[Biosphere Collapse] 420 days of blazin' it

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Paradoxish: Dec 19, 2003; Will you stop going crazy in there?

Doctor Jeep posted:

since I'm not a climate scientist I have no other choice than to take it on faith that these people who have been educated to know their poo poo are right
isn't that how things usually work

a major victory for climate denialism/inaction was learning how to exploit the scientific community so that it's now impossible for average people to parse reality without having a relatively deep understanding of the subject matter

the lightning speed with which the government/media/corporations were able to bend reality around covid is a consequence of this btw

# ? Jan 5, 2022 02:21

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# ? May 26, 2024 22:47

skooma512: Feb 8, 2012; You couldn't grok my race car, but you dug the roadside blur.

I'm already accustomed to running to Dr. Google when I'm sick because I've accepted that doctors most of the time can't really help. If it's a small time illness, they're just going to tell you to take OTC meds and rest. The same for a joint sprain. Considering a doctor visit in the US could be 50 to infinity dollars depending on what the insurance company feels like doing, I'm pretty sure I'm not alone in not seeking medical care and advice unless there is truly no alternative.

# ? Jan 5, 2022 02:52

stringless: Dec 28, 2005; keyboard ⌨️ cowboy

Trabisnikof posted:

and how can a society survive for long if it can't even agree on what reality is.

like 6 more years according to trustworthy source Bo Burnham

# ? Jan 5, 2022 03:04

Rime: Nov 2, 2011; by Games Forum

Paradoxish posted:

a major victory for climate denialism/inaction was learning how to exploit the scientific community so that it's now impossible for average people to parse reality without having a relatively deep understanding of the subject matter

the lightning speed with which the government/media/corporations were able to bend reality around covid is a consequence of this btw

This goes back to narrative control tactics which the US government started experimenting with during WWII to manufacture support for the war domestically - after historically being an isolationist nation. In the years following the war these experiments towards brainwashing and mind control at a societal scale continued and saw widespread deployment in order to manufacture consent for western imperialist actions internationally - especially following the debacle of Vietnam. The brute-force tactics explored by MKULTRA were discarded for the subtle shaping powers of propaganda and suggestion.

It's not limited to COVID or Climate: the driving goal behind American society for the better part of the past sixty years has been to cultivate a population which is functionally incapable of independent thought or critical thinking, one which cannot determine for itself the truth of a matter and must be told the sky is blue by a trusted media figure, and critically - a society which ridicules intellectualism or educated figures in favor of "layman experts".

This has been a top-down effort from the highest levels to lobotomize the population. Unfortunately somewhere just after the turn of the century they lost control of this particular demon and now you have a messy web of poo poo like Q starting to pop up organically. The internet grew way too fast and the rise of memetic communication introduced variables which were definitely not taken into consideration. While power-hungry state or corporate actors very interested in seizing power are still able to harness the narrative control lightning to some extent, giving us fun like Jan 6th, for the most part this systemic brainworm is fully self-propagating now.

Trabisnikof posted:

and how can a society survive for long if it can't even agree on what reality is.

...is the question which everyone in the west should be asking ourselves, when it's clear that there are rapidly deepening schisms being carved into the minds of everyone who touches any form of media-interface now, and that this process is accelerating at a breathtaking pace.

# ? Jan 5, 2022 03:07

petit choux: Feb 24, 2016

Trabisnikof posted:

right and our society is collapsing precisely because those experts who "have been educated to know their poo poo" have lied and conned enough people enough times that no one can trust them unless someone that you already agree with says to trust them.

if society was functioning correctly none of us would need to know anything about the global warming potential of methane, the varying efficacy of mask types, or the signs of dangerous failure in concrete. instead our society is failing and we can't trust the experts on any of those topics, so instead we're all forced to "do our own research"

neolibs/libs like to mock the right wing idiots who "do their research on facebook" while they wisely have been educated on the *correct* sources of information. But even then, this thread knows that smugly saying "climate change is no big deal, a noble winning economist said so!" is just the boogie version of "doing their research on facebook."

and this process of not just ideological splintering but epistemological splintering shatters the shared definition of reality.

and how can a society survive for long if it can't even agree on what reality is.

# ? Jan 5, 2022 03:37

petit choux: Feb 24, 2016

Trabisnikof posted:

and how can a society survive for long if it can't even agree on what reality is.

What is politics if words don't mean anything?

# ? Jan 5, 2022 03:41

Mayor Dave: Feb 20, 2009; Bernie the Snow Clown

LionArcher posted:

So I have a fun "infrastructure" post.

Last week, I was in LA driving back North. The rain is insane. Like, dumping. I use GPS to get on the I5, but apple maps reroutes me to 14. Makes no sense, and I don't realize this till almost 40 minutes into the drive. So I turn around, and get back on 5 towards the grapevine. And get stuck for an hour in traffic. Then, right at the start of the grapevine, the police have it blocked off, because i5 is shut down. Totally. For rain.

so back to 14 I go. Only, it's me, and every single other car and truck heading that way too. Long story short, I get stuck in mud in the high dessert, (tried to pull a u turn on a dessert road, and the mud instantly stuck my hatch and half a dozen other sedans) get pulled free by a mom and her son driving around in a giant lifted truck looking happier than pigs with a chain, and then was stuck on a 30 mile section of highway to Bakersfield for 3 hours.

I left at 7AM, and pulled into a cheap motel off of i5, just north of Bakersfield. at 9:30PM. I was in the car for 14 hours, and drove roughly 150 miles. And all I could think was, (that was just some rain. And it disrupted so many people for a day). So when this East Coast car jam up for a day in frozen conditions hits just a few days later, I just laugh.

Also, the roads were terrible. We're talking potholes I avoided because I'm pretty sure they would cause a flat. Also, half of the rest stops were closed on i5.

Things aren't bad.... yet.

I used to live at the top of the grapevine and it regularly closes due to snow during the winter. I also wouldn't wish driving on any of those routes on anyone

# ? Jan 5, 2022 03:45

Perry Mason Jar: Feb 24, 2006; "Della? Take a lid"

https://twitter.com/KrystofSubr/status/1478434262726684680?s=20

# ? Jan 5, 2022 04:22

Horizon Burning: Oct 23, 2019

Perry Mason Jar posted:

https://twitter.com/KrystofSubr/status/1478434262726684680?s=20

lmfao

# ? Jan 5, 2022 04:28

Second Hand Meat Mouth: Sep 12, 2001

Perry Mason Jar posted:

https://twitter.com/KrystofSubr/status/1478434262726684680?s=20

rofl

# ? Jan 5, 2022 04:56

SKULL.GIF: Jan 20, 2017

Perry Mason Jar posted:

https://twitter.com/KrystofSubr/status/1478434262726684680?s=20

indeed

# ? Jan 5, 2022 05:05

Homeless Friend: Jul 16, 2007

Perry Mason Jar posted:

https://twitter.com/KrystofSubr/status/1478434262726684680?s=20

lmfao

# ? Jan 5, 2022 05:07

goochtit: Nov 2, 2021

petit choux posted:

love to live in the tower of babble

petit choux posted:

What is politics if words don't mean anything?

big stick

# ? Jan 5, 2022 05:14

tiberion02: Mar 26, 2007; People tend to make the common mistake of believing that a situation will last forever.

skooma512 posted:

If a State Uni researcher could see it, other observatories could too. Hell, even US researchers have to rent time on observatories in other countries. Chile has excellent ones because the Atacama desert has no real weather.

Don't underestimate the quality of Michigan State University Astronomers, haha!

I guess this didn't bother me because its literally a movie trope... discover aliens/asteroid, tell almost noone, but a top science dude and go straight to the P O T U S. I read it as all happening in like a 12 hour period.

# ? Jan 5, 2022 05:38

Rime: Nov 2, 2011; by Games Forum

It's perfectly logically consistent to imagine "cascading effects" that destroy society. You can even throw in plausible-sounding justifications like reference to supply chains, a hot topic now that we're facing an actual supply chain crisis for reasons that have essentially nothing to do with climate. But it's equally consistent to imagine that these pressures don't cascade out of control and wreck everything, or that they drive the economy into a recession that it eventually recovers from and leads to adaptation that prevents it from happening again, or any number of other scenarios. These kind of stories are essentially speculation, fun to think about but not particularly meaningful for understanding the future of human society.

This is what people said in the 1960s about the famines induced by population growth, the effects of Peak Oil in the early 2000s, (and really, going back to the 70s oil crisis and beyond), the hole in the ozone layer, acid rain, and really, every single eco-environmental problem we've had since the beginning of modernity. And guess what? None of them actually happened. Climate change is going to be more disruptive than any of those, but it will fail to produce the "enormous change" that people like yourself and the doomsayers of yesterday hope for, at least on the timescale of a human life.

# ? Jan 5, 2022 05:39

Car Hater: May 7, 2007; wolf. bike.
Wolf. Bike.
Wolf! Bike!
WolfBike!
WolfBike!
ARROOOOOO!

Rime posted:

*Howling and beating myself in the face with my undergrad Nonlinear Dynamics and Chaos textbook*

# ? Jan 5, 2022 05:50

rabble rabble: Mar 24, 2015; Nap Ghost

as a child of the 90s, one omnipresent fact about the end of history is that the Government is all powerful. When faced with a threat, The Government will move to squash whatever is in its way. I will broadly gesture to pop-media like the xfiles, enemy of the state, etc. the government can muster enormous resources to effectively contain any possible situation, and it's only the covert nature of these actions that allows them to continue without being stopped by ~meddling congressional inquiry~

similarly then, when we consider the doomsday future, one fact is that the government is decidedly NOT in control any more, we need OCP to build robots, or weyland yutani to scour the stars or wahtever the gently caress else, but importantly the United States Government is not the most powerful thing effecting change

you'd be easily forgiven if you mistook a lot of the news recently for a quick "before" montage of government collapse in the Running Man is all i guess i'm saying

# ? Jan 5, 2022 05:50

Mayor Dave: Feb 20, 2009; Bernie the Snow Clown

Perry Mason Jar posted:

https://twitter.com/KrystofSubr/status/1478434262726684680?s=20

# ? Jan 5, 2022 06:05

Rah!: Feb 21, 2006

Perry Mason Jar posted:

https://twitter.com/KrystofSubr/status/1478434262726684680?s=20

lol

# ? Jan 5, 2022 06:17

Shima Honnou: Dec 1, 2010; The Once And Future King Of Dicetroit; College Slice

Perry Mason Jar posted:

https://twitter.com/KrystofSubr/status/1478434262726684680?s=20

lmao

# ? Jan 5, 2022 06:20

Alobar: Jun 21, 2011; Are you proud of me?

Are you proud of what I do?

I'll try to be a better man than the one that you knew.

i don't get it

# ? Jan 5, 2022 06:26

SSJ_naruto_2003: Oct 12, 2012

Alobar posted:

i don't get it

# ? Jan 5, 2022 06:29

Alobar: Jun 21, 2011; Are you proud of me?

Are you proud of what I do?

I'll try to be a better man than the one that you knew.

yeah, i saw the whole thing

i uhh...still don't get it :smith:

# ? Jan 5, 2022 07:43

BIG HEADLINE: Jun 13, 2006; "Stand back, Ottawan ruffian, or face my lumens!"

It's a meme.

https://knowyourmeme.com/memes/two-soyjaks-pointing

# ? Jan 5, 2022 07:58

Goa Tse-tung: Feb 11, 2008; ;3; Yams Fan

Alobar posted:

yeah, i saw the whole thing

i uhh...still don't get it

the two soy wojaks are a meme, the post implies the movie recreated that meme, in part to make fun of the cvharacters since the meme makes fun of the orignal photo too

# ? Jan 5, 2022 09:45

tiberion02: Mar 26, 2007; People tend to make the common mistake of believing that a situation will last forever.

Goa Tse-tung posted:

the two soy wojaks are a meme, the post implies the movie recreated that meme, in part to make fun of the cvharacters since the meme makes fun of the orignal photo too

original photo was of two pasty white entrepreneurs shocasing beyond meat fried chicken being used at KFC

lmao

you know, to save the planet?

# ? Jan 5, 2022 10:11

Minera: Sep 26, 2007; All your friends and foes,
they thought they knew ya,
but look who's in your heart now.

tiberion02 posted:

original photo was of two pasty white entrepreneurs shocasing beyond meat fried chicken being used at KFC

lmao

you know, to save the planet?

the fact its from the montage where they try a last ditch effort to raise awareness and save the planet and fail is lol lmao

# ? Jan 5, 2022 10:59

Lpzie: Nov 20, 2006

don't look up is a documentary

# ? Jan 5, 2022 11:05

petit choux: Feb 24, 2016

Rime posted:

This goes back to narrative control tactics which the US government started experimenting with during WWII to manufacture support for the war domestically - after historically being an isolationist nation. In the years following the war these experiments towards brainwashing and mind control at a societal scale continued and saw widespread deployment in order to manufacture consent for western imperialist actions internationally - especially following the debacle of Vietnam. The brute-force tactics explored by MKULTRA were discarded for the subtle shaping powers of propaganda and suggestion.

It's not limited to COVID or Climate: the driving goal behind American society for the better part of the past sixty years has been to cultivate a population which is functionally incapable of independent thought or critical thinking, one which cannot determine for itself the truth of a matter and must be told the sky is blue by a trusted media figure, and critically - a society which ridicules intellectualism or educated figures in favor of "layman experts".

This has been a top-down effort from the highest levels to lobotomize the population. Unfortunately somewhere just after the turn of the century they lost control of this particular demon and now you have a messy web of poo poo like Q starting to pop up organically. The internet grew way too fast and the rise of memetic communication introduced variables which were definitely not taken into consideration. While power-hungry state or corporate actors very interested in seizing power are still able to harness the narrative control lightning to some extent, giving us fun like Jan 6th, for the most part this systemic brainworm is fully self-propagating now.

...is the question which everyone in the west should be asking ourselves, when it's clear that there are rapidly deepening schisms being carved into the minds of everyone who touches any form of media-interface now, and that this process is accelerating at a breathtaking pace.

LOL yeah RIP

# ? Jan 5, 2022 11:56

tokin opposition: Apr 8, 2021; I don't jailbreak the androids, I set them free.

WATCH MARS EXPRESS (2023)

Lpzie posted:

don't look up is a documentary

is it good

# ? Jan 5, 2022 11:59

500excf type r: Mar 7, 2013; I'm as annoying as the high-pitched whine of my motorcycle, desperately compensating for the lack of substance in my life.

tokin opposition posted:

is it good

It's not good but it isn't bad. It isn't subtle but people are idiots and the audience needs it to be ham fisted and in their face otherwise it is just lost upon them, like everyone that thinks it's about trump and covid

# ? Jan 5, 2022 12:13

Tiler Kiwi: Feb 26, 2011

Spime Wrangler posted:

just wanna say this is some good posting, nice discussion going on by everyone really

# ? Jan 5, 2022 12:17

Tiler Kiwi: Feb 26, 2011

i think Don't Look Up is less about any particular crisis but rather that the us is systemically incapable of responding competently to any major problem that would require it to shift any ideological gear.

i think it also unwittingly points out that the intellectual/activist castes in the usa are utterly ineffectual; they got people to look up, so what? in the end them and the entire us public are powerless compared to what one rich guy thinks is best. it is really my biggest criticism of the film in, in the end, lionizing the tragedy of their impotence instead of underscoring that trying to stop a meteor with ballads and yelling WAKE UP SHEEPLE is just as pathetic and useless as shooting it with a m60

# ? Jan 5, 2022 12:25

Goa Tse-tung: Feb 11, 2008; ;3; Yams Fan

Tiler Kiwi posted:

i think Don't Look Up is less about any particular crisis but rather that the us is systemically incapable of responding competently to any major problem that would require it to shift any ideological gear.

i think it also unwittingly points out that the intellectual/activist castes in the usa are utterly ineffectual; they got people to look up, so what? in the end them and the entire us public are powerless compared to what one rich guy thinks is best. it is really my biggest criticism of the film in, in the end, lionizing the tragedy of their impotence instead of underscoring that trying to stop a meteor with ballads and yelling WAKE UP SHEEPLE is just as pathetic and useless as shooting it with a m60

it does make sense when you see the two writers on twitter

a lot of stupid people angry at the movie ask "where are the jokes?!?" when they are right there

# ? Jan 5, 2022 12:47

wynott dunn: Aug 9, 2006; What is to be done?

Who or what can challenge, and stand a chance at beating, the corporate juggernauts dominating the world?

SSJ_naruto_2003 posted:

nice

# ? Jan 5, 2022 12:57

uguu: Mar 9, 2014

Rime posted:

This has been a top-down effort from the highest levels to lobotomize the population. Unfortunately somewhere just after the turn of the century they lost control of this particular demon and now you have a messy web of poo poo like Q starting to pop up organically. The internet grew way too fast and the rise of memetic communication introduced variables which were definitely not taken into consideration. While power-hungry state or corporate actors very interested in seizing power are still able to harness the narrative control lightning to some extent, giving us fun like Jan 6th, for the most part this systemic brainworm is fully self-propagating now.

Wouldn't this also mean that climate change activists have the same shot at influencing the narrative?
Obviously the powers that be have way more clout, but history being on our side and all that, momentum will switch at some point.

I know we won't make 2 or 3 degrees, but there'll still be a big difference between 6 or 8 degrees.
Same with all the different pollutions, we're set for grotesque amounts, but it can still end up worse or better.
And we can also influence the direction society will steer during and after the collapse.
Think of it as hospice care.

I'm trying to do stuff; writing pieces for newspapers which get rejected, making memes and an app, joining protests.
It all feels very slacktivist and propably only helps to soothe my conscious, but it's the best I can do.

I would like to be more effective though.
Does anyone have any resources on learning to influence people?

# ? Jan 5, 2022 13:05