairly well known) FlightInsight covers IFR procedures (this one started up a few months ago)
|
|
#
?
Dec 28, 2021 15:07
|
|
|
That FlightInsight channel got recommended to me a little while back and I've watched a few of them. They're really well made and well explained, the various approach videos he's done like non-precision landings and hold entries are pretty useful.
|
|
#
?
Dec 28, 2021 15:53
|
|
|
Which channel specifically? I looked back and your posts several pages and didn't see anything you were replied to/linked. I'm always on the hunt for quality channels.
|
|
#
?
Dec 28, 2021 17:54
|
|
|
The one in my post and the post directly above mine, FlightInsight.
|
|
#
?
Dec 28, 2021 18:07
|
|
|
Ah, sorry, I'm slow  https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCAHvg_6KCB3MgOY_PvNZCDQ/featured Looks interesting - thanks.
|
|
#
?
Dec 28, 2021 18:22
|
|
|
I'll throw out another plug for P Gatcomb Dude always seems to have a video for every question I have in MSFS2020 and he's also a real life pilot (and I think CFI) so he throws in fun info about how things are done in the sim vs. real life. He also has a fantastic tutorial playlist for DCS called Zero to Ace where he starts you out in a YAK-52 for the basics, then moves you to the L-39 to start learning jets, then moves you to the F-16 for advanced flight stuff.
|
|
#
?
Dec 28, 2021 20:01
|
|
|
His earlier videos are kinda weird, pretty much every one of his approach demonstrations has "AP" clearly displayed on the annunciator yet he's fighting the engaged autopilot on final. e.g. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZY5PPqljXSE&t=820s not a pilot but idk that just seems dubious. Sapozhnik fucked around with this message at 20:15 on Dec 28, 2021 |
|
#
?
Dec 28, 2021 20:12
|
|
|
Sapozhnik posted:His earlier videos are kinda weird, pretty much every one of his approach demonstrations has "AP" clearly displayed on the annunciator yet he's fighting the engaged autopilot on final. Is that steep...? That looks like my average GA landing.
|
|
#
?
Dec 28, 2021 20:20
|
|
|
Sapozhnik posted:His earlier videos are kinda weird, pretty much every one of his approach demonstrations has "AP" clearly displayed on the annunciator yet he's fighting the engaged autopilot on final. No, that approach is just a real weird motherfucker. Aspen is an exception to most rules. Their departure procedures are a hell of a thing too.
|
|
#
?
Dec 28, 2021 21:57
|
|
|
Thanks for the keybinding suggestions guys, I appreciate it. In other news, I found a mod that allows MSFS2020 to stream Google Maps data instead of Bing Maps, and it's a huge improvement to the game. Here's a video showing the differences: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E11XsrBdzcg And here's a video showing how to install and uninstall the mod: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HqaD2y7HA6o You don't have to do anything to MSFS2020's game directory at all, you just need to run a small separate app alongside the game.
|
|
#
?
Dec 28, 2021 22:24
|
|
|
How does the procedural generation of buildings work with that? Just uses the same data that Bing had?
|
|
#
?
Dec 28, 2021 22:39
|
|
|
Shipon posted:How does the procedural generation of buildings work with that? Just uses the same data that Bing had? The buildings and trees are identical in mesh and texture to Microsoft's. It's only the ground texture that changes.
|
|
#
?
Dec 28, 2021 22:58
|
|
|
I'm gonna try it out, but I'm seeing a number of comments from people complaining about obvious color changes from tile to tile, and one guy who says the Alps are covered in big Google copyright logos. lol
|
|
#
?
Dec 28, 2021 23:53
|
|
|
Say what you will about google, but copyrighting the alps is a power move
|
|
#
?
Dec 29, 2021 00:18
|
|
|
I think the last time this was brought up, someone mentioned that it doesn't modify textures in photogrammetry areas (which is why the urban shot in the first video was identical with the mod off and on), which causes obvious color shifts along the borders of those zones. The google copyright notices is a new one to me. That's pretty funny.
|
|
#
?
Dec 29, 2021 00:19
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 26, 2024 23:36 |
|
|
I wish Bing Maps would spend more effort keeping their satellite data current. Considering it's probably not really popular in comparison to Google Maps, and therefore doesn't generate as much revenue, they're likely cagey about spending money. The imagery around here I live is old as gently caress, and to add insult to injury, they ran the imagery through some ML scaling algorithm somewhen last year and made it worse.
|
|
#
?
Dec 29, 2021 00:32
|
|
