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PremiumSupport
Aug 17, 2015

The Iron Rose posted:

I also take issue with some of those recommendations, but as in all things it is a balance. Language evolves over time, but it’s not an instantaneous process, nor is it one that consistently goes in any particular direction, and as in all things there is a balance.

People also hate hate hate being told what to say, so you gotta softball that poo poo and normalize it over time. I think some excellent examples of that are whitelist/blacklist and master/slave. Pretty much everyone is onboard with the latter, and allowlist/denylist *are* more clear, and so it’s slowly percolating through the community.

Replacing “cattle” with “commodities” to appease the vegans is on the other hand absolutely ridiculous *at this moment in time*… at least until we collectively as a society start giving a poo poo about animals, and it permeates through our social unconsciousness. Which you can do by replacing “cattle” with “commodities” in your personal language, among other techniques, and eventually we may get to the point where yeah, it’s more reasonable. I just don’t think we’re there yet, and don’t care enough about animals to lead the way.


I prefer Redlist and Greenlist myself, but that hasn't really caught on yet...


Edit:

Crappy page snipe, added quote for context.

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The Fool
Oct 16, 2003


We use disposable / non-disposable here

Commodities feels weird

Takkaryx
Oct 17, 2007

Bunnies (very useful) Scientific Facts: Bunnies never close doors
Even if you don't have the authority or the social currency to call someone out, changing your own language and sticking to it can affect change on those around you. Hang out with people enough and you start picking up their idioms and phrasing. We joke about "doing the needful" but mimicking speech patterns is a strong way to identify with an in-group and has enormous weight on our psychology. I'm the SME in several areas our company is expanding into like Intune and AWS Workspaces and I've noticed that how I shorthand describe processes are almost universally picked up by people I direct and interact with over time. Especially if the person is coming into the knowledge fresh.

Why yes, IT is a second career from clinical psych, why do you ask.

Takkaryx fucked around with this message at 19:32 on Jan 28, 2022

22 Eargesplitten
Oct 10, 2010



PremiumSupport posted:

I prefer Redlist and Greenlist myself, but that hasn't really caught on yet...


Edit:

Crappy page snipe, added quote for context.

People like you just leave duct taped solutions everywhere you go.

DelphiAegis
Jun 21, 2010

Takkaryx posted:

Even if you don't have the authority or the social currency to call someone out, changing your own language and sticking to it can affect change on those around you. Hang out with people enough and you start picking up their idioms and phrasing. We joke about "doing the needful" but mimicking speech patterns is a strong way to identify with an in-group and has enormous weight on our psychology. I'm the SME in several areas our company is expanding into like Intune and AWS Workspaces and I've noticed that how I shorthand describe processes are almost universally picked up by people I direct and interact with over time. Especially if the person is coming into the knowledge fresh.

Why yes, IT is a second career from clinical psych, why do you ask.

I've been playing FFXIV a lot and have more than once now replied to an email with "<this thing> needs must be updated before <other thing>" and only realized when I was reading the emails after the fact.

I will die on the allow/white and block/blacklist hill though. Even though our own platform SAS whitelist, I only ever refer to it as allowlist. Nobody's questioned me on it yet.

Sirotan
Oct 17, 2006

Sirotan is a seal.


PremiumSupport posted:

I prefer Redlist and Greenlist myself, but that hasn't really caught on yet...


Edit:

Crappy page snipe, added quote for context.

Can't tell if you're joking or not but considering how red-green colorblindness predominantly affects men, this seems like a really bad choice in a male-dominated industry!

SyNack Sassimov
May 4, 2006

Let the robot win.
            --Captain James T. Vader


The Iron Rose posted:

I also take issue with some of those recommendations, but as in all things it is a balance. Language evolves over time, but it’s not an instantaneous process, nor is it one that consistently goes in any particular direction, and as in all things there is a balance.

People also hate hate hate being told what to say, so you gotta softball that poo poo and normalize it over time. I think some excellent examples of that are whitelist/blacklist and master/slave. Pretty much everyone is onboard with the latter, and allowlist/denylist *are* more clear, and so it’s slowly percolating through the community.

Replacing “cattle” with “commodities” to appease the vegans is on the other hand absolutely ridiculous *at this moment in time*… at least until we collectively as a society start giving a poo poo about animals, and it permeates through our social unconsciousness. Which you can do by replacing “cattle” with “commodities” in your personal language, among other techniques, and eventually we may get to the point where yeah, it’s more reasonable. I just don’t think we’re there yet, and don’t care enough about animals to lead the way.

Gonna be honest, it'll take me a loving long time to not say pets vs cattle, and ironically I don't even eat that much beef anymore. Allowlist/denylist? Sure, 100% and I've been modifying my speech patterns - I'm still at the stage where I have to internally translate (i.e. my brain goes "we need to whitelist.....rewind, allowlist xyz"), but I never say the words anymore and hopefully soon my brain will go to allow/deny first instead of the colors. But I don't really feel like appeasing the vegans, because, well, sorry vegans, I just don't care. We raise animals for food, and as inadvisable as that is from an environmental standpoint I can't be hosed to care about it from the animal standpoint because the vast majority of those animals wouldn't exist in the first place if it weren't so we could kill and eat them.

Anyway, more on topic, I have a AWS deployment of Server 2019 pets, specifically traditional domain servers (DC, file, print, the works), and they all need to be Server 2022 pets, if not become actually devops-style-managed to deploy updated Server 2022 AMIs. (I recognize this is not great, but the client doesn't want any on-premises infrastructure beyond firewalls/APs).

Anyone have any thoughts on the best way to do this? Some combination of Terraform/Ansible/Powershell DSC? The big problem I see is not the spinning up of instances themselves, but programmatically migrating services, since things like DCs aren't typically / easily moved from one instance to another with the same name and IP address. (I've done it, manually, quite a lot, but it's a pain in the rear end decomming the old one, making sure all references to it in AD are removed, and then spinning up the new one). Do I just need to combine a devops deployment platform with a bunch of customized Powershell scripts to migrate things?

nielsm
Jun 1, 2009



PremiumSupport posted:

I prefer Redlist and Greenlist myself, but that hasn't really caught on yet...


Edit:

Crappy page snipe, added quote for context.

Apart from color blindness, also consider that in some cultures (in particular eastern Asia), red is the color of good and desired things. Colors are difficult, try to avoid using them to represent value judgements.

The Fool
Oct 16, 2003


SyNack Sassimov posted:

Do I just need to combine a devops deployment platform with a bunch of customized Powershell scripts to migrate things?

I did this on a smaller scale about 3 years ago, and unless something has changed there a bunch of windows infra stuff that still doesn’t automate well and you’ll be looking at writing custom confit script for those pieces. Don’t even bother with DSC.

Probably looking at some combination of terraform/ansible/custom powershell

Methylethylaldehyde
Oct 23, 2004

BAKA BAKA

22 Eargesplitten posted:

People like you just leave duct taped solutions everywhere you go.

The code may not be Handsome, but at least we find it handy!.

skooma512
Feb 8, 2012

You couldn't grok my race car, but you dug the roadside blur.
Really hating HP right now.

Our G3s are suddenly losing audio and it can't be recovered without a full format. Windows Audio Service and MMBuilder's registry keys have weird permissions, but even after that's fixed the drivers refuse to work. SFC and DISM useless, per usual.


And then I spent 4 hours trying to change a fuser in a Color Laserjet M452dn. Most just slide in and out, not this one. You have to open the top and side panels, attach two wiring harnesses yourself, and then they put a ZIF jumper right in the middle of what you're supposed to change so it gets pulled out easily. The control panel also uses such a ribbon cable from the opposite corner of the machine to the same board, and good luck if you broke any of those cables during this process.

Agrikk
Oct 17, 2003

Take care with that! We have not fully ascertained its function, and the ticking is accelerating.

SyNack Sassimov posted:

Gonna be honest, it'll take me a loving long time to not say pets vs cattle, and ironically I don't even eat that much beef anymore. Allowlist/denylist? Sure, 100% and I've been modifying my speech patterns - I'm still at the stage where I have to internally translate (i.e. my brain goes "we need to whitelist.....rewind, allowlist xyz"), but I never say the words anymore and hopefully soon my brain will go to allow/deny first instead of the colors. But I don't really feel like appeasing the vegans, because, well, sorry vegans, I just don't care. We raise animals for food, and as inadvisable as that is from an environmental standpoint I can't be hosed to care about it from the animal standpoint because the vast majority of those animals wouldn't exist in the first place if it weren't so we could kill and eat them.

Anyway, more on topic, I have a AWS deployment of Server 2019 pets, specifically traditional domain servers (DC, file, print, the works), and they all need to be Server 2022 pets, if not become actually devops-style-managed to deploy updated Server 2022 AMIs. (I recognize this is not great, but the client doesn't want any on-premises infrastructure beyond firewalls/APs).

Anyone have any thoughts on the best way to do this? Some combination of Terraform/Ansible/Powershell DSC? The big problem I see is not the spinning up of instances themselves, but programmatically migrating services, since things like DCs aren't typically / easily moved from one instance to another with the same name and IP address. (I've done it, manually, quite a lot, but it's a pain in the rear end decomming the old one, making sure all references to it in AD are removed, and then spinning up the new one). Do I just need to combine a devops deployment platform with a bunch of customized Powershell scripts to migrate things?

While I don’t have an explicit solution for you, I’m really interested to know what is driving the migration from 2019 to 2022. The OS is only three years old. What’s the hurry to migrate?

Combat Pretzel
Jun 23, 2004

No, seriously... what kurds?!
Today I looked up whether Parsec finally has an iOS/iPadOS app, turns out they still don't. I found tweets from spring 2020 saying it's a future goal, and another from January 2022 practically saying the same.

Considering they leaned hard into home office/remote working, why in the gently caress they don't have the very least an iPad app is puzzling. If anyone's gonna use a remoting device, a tablet is a very likely target, and iPads is defacto the tablet.

I figured the acquisition by Unity would have done something, but I guess not.

SlowBloke
Aug 14, 2017

Combat Pretzel posted:

Today I looked up whether Parsec finally has an iOS/iPadOS app, turns out they still don't. I found tweets from spring 2020 saying it's a future goal, and another from January 2022 practically saying the same.

Considering they leaned hard into home office/remote working, why in the gently caress they don't have the very least an iPad app is puzzling. If anyone's gonna use a remoting device, a tablet is a very likely target, and iPads is defacto the tablet.

I figured the acquisition by Unity would have done something, but I guess not.

It’s the same issue that stops the various cloud gaming outfits from publishing on App Store. If it’s doing remote gaming, Apple will throw a shitfit and stops it from publishing since they expect dedicated listing for every game or software. Best case scenario is html5 client portals unless they throw a big antitrust spanner in Apple works.

Combat Pretzel
Jun 23, 2004

No, seriously... what kurds?!
Anydesk and Teamviewer are on the store, too, and some more direct alternatives to Parsec (e.g. Moonlight). Nowadays, Parsec is just another remote desktop tool. The ability to game is a side effect in how it implements the display content streaming.

I mean, it's running against selfhosted systems, unlike Xbox Cloud Gaming or Geforce Now.

Apple really needs a kick in the balls about their loving app store and the ridiculously draconian rules related to it.

SyNack Sassimov
May 4, 2006

Let the robot win.
            --Captain James T. Vader


The Fool posted:

I did this on a smaller scale about 3 years ago, and unless something has changed there a bunch of windows infra stuff that still doesn’t automate well and you’ll be looking at writing custom confit script for those pieces. Don’t even bother with DSC.

Probably looking at some combination of terraform/ansible/custom powershell
I kind of figured this was the case just from my long experience with AD and traditional Windows infrastructure :(. Oh well, guess I have to figure out if it's worth the trouble of writing said scripts.

Agrikk posted:

While I don’t have an explicit solution for you, I’m really interested to know what is driving the migration from 2019 to 2022. The OS is only three years old. What’s the hurry to migrate?

Jesus the TAM can't even help me? OUTRAGEOUS. I demand to speak to your manager. This client drops multiple thousands of dollars a year on your service, we expect solutions! Multiple thousands! Up to and including possibly 10 thousand American dollars! You'd think AWS would want to help what I can only presume is one of their biggest customers!

(sorry for triggering you)

It's more that for some reason Windows Update isn't working correctly on these 2019 instances - I haven't actually checked this out myself but my junior admin claims he's tried everything and they just won't update. So the thought is we should migrate to new instances anyway, and since we're not paying for the licenses, why not just move to 2022 since it's not that different from 2019. We also tend to keep our clients up to date Windows Server-wise, which we (and they) can afford to do because they're small to midsize so they don't have huge numbers of OS instances. I sympathize with all of you still dealing with Server 2016 (speaking of updating problems), or even worse 2012 R2 or before.

And I figured, instead of spending a week migrating server workloads manually like some sort of OLD PERSON still crowing about when he got his MCSE, why don't I get with the times and automate it, except I was reasonably sure all that old poo poo isn't amenable to being automatably migrated easily which is why I asked. I also liked the idea because I'd find it cleaner to redeploy all the infra every month with the newest WS2022 AMI, and of course having that kind of thing automated once means I could automate it for other customers and/or new customers, such that if we got a new customer I could easily deploy a full AD infrastructure with two clicks. I wonder if there's a phrase for this kind of thing. Hmm, "infrastructure through scripts" maybe?

Anyway my plan was that after getting this set up I could concentrate on finding an additional job and being the next Sickening.

incoherent
Apr 24, 2004

01010100011010000111001
00110100101101100011011
000110010101110010
2022 Not that different? Hope you never need to expand the c: drive ever, because they put the recovery volume at the end of the drive vs of before the data volume.

Also

quote:

It's more that for some reason Windows Update isn't working correctly on these 2019 instances - I haven't actually checked this out myself but my junior admin claims he's tried everything and they just won't update.

I would "trust, but verify" this. If you're running WSUS (and being an old school admin), just click "check from microsoft" directly to see if it updates. I can guarantee they're missing a service stack update.

quote:

I wonder if there's a phrase for this kind of thing. Hmm, "infrastructure through scripts" maybe?

You're so insanely close to infrastructure as code.

Bob Morales
Aug 18, 2006


Just wear the fucking mask, Bob

I don't care how many people I probably infected with COVID-19 while refusing to wear a mask, my comfort is far more important than the health and safety of everyone around me!

I hate sharepoint and document sharing.

Share a document with me. I have to enter a loving code for every single one. I have to request a code and it takes at least a minute to get it.

The Fool
Oct 16, 2003


Bob Morales posted:

I hate sharepoint and document sharing.

Share a document with me. I have to enter a loving code for every single one. I have to request a code and it takes at least a minute to get it.

Something is wrong with your setup because sharing documents internal user to internal users shouldn’t be doing that

Bob Morales
Aug 18, 2006


Just wear the fucking mask, Bob

I don't care how many people I probably infected with COVID-19 while refusing to wear a mask, my comfort is far more important than the health and safety of everyone around me!

The Fool posted:

Something is wrong with your setup because sharing documents internal user to internal users shouldn’t be doing that

Or I'm not talking about internal users

The Fool
Oct 16, 2003


Even then, the workflow you are describing should only be triggered if the document is shared directly with someone that doesn’t have a Microsoft account.

duffmensch
Feb 20, 2004

Duffman is thrusting in the direction of the problem!
That sounds about right for external users (people outside his specific Org, regardless of Microsoft account status), especially since you're in Healthcare (or government space).

Thanks Ants
May 21, 2004

#essereFerrari


If you regularly collaborate with external orgs then you should look at Azure AD B2B

klosterdev
Oct 10, 2006

Na na na na na na na na Batman!
SharePoint doing exactly what it should be doing. The link you provided is just a link. Without any kind of verification when opening it's effectively a link accessible to the public internet that hasn't leaked yet.

E: There's a setting in SharePoint Admin Center where you can allow links accessible to the public internet w/o verification, but I guarantee an admin turned that off for good reasons.

klosterdev fucked around with this message at 16:38 on Jan 31, 2022

The Fool
Oct 16, 2003


duffmensch posted:

That sounds about right for external users (people outside his specific Org, regardless of Microsoft account status), especially since you're in Healthcare (or government space).

I forgot he was in gcc high.

Problems are self inflicted.

Edit: won’t fix, close ticket

Bob Morales
Aug 18, 2006


Just wear the fucking mask, Bob

I don't care how many people I probably infected with COVID-19 while refusing to wear a mask, my comfort is far more important than the health and safety of everyone around me!

The Fool posted:

I forgot he was in gcc high.

Problems are self inflicted.

Edit: won’t fix, close ticket

:eng101: all GCC high issues are 'uhhh we should have that fixed in Q3 2024'

Bob Morales
Aug 18, 2006


Just wear the fucking mask, Bob

I don't care how many people I probably infected with COVID-19 while refusing to wear a mask, my comfort is far more important than the health and safety of everyone around me!

It's so annoying that for various reasons (mergers and acquisitions), none of our accounts with vendors are under the same name

Hi it's Bob from MegaGroup S.P.A., or it might be Conglomerate 1, Super Conglomerate 2, Jones Defense, or it might be Jones Aerospace Manufacturing

The Fool
Oct 16, 2003


pissing me off: multi day scaling issues in azure last week that were resolved by ms changing some quota numbers behind the scenes

Internet Explorer
Jun 1, 2005





Today I'm dealing with a file server migration gone wrong. Someone hosed up and I get to pick up the pieces, I guess. What a thing to be working on in the year 2022.

Sickening
Jul 16, 2007

Black summer was the best summer.

The Fool posted:

pissing me off: multi day scaling issues in azure last week that were resolved by ms changing some quota numbers behind the scenes

I am finding these mysterious quota things to be a pain in the rear end too. They need a better mechanism.

Bob Morales
Aug 18, 2006


Just wear the fucking mask, Bob

I don't care how many people I probably infected with COVID-19 while refusing to wear a mask, my comfort is far more important than the health and safety of everyone around me!

Good. I would like to see a Fortinet in that rack, as I would like to replace the Cisco switches and get 10GB all the way back to MRO.



:anime:

The Fool
Oct 16, 2003


Sickening posted:

I am finding these mysterious quota things to be a pain in the rear end too. They need a better mechanism.

Yeah, it was awesome to have our ASE’s stop scaling, then to fail outright, then be on the phone for 12 hours* before ms is like, “oh let me just increase this quota over here” and the problem magically goes away

* not me but one of the guys on my team

SyNack Sassimov
May 4, 2006

Let the robot win.
            --Captain James T. Vader


incoherent posted:

2022 Not that different? Hope you never need to expand the c: drive ever, because they put the recovery volume at the end of the drive vs of before the data volume.

Also

I would "trust, but verify" this. If you're running WSUS (and being an old school admin), just click "check from microsoft" directly to see if it updates. I can guarantee they're missing a service stack update.

Yeah the updates thing is on my list of things to check out because I assume it's missing some update that tells it how to access updates now and my admin just hasn't figured it out. Though we're not using WSUS because gently caress that noise, moved away from it as soon as possible, so when I say it's not updating I mean not updating from Microsoft.

I allocate my C drives usually with about 80-100 GB, and replace/migrate server instances often enough that it's never been an issue. (And no data ever gets stored on the system drive obviously, if it's a OSE that has data on it - I give DCs a 20 GB D: drive just so that SYSVOL/NTDS/NTDSLogs aren't on C:, stuff like that). But uh, yeah, that's some real lovely behavior RE the recovery volume, why the hell did they change that.

incoherent posted:

You're so insanely close to infrastructure as code.

couuuuuuggghhhh

:thejoke:

klosterdev
Oct 10, 2006

Na na na na na na na na Batman!
What kind of nitwit bought two ethernet-fiber adapter boxes and ran 30' of fiber between two rooms instead of just running a drat ethernet cable when they're only dealing with one gig speeds

Bob Morales
Aug 18, 2006


Just wear the fucking mask, Bob

I don't care how many people I probably infected with COVID-19 while refusing to wear a mask, my comfort is far more important than the health and safety of everyone around me!

klosterdev posted:

What kind of nitwit bought two ethernet-fiber adapter boxes and ran 30' of fiber between two rooms instead of just running a drat ethernet cable when they're only dealing with one gig speeds

FUTURE PROOFING

Wizard of the Deep
Sep 25, 2005

Another productive workday

klosterdev posted:

What kind of nitwit bought two ethernet-fiber adapter boxes and ran 30' of fiber between two rooms instead of just running a drat ethernet cable when they're only dealing with one gig speeds

The kind of nitwit that either wants to learn how to make fiber cables, wants the company to pay for the tools to make fiber cables, or both.

dragonshardz
May 2, 2017

klosterdev posted:

What kind of nitwit bought two ethernet-fiber adapter boxes and ran 30' of fiber between two rooms instead of just running a drat ethernet cable when they're only dealing with one gig speeds

Linus, and here's his segue to today's sponsor, CableMod!

Methylethylaldehyde
Oct 23, 2004

BAKA BAKA

Wizard of the Deep posted:

The kind of nitwit that either wants to learn how to make fiber cables, wants the company to pay for the tools to make fiber cables, or both.

I mean, if I could convince work that I needed a fusion splicer kit to get the network running, I'd be tempted to do 'both'.

Thanks Ants
May 21, 2004

#essereFerrari


If the rooms are on different electrical supplies and there's a possibility of a ground potential difference then not running copper between the rooms makes sense. Unlikely if these are just two rooms in the same building though.

Did the cables ever run past rooms that had lots of electrical equipment in?

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SlowBloke
Aug 14, 2017

incoherent posted:

2022 Not that different? Hope you never need to expand the c: drive ever, because they put the recovery volume at the end of the drive vs of before the data volume.

Also

I would "trust, but verify" this. If you're running WSUS (and being an old school admin), just click "check from microsoft" directly to see if it updates. I can guarantee they're missing a service stack update.

You're so insanely close to infrastructure as code.

You can still manually enforce the old partition format using unattend files or just deleting the trailing partition, resize and remake it. Microsoft provides a set of scripts to simplify/automate the process.
https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/windows-hardware/manufacture/desktop/oem-deployment-of-windows-desktop-editions-sample-scripts

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