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Begemot
Oct 14, 2012

The One True Oden

HackensackBackpack posted:

Pals, I love Summoner.

Show me your SMN glams. What're your best books?



I got a fancy moon book, with extending covers!


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ImpAtom
May 24, 2007

FuturePastNow posted:

My current favorite book is a holy book



This is my favorite too. I really love the effect, it just feels super cool.

Kyrosiris
May 24, 2006

You try to be happy when everyone is summoning you everywhere to "be their friend".



HackensackBackpack posted:

Pals, I love Summoner.

Show me your SMN glams. What're your best books?



jjac
Jun 12, 2007

What time is it?!

HackensackBackpack posted:

Pals, I love Summoner.

Show me your SMN glams. What're your best books?



The fancy one from hell island

limp dick calvin
Sep 1, 2006

Strepitoso. Vedete? Una meraviglia.
I finished Eureka. Are there any follow up quests or does it just end?

Next up: finishing BLU levels.

Thundarr
Dec 24, 2002


In one night my group went from losing both tanks to cleaning up Act 3-4, one-shotting Finale, and seeing Curtain Call. That went a heck of a lot better than I was expecting.

It did help that one of the healers realized he'd been running the wrong direction in Act 2 50% of the time up until now. :shobon:

Ibblebibble
Nov 12, 2013

Consummate Professional posted:

I finished Eureka. Are there any follow up quests or does it just end?

Next up: finishing BLU levels.

Is this including BA? You need to finish a run of BA to get any real closure.

Concurred
Apr 23, 2003

My team got swept out of the playoffs, and all I got was this avatar and red text


Is there any feather gear for casters? I have Suzaku's glowy book but can't find anything that looks phoenixy. I know there's the Replica Dreadwyrm gear which has the dragon wings, but... not the same

limp dick calvin
Sep 1, 2006

Strepitoso. Vedete? Una meraviglia.

Ibblebibble posted:

Is this including BA? You need to finish a run of BA to get any real closure.

Ah okay. I will do that this weekend.

Sanguinia
Jan 1, 2012

~Everybody wants to be a cat~
~Because a cat's the only cat~
~Who knows where its at~

In tonight's Heavensward we discuss Minors and Miners

TopHatGenius
Oct 3, 2008

something feels
different

Hot Rope Guy

Consummate Professional posted:

I finished Eureka. Are there any follow up quests or does it just end?

Next up: finishing BLU levels.

You should do BLU savage.

super sweet best pal
Nov 18, 2009

At the point in the expansion where I want to take a break from tomestone and weapon token grinding and am once again wishing endgame gear was just cosmetic so I wouldn't have to care.

Yapping Eevee
Nov 12, 2011

STAND TOGETHER.
FIGHT WITH HONOR.
RESTORE BALANCE.

Eevees play for free.
Remember, you don't have to care at all if you don't want to. You could very easily just coast on random dungeon drops and/or crafted gear until next expansion, and then buy the best stuff from this expansion with poetics. You have the power to go full lazy if you wish.

Mr. Nice!
Oct 13, 2005

bone shaking.
soul baking.
Exactly. The only place gear has any real mattering is savage content.

Vargs
Mar 27, 2010

As a newcomer, how does this game do gearing between patches anyways? Is the equipment I'm getting now going to be pointless and easily replaced once 6.1 comes out like in WoW?

SpaceDrake
Dec 22, 2006

I can't avoid filling a game with awful memes, even if I want to. It's in my bones...!

Vargs posted:

As a newcomer, how does this game do gearing between patches anyways? Is the equipment I'm getting now going to be pointless and easily replaced once 6.1 comes out like in WoW?

The new top end raid tier will come in 6.2, and the gear you're using now will be what you do early Savage runs with. While normal mode Second Panda will give gear slightly stronger than what we have now, the savage mode will unlock immediately. If you're ~world first~ or just a pusher of content in general, the gear you earn now will remain relevant in the first month or so of 6.2.

It's only really with 6.3 - not quite a year out from now - that your current gear will be 100% "outdated".

orcane
Jun 13, 2012

Fun Shoe

Mr. Nice! posted:

Exactly. The only place gear has any real mattering is savage content.
Yeah except for the thing where new MSQ, trials, and normal/ally raids require an ever increasing item level. There are several points in the expansion cycle where your next MSQ dungeon will require a higher item level than what you get from the last one, and that doesn't even include the weapon so gear keeps mattering, unless you keep upgrading to crafted gear (not really what I'd consider "not caring about gear") or plan to be several patches behind with the MSQ until the next expansion launches.

orcane fucked around with this message at 13:06 on Feb 11, 2022

Bleck
Jan 7, 2014

No matter how one loves, there are always different aims. Love can take a great many forms, whatever the era.

orcane posted:

There are several points in the expansion cycle where your next MSQ dungeon will require a higher item level than what you get from the last one

I'm not one of the thread experts but I don't think this is true - or, if it is, then by the time I would ever get to that point, the equipment I would get from the previous MSQ already put me at that point. I've never had to stop doing MSQs because my item level wasn't high enough.

Mr. Nice!
Oct 13, 2005

bone shaking.
soul baking.
Things do creep up a bit, but nothing requires restricted tomestone items or better until they’re available for unrestricted tomes.

For example, when panda dropped, it had an ilevel of 565 which was higher than anything else. When the 24 man raids and dungeons drop in 6.1 (and will drop 590 gear), they will probably require 570 which can be achieved with nothing but unrestricted tomes or maybe 575. I don’t think anything will require above 580 prior to 6.2.

orcane
Jun 13, 2012

Fun Shoe
Realistically you will have gear from other places, like normal/ally raids and tomestones. But taking breaks or going lazy absolutely will hit points where the MSQ requires more gear than what you can get from the MSQ itself and the old unlimited tomestones barely help - you'll have to buy crafted upgrades or farm a lot of tomestones and raid tokens. In ShB, Heroes' Gauntlet required an item level of 460 but the previous dungeon (Anamnesis Anyder) dropped 455. Paglth'an required 490 but Matoya's Relic dropped 485. At the time, you could get unlimited tomestone gear + normal raid weapons that matched the requirements (460/490), but that was a lot of farming to hit a baseline for a dungeon just to continue the MSQ, which was also useless for the next content drop vs. having gear from capped tomestones (490/520) and crafted gear/normal raid tokens (480/510).

You can ignore part of the treadmill occasionally as a "casual", you can't escape it. FF14 is not that game and someone who wishes the endgame gear was strictly cosmetic is probably not talking about "but actually you can get along fine by only farming the unlimited tomestones and unrestricted raid drops all the time!".

Ibram Gaunt
Jul 22, 2009

I'm glad the endgame isn't all cosmetic...That would be dire IMO.

Mr. Nice!
Oct 13, 2005

bone shaking.
soul baking.

Ibram Gaunt posted:

I'm glad the endgame isn't all cosmetic...That would be dire IMO.

Agreed. I probably wouldn’t care as much about savage raiding if I didn’t get top of the line gear from it. I don’t care about glamor or cosmetics in this game at all, really. I just like to smack baddies with an axe.

SettingSun
Aug 10, 2013

You can just not get on the loot treadmill if you don't want. Come back for new patch, buy or grind out a set, and get right to the new stuff.

Pollyanna
Mar 5, 2005

Milk's on them.


XIV is extremely amenable to just not playing for 4-6 months, especially now during covid. Not a lot happens between or even within patches, and there’s not a lot to work on in the meantime unless you’re insane. Hell, the devs have explicitly said it’s okay to unsub until the next patch.

XIV ain’t WOW, it’s not a full-time job.

escape mechanism
Feb 12, 2012

ShB 5.3 :words:: it was good.

From his first appearance, G’raha’s appearance has become alarming and will get worse as we progress. They did a really good job with visual storytelling here, compared to their usual trick of relying on emotes and animations.
He’s going to do something stupidly self-sacrificial again, isn’t he?

Even after finishing this chapter, I’m unsure about what called Elidibus and the WoL to the Crystarium watchtower. The game says that the WoL drifts there because they’re thinking of Ardbert, but later Elidibus implies that it’s some Ascian call the WoL let out unconsciously?

Elidibus’s comment about G’raha soul density made me realise that as one who lived through the eight calamity, he’s more rejoined as the rest of our crew except the WoL.

Thancred collapsing (and the previous bouts of dizziness the Scions have been experiencing) have been clear setups for the urgency of getting the Scions home to the Source, but that plot point ends up completely evaporating once Elidibus’s plot gets in motion. Instead the narrative focus is on G’raha’s ploy to return to the Source with us. It might have been for the best because the Scions never really felt in danger (and again, I’ve seen the EW trailer), and my questions were mostly on who else would be able to make the trip.

Speaking of, there’s six vessels prepared and only five Scions to bring back, as Alisaie immediately notes (the game keeps not making its NPC stupid, which I appreciate). It’s at that point I start to realise the game won’t find a contrivance to bring Ryne with us, which is… rough. The game has done a very bad job of showing her forming connections with the people of the First, instead focusing mostly on her interactions with the Scions. I realise there’s Gaia from the Eden raid series (whose second third I now regret not having completed before playing this patch, in hindsight), but they have the very annoying habit of not acknowledging the post-ARR raid series in the MSQ, so we just end up leaving this orphaned teenager behind without any obvious support network, leaving me grumbling at my computer screen.

At that point I expected that Elidibus’s plot was to paint the WoL/D as a villain to make us unable to act in the First, so the duty where he has you killing through all the MSQ’s characters was extra unnerving, because I was awaiting the hammer to drop that we were striking down random people under the illusions.

Instead the duty serves as exploration of Elidibus’s feeling toward the WoL’s actions. Unlike Emet-Selch who never seemed to care too much about what happened to Lahabrea, Elidibus is full of resentment toward our actions, and the duty is a reflection of the horror our work has evoked in him.

This does bring up some questions though: has there been no other in all the millennia since the sundering that significantly set the Ascians’ plot back? No other unsundered Paragon who fell on the Source or some shard? I kinda hope they expand on those things at some point because it’s starting to make the world seem smaller.

We do get some lore though: Elidibus is the primal of Salvation, separated from Zodiark as an independent entity but still powered by people’s faith in heroes, which is why he’s been inspiring a new generation of them. Now I fully expect to see Venat separated from Hydaelyn in the same at some point.

We also learn how minor Ascians are made: by imbuing them with partial memories of their Convocation predecessors (I assume those who share the same souls?) through the constellation crystals. At least those minors Ascians who have names, I still don’t know what’s going on with the mooks with names like “Ascian of the Twelfth cup”.

We also get backstory on the Fourteenth convocation member, and their name: Azem, a traveller who went around solving trouble with an adventuring party, like some kind of RPG protagonist. Despite their damnatio memoriae, “a friend” (I first thought it was Hythlodaeus, but in hindsight it might be Emet-Selch, or it’s just someone we haven’t met yet and I’m just grasping at clues I don’t have the context for) created a memory crystal of them, with a spell to summon heroes to your help. Despite what I expected, we never see any memories from this crystal, but the WoL still has it on them by the end of the patch, so that’s a Chekhov's gun I expect to see fired at some point.

(There’s a later dialogue in the Rising Stones where Urianger wonders if the gods Azeyma and Azim might not be named after Azem, which seems like…a huge stretch. That’s not how historical linguistic reconstruction works, Urianger, and even then why would a single ancient, not matter how notable, be remembered as divine when the others weren’t?)

Finally, we learn Elidibus’s real plot and it makes for amazing setpieces: Rather than sully our reputation in the First (which would require at least some of the people the party helped or inspired to turn against us, which would have felt a bit contrived), he’ll do it in the other shards and turn the power that defeated Emet-Selch against his foe.

Not only does this dodge the narrative contrivance I was worried about, it allows everyone we’ve formed a connection with in the First to help us as we race through it one last time in the Heroes’ Gauntlet, fighting against the shade of other player characters. It’s probably the best story dungeon they’ve made so far, and the possibility of doing it with Trust allows the player to take it slow and notice all the details they’ve sprinkled through.

After meeting up with the Exarch, his farewell to Lyna and starting the climb in the Crystal Tower, it becomes clear that another one of my expectations is being subverted: Rather than sacrificing himself G’raha is taking every risk to accomplish his dreams, including burning up his current body. This culminates in one of the final cutscene of the patch, a somewhat discordant comedy routine by the Scions that ends with them just jumping into action to solve a yellow sidequest, which is everything G’raha ever hoped for.

The final boss fight was nice and I enjoyed the many call backs to Hades, and the role reversals in general.
I wondered at Emet-Selch’s intervention during the fight, which seemed rather out of character, but after rewatching the Hythlodaeus cutscene, things clicked a bit for me: once Emet lost hope that their restoration of the ancients would succeed, he asked us to remember them. Elidibus’s “single minded pursuit of a half-forgotten cause” is antithetical to that, a vain attempt that won’t succeed in perpetuating their memory. So he stopped Elidibus before he could get forget all but his goal completely.

Overall they did a very good job at raising Elidibus from a 2.x Ascian ranting in the sidelines into a compelling antagonist. I’m not sure how much of his backstory and characterisation was planned in advance, but it made for a good story, so whatever. One thing I remain unsure of is whether Elidibus was still a child when he became the core of Zodiark, or whether those memories of being inducted into the convocation (I noticed he was shorter than the rest in his pov during those flashbacks) were the last thing he had to cling to by the end.

Finally, the Fandaniel stinger is interesting in that it shows that both of our old foes, the Ascians and the Garleian, have now splintered into subfactions pushing their own objectives. We’re following the unhinged nihilist splinter in the MSQ, looks like, but it feels like they could sustain a whole EU of Garleian warlords and unfettered Ascian wizard causing regional trouble from now on. This actually makes the direction of Endwalker really difficult to predict, with our traditional antagonists so weakened I’m starting to wonder if they’ll sustain a whole extension worth of plot.

As for the character of Fandaniel, he’s reminiscent of 4.x’s Emet-Selch in his theatrics, but pushed much further into insanity. I asked back in 5.0 just what kind of character would accept to be recruited into the Ascians besides those very hungry for personal power, and yeah there's also That Guy. If it weren’t for the Omega raids, I’d expect him to reveal his true name as Kefka just before his boss fight.

Macaluso
Sep 23, 2005

I HATE THAT HEDGEHOG, BROTHER!
Funny enough FF having such respect for your time compared to WoW just makes me want to stick around more

Oxyclean
Sep 23, 2007


I've definitely taken hiatuses mid expansion to come back and run into patch MSQ trial/dungeon ilvl gates, and it doesn't really feel great having to run like 5-10 dungeons or buy a bunch of gear just to get over that, but it is much better then "in the 20 weeks you've been gone, you've fallen 20 weeks behind on this power progression." The ilvl hurdlers are by no means bad, but they can be kind of momentum destroying.

What i'm saying is I want to see a XIV Kelly comic with "ilvl gate" and "Greedy, No good crafters" offering high priced tickets to a sad child labeled "poor, innocents casual MSQ players."

Kyrosiris
May 24, 2006

You try to be happy when everyone is summoning you everywhere to "be their friend".



Oxyclean posted:

What i'm saying is I want to see a XIV Kelly comic with "ilvl gate" and "Greedy, No good crafters" offering high priced tickets to a sad child labeled "poor, innocents casual MSQ players."

Which is hilarious because I'm pretty sure I gave away like fifteen different full sets of exarchic to friends coming back in 5.5 to get ready for Endwalker. :v:

Oxyclean
Sep 23, 2007


Kyrosiris posted:

Which is hilarious because I'm pretty sure I gave away like fifteen different full sets of exarchic to friends coming back in 5.5 to get ready for Endwalker. :v:
I mean, certainly goons and friends are cool and often willing to give a hookup, but I personally always hate imposing - and seeing gear in the 100k-500k region is not unaffordable for me, but it feels bad to spend for something I know I might just replace shortly after I get beyond the ilvl gate.

Obviously crafters aren't greedy, but it feels like a XIV-Kelly-esque take that they're the gatekeepers to the ilvl gates. Maybe thrown in the tome vendors beside them.

That said, I certainly wouldn't want XIV to be an MMO without gear progression.

the_steve
Nov 9, 2005

We're always hiring!

Kyrosiris posted:

Which is hilarious because I'm pretty sure I gave away like fifteen different full sets of exarchic to friends coming back in 5.5 to get ready for Endwalker. :v:

Yeah, I made a full HQ set of the AR-CAEN crafting gear for a buddy of mine just because I had nothing better to do.

Thundarr
Dec 24, 2002


So it sounds like in the next live letter they'll be discussing how to do a mandatory link between your Steam and SQEX accounts for Steam players. Which also means it'll finally be the death of the stand alone launcher if you have the game through Steam.

Vitamean
May 31, 2012

personally if I wasn't raiding I'd probably unsub until they introduced whatever long term content they had in the pipeline. I know early in shb and stb I was mostly raid logging until bozja and hoh/eureka dropped.

Begemot
Oct 14, 2012

The One True Oden

I just let my sub lapse and probably won't come back until 6.1 or 6.2. Luckily, I managed to sell a piece of extremely rare Eureka equipment, so I have 5 million gil waiting for me to spend on catch-up gear when I come back!

Pollyanna
Mar 5, 2005

Milk's on them.


But how much time did you sink into getting that equipment…?

a cartoon duck
Sep 5, 2011

TopHatGenius posted:

You should do BLU savage.

BLU savage owns

Vargs posted:

As a newcomer, how does this game do gearing between patches anyways? Is the equipment I'm getting now going to be pointless and easily replaced once 6.1 comes out like in WoW?

people already answered it, but yeah the short answer is gear becomes outdated roughly every eight to ten months when a new raid tier hits.

the longer answer is that every raid tier puts gear in three tiers. starting from ilvl 10 for ease of illustration:
ilvl 10: crafted gear and normal raid gear
ilvl 20: tomestone gear
ilvl 30: savage raid gear and augmented tomestone gear

major non-raid patches (6.1, 6.3 and 6.5) then add augmented crafted gear and alliance raid gear to the ilvl 20 tier so you're not too far behind savage raiders if you're late to a raid tier. every new raid tier (6.2, 6.4) then effectively resets the gear curve by making the new crafted and normal raid sets ilvl 40, so they'll be better than the best gear from the previous raid tier.

if you don't care about high-end raiding, the easiest way to stay on the curve is just being in a free company and asking a helpful crafter what materials they need to make the latest set and coast on by the for the next eight months

Begemot
Oct 14, 2012

The One True Oden

Pollyanna posted:

But how much time did you sink into getting that equipment…?

Oh it was a speed belt (now ring) that dropped while I was grinding for elemental armor, so I didn't put any time into seeking it out specifically. I actually used it as a belt, and then it got un-soulbound when it got transmogrified into a ring with 6.0, so I could go sell it :v:

Heroic Yoshimitsu
Jan 15, 2008

I want level up all the jobs to 90, that among other things keeps me coming back!!

Vitamean
May 31, 2012

I keep putting off getting these last four trusts up to 90 but I'll prob work on that in 6.1 once the new ultimate comes out and I have a set raid schedule beyond "maybe one or two days a week for reclears" again

Pollyanna
Mar 5, 2005

Milk's on them.


Begemot posted:

Oh it was a speed belt (now ring) that dropped while I was grinding for elemental armor, so I didn't put any time into seeking it out specifically. I actually used it as a belt, and then it got un-soulbound when it got transmogrified into a ring with 6.0, so I could go sell it :v:

:laffo: Okay that’s pretty good.

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hazardousmouse
Dec 17, 2010
I'd take a hiatus to play elden ring but how will I keep showing up to fishing windows and the occasional BLU ex fight if I'm unsubbed?

I also just realized that the final stb alliance raid casting gear is extremely pro BLU glam and now I need to farm it up

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