|
Willa Rogers posted:And it should be pretty clear by now that many liberals are more elated at the thought of non-vaxed people ditching their tests & winning darwin awards than depressed about it; they're practically pornographic in describing their death-wish fantasies every time the topic arises.  How do you know those posters were liberals? Or is liberals=people I don't like still something we're going to do in this thread? Can we not?
|
#
?
Jan 7, 2022 17:39
|
|
|
|
| # ? Jun 8, 2024 20:55 |
|
|
Joe Manchin is probably having the time of his life getting this much attention. The tl;dr version of the article is: - Manchin and Sinema both 100% ruled out anything that lowers the 60 vote threshold for legislation. - Manchin is open to other changes to Senate rules and the filibuster that don't explicitly change the 60 vote threshold. - Sinema doesn't take calls or come to meetings, so they don't know what her position is besides point #1. https://twitter.com/burgessev/status/1479419066943168521
|
|
#
?
Jan 7, 2022 17:45
|
|
|
Part of me thinks that they can get some kind of useful reconcilation through, focusing on the CTC and childcare, but I dunno - it seems like Manchin very explicitly doesn't want to do that stuff. He is continuing to insist on poison-pilling the CTC with work requirements. He seems to be laser focused on a reconciliation bill focused on raising taxes and climate change spending, which are probably two of the less popular parts of BBB, and don't seem to match his existing priorities, so, hmm, draw your own conclusions. (He is intentionally loving them over.) Really Biden should start governing like he's in the minority now, and insisting that he is.
|
|
#
?
Jan 7, 2022 17:50
|
|
|
Leon Trotsky 2012 posted:Another Maxwell juror apparently didn't disclose everything on their juror selection forms and said that they wanted to be on the jury to stick up for other people who were sexually abused as children. God drat it. I feel bad for this juror, but this is why we can't have nice things. I imagine this is already starting to stoke new fuel for conspiracy theories.
|
|
#
?
Jan 7, 2022 17:51
|
|
|
When it did become normal for jurors to talk to the press? I feel like this is a new and very bad development
|
|
#
?
Jan 7, 2022 17:53
|
|
|
haveblue posted:When it did become normal for jurors to talk to the press? I feel like this is a new and very bad development It's a semi-normal thing for high-profile trials. Oprah did an entire hour-long primetime interview with all of the O.J. Simpson jurors in the 90's. Most of the jurors in the recent high-profile police cases have talked to the press afterwards.
|
|
#
?
Jan 7, 2022 17:59
|
|
|
haveblue posted:When it did become normal for jurors to talk to the press? I feel like this is a new and very bad development I feel like this phenomenon has been around forever. One OJ criminal trial juror (who didn't make it to the end of the trial) even ended up posing for Playboy in the mid-1990s.
|
|
#
?
Jan 7, 2022 18:00
|
|
|
haveblue posted:When it did become normal for jurors to talk to the press? I feel like this is a new and very bad development My question is what does it matter if any of them were sexually abused in the past when it comes to this case? In the age of 24/7 media coverage there is no such thing as an impartial jury.
|
|
#
?
Jan 7, 2022 18:02
|
|
|
virtualboyCOLOR posted:My question is what does it matter if any of them were sexually abused in the past when it comes to this case? In the age of 24/7 media coverage there is no such thing as an impartial jury. Their experiences might affect their ability to be objective about the evidence presented and arguments made during the trial. Jurors are ideally blank slates who are only swayed by the arguments made in court and not affected by things like "life experience."
|
|
#
?
Jan 7, 2022 18:10
|
|
|
virtualboyCOLOR posted:My question is what does it matter if any of them were sexually abused in the past when it comes to this case? In the age of 24/7 media coverage there is no such thing as an impartial jury. It's not the life experience in particular, it's that during voir dire the attorneys for the defense and prosecution both get to remove a few jurors from the pool because of things they think might bias them unconsciously or consciously. The defense specifically asked about that and when people lie or omit that, then the defense is on unequal footing with the prosecution during voir dire. The juror also said that they wanted to defend others who were abused as kids, which strongly implies pre-judgement. The judge has to decide if that is enough to warrant a new trial or not. The odds are still stacked against her, though. It is just more possible now.
|
|
#
?
Jan 7, 2022 18:14
|
|
|
virtualboyCOLOR posted:My question is what does it matter if any of them were sexually abused in the past when it comes to this case? In the age of 24/7 media coverage there is no such thing as an impartial jury.
|
|
#
?
Jan 7, 2022 18:16
|
|
|
Leon Trotsky 2012 posted:Joe Manchin is probably having the time of his life getting this much attention. "Sinema doesn't take calls or come to meetings, so they don't know what her position is besides point #1" is not in the article at all.
|
|
#
?
Jan 7, 2022 18:19
|
|
|
Fister Roboto posted:Why not stimulus checks AND free tests? They can easily do both. Send a check *with* the tests. Include a letter from Joe Biden. People would love that.
|
|
#
?
Jan 7, 2022 18:24
|
|
|
Civilized Fishbot posted:"Sinema doesn't take calls or come to meetings, so they don't know what her position is besides point #1" is not in the article at all. There are two different Politico articles in the tweet chain. The other one says that. https://www.axios.com/snow-covid-schumer-miterm-plans-55440224-d19b-4373-a550-5caa4a34cb4e.html quote:Sen. Kyrsten Sinema (D-Ariz.), also a key holdout to major filibuster reform, reiterated during the Democratic lunch she will not support any effort to get rid of the 60-vote threshold, according to two sources familiar with the call. quote:The spike in the Omicron variant also forced Schumer to move Democrats' weekly in-person caucus lunches back to a virtual setting. Sinema doesn't come to the meetings or group calls held by Tester, Kaine, and King, but says she has one-on-one calls with other people instead. They only know that she has rejected any effort to get rid of the 60 vote threshold and don't know what else she would be open to. quote:Sinema has been having one-on-one talks with her colleagues for weeks, one of the sources said.
|
|
#
?
Jan 7, 2022 18:30
|
|
|
DeadlyMuffin posted:Weird. I don't live in the interior of the country because I don't want to live somewhere that I could be fired (or worse) for being queer. Maybe being unemployed in New York is better than having a cheap studio apartment in Witchata Witchita is a democrat run city with a major public university and a large LGBT population. I know it's a popular coastal lib hobby to pretend like the entire middle of the country is a fundy hellhole, but please do the barest amount of research next time you want to poo poo on the people that actually live there.
|
|
#
?
Jan 7, 2022 18:36
|
|
|
The NFL needs a man with a butthole for a chin more then it needs another Harbaugh.
|
|
#
?
Jan 7, 2022 18:37
|
|
|
Eric Cantonese posted:Jurors are ideally blank slates who are only swayed by the arguments made in court and not affected by things like "life experience." Again this is not possible in the age of social media / CNN / internet in general / etc. InsertPotPun posted:if the lawyers are paid enough to make it seem like a big deal, it'll be a big deal And this is the take that makes the most logical sense. Impartial Jurors are a myth.
|
|
#
?
Jan 7, 2022 18:44
|
|
|
camoseven posted:Witchita is a democrat run city with a major public university and a large LGBT population. I know it's a popular coastal lib hobby to pretend like the entire middle of the country is a fundy hellhole, but please do the barest amount of research next time you want to poo poo on the people that actually live there.
|
|
#
?
Jan 7, 2022 18:49
|
|
|
virtualboyCOLOR posted:Again this is not possible in the age of social media / CNN / internet in general / etc. Depends on the defendant and the case, but I generally agree. Total impartiality is an impossible ideal. At the same time, you have to try to eliminate bias that could affect the fairness of a trial and, ideally, every defendant can get this level of fairness and not just Ghislaine F'n Maxwell. Unfortunately, in this country, only richer defendants have the resources to get a real shot at this. Plus, we're talking about jurors who might have deliberately lied so they could get on the jury and make sure a certain outcome came to pass. I'd like to think in this particular case it was the right outcome, but that's still not something that we should want to happen. I can think of many realistic case scenarios where not answering voir dire questions honestly could lead to outcomes we do not want.
|
|
#
?
Jan 7, 2022 18:53
|
|
|
DeadlyMuffin posted:
How do you know I was talking about posters?
|
|
#
?
Jan 7, 2022 18:59
|
|
|
Inferior Third Season posted:As someone who lived in Wichita for several years, I can confirm that the city is a conservative shithole. It's always strange to me when people try to elevate a city locked somewhere in chud territory. It most often happens to me when people talk about cities like Austin. Like sure, maybe people have tattoos, and you're allowed to be gay without getting beaten in the street, but you're still in loving Texas. You're still beholden to senators and representatives and governors that can/will, at any moment, legislate away your rights. Wow, it's so cool to be a woman in Austin, oops, there goes my reproductive freedom. Now, let me tell you about our vast microbrew community. If you are in a Red state and in a "cool" city, you're basically in a low-security prison.
|
|
#
?
Jan 7, 2022 18:59
|
|
|
camoseven posted:Witchita is a democrat run city with a major public university and a large LGBT population. I know it's a popular coastal lib hobby to pretend like the entire middle of the country is a fundy hellhole, but please do the barest amount of research next time you want to poo poo on the people that actually live there. Do you know? Can you quote some users who identify as "coastal lib" that displayed that belief? Or is downplaying the trials of the LGBT population your hobby?
|
|
#
?
Jan 7, 2022 19:00
|
|
|
Willa Rogers posted:How do you know I was talking about posters? context LorneReams posted:Do you know? Can you quote some users who identify as "coastal lib" that displayed that belief? Or is downplaying the trials of the LGBT population your hobby? it was a conversation with someone who was explaining why they live on the coast
|
|
#
?
Jan 7, 2022 19:00
|
|
|
Mellow Seas posted:Part of me thinks that they can get some kind of useful reconcilation through, focusing on the CTC and childcare, but I dunno - it seems like Manchin very explicitly doesn't want to do that stuff. He is continuing to insist on poison-pilling the CTC with work requirements. Biden's approval rating in W. Virginia was 18 percent the last time I saw it. If Dems are gonna let King Coal keep his energy committee chair (and nothing indicates that they won't) he literally has nothing to lose, and much to gain, by continuing to play the contrarian.
|
|
#
?
Jan 7, 2022 19:05
|
|
|
Kamala Harris hired a new comms director who seemingly isn’t very good at his job because he didn’t bother to vet his own tweets before he accepted the position https://twitter.com/eoinhiggins_/status/1479486948003753987?s=21 If you go read the replies he also defended waterboarding. I’m guessing only C-tier talent want to work for her anymore
|
|
#
?
Jan 7, 2022 19:16
|
|
|
virtualboyCOLOR posted:
The answer appears to be Kill OSHA https://twitter.com/mjs_DC/status/1479491844753006600?s=20 Obviously this is ridiculous since congress awarded the powers to OSHA already with the Occupational Safety and Health Act of 1970. But the illegitimate Supreme Court thinks otherwise.
|
|
#
?
Jan 7, 2022 19:17
|
|
|
camoseven posted:Witchita is a democrat run city with a major public university and a large LGBT population. I know it's a popular coastal lib hobby to pretend like the entire middle of the country is a fundy hellhole, but please do the barest amount of research next time you want to poo poo on the people that actually live there. From what I can tell, Kansas adopts LGBT protections when they are forced to by the federal government, and no sooner. This is from 2019: https://williamsinstitute.law.ucla.edu/publications/lgbt-discrimination-ks/ When I was getting out of school and looking at career options, I had a list of states I could live in that would not legally discriminate against me in employment because I am trans. Kansas did not make this list, regardless of how great Witchata is. If you like Witchata, or Austin, or whatever, that's awesome, really. But they didn't make my list because I was concerned about employment discrimination. Oceans *are* nice, but were the state governments flipped I'd be living in the Midwest in a heartbeat. Rail against costal liberals all you want, but that isn't the case here. Is "check your privilege" still something the kids say? Willa Rogers posted:How do you know I was talking about posters? Because you complained about it immediately after posters made those comments. Also I'm a detective. 
DeadlyMuffin fucked around with this message at 19:38 on Jan 7, 2022 |
|
#
?
Jan 7, 2022 19:20
|
|
|
selec posted:Kamala Harris hired a new comms director who seemingly isn’t very good at his job because he didn’t bother to vet his own tweets before he accepted the position Or more likely Harris' office did read every applicant's tweets and rejected anyone who wouldn't defend waterboarding out of hand
|
|
#
?
Jan 7, 2022 19:23
|
|
|
DeadlyMuffin posted:From what I can tell, Kansas adopts LGBT protections when they are forced to by the federal government, and no sooner. Yeah, it's really weird how folks don't seem to understand the interactions between city/municipal law <-> state law <-> federal law. Or they do and they're just ignoring it. It's really common in red states to actively limit the liberties of blue cities, TX is very well known for this. Why even mention a place like Wichita and not mention the state legislature? I've certainly mentioned the effects of state legislatures in deep blue states like WA, so it's not like it's never been mentioned before. By the way, if someone wants an abortion in Wichita, how far do they have to go and what hoops do they have to jump through? If they're not 18, are they able to get one without their parent's permission? Are their parents automatically notified? Solkanar512 fucked around with this message at 19:31 on Jan 7, 2022 |
|
#
?
Jan 7, 2022 19:28
|
|
|
it's wichita, you're all killing me here
|
|
#
?
Jan 7, 2022 19:29
|
|
|
Willa Rogers posted:How do you know I was talking about posters? Even though she made an assumption about you, please answer it directly rather than meeting a question with a question. It does appear in your post that the group you're referring to includes posters here, but as long as you're talking about a general political trend that would be fine.
|
|
#
?
Jan 7, 2022 19:29
|
|
|
Eric Cantonese posted:
It really sucks in this case, but I agree. I was recently selected for jury duty and to answer some voire dire questions (the written ones), they asked if I knew (list of police officers). If I knew them and wanted to be on the jury, I would say no, and possibly serve on the jury, maybe not in the interest in justice, but in the interest of my cop buddy.
|
|
#
?
Jan 7, 2022 19:30
|
|
|
Meatball posted:It really sucks in this case, but I agree. Given the percentage of women in the United States who have been sexually assaulted or harassed, there'd certainly be a lot of jurors thrown out just for being women.
|
|
#
?
Jan 7, 2022 19:38
|
|
|
selec posted:Kamala Harris hired a new comms director who seemingly isn’t very good at his job because he didn’t bother to vet his own tweets before he accepted the position He already apologized (badly): https://twitter.com/AlexThomp/status/1479508756581003275?s=20 At least it's only upwards from here, right?
|
|
#
?
Jan 7, 2022 19:40
|
|
|
DeadlyMuffin posted:Because you complained about it immediately after posters made those comments. If we're playing detective, then I've come across the damning evidence that "hit dogs will holler."
|
|
#
?
Jan 7, 2022 19:41
|
|
|
CommieGIR posted:Given the percentage of women in the United States who have been sexually assaulted or harassed, there'd certainly be a lot of jurors thrown out just for being women. on top of the tendency to just throw out jurors for being women
|
|
#
?
Jan 7, 2022 19:42
|
|
|
Having just dug through a bunch of tweets from Jamal Simmons: I think the 2010 immigration ones (there were a few, looks like he tried to tweet through it a bit before giving up) probably don't reflect his current position on immigration, which comes across as left of both Dem consensus and of his new boss. I'm using weasel words because it's a quick scan of quite a bit of material and he's probably said something more explicit on a different platform (guy had an interview show produced by The Hill, for one). So this is a vetting fuckup but it looks like he could credibly apologize for saying stupid poo poo back when, if he hasn't already. However, there's no non-monstrous read of the tweet where he suggests Bush implementing a torture program wasn't impeachable because his intent was protecting America, so gently caress that guy. e: beaten with more info, so I guess for content I'll link that other tweet, which, unlike the immigration ones, is fairly recent: https://twitter.com/JamalSimmons/status/1221106500879425536 eviltastic fucked around with this message at 19:53 on Jan 7, 2022 |
|
#
?
Jan 7, 2022 19:46
|
|
|
Koos Group posted:Even though she made an assumption about you, please answer it directly rather than meeting a question with a question. It does appear in your post that the group you're referring to includes posters here, but as long as you're talking about a general political trend that would be fine. What sort of evidence are you asking for? That the people celebrating death among non-vaxxers are liberals, or something else? (also, btw, there's no slow-roll for this thread anymore, in case it matters.) eta: I was also thinking of liberals elsewhere, like on DU, in addition to the schadenfreude I've seen in dnd; I can provide some evidentiary links, if you'd like.
|
|
#
?
Jan 7, 2022 19:46
|
|
|
Willa Rogers posted:If we're playing detective, then I've come across the damning evidence that "hit dogs will holler." I will happily admit that I have been on the recieving end of "we disagree on thing, therefore you are a dirty lib". I think it's useless name-calling since everyone seems to have their own definition. I'd love to avoid it in the new and shiney thread, but that's perhaps naive of me. I think there are definitions ranging from "anyone who isn't a communist" to "bad people generally" Willa Rogers posted:eta: I was also thinking of liberals elsewhere, like on DU, in addition to the schadenfreude I've seen in dnd; I can provide some evidentiary links, if you'd like. Emphasis mine. Doesn't that mean you are talking about posters? DeadlyMuffin fucked around with this message at 20:00 on Jan 7, 2022 |
|
#
?
Jan 7, 2022 19:53
|
|
|
|
| # ? Jun 8, 2024 20:55 |
|
|
Cease to Hope posted:on top of the tendency to just throw out jurors for being women Are there any studies or surveys on this? I was only able to find one relevant (Bias in Jury Selection: Justifying Prohibited Peremptory Challenges) and it didn't seem possible to generalize from it. Willa Rogers posted:What sort of evidence are you asking for? That the people celebrating death among non-vaxxers are liberals, or something else? Yes, I'm trying without slow-roll for the time being. I wasn't asking for evidence, since I'd seen what you were describing happen enough myself and assumed others also had. But if you'd like to provide some that does always make a point better. DeadlyMuffin posted:Emphasis mine. Doesn't that mean you are talking about posters? Sort of. Using posters on SA as an example of a larger political trend is a gray area, since the point you're making isn't about the posters, but it still puts people on the defensive so I'd like it to be done sparingly. Koos Group fucked around with this message at 19:59 on Jan 7, 2022 |
|
#
?
Jan 7, 2022 19:55
|
|