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How does one (can one) apply that modern DSP wizardry to sources that are not a phone or a computer?
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Jan 31, 2022 17:28
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PBCrunch posted:How does one (can one) apply that modern DSP wizardry to sources that are not a phone or a computer? https://www.minidsp.com/
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Jan 31, 2022 20:13
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PBCrunch posted:How does one (can one) apply that modern DSP wizardry to sources that are not a phone or a computer?
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Jan 31, 2022 20:40
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Does the mojo those apps work into the output also apply to the Bluetooth output (for car use)?
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Jan 31, 2022 20:44
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PBCrunch posted:Does the mojo those apps work into the output also apply to the Bluetooth output (for car use)?
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Jan 31, 2022 20:57
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The cheapest MiniDSP works fine but only provides .9v output which simply isn't enough for home or car audio. The 2/.9 v distinction that they make on the website only applies to the input, it does not apply to the output. I have the DDRC-88D which probably is overkill for the car, but Dirac Live is seriously some top-level poo poo and I promise will blow your mind.
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Jan 31, 2022 21:30
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RIP Paul Walker posted:The cheapest MiniDSP works fine but only provides .9v output which simply isn't enough for home or car audio. The 2/.9 v distinction that they make on the website only applies to the input, it does not apply to the output. Is there, like, a MiniDSP for dummies somewhere? I don't have the budget to be doing that at all at the moment, but it's interesting and I'd like to know more
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Jan 31, 2022 21:36
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BonoMan posted:Is there, like, a MiniDSP for dummies somewhere? I don't have the budget to be doing that at all at the moment, but it's interesting and I'd like to know more MiniDSP on easy mode is just getting one with Dirac Live and following the prompts. It tells you where to place the microphone and does much of the heavy lifting for you. MiniDSP for dummies? This one isn't bad: https://www.minidsp.com/applications/auto-eq-with-rew
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Jan 31, 2022 21:48
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RIP Paul Walker posted:MiniDSP on easy mode is just getting one with Dirac Live and following the prompts. It tells you where to place the microphone and does much of the heavy lifting for you. Sorry - I just meant conceptually - like what's going on.
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Jan 31, 2022 21:57
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BonoMan posted:Sorry - I just meant conceptually - like what's going on. It's for correcting issues with speakers and the space they are in, essentially. Here are a couple links that'll kind of get you started, they're not specific to the MiniDSP but the concepts are the same no matter what processor or measurement tooling you use (Room EQ Wizard being one of the most common you'll come across). I didn't spend a lot of time vetting these but they'll get your feet wet. Kinda technical: https://www.roomeqwizard.com/features.html Some dummy-how-to links related to room acoustics. I know they say pro audio but the concepts are broadly the same: https://producelikeapro.com/blog/room-eq-wizard/ https://www.pro-tools-expert.com/home-page/how-to-analyse-your-room-and-speakers-using-room-eq-wizard https://www.gikacoustics.com/room-eq-wizard-tutorial/
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Jan 31, 2022 22:39
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I think the most helpful thing would just be for me to explain how I set it up for my car. I have an ancient T61 Thinkpad (with an SSD and 4GB ram thankfully) that I run Room EQ Wizard on. It has a bluetooth dongle so it can just play directly to my deck. Ideally you measure from the same source as you'll eventually listen to. After making a couple sweeps while sitting in my driver's seat holding a mic and my breath, you can average them together and generate something like this.  Yeah, sucks! Next I open the EQ wizard.  After setting ranges and slopes you want it will generate you some filters like those teal lines that show it removing a ton around 150, 1.5k, and 6k. There's a lot of analysis that can be done all over the place but I won't bother even trying to explain. Calculate target Level > Match Response is surprisingly adequate by itself. You can export these coefficients right to whatever format you want, but REW only does IIR minimum phase filters. Instead I export the measurement into rePhase to create FIRs and tune the phase a little more.  This is what it looks like right after importing the measurement and filters from REW. I decided to even out my subwoofer hump since it's a little easier to do here than REW. I purposely made this box with a slot port that's too big so it can have inserts to raise it up to something reasonable and without them it's just way too low, but I wanted to see what it would sound like in the end.  I didn't do TOO insane of a job because I actually want to do a better one in stereo, but notice the phase scale is now way smaller. The blue line was predicted, and the red line is the result. More taps or different windows make it longer/shorter and more/less accurate. It says 170ms at the bottom but that isn't the final latency imposed by the resulting impulse response filtering. You seem to be able to cover most stuff in <30ms unless you wanna go all audiophile on it for no benefit. I take the file it generates, rename it to .irs so android doesn't try to play it ever, plop it on my phone and click a little box in Viper4Android and it's done. You can measure it again and tweak it more, but even 1 pass is a substantial upgrade. E: In case you were looking for a more technical explanation, you record your speakers playing a sweep from the bottom to the top of their range, which can be transformed into what happened if your speakers were a gun but without the gun, flip it upside down and smash it on the signal OVER TIME and it should cancel out and sound good. EE: Future Lowclock knowledge: REW has added some fancy math poo poo that makes this a lot faster and more accurate now. Also, just ignore the paragraphic phase EQ and just use the filter linearization stuff to fix phase crap caused by crossovers without adding a bunch of pre-response. If you're curious ask me about it. Lowclock fucked around with this message at 19:42 on Mar 27, 2023 |
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Feb 1, 2022 00:40
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otter posted:Pardon my dumb question if it has been answered previously. Update on this. I ended up buying the one from eBay. I paid $510 shipped and it did not include the wireless CarPlay adapter but Bluetooth works just fine. Holy moly the difference between sync2 and sync3 is night and day. Super happy with the upgrade so far. Took about 45 minutes but it would have taken less time if I had: Parked flat instead of at an incline in my driveway Had smaller hands Had watched a video about the specific model of explorer I have which has extra speakers and thus the disassembly was slightly different.
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Feb 2, 2022 05:38
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otter posted:Update on this. I ended up buying the one from eBay. I paid $510 shipped and it did not include the wireless CarPlay adapter but Bluetooth works just fine. Holy moly the difference between sync2 and sync3 is night and day. Super happy with the upgrade so far. Took about 45 minutes but it would have taken less time if I had: Not sure which version of sync3 you got, but you can use this tool to update to the latest even if it's not officially supported. I used it to get my 18 Mustang up to 3.4 even though 3.0 is the latest version officially offered for my year https://cyanlabs.net/tutorials/windows-automated-method-update-to-3-4/
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Feb 2, 2022 18:07
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Dunno if anyone was waiting for the Motorola* MA1 (Android Auto wireless adapter), but mine finally showed up. Easy peasy. Plug it into the stereo's USB port, pair to the adapter via Bluetooth, and once it's paired, it kicks off a wifi connection to the dongle every time the dongle powers up. Takes about a minute from engine startup until I have AA on the stereo instead of ~15-20 seconds, but I'll take that over having to plug it in every time. Lowclock posted:I have a rooted Android phone with Viper4Android and it will automatically apply different profiles depending on the connection, so you can correct the internal speaker, a set of headphones, or bluetooth separately. It's kinda wonky to get working but once you do it seems fine. It's been a looooong time since I used Viper, do you still need root to use it? My head unit also has a 13 band EQ, along with time delay for each speaker (no clue how to use that, so I haven't touched it) I have the typical smiley face EQ profile right now that every 80s/90s kid had on their stereos.  Also lets me set speaker locations and size, which is kinda cool (oddball 6x8 Ford size is in there)
randomidiot fucked around with this message at 03:57 on Feb 6, 2022 |
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Feb 6, 2022 03:53
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A minute? Geez that's painfully long ha.
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Feb 6, 2022 05:09
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STR posted:It's been a looooong time since I used Viper, do you still need root to use it? STR posted:My head unit also has a 13 band EQ, along with time delay for each speaker (no clue how to use that, so I haven't touched it) I have the typical smiley face EQ profile right now that every 80s/90s kid had on their stereos. I'd use that EQ to take a chunk out around like 150 and a smaller one near 1750 if you have the bands for it. If your speaker profiles haven't already done this, that'll probably help a lot more than any amount of alignment and could let you pull out some boost around the really high and low ends which can be problematic.
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Feb 6, 2022 05:18
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I'm half deaf at this point anyway.  I'm kinda done with rooting these days; my work phone is rooted, but the A/B devices are a different breed than what I'm used to. Plus pretty much everything I listen to is streaming, so something integrated into, say, Poweramp, wouldn't do me any good.It's funny.. my phone has 256GB of storage, but I'd be fine with 64GB. Probably 32GB.. very little is actually stored on the device itself, it's all ~in the cloud~ BonoMan posted:A minute? Geez that's painfully long ha. To be fair, it's a low end JVC head unit. It's not good at anything except sound quality (and that's debatable if you're using an amp.. 2V RCA outs). Ever since I factory reset my phone, the head unit doesn't auto-start AA anyway. Once prices and availability come back down on Pioneer and Kenwood stuff, I'll ditch it for something better. Kinda tempted to see how the MA1 works on my work van (Ford Transit w/Sync 3). Pretty impressed with Sync on it, except if I unplug my phone from USB while on a phone call (or if the cable is starting to fail), the head unit sometimes freezes and needs a hard reset (power + next buttons held down) - won't even power off with the ignition when that happens. It's a much more responsive head unit compared to the JVC though.
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Feb 6, 2022 07:06
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STR posted:I'm half deaf at this point anyway. PowerAmp also somewhat recently spun their audio processing off into a separate app, but it's just parametric IIRs and a compressor. While it's global, doesn't require root, and might get some support and further development, it's still missing the real good poo poo.
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Feb 6, 2022 07:43
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STR posted:Dunno if anyone was waiting for the Motorola* MA1 (Android Auto wireless adapter), but mine finally showed up. Where did you order from? No one has it right now, but I'm on it the second I can buy one. A one minute boot is small price to pay versus hitting a hard bump and having it disconnect.
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Feb 6, 2022 13:13
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Amazon, when they were taking preorders. Target can let you know when it's back in stock, otherwise you're stuck just checking Amazon and Target every day to see if they've restocked. AAWireless is supposed to be good too (arguably better), but it looks like they're also having stock issues. I did have it disconnect on me earlier, but I'm not sure if that's my phone being weird or not - it was occasionally disconnecting while plugged in, but I was chalking that up to a flaky cable. Need to go down the list of 500+ things that can cause Android Auto to act up.
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Feb 6, 2022 17:47
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STR posted:Amazon, when they were taking preorders. Thanks. Signed up with target.
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Feb 6, 2022 17:52
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Any recs for minimalist single DIN mechless head units with no blinding blue lights? I like the Clarion M508 a lot but it's kinda pricey and seems to be out of stock at most places.
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Feb 7, 2022 00:01
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I think some of the Sony units have selectable colors and brightness. The double DIN mechless in my CR-V lets me pick a color and brightness for the display and a separate color for the buttons.
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Feb 7, 2022 00:12
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I think Clarion is pretty much done at this point. That's a marine deck which is why it's also like twice the price it should be. Most manufacturers have color adjustment on all but their lowest end decks, but they're still ugly.
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Feb 7, 2022 02:45
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I’ve got an assortment of $15-25 head units that I’ve thrown in Kei trucks and all have been fine and most offer color adjustment
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Feb 7, 2022 04:02
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I have one of the $20 cheapos in my current work truck and it's alright except for the bluetooth not working sometimes and it has to be on max volume to be loud enough.
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Feb 7, 2022 04:29
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Lowclock posted:I think Clarion is pretty much done at this point. That's a marine deck which is why it's also like twice the price it should be. Most manufacturers have color adjustment on all but their lowest end decks, but they're still ugly. I think Clarion is primarily OEM these days - for awhile they were OEM and marine stuff, but I don't see any marine stuff in their current lineup. One 24 volt CD player in the lineup, I assume for big trucks. Shame, they used to put out some nice stuff.
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Feb 7, 2022 04:54
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I just finished spending a few hours getting better with REW, rePhase, and a mic and really nailing down my car. The ability to do phase correction is so insane. It's literally a time equalizer. In the midrange it's not terribly noticeable, but it absolutely transforms subwoofers. I have a modified rebuilt 18" in almost 5 cubic feet on 2500 watts. It sounds better than you'd think it would, but not to be confused with "good". After some phase correction that actually makes bass lines of hip-hop songs play backwards on my home stereo, I'll be damned if the thing doesn't sound like the loudest sealed 12" you've ever heard. The frickin' future is now.
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Feb 7, 2022 06:36
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STR posted:I think Clarion is primarily OEM these days - for awhile they were OEM and marine stuff, but I don't see any marine stuff in their current lineup. One 24 volt CD player in the lineup, I assume for big trucks. Apparently JL Audio handles all of Clairon’s marine audio business in the US now. I guess that explains why trying to search for the marine stuff on Clarion’s website just results in a page not found screen.
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Feb 7, 2022 08:16
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Yerok posted:Any recs for minimalist single DIN mechless head units with no blinding blue lights? I currently have a Pioneer MVH-X560BT in my Crown Vic. It's reasonably minimalist, and the screen and button colors are customizable, along with a manual dimmer. I keep it all green to match the Ford dash lighting. It sounds decent. Unfortunately it's been discontinued: https://www.sonicelectronix.com/item-74585-Pioneer-MVH-X560BT.html edit: pic:  It was $110 when I bought it. Interestingly, literally every singl;e-DIN Pioneer shows out of stock on Sonic Electronix, so I don't know what's going on there, but there are several current models with similar features to mine, with an updated look that still not too flashy, at least for me. I am about to replace it, though, since my car has room for a double-DIN, and I need a reversing camera for that boat. Speaking of, I bought one of the Atoto F7 units with CarPlay from Amazon. I believe I saw that recommendation in here. Amazon had a one-day sale on them last week that saved me a few bucks.
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Feb 7, 2022 22:33
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Most Pioneer and Kenwood is OOS everywhere, except for the real high end stuff and some low end stuff. Crutchfield claims chip shortages. That's why I wound up going JVC. 
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Feb 8, 2022 03:02
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STR posted:Most Pioneer and Kenwood is OOS everywhere, except for the real high end stuff and some low end stuff. Crutchfield claims chip shortages.
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Feb 8, 2022 04:24
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Well most of the mechless stuff probably wasn't designed 15 years ago.
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Feb 8, 2022 16:31
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PBCrunch posted:Well most of the mechless stuff probably wasn't designed 15 years ago.
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Feb 8, 2022 20:29
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Ironically I'm running a CD player from 2007 that has never had a CD in the mechanism. I got hooked on the Phatnoise media player back in 2005 and still use them. I've had to replace the IDE 2.5" drives several times and since there's zero support for switching to SATA or solid state, and head units newer than 2009 don't operate the things anyway, I think it's time to retire them. So I just pulled the trigger on the Chinese android unit I was talking about earlier. I'll update if it's good.
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Feb 9, 2022 08:19
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An IDE to SD adapter won't work? Also for those considering the Motorola MA1... it's a big roll of the dice with an aftermarket head unit, it's been nothing but skips and disconnects with my JVC. Works great in my work van though (Ford Sync 3.4) - in 8 hours yesterday I never had it disconnect, and only noticed one audio skip. Murders my phone battery, but at least I can plug it into a quick charger for 15 minutes here and there instead of relying on the van's 500mA (which just slows down how fast my phone discharges when using wired AA - and unplugging/plugging the phone back in 80+ times a day doesn't seem good for longevity).
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Feb 9, 2022 14:00
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LloydDobler posted:So I just pulled the trigger on the Chinese android unit I was talking about earlier. I'll update if it's good. STR posted:An IDE to SD adapter won't work?
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Feb 9, 2022 19:17
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What is the rock-bottom of gear I could get my hands on to take a crack at some of this DSP stuff? Would a Dayton iMM-6 do the job? I'm willing to root my Android phone or break it while trying.
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Feb 9, 2022 19:35
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PBCrunch posted:What is the rock-bottom of gear I could get my hands on to take a crack at some of this DSP stuff? Would a Dayton iMM-6 do the job? I'm willing to root my Android phone or break it while trying. A new UMM-6 or UMIK-1 is like $80, but MiniDSP wants $27 shipping and stock/scalpers are garbage. I happened across my "restocked" UMM-6 on parts express for $45 and it appears brand new and works great. WRT the phone, If you can get Magisk on there, getting Viper or JamesDSP going is pretty easy. The main trick that I figured out is that it doesn't seem to play nice with stock bundled stuff like AudioFX or MusicFX, so just stripping down or replacing audio_effects.conf makes it pretty rock solid. I wouldn't be any help with rooting, but if you need a hand with those just say so. E: You also have to turn off bluetooth direct volume control. Lowclock fucked around with this message at 21:17 on Feb 9, 2022 |
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Feb 9, 2022 21:01
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STR posted:An IDE to SD adapter won't work? Crazy, it might. The system has a few die hard enthusiasts and I know one person was able to make it work using an IDE to SATA adapter and got a modern SSD to work but then it didn't fit in the cartridge so he had to run it open chassis and it wasn't really compatible with the automotive environment, but it was a good exercise. The manufacturer did something to write on hidden sectors on the drive so that only "authorized" drives could be used in the cartridges but people figured out how to hack around that a long time ago when drives were failing all over. But again, the second biggest problem is that they require a head unit to operate and the protocol is all written around Kenwood's pre-2009 cd changer instructions. So nothing newer than 13 years old will run it. Mine has a broken volume knob and poo poo like that so it's time.
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Feb 9, 2022 21:23
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