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Batterypowered7
Aug 8, 2009

The mist that chills you keeps me warm.

Heath posted:

These new ninjas and Kaito Shizuki might actually make Etrata viable as a commander

How so? Because she's unblockable so she guarantees you can Ninjutsu something in?

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Dizz
Feb 14, 2010


L :dva: L
im considering checking out Neo Kami but honestly im unsure of it. only thing im interested is the satoru umezawa card art and the lands art. they're real pretty and i want a fat stack of them foil.

Bust Rodd
Oct 21, 2008

by VideoGames
I’m gonna be honest, Im in the process of selling some of my EDH decks and thinking of taking the year off. I was really unhappy with the last year of products outside of a few cards, and don’t feel a connection to any new planes or characters because the one-&-done blocks don’t give you any time to put down roots.

But the art in Neo-Kami is absolutely blowing my mind and I am back to considering buying a box just because holy gently caress this set is firing on every cylinder for artwise, and I hadn’t realized how much I missed connecting to a magical plane through the art until I saw good art on magic cards again.

Dizz
Feb 14, 2010


L :dva: L

Bust Rodd posted:

I’m gonna be honest, Im in the process of selling some of my EDH decks and thinking of taking the year off. I was really unhappy with the last year of products outside of a few cards, and don’t feel a connection to any new planes or characters because the one-&-done blocks don’t give you any time to put down roots.

But the art in Neo-Kami is absolutely blowing my mind and I am back to considering buying a box just because holy gently caress this set is firing on every cylinder for artwise, and I hadn’t realized how much I missed connecting to a magical plane through the art until I saw good art on magic cards again.

That's how i felt with the innistrad stuff. Im not a fan of werewolves, vampires, etc, and the set doesn't really has anything that tickles my fancy.

Jiro
Jan 13, 2004

Bust Rodd posted:

I’m gonna be honest, Im in the process of selling some of my EDH decks and thinking of taking the year off. I was really unhappy with the last year of products outside of a few cards, and don’t feel a connection to any new planes or characters because the one-&-done blocks don’t give you any time to put down roots.

But the art in Neo-Kami is absolutely blowing my mind and I am back to considering buying a box just because holy gently caress this set is firing on every cylinder for artwise, and I hadn’t realized how much I missed connecting to a magical plane through the art until I saw good art on magic cards again.

I'd say make a final decision after the new Commander Legends set comes out, even if it is flavored with Baldur's Gate. Brother's War and new Dominaria set are things to look forward to as well. But I definitely get what you mean.

Bust Rodd
Oct 21, 2008

by VideoGames
I don’t know exactly what I expected from Midnight//Crimson but it was a totally damp fart of a set and I don’t feel like anyone anywhere has strong feelings about it. Eldritch Moon might not be anyone’s favorite set and it had mechanical issues but Jesus it was weird and unique and had a really cool idea.

Midnight//Crimson feels like magic just spinning its wheels, pushing no envelopes and doing nothing interesting or mechanically engaging ally all. I really felt that way about Khaldheim as well, Strixhaven was better but still nothing like I remember magic cards being like when I was a kid. I miss Urza’s Legacy and Planar Chaos and Portal so bad lol

Framboise
Sep 21, 2014

To make yourself feel better, you make it so you'll never give in to your forevers and live for always.


Lipstick Apathy
Idk if I'd be interested in selling my decks off (if not only because when I buy into decks it's mostly just me buying staples that I've no reason to sell) but my enthusiasm is lower even if my buying frequency is higher. Only set I liked last year (aside from MH2) was Strixhaven, I felt no interest in the rest.

I'm more just exhausted from the speed in which WotC is puking out new stuff and it feels like there's not enough time to enjoy anything. My mind has been so scattered with decks I want to build that by the time I've resolved myself on building them, something newer and more interesting comes along.

That's not to say I want things to stagnate, but drat.

At least this year's sets seem real good.

Framboise
Sep 21, 2014

To make yourself feel better, you make it so you'll never give in to your forevers and live for always.


Lipstick Apathy

Bust Rodd posted:

I don’t know exactly what I expected from Midnight//Crimson but it was a totally damp fart of a set and I don’t feel like anyone anywhere has strong feelings about it. Eldritch Moon might not be anyone’s favorite set and it had mechanical issues but Jesus it was weird and unique and had a really cool idea.

Midnight//Crimson feels like magic just spinning its wheels, pushing no envelopes and doing nothing interesting or mechanically engaging ally all. I really felt that way about Khaldheim as well, Strixhaven was better but still nothing like I remember magic cards being like when I was a kid. I miss Urza’s Legacy and Planar Chaos and Portal so bad lol

This trip back to Innistrad was boring as hell and neither set really provided much of interest. The fact that they really phoned it in tells me how much they really bank on Innistrad selling based on hype alone when the only good Innistrad set was... Innistrad. (Though I actually liked Eldritch Moon a lot flavorwise.)

Bust Rodd
Oct 21, 2008

by VideoGames
I literally just want less cards. Fewer products. I’m not even asking for higher quality products. I just used to love every part of this game, the gameplay but also the story and the characters and the world. I don’t feel connected to magic as a story or a game at all right now. I just want two planes a year, a winter set and a fall set, and then you can do whatever you want with supplemental stuff. Just slow the gently caress down.

Sonrebel, the only smart person playing Commander

https://twitter.com/sonrebell/status/1485494413526773763?s=21

Bust Rodd fucked around with this message at 07:18 on Jan 24, 2022

Heath
Apr 30, 2008

🍂🎃🏞️💦

Batterypowered7 posted:

How so? Because she's unblockable so she guarantees you can Ninjutsu something in?

That's generally how you get her to work as a commander. You let her hit and do the damage, and in response to her trigger, ninjutsu her back to your hand before you shuffle her in. Satoru Umezawa giving everything ninjutsu gives you much more in the way of options (including ninjutsu-ing Etrata herself) and Kaito's ult would give you a good way to repeatedly tutor her back to the battlefield if she does get shuffled in, if you can get him there. Will have to see what else shakes out.

Bust Rodd
Oct 21, 2008

by VideoGames
Uh, I’m sorry dude, but your Plan A is to connect 9 separate attacks over the course of the game to beat out a table with Etrata? That’s just never gonna happen.

T1 Sol Ring
T2 Etrata
T3-T12 attack with Etrata, Ninjutsu her, play her again? repeat?

Framboise
Sep 21, 2014

To make yourself feel better, you make it so you'll never give in to your forevers and live for always.


Lipstick Apathy

Bust Rodd posted:

I literally just want less cards. Fewer products. I’m not even asking for higher quality products. I just used to love every part of this game, the gameplay but also the story and the characters and the world. I don’t feel connected to magic as a story or a game at all right now. I just want two planes a year, a winter set and a fall set, and then you can do whatever you want with supplemental stuff. Just slow the gently caress down.

Sonrebel, the only smart person playing Commander

https://twitter.com/sonrebell/status/1485494413526773763?s=21


I keep saying it but rebell is the best


Like I never really wanted to specifically become "a cEDH player", it was more an identity I took on because I wanted to separate myself from a toxic community that would accuse you of pubstomping for playing cards they didn't like or breaking one of a million unwritten social rules that aren't readily known to everyone. It's a disgusting feeling to have a whole community see the way you play as pubstomping when that's never what you wanted to do, especially when you only play with people on your own level-- and yet people see your decklist and preferred way to play and decide that it's necessary to inject themselves into a conversation they weren't invited to since you had to distance yourself from theirs.

I just wanna play EDH, you know? I wanna build cool and strong decks with and play them with people who want to play the same way. I'm not interested in building slow or durdly decks, and I'm not interested in playing against jank or "theme" or chaos or group hug decks.

I don't really want to be wedged into a niche but you kind of feel forced to make your home in one by the nature of the format and the community that surrounds it, and it really does get exhausting trying to defend the way you want to play from people you'd never want to play with due to their attitude being rotten or their play style simply not being compatible with mine. It doesn't help that the face of the RC has never been one to shy away from drawing his line in the sand, and people see it and say SEE YOU'RE DOING IT WRONG.

And that's why the separation exists and probably will continue to until people can agree that there's not just one way to play and we don't want to infiltrate their ivory tower of beer and pretzels and dudes with hats looking left sitting in chairs tribal.

Framboise fucked around with this message at 14:33 on Jan 24, 2022

Batterypowered7
Aug 8, 2009

The mist that chills you keeps me warm.


Which Eric Andre image would be appropriate here?

"Why would you say something so controversial yet so brave?"

"Why are you booing me, I'm right?"

Or

"Let me in, let me in!"

Bust Rodd
Oct 21, 2008

by VideoGames
https://twitter.com/gavinverhey/status/1485463183695376384?s=21

If there isn’t already a Dockside reprint in the pipeline I seriously doubt it’ll ever see a reprint if this is how Gavin (rightfully) views the card.

I voted “only counts artifacts” because Red cards shouldn’t ever care about or notice enchantments, that’s just a straight up color pie break. And Flavorwise it makes sense that a port rogue would notice magic items but how would they detect an enchantment? What?

Framboise
Sep 21, 2014

To make yourself feel better, you make it so you'll never give in to your forevers and live for always.


Lipstick Apathy
Only counts artifacts is the best answer, but making it get exiled when it leaves the battlefield is the correct answer imo. One Dockside is whatever. Many is bad.

LeafHouse
Apr 22, 2008

That's what you get for not hailing to the chimp!



I don’t see why being too powerful would preclude it from being reprinted. The genie is already out of the bottle, no reason for WoTC to give up reprint equity and hose the players.

Batterypowered7
Aug 8, 2009

The mist that chills you keeps me warm.

Clearly this is for Dockside's addition to Alchemy!

Bust Rodd
Oct 21, 2008

by VideoGames
I don’t think Gavin is a big “reprint our mistakes” kind of guy. Dockside has proven to be a pretty big mistake. If the once & future king of Magic (who considers themselves a Commander player first) is openly acknowledging that Dockside is too good, I doubt he’d jam it into more decks. We’ll see a fixed version of dockside before we see a reprint… and I’d toxxx in that if there weren’t secret lairs

Framboise
Sep 21, 2014

To make yourself feel better, you make it so you'll never give in to your forevers and live for always.


Lipstick Apathy
I think Dockside is on the chopping block and is rightfully on borrowed time, if this is the point of the conversation we're at.

Bust Rodd
Oct 21, 2008

by VideoGames
Losing Dockside would be probably the biggest shake up to the format since Prime Time or Prophet ban, it would completely alter the state of cEDH and probably slow down the casual meta by a full turn.

TotalHell
Feb 22, 2005

Roman Reigns fights CM Punk in fantasy warld. Lotsa violins, so littl kids cant red it.


I’m curious what that could mean for the future value of Dockside. Would an EDH ban make it drop to a $1, or does it have a higher floor?

Bust Rodd
Oct 21, 2008

by VideoGames
It doesn’t see play anywhere else, it’s only legal in Legacy and Vintage and it’s not strong enough for those, maybe as a sideboard card if you’re playing against Vintage Mono-Brown

But we also don’t have a print run # for those precons. There are only a couple thousand docksides on Earth. I think a hundred thousand is probably pushing it, because that would mean WotC printed half a million of those precons. I have no idea on what scale or distribution model commander precons had 5 years ago, but they’re global now.

Framboise
Sep 21, 2014

To make yourself feel better, you make it so you'll never give in to your forevers and live for always.


Lipstick Apathy
It'd go the way of Pengine. Sub-10, retaining value only from the memory of it once being broken when playable.

Why yes, I still hold on to my Pengine in hopes that it'll see an unban one day. :smith:

Bust Rodd
Oct 21, 2008

by VideoGames
My foil Prophet of Kruphix was altered by the original artist to add extra arms using paint markers, and it’s gonna sit in my staples binder forever because I love her.

Macdeo Lurjtux
Jul 5, 2011

BRRREADSTOOORRM!
I mean Hullbreacher lost 90% of its value in days after the ban, and it sees some corner case usage in Legacy. Unless that's people just trying to jam it in hoping to recoup some of the loss they took on it.


Maybe an Oops! Theme could be the list cards for Commander Legends 3. Just slightly less powerful versions of cards too good for Commander.

Dockside that only sees artifacts
Hullbreacher without flash
Tergrid that only triggers once per turn

Batterypowered7
Aug 8, 2009

The mist that chills you keeps me warm.

https://articles.starcitygames.com/select/other-peoples-decks-dan-sheehans-rin-and-seri-changelings/

Bust Rodd
Oct 21, 2008

by VideoGames
LoL Rin & Siri puppy tribal with surprise Eldrazi titans, please go gently caress yourself to death

Framboise
Sep 21, 2014

To make yourself feel better, you make it so you'll never give in to your forevers and live for always.


Lipstick Apathy
I'm just sad there aren't enough good dog and cat cards to actually make Rin and Seri reasonably viable.

logis
Dec 30, 2004
Slippery Tilde

Framboise posted:

Only counts artifacts is the best answer, but making it get exiled when it leaves the battlefield is the correct answer imo. One Dockside is whatever. Many is bad.

Ok, I did not know that Dockside actually counts enchantments. I just assumed counting artifacts was already nuts enough, with all the artifact ramp that people play, plus I haven't played enough EDH in the last 2 years to see anyone cast it. Jeez, what a card.

Toshimo
Aug 23, 2012

He's outta line...

But he's right!

This is the most insufferable poo poo.

He leads off with a "this recipe reminds me of 9/11" style opening to generate wordcount for SEO (and bury all the sales links).

Then he presents a deck list in generally random useless order/categories.

Then paragraph 1 of "My Take" is this monstrosity and I can't even follow what he's trying to say: "He can even put the triggered ability of the Changeling Titan, Changeling Berserker, or Changeling Hero on the stack first and then Rin and Seri’s so that he can eat the one with summoning sickness. "

Jiro
Jan 13, 2004

Framboise posted:

I'm just sad there aren't enough good dog and cat cards to actually make Rin and Seri reasonably viable.

There are plenty of cats, too many even, there aren't enough DOGS. :colbert: Ren and Siri is a fun janky time with Maskwood Nexus and Taurean Mauler as your big chonky boy is the best Dog/Cat.

https://archidekt.com/decks/928845#Linda%27s_Deck

This is the deck I made for my girlfriend's birthday as a starter deck. I think we've tweaked the lands a bit going to have to go look through it and update the decklist.

TotalHell
Feb 22, 2005

Roman Reigns fights CM Punk in fantasy warld. Lotsa violins, so littl kids cant red it.


Jiro posted:

There are plenty of cats, too many even, there aren't enough DOGS. :colbert: Ren and Siri is a fun janky time with Maskwood Nexus and Taurean Mauler as your big chonky boy is the best Dog/Cat.

https://archidekt.com/decks/928845#Linda%27s_Deck

This is the deck I made for my girlfriend's birthday as a starter deck. I think we've tweaked the lands a bit going to have to go look through it and update the decklist.

Run Ren and Siri with Purphoros, GodDog of the Forge

Batterypowered7
Aug 8, 2009

The mist that chills you keeps me warm.

Toshimo posted:

This is the most insufferable poo poo.

He leads off with a "this recipe reminds me of 9/11" style opening to generate wordcount for SEO (and bury all the sales links).

Then he presents a deck list in generally random useless order/categories.

Then paragraph 1 of "My Take" is this monstrosity and I can't even follow what he's trying to say: "He can even put the triggered ability of the Changeling Titan, Changeling Berserker, or Changeling Hero on the stack first and then Rin and Seri’s so that he can eat the one with summoning sickness. "

His old man brain got confused and thought Rin and Seri's ability was an ETB trigger, so he thought it was super smart sounding to say you can order the triggers so your changeling eats the summoning sick token that gets created instead of having to eat a creature that might otherwise be able to attack.

E:

It's super dumb, because since the Rin and Seri trigger is on cast, there's no 4D chess you have to play in order to realize you can champion the summoning sick token.

E2:

Jiro posted:

There are plenty of cats, too many even, there aren't enough DOGS. :colbert: Ren and Siri is a fun janky time with Maskwood Nexus and Taurean Mauler as your big chonky boy is the best Dog/Cat.

https://archidekt.com/decks/928845#Linda%27s_Deck

This is the deck I made for my girlfriend's birthday as a starter deck. I think we've tweaked the lands a bit going to have to go look through it and update the decklist.

Hounds were erratad to Dog. Does that help?

Batterypowered7 fucked around with this message at 20:08 on Jan 24, 2022

Jiro
Jan 13, 2004

Batterypowered7 posted:

Hounds were erratad to Dog. Does that help?

Deck already has Mowu, and Bolt Hound. Magic does tend to go for wolves and werewolves, but dogs/hounds not so much.

pseudanonymous
Aug 30, 2008

When you make the second entry and the debits and credits balance, and you blow them to hell.

Batterypowered7 posted:

His old man brain got confused and thought Rin and Seri's ability was an ETB trigger, so he thought it was super smart sounding to say you can order the triggers so your changeling eats the summoning sick token that gets created instead of having to eat a creature that might otherwise be able to attack.

E:

It's super dumb, because since the Rin and Seri trigger is on cast, there's no 4D chess you have to play in order to realize you can champion the summoning sick token.

E2:

Hounds were erratad to Dog. Does that help?

This can't be right, Bust Rodd assures us that Judges are good at magic, and that Sheldon in particular knows what's going on and is good at managing the format, he can't possibly be a clueless twat who doesn't understand basic things like "cast" vs "enters"; who is just mindlessly exploiting his lucky position.

Also here's an article on building a Rin and Seri deck (that's 18 months old so YMMV) https://www.goonhammer.com/rin-and-seri-seperable-from-my-money/

Batterypowered7
Aug 8, 2009

The mist that chills you keeps me warm.

pseudanonymous posted:

This can't be right, Bust Rodd assures us that Judges are good at magic, and that Sheldon in particular knows what's going on and is good at managing the format, he can't possibly be a clueless twat who doesn't understand basic things like "cast" vs "enters"; who is just mindlessly exploiting his lucky position.

Also here's an article on building a Rin and Seri deck (that's 18 months old so YMMV) https://www.goonhammer.com/rin-and-seri-seperable-from-my-money/

Everyone knows that your ability to play Magic is inversely proportional to how high of a judge level you attain. Even becoming a rules advisor, or whatever that sub-judge level is called, negatively impacts your ability to play Magic well.

Dizz
Feb 14, 2010


L :dva: L

Bust Rodd posted:

I don’t think Gavin is a big “reprint our mistakes” kind of guy. Dockside has proven to be a pretty big mistake. If the once & future king of Magic (who considers themselves a Commander player first) is openly acknowledging that Dockside is too good, I doubt he’d jam it into more decks. We’ll see a fixed version of dockside before we see a reprint… and I’d toxxx in that if there weren’t secret lairs

My stance is that if they think a card is a mistake, then it should be banned in all formats. why refuse to reprint an obscenely powerful card but also refuse to ban it?


Framboise posted:

I'm just sad there aren't enough good dog and cat cards to actually make Rin and Seri reasonably viable.

if you think about it, anything can be a dog or a cat.

H.P. Hovercraft
Jan 12, 2004

one thing a computer can do that most humans can't is be sealed up in a cardboard box and sit in a warehouse
Slippery Tilde
my in-person playgroup isn't super cutthroat and we're welcoming a new guy in who's entirely new to the game so i'm building a fun Jared Carthalion deck

it looks like the challenge is going to be designing a pile that isn't just a punching bag; i'm thinking curses instead of any kinda pillowforty stuff but i'm wondering how easy it'll be to incentivize attacking someone else when i'm the monarch

any of y'all have any experience with jerry, or seen him in the wild?

Dizz
Feb 14, 2010


L :dva: L
Also i heard that boros was like one of the weakest types and i was kinda interested in looking at their commanders but now im under the belief that it's the weakest because their commanders are just extremely boring.

most of them are just "human dude" or "human dude in armor".

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H.P. Hovercraft
Jan 12, 2004

one thing a computer can do that most humans can't is be sealed up in a cardboard box and sit in a warehouse
Slippery Tilde

Dizz posted:

Also i heard that boros was like one of the weakest types and i was kinda interested in looking at their commanders but now im under the belief that it's the weakest because their commanders are just extremely boring.

most of them are just "human dude" or "human dude in armor".

there are a buncha interesting ones that've been printed recently like Osgir and Rem, and a few others like Feather

i've got a boros reanimator deck helmed by Plargg, having a looter in the command zone is p great


that color combination's main problem is card draw, followed by poor ramp availability. but you can make it work

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