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Open Marriage Night posted:Inferno #4 tomorrow. In4no
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Jan 4, 2022 22:51
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danbanana posted:19 Age of Apocalypse Way worse than its reputation. Only the GenX stuff is worthwhile. I'm not an AoA fan myself, but for its time, it was ambitious. Maybe even the first of it's kind in terms of scope and story? The entire line of X-related books was impacted. Everything was re-titled. It rewarded well-versed readers by touching on every character that had ever existed in the X-Men world (up until then, except Psylocke lol).
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Jan 5, 2022 01:49
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iceyman posted:I'm not an AoA fan myself, but for its time, it was ambitious. Maybe even the first of it's kind in terms of scope and story? The entire line of X-related books was impacted. Everything was re-titled. It rewarded well-versed readers by touching on every character that had ever existed in the X-Men world (up until then, except Psylocke lol). But with very few exceptions, every AoA version of the character is worse than the 616 version, some wayyyyyy worse. Also: a handful of those books are unreadable slogs. Also, the story makes no sense and while it's not on the level of Magneto from this era, the Apocalypse of AoA makes no goddam sense compared to the character portrayed as recently as Xcutioners Song.
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Jan 5, 2022 02:15
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AoA is not a particularly compelling narrative, and it's core premise is full of holes, but it has Rogue's best haircut, the best Sunfire design, and it brought Blink back, so I would put it in the top 10th percentile of big 90s crossovers.
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Jan 5, 2022 02:51
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I know a lot of people around my age who are ride or die for Age of Apocalypse, but it just kind of makes me tired overall and has since it was new. It wasn't like '90s X-Men was exactly infused with sunshine and lollipops to begin with, so a total dystopia didn't really work as a shocking comparison. The only parts of it that really stuck with me, and I've read more or less the entire thing, are the Butch & Sundance ending to Generation Next and that infamous panel where Havok kills Cyclops. Really, though, I've never cared for the big X-crossovers. There have been a lot of individual X-books I've liked since Claremont--David's X-Factor, Carey's run, Gillen and Fraction, the current status quo--but the crossovers always seem to screw up each book's progress. Messiah Complex was probably the one I came closest to liking, and even it's saddled with some hideous artistic whiplash when you go from somebody like Scott Eaton (realistic proportions, Xavier looks like Patrick Stewart) to Humberto Ramos (everybody's somewhere between manga and Gumby).
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Jan 5, 2022 03:43
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Haven’t read AoA since I was like thirteen, so I’m just going to assume it still rules.
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Jan 5, 2022 03:48
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BrianWilly posted:The short answer is: yes, but...sort of. Claremont has always been very clear and intentional that the Phoenix is Jean herself, but there are some vague statements in the run that could be construed to maybe possibly sort of suggest that she's tapping into a higher cosmic entity that's a little bit separate from her, sort of. I mostly agree with this. Although I was fine with the retcon actually, because Jean still tapped into the cosmic force, she basically (at least at the time of retcon 1) made something with no consciousness wake up and wonder "hey what would it be like to be this person, this one's really cool. poo poo let's try that out." Excalibur covering that it turns out that for the Phoenix being aware actually loving sucked and deciding to use Rachel (who was actually probably the Phoenix force's daughter rather than Jean's, when you consider the timeline, as What-If of all things did) to deal with the living manifestation of it all while the force itself returned to just being a mindless force of nature was something I always liked.
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Jan 5, 2022 04:14
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Wanderer posted:
I actually bought Messiah Complex as it was coming out and rereading it 18ish months ago is what inspired the other readings. I figured I'd never catch up on all the stuff I missed (I've been a way more off than on reader since I was 14) so the bigger stories would catch me up over 25ish years. And it's been fun, even the Alan Davis trash. I think Messiah Complex is a top tier action story. There's a ton of poo poo going on and it all melds perfectly, while wrapping up some long standing stories and leaving a lot of interesting new stories to be told.
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Jan 5, 2022 04:28
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OnimaruXLR posted:AoA is not a particularly compelling narrative, and it's core premise is full of holes, but it has Rogue's best haircut, the best Sunfire design, and it brought Blink back, so I would put it in the top 10th percentile of big 90s crossovers. 
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Jan 5, 2022 04:51
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Y'know what else brought Blink back? Necrosha. Which is of similar quality.
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Jan 5, 2022 14:37
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Serious question since I never read the Phalanx Saga: do people actually care about 616 Blink who was in like four issues then died, or is the positive of bringing Blink "back" entirely predicated on the AoA version that is 99.9% of the appearances of the character?
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Jan 5, 2022 15:06
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Endless Mike posted:Serious question since I never read the Phalanx Saga: do people actually care about 616 Blink who was in like four issues then died, or is the positive of bringing Blink "back" entirely predicated on the AoA version that is 99.9% of the appearances of the character? Oh, it's entirely the AoA version. Full stop.
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Jan 5, 2022 17:03
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Wanderer posted:Oh, it's entirely the AoA version. Full stop. This is 616-Blink-brought-back-by-Selene-to-murder-everyone erasure.
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Jan 5, 2022 18:10
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Big moves in Inferno #4 and X-Men #6 this week. They said they were going to burn it down and they weren't kidding!
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Jan 5, 2022 18:13
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I love that they took that old old theory that Cyclops could be Superman since he's also powered by the sun and are kind of using that for Captain Krakoa. I'm also glad that Doug didn't go heel like it seemed as if he would, and that Moira was indeed still trying to cure mutants. Though I wonder what she did when she was talking about having already put something into motion to stop mutants from becoming.
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Jan 5, 2022 18:25
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DOUG'S BIG WIFE I'm a little disappointed in Hickman's out... not the most clever of solutions. But one that makes sense, has some history behind it, etc. I'm also a little confused at what exactly (and when she was going to hatch it?) Moira's final plan was. Though I think I can finally rest (kind of?) knowing what the "It's time to change the rules" line from her birth in Life 10 meant. But overall it was fun as hell. Good reveals, a fun couple of twists, new status quo without resetting Krakoa as a whole... I guess my one big question is why were people so pissed about Mags and Xavier keeping Moira a secret? Is it because they felt, I dunno, manipulated? Motherfuckers have you MET Xavier since the Danger/Deadly Genesis stuff? It's weird that this would piss off Emma so much. danbanana fucked around with this message at 18:56 on Jan 5, 2022 |
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Jan 5, 2022 18:50
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Wanderer posted:Oh, it's entirely the AoA version. Full stop. And technically she had a long career in the Judd Winick Exiles book, but sadly that book wasn't super good.
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Jan 5, 2022 19:07
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Judd Winick's Exiles made me a regular comics reader. That book was awesome.
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Jan 5, 2022 20:10
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Winick was having a lot of fun with that book, which is nice.
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Jan 5, 2022 20:21
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Read X-Men or Inferno first? Or does it matter? And yeah, Exiles was a lot of fun. It's not surprising it lasted as long as it did, but pretty surprising that revivals didn't last.
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Jan 5, 2022 20:25
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It doesn't actually feel like Inferno changed the status quo too much. Everyone who is everyone is still everyone. Moira's been exposed and on the run, but she was such a small part of the main books that it barely feels like a change. Still, I did enjoy reading this. There were some great moments and great writing. I don't understand how Xavier was able to stand up against Nimrod and whatshername, though. Does he have TK, now? Endless Mike posted:Read X-Men or Inferno first? Or does it matter?
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Jan 5, 2022 20:43
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Endless Mike posted:Read X-Men or Inferno first? Or does it matter? X-Men takes place before Inferno, but the story lines don't intersect at all.
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Jan 5, 2022 21:16
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People that like Blink almost entirely have affection because of the Exiles run. So yeah she started as AoA but came into her own elsewhere. I say this as a Blink fan who had theories about her being an important part of Secret Wars because of the... whatsist, tallus? The wrist thing. She could have rejoined the universe that way like miles did and.... Oh well. 
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Jan 5, 2022 21:55
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you do know she's still alive right
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Jan 5, 2022 22:15
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I believe it was her 616 version working with Nightcrawler's team in Way of X, but her Exiles version is out there as well. In other news, I really hope Immortal X-Men delivers in spades, especially with what was just set up today. On Duggan's X-Men, at first I thought I had missed an issue somewhere, only to realize at the end of the issue that it was a deliberate choice to keep the reader asking questions. Not bad. Let's see where this is going as well.
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Jan 5, 2022 22:31
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Seems like Scott died in full public view. Then the telepaths erased Ben's mind about figuring out resurrection and ever having met Scott. Then since Scott died in such a public way, they forced him into having a new identity.
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Jan 5, 2022 23:07
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Codependent Poster posted:Seems like Scott died in full public view. Then the telepaths erased Ben's mind about figuring out resurrection and ever having met Scott. Then since Scott died in such a public way, they forced him into having a new identity. Can you explain to me how Scott was flying? I can kind of accept the Krakoan vines thing as Forgetech but, he was definitely flying.
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Jan 5, 2022 23:11
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Sandwolf posted:Can you explain to me how Scott was flying? I can kind of accept the Krakoan vines thing as Forgetech but, he was definitely flying.
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Jan 5, 2022 23:14
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Considering like, 1/5th of mutants have some really outlandish excuse for why they can fly or their sole mutation is flight, uhh, yeah, I do need an explanation?
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Jan 5, 2022 23:15
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Yeah, they can build him a suit to do about anything. Either that or like I said, the old theory that since Scott is powered by the sun, that if he channeled his powers in a different way he could be Superman is now true!
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Jan 5, 2022 23:17
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Jean and Lorna are off-panel throwing him around.
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Jan 5, 2022 23:22
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Yeah, it's all Krakoan tech built into the suit. He's basically Plant Iron Man.
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Jan 5, 2022 23:24
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BrianWilly posted:Jean and Lorna are off-panel throwing him around. "Jeeeeaaaannnnn! Stop this crazy thing!"
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Jan 5, 2022 23:30
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he has a giant eye on his butt to channel the punch dimension backwards
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Jan 5, 2022 23:31
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Inferno talk: I like how even though Destiny is straight up telling Raven not to gently caress with Doug because she can't see what's going to happen since what they're doing is going to have so many profound effects, Raven still continues to gently caress with Doug until the very end because she's comically bloodthirsty. And they STILL want to kill Moira even though Doug just rightfully says be satisfied with that you have each other, tomorrow isn't a promise. I did like how Moira rightfully points out that Destiny can't see EVERYTHING with her visions clear as a picture while Moira remembers everything about her past lives, a shame you couldn't have had them work together. Guess we are going to see Moira hide out with Orchis for a while or something. Codependent Poster posted:Yeah, they can build him a suit to do about anything. His punch lasers now get redirected to push out through his feet for thrust!
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Jan 5, 2022 23:34
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Jiro posted:Inferno talk: I did like how Moira rightfully points out that Destiny can't see EVERYTHING with her visions clear as a picture while Moira remembers everything about her past lives Past performance may not be indicative of future results! I dont know about your last point since she has very clearly different goals than they do (even if I am still very unsure what her goals were or why she just didn't do them during the many years Destiny was dead and would not be there to stop her).
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Jan 5, 2022 23:55
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danbanana posted:Past performance may not be indicative of future results! It's more of a line of thinking that since Moira is now human with a chunk of Phalanx on her arm, that would prove to be incredibly enticing for the Omega Sentinel and Nimrod to have, plus Orchis seem like the only people that Moira would be around that would have the resources she needs for her "cure" and also keep her alive long enough for her to actually try and go for it. And keeps her in the story as a whole, since she never really got to see mutanity succeed in it's goals of getting past the machines and Phalanx Gods like Omega Sentinel did. But then again her stated goal was never really that but for a cure, sooooooo no idea???
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Jan 6, 2022 00:30
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Sandwolf posted:Can you explain to me how Scott was flying? I can kind of accept the Krakoan vines thing as Forgetech but, he was definitely flying. 
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Jan 6, 2022 01:07
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I'm a little confused on Moira's motivations. Unless she doesn't care about the long-long term, I don't really see how humans beat machines on their own, and if mutants are depowered and essentially "absorbed" into humanity, that doesn't really seem like it improves anyone's chances.
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Jan 6, 2022 01:17
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Jiro posted:It's more of a line of thinking that since Moira is now human with a chunk of Phalanx on her arm, that would prove to be incredibly enticing for the Omega Sentinel and Nimrod to have, plus Orchis seem like the only people that Moira would be around that would have the resources she needs for her "cure" and also keep her alive long enough for her to actually try and go for it. And keeps her in the story as a whole, since she never really got to see mutanity succeed in it's goals of getting past the machines and Phalanx Gods like Omega Sentinel did. But then again her stated goal was never really that but for a cure, sooooooo no idea??? Wait. Are Nimrod and Omega still part of Orchis? They loving murdered a bunch of them and gave a big speech about how they don't see a difference between mutants and humanity. I guess with no survivors, they could just go back like that didn't happen but... What's the point? I guess I just assumed they were a separate threat now.
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Jan 6, 2022 02:07
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