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(Thread IKs: Nuns with Guns)
 
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Dapper_Swindler
Feb 14, 2012

Im glad my instant dislike in you has been validated again and again.
https://www.youtube.com/c/PerspectiveArts

found another art history channel. its has alot of documentaries of Waldemar Januszczak that i watched in college and i genuinely enjoy his stuff.

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Endorph
Jul 22, 2009

Bar Crow posted:

You do. Identify your goals and identify who has power and is using that power to oppose your goals. Those are your enemies.
okay. i think the queer sf lit guys who harassed fall are doing that. good talk?

Endorph
Jul 22, 2009

DoctorWhat posted:

The reason queer sf and YA Twitter are batshit insane and vindictive and cruel is because every author is desperate to make a living and a career off it and there isn't enough money to go around. So you have authors living off dwindling stores of instant ramen bought with the remains of their advance, spending all their time on social media doing self-promotion, but self-promotion isn't enough.

The field is so huge and crowded that not only do your books have to hit all the basic audience expectations for representation, romance, magic systems, historical motifs, and laundered shonen anime tropes, but they also have to do it in a way that is perceived as morally superior to the competition. You are incentivized economically - or at least it seems that way - to attack every other YA SF author as being crypto-fash, or privileged, or appropriative, or secretly a pedophile, in order to cut them out of the market and devour their fanbase. This is usually done via vagueposting and taking part in pile-ons other people start, but sometimes it is just all out war.

Obviously this is insane. But that's what happens when people are fighting over scraps. Sending armies of emotional teenagers to litigate the exact emotional dynamics of one book's toxic romance in order to paint your competitors as rapists while your psuedo-horny anime book is woke and saintly. It's a perverse system of incentives that cannot ever, ever support human kindness.
once you dig into it even a little bit it really is easy to tell how much of the fall stuff was driven by sheer jealousy.

Acute Grill
Dec 9, 2011

Chomp

sexpig by night posted:

it's this, humanity hasn't magically gotten worse, it's just way easier to see DogBallz69's thoughts on what really IS a woman than it was before but he always had those views and always was happy to share them when he could

It's not. Dogballz69 was always a bigot and was always going to talk to anyone who would listen but Jack Dorsey gave him a free to use platform to speak to a global audience that he didn't previously have access to and that's kind of a net loss for everyone.

Even 8chan, a website that was a staging ground for multiple acts of terrorism has a lower body count than Facebook or Twitter.

stev
Jan 22, 2013

Please be excited.



Dias posted:

gently caress, this whole Lindsay situation is people ignoring poo poo like "making GBS threads blood" and "my life is running on fumes" in favor of discussing how she should have been careful invoking that case because of potential harassment when it's something clearly written under a massive amount of stress.

This is the main takeaway for me. Every word of that posts screams that she's seriously not ok on a lot of fronts - and people are still picking every sentence apart looking for something out of place to further weaponise. I've seen a lot of people gently caress up and get called out for it on the mighty Twitter Dot Com but this whole thing and the extreme lengths that people have gone to tear this woman down is mind boggling to me. Like - what do they actually want at this point?

Dapper_Swindler
Feb 14, 2012

Im glad my instant dislike in you has been validated again and again.

stev posted:

This is the main takeaway for me. Every word of that posts screams that she's seriously not ok on a lot of fronts - and people are still picking every sentence apart looking for something out of place to further weaponise. I've seen a lot of people gently caress up and get called out for it on the mighty Twitter Dot Com but this whole thing and the extreme lengths that people have gone to tear this woman down is mind boggling to me. Like - what do they actually want at this point?

because she needs to learn and she commited to many "sins"/sins to be allowed to walk away. it doesnt help that alot of those close critic communities build alot of weird annimosity toward each other as much as the build up comradship. i partly blame her weird ex friend and that lady who made that 50 post "look at all her sins" including weird personal college poo poo and then hid behind being jewish and neurodivergent when she got called out. its mostly weird fucks who collect grivances and weird former colleagues and friends who will stab you in the back for a chance to climb some online ladder. its also because you can't actually hurt the real loving monsters because they tend to be weird sociopaths and the people who care can actually be hurt.

like i think lindsay can be an rear end in a top hat(like most people) and from reading various stuff can probably be a prickly person to be around and has made dumb mistakes but holy gently caress this shits nuts.

Dapper_Swindler fucked around with this message at 21:15 on Dec 28, 2021

Clip-On Fedora
Feb 20, 2011

stev posted:

This is the main takeaway for me. Every word of that posts screams that she's seriously not ok on a lot of fronts - and people are still picking every sentence apart looking for something out of place to further weaponise. I've seen a lot of people gently caress up and get called out for it on the mighty Twitter Dot Com but this whole thing and the extreme lengths that people have gone to tear this woman down is mind boggling to me. Like - what do they actually want at this point?

well shes not making essays anymore how else are we supposed to get entertainment out of her???

BlankSystemDaemon
Mar 13, 2009



Giving a shoutout to KarlJobst who is a pick-up-artist, really lovely dude and really likes hanging out with nazis on their discords and joking around with them isn't great.

Just so people don't think I'm making things up, I'll quote a few things from the speedrunning thread over in the games subforum:

KennyMan666 posted:

He's pals with RWhiteGoose and hangs out in his Discord and oh look

One thing I've been wondering is if "Karl Jobst" is his actual real name. Searching around hasn't led me to any evidence one way or the other, but one thing you do find when searching the name is an actual nazi from the 1940s...

DEEP STATE PLOT posted:

he used his huge fanbase to run kevinddr off twitch because kevinddr committed the cardinal sin of being a gay man

gently caress karl jobst

And don't have a link for his PUA poo poo, but it's archived and still linked to him.

BlankSystemDaemon fucked around with this message at 21:33 on Dec 28, 2021

Dias
Feb 20, 2011

by sebmojo
It's the whole "kill the bad guys" power fantasy, just adapted to avoid toxic masculinity cliches. People get called out for being assholes and will still defend their actions because they have a moral high ground or whatever.

Endorph
Jul 22, 2009

https://twitter.com/MENA_Conflict/status/1475914827008724994/photo/1

Booky
Feb 21, 2013

Chill Bug



:yeah:

thetoughestbean
Apr 27, 2013

Keep On Shroomin

Nuns with Guns posted:

I think you can extrapolate this out to every "unstable" profession at this point (which is getting to be nearly all of them, I know.) It's something that's been there since capitalist forces have pushed certain people to the top, who can enshrine their place there and stop anyone else from getting up or pulling them down. But it's easier now to perceive and compare notes or even just feel that malaise around your condition.

In particular this winds back to youtube video essayists and political accounts there and on twitter whose profession is talking about this stuff, and whose capital is their credibility as a leftist "face" that gets constantly scrutinized and nitpicked in large and small ways. They're close enough to react to your feedback, but also completely inconsequential as political forces. The perfect coastal communities for all the storms of the internet to break against and absorb all the destruction.

There are plenty of people who are economically stable who are just complete assholes online so I don’t really buy this.

To be honest I don’t think we’d be all that much nicer to each other it we were in fully automated luxury socialism

Sudden Loud Noise
Feb 18, 2007

Here's my hot take:

Similar to how mining gives you black lung, having a presence online be part of how you provide for yourself is harmful to your health.

We should absolutely fight to make mining safer and less toxic, there are people who are being actively harmed because of it. If you personally have the ability to not mine and not get black lung you should probably take it. We should commend people who quit mining.

Additionally, if you are mining and it is not part of your job you really should stop that. Mining isn't that cool or fun.

I AM GRANDO
Aug 20, 2006

thetoughestbean posted:

There are plenty of people who are economically stable who are just complete assholes online so I don’t really buy this.

To be honest I don’t think we’d be all that much nicer to each other it we were in fully automated luxury socialism

It helps to have community and a meaningful life, or something that gives your life meaning. Modernity is confusing and doesn’t do much for belonging or sense of purpose, even if you’re safe.

thetoughestbean
Apr 27, 2013

Keep On Shroomin

Antifa Turkeesian posted:

It helps to have community and a meaningful life, or something that gives your life meaning. Modernity is confusing and doesn’t do much for belonging or sense of purpose, even if you’re safe.

I don’t think that pre-modernity was all that fulfilling either!

Dias
Feb 20, 2011

by sebmojo
Bo Burnham hit the nail on the head with that Welcome to the Internet chorus, really. Being content isn't enough in this day and age, and some people are also far from content so what the gently caress is even left for them?

edit: here, have internet man burning bad people but funny

https://twitter.com/shaun_vids/status/1475920527369949196

Dias fucked around with this message at 21:41 on Dec 28, 2021

Ash Crimson
Apr 4, 2010
it's actually a good thing now!!

Nuns with Guns
Jul 23, 2010

It's fine.
Don't worry about it.

thetoughestbean posted:

There are plenty of people who are economically stable who are just complete assholes online so I don’t really buy this.

To be honest I don’t think we’d be all that much nicer to each other it we were in fully automated luxury socialism

I never said it was the root of all internet drama or something. Well off or stable people can be assholes too, yeah.

I AM GRANDO
Aug 20, 2006

thetoughestbean posted:

I don’t think that pre-modernity was all that fulfilling either!

Can’t experience existential angst when you’re dying of ergot from the barley you spend your every waking minute growing so that you narrowly escape starvation for one more growing season! Or you would at least think of it as a witch’s curse or something instead.

BlankSystemDaemon
Mar 13, 2009



Dias posted:

edit: here, have internet man burning bad people but funny

https://twitter.com/shaun_vids/status/1475920527369949196
Holy loving lol, I remember Jimmy Dore showing up on Jimmy Pardo's podcast a decade ago and playing what I thought was a character, but it turns out it's not actually a character at all and that's just who he is? :v:

EDIT: I use per-channel youtube feeds because I don't trust the algorithmically-generated subscription tracking youtube does, because they can't even list all of my subscriptions correctly on the website and unless you do five different things it's very possible you won't even get all of the content that someone posts?
Anyway, it turns out that in order for that to work, I have to not be an idiot and forget to check the log files of the programs I use to scrape those rss feeds, so I'm like a month behind on Shaun videos because my RSS feeds stopped working at some point? Great.
Anyway, I had a point about him being a character, because he wasn't even remotely leftist so if that's what he's been branding himself as he's been lying to himself and/or everyone else.

BlankSystemDaemon fucked around with this message at 21:52 on Dec 28, 2021

Clip-On Fedora
Feb 20, 2011

thetoughestbean posted:

There are plenty of people who are economically stable who are just complete assholes online so I don’t really buy this.

To be honest I don’t think we’d be all that much nicer to each other it we were in fully automated luxury socialism

Perhaps, but we'd certainly be less vicious.

Jamie Faith
Jan 13, 2020

In some good news, ProZD is going to be in One Piece!!! :unsmith:

https://twitter.com/ProZD/status/1475866797060640774

Dias
Feb 20, 2011

by sebmojo

Jamie Faith posted:

In some good news, ProZD is going to be in One Piece!!! :unsmith:

https://twitter.com/ProZD/status/1475866797060640774

yeyeye prozd is an anime now!

Between this and the Epic Meal Time video someone posted before, I think we're starting to see the answer to a much-asked question in these forums and threads: "what are these people going to do for a living when they wanna move on or their stuff stalls out and they've been 5 years removed from ~real jobs~?"

Apparently you just retain enough of an audience to keep doing your thing and paying your bills or you diversify because you also built up a nice network during those years.

pentyne
Nov 7, 2012

Endorph posted:

once you dig into it even a little bit it really is easy to tell how much of the fall stuff was driven by sheer jealousy.

NK Jemisin jumped in, I guess for the free social media attention, and later admitted she didn't see the title or the story at all. It's not just struggling authors barely making a buck pretty much anyone active online in the scene needs to throw out their "correct" opinions at the drop of a hat to try and boost their credibility.

John Murdoch
May 19, 2009

I can tune a fish.
I know this is just going to engender a "get a load of this guy" type response, but it would be cool if in 2022 we could get away from the strange flagellating about this thread being a uniquely terrible garbage heap. Because obviously no other thread on SA, anywhere, devolves into weird and dumb arguments, or derails over nonsense, or gets mired in Twitter discourse. Or deals with personality clashes between argumentative posters. Nope, just this one. Better quarantine it to improve the internet as a whole...somehow.

It might as well be a self-fulfilling prophecy. If you keep calling the thread a trash bin, big surprise that people keep treating it like a trash bin.

Idk, I'm just tired of the drive-by :gas: posts (or equivalent) every time the thread isn't living up to whatever vague standards <insert SA name here> has in their head.

Dias
Feb 20, 2011

by sebmojo

pentyne posted:

NK Jemisin jumped in, I guess for the free social media attention, and later admitted she didn't see the title or the story at all. It's not just struggling authors barely making a buck pretty much anyone active online in the scene needs to throw out their "correct" opinions at the drop of a hat to try and boost their credibility.

Don't forget it's also to get ahead of the inevitable "why didn't X talk about the Milkshake Duck incident, they follow each other on Twitter!" questions.

Oxxidation
Jul 22, 2007

Dias posted:

yeyeye prozd is an anime now!

Between this and the Epic Meal Time video someone posted before, I think we're starting to see the answer to a much-asked question in these forums and threads: "what are these people going to do for a living when they wanna move on or their stuff stalls out and they've been 5 years removed from ~real jobs~?"

Apparently you just retain enough of an audience to keep doing your thing and paying your bills or you diversify because you also built up a nice network during those years.

i'm not sure if that really applies to prozd, guy's been slowly breaking his way into the professional VA scene for a long time now. and that is not an easy feat by any means

but over the last 5-7 years he's been going from webcomic fandubs, to indie game roles, to tv/anime work, and unlike Team 4star he doesn't have those pricks at tecmo koei trying to blackball him

Dias
Feb 20, 2011

by sebmojo

Oxxidation posted:

i'm not sure if that really applies to prozd, guy's been slowly breaking his way into the professional VA scene for a long time now. and that is not an easy feat by any means

but over the last 5-7 years he's been going from webcomic fandubs, to indie game roles, to tv/anime work, and unlike Team 4star he doesn't have those pricks at tecmo koei trying to blackball him

Oh, sure, I'm not saying he got handed anything, but he used his own work in social media and YT as leverage too. There's nothing wrong with it, of course, quite the opposite, dude deserves it.

Also Cody decided to just do a long MCU bit and it actually kinda works?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-tt1HkiTcZ0&hd=1

Happy Landfill
Feb 26, 2011

I don't understand but I've also heard much worse
ProZD deserves it because the dude is legit talented. Didn't even know that was him in Aggretsuko until he mentioned it on Twitter.

Seriously, good for him. I know he's a huge one piece fan, too.

sexpig by night
Sep 8, 2011

by Azathoth

Jamie Faith posted:

In some good news, ProZD is going to be in One Piece!!! :unsmith:

https://twitter.com/ProZD/status/1475866797060640774

hey that's cool! Cat Viper is a fairly big character and a fun part of a good arc, I can totally imagine his voice for it.

Antigravitas
Dec 8, 2019

Die Rettung fuer die Landwirte:
I'm counting Dslyecxi as an Online Creator so…

His 2021 Year In Review is just a supercut of cool arma stuff.

I like it, it's just people having fun. Watch people having fun doing pewpews.

thetoughestbean
Apr 27, 2013

Keep On Shroomin

Clip-On Fedora posted:

Perhaps, but we'd certainly be less vicious.

I don’t think that’s particularly true either! I don’t think you can economics your way into a kinder society

Oxxidation
Jul 22, 2007
the classic

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=diOhwvRYlsU

thetoughestbean
Apr 27, 2013

Keep On Shroomin
SunWon Cho is extremely funny, I know he’s mostly content to make board game reviews and do his job as a VA but I miss his funny videos

sexpig by night
Sep 8, 2011

by Azathoth

thetoughestbean posted:

SunWon Cho is extremely funny, I know he’s mostly content to make board game reviews and do his job as a VA but I miss his funny videos

yea on one hand you love to see a cool guy like him getting his dreams but on the other I miss my silly youtube man :qq:

on the plus side though this does mean now we have odds of getting a silly reading by Cat Viper and that'd be p. funny considering the character.

Mr.Radar
Nov 5, 2005

You guys aren't going to believe this, but that guy is our games teacher.

Dias posted:

Oh, sure, I'm not saying he got handed anything, but he used his own work in social media and YT as leverage too. There's nothing wrong with it, of course, quite the opposite, dude deserves it.

Also Cody decided to just do a long MCU bit and it actually kinda works?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-tt1HkiTcZ0&hd=1

It's nice to see he made a followup to his Star Wars video from last year 2019 (fake edit: my sense of time is broken :psyduck:):

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q5MTIIou56Y

Acerbatus
Jun 26, 2020

by Jeffrey of YOSPOS

sexpig by night posted:

it's this, humanity hasn't magically gotten worse, it's just way easier to see DogBallz69's thoughts on what really IS a woman than it was before but he always had those views and always was happy to share them when he could

More people having access to conspiracy theories means more people buy into it to spread to more people. A lot of that wouldn't have sprung up independently for each person who buys into it, because these theories are completely insane and entirely detached from reality.

BlankSystemDaemon posted:

Giving a shoutout to KarlJobst who is a pick-up-artist, really lovely dude and really likes hanging out with nazis on their discords and joking around with them isn't great.

Just so people don't think I'm making things up, I'll quote a few things from the speedrunning thread over in the games subforum:





And don't have a link for his PUA poo poo, but it's archived and still linked to him.

cage-free egghead posted:

Cool, so the guy is a shithead. I don't give a poo poo about what he is outside of the content he produces. Everybody is a shithead.

Edit: Page snipe, let's drop this poo poo and just post speedrunning content please



this site sure knows how to pick mods lmao

Acerbatus fucked around with this message at 23:33 on Dec 28, 2021

RareAcumen
Dec 28, 2012




Endorph posted:

okay. i think the queer sf lit guys who harassed fall are doing that. good talk?

God I wish we could just manufacture little Nen-powered Jiminiy Crickets for people attached to their hearts so they cod just loving stop for once.

I wish for a lot of things because changing some people's minds is like destroying matter.

Ash Crimson
Apr 4, 2010
We need to talk about schadenfreude

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Alaois
Feb 7, 2012

Grondoth posted:

I used to believe this, but I do not think it's true anymore. The most awful people were always here, radicals are always drawn to spaces like this and way back in the day people were laughing at internet nazi forums and chat groups. There's been a noticeable shift in how the normal people engage with the internet, not just in the presence of people.

Cute cat pictures, cute dog pictures, and banal minion memes used to be how normal people communicated online. They'd post pictures of food, post pictures of pets, and share things like "can't wait for wine 'o clock" next to a picture of a minion and their friends would all go "nice one, Gerry/Kathy!" This is straight up not how it is anymore. Normal people facebook is just as full of provocative material as the Too Online facebook is. Things designed to either start a fight or get people to react as though someone else is starting a fight is very common posting, because that's what people interact with and the whole system is designed to encourage that behavior. From the notifications to the reaction faces, it's about getting people to spend time making posts that people engage with, because that makes people stay on the site and that's what it wants. "Nice one, Gerry/Kathy" takes much less time than a post about why Gerry/Kathy is wrong.

you've never seen an email chain-letter have you

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