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As a show of his commitment to peace and de-escalation, Putin has ordered Russia's large scale nuclear forces exercise - originally scheduled for September - to begin tomorrow. Nothing says "we're just minding our own business - you should mind yours" like pulling out the nukes.
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Feb 16, 2022 20:43
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Conspiratiorist posted:As a show of his commitment to peace and de-escalation, Putin has ordered Russia's large scale nuclear forces exercise - originally scheduled for September - to begin tomorrow. To slightly expand on this, it got rescheduled 1-2 weeks ago.
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Feb 16, 2022 20:46
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Conspiratiorist posted:Ethnic cleansing. That is what the Azov battalion is for, afterall: Exterminating the Russians and their Jewish overlords.
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Feb 16, 2022 20:47
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Conspiratiorist posted:As a show of his commitment to peace and de-escalation, Putin has ordered Russia's large scale nuclear forces exercise - originally scheduled for September - to begin tomorrow. To be clear, they're not actually pulling out the nukes here, just the nuke-capable missiles. Which is still some pretty un-subtle posturing, particularly given the timing, but in the end, it's posturing.
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Feb 16, 2022 20:51
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cinci zoo sniper posted:To slightly expand on this, it got rescheduled 1-2 weeks ago. Yeah it was a short while ago and unilateral but wasn't a finger snap; there's a timetable involved. Ahead of sensationalist media I'll add that this is a pure deterrence move, and not that Putin is planning to escalate things with NATO. Deterring NATO is not good for Ukraine's prospects, though.
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Feb 16, 2022 20:52
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fatherboxx posted:Once Russian advisors/leaders pack up and the cashflow stops it would go back into Ukraine near-instantly because it is not really a self-sustainable region and turning into permanent hellhole like Transnistria is not a fate that people still left there would prefer. Why would a populace who were oppressed while part of Ukraine want to rejoin ukraine? Seems counter intuitive.
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Feb 16, 2022 21:00
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Mr Hootington posted:Why would a populace who were oppressed while part of Ukraine want to rejoin ukraine? Seems counter intuitive. That'd be because they were not actually oppressed. Except maybe in the way that white Christian males are oppressed in the United States.
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Feb 16, 2022 21:04
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OddObserver posted:That'd be because they were not actually oppressed. Except maybe in the way that white Christian males are oppressed in the United States. A state seeking to eliminate your native language seems pretty loving horrible but I eagerly await Eastern Euros explaining how cultural genocide is actually progressive
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Feb 16, 2022 21:06
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Terminal autist posted:A state seeking to eliminate your native language seems pretty loving horrible but I eagerly await Eastern Euros explaining how cultural genocide is actually progressive Yeah, Russia should really stop doing it.
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Feb 16, 2022 21:08
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OddObserver posted:Yeah, Russia should really stop doing it. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ukrainization
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Feb 16, 2022 21:12
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Terminal autist posted:A state seeking to eliminate your native language seems pretty loving horrible but I eagerly await Eastern Euros explaining how cultural genocide is actually progressive Are you suggesting that speaking Russian was outlawed in Donbas, a region where Russian speakers are a minority? Edit: https://www.politico.eu/article/nato-chief-russia-continuing-military-buildup-at-ukraine-border/ Stoltenberg claims that the military buildup is continuing. cinci zoo sniper fucked around with this message at 21:19 on Feb 16, 2022 |
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Feb 16, 2022 21:12
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cinci zoo sniper posted:Are you suggesting that speaking Russian was outlawed in Donbas, a region where Russian speakers are a minority? No I'm suggesting Ukraine is pursuing a policy where the ultimate goal would be the elimination of Russian language speakers and culture in Ukraine on a long enough timeframe
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Feb 16, 2022 21:20
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Terminal autist posted:No I'm suggesting Ukraine is pursuing a policy where the ultimate goal would be the elimination of Russian language speakers and culture in Ukraine on a long enough timeframe It's not. It's pursuing policy where Ukrainian culture becomes dominant among Ukrainians. And you are equating it to policies of complete eradication of a culture, which is what Russia has attempted in Ukraine in the past, and is doing now in Tatarstan
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Feb 16, 2022 21:25
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Terminal autist posted:No I'm suggesting Ukraine is pursuing a policy where the ultimate goal would be the elimination of Russian language speakers and culture in Ukraine on a long enough timeframe Sounds like you're a person who would also condemn Russification of Ukraine. In which case, I wonder if you would be open to consider possible connections between the two.
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Feb 16, 2022 21:25
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cinci zoo sniper posted:Are you suggesting that speaking Russian was outlawed in Donbas, a region where Russian speakers are a minority? This going to be an interesting next few weeks which the estimated ideal time for an invasion. Granted, they could invade sooner but that's an incredibly expensive assembly of an army and worse conditions for fighting military and economically. 
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Feb 16, 2022 21:30
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cinci zoo sniper posted:Sounds like you're a person who would also condemn Russification of Ukraine. In which case, I wonder if you would be open to consider possible connections between the two. That is correct and I do but much like any conflict that arises from hastily drawn borders following the breakup of a massive colonial project we're probably looking at some new borders to resolve the conflict.
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Feb 16, 2022 21:30
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I saw ukranians at Charlottesville yelling "you will not replace us" with signs showing big red Xs over photos of gopniks. They also burned Russian language books. So yes. Ukraine wants to genocide all of Russia and push the slavs back to the urals.
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Feb 16, 2022 21:38
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WAR CRIME GIGOLO posted:I saw ukranians at Charlottesville yelling "you will not replace us" with signs showing big red Xs over photos of gopniks. They also burned Russian language books. Ukrainian regime defeating Slavs would be a sight to behold.
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Feb 16, 2022 21:40
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ronya posted:Big if true? Belarus to Russian troops: "You don't have to go home, but you can't stay here"
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Feb 16, 2022 21:44
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Some of the most prolific white supremacists in the US are Latino or Pacific Islander white nationalism isn't exactly logical. The Ukrainian nazi narrative at leasts makes more sense that Russians are Asian or whatever.
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Feb 16, 2022 21:45
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Well, if Russians are Asian because in some superficial ways Moscow was a Golden Horde successor state, clearly Ukrainians are Scandinavian!
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Feb 16, 2022 21:50
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cinci zoo sniper posted:Ukrainian regime defeating Slavs would be a sight to behold. The Ukrainian regime is actually Germans wearing slav-face
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Feb 16, 2022 21:50
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There's no reason Nazis should be limited to one race. If you are I dunno, Mongolian, you can think that Hitler was onto something, but he failed because the chosen people are actually Mongolians and not Germans. And indeed, there are Mongolian Nazis. Ultimately Nazism just says that the stronger races will conquer the weaker ones.
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Feb 16, 2022 21:51
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WAR CRIME GIGOLO posted:The Ukrainian regime is actually Germans wearing slav-face They would be way friendlier to Russia if that were the case. Unless it's secretly zombie Skoropadsky (boy, what an accurate family name).
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Feb 16, 2022 21:52
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ronya posted:Big if true? I can think of at least one way this can be 100% true without having those forces return to Russia.
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Feb 16, 2022 21:54
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Ynglaur posted:I can think of at least one way this can be 100% true without having those forces return to Russia. I propose a third possibility: They turn Belarus into Russia
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Feb 16, 2022 21:59
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Mr Hootington posted:Why would a populace who were oppressed while part of Ukraine want to rejoin ukraine? Seems counter intuitive. Because Glorious Russia that fed them fairytales of rejoining for a decade prior to 2014 left them in a ditch for seven years of war under the rule of small time criminals while focusing on Crimea.
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Feb 16, 2022 22:01
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OctaMurk posted:I propose a third possibility: They turn Belarus into Russia The Union State is quite a step in that direction already.
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Feb 16, 2022 22:04
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They already signed a bunch of integration treaties early in November that effectively turn Belarus into a territory subordinate to Moscow. I'd say the idea that Russia would invade Belarus is intentionally fed misinfo but this is Fox News so I can't tell you which side its coming from or if the talking heads are truly that ignorant to believe it.
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Feb 16, 2022 22:23
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fatherboxx posted:Because Glorious Russia that fed them fairytales of rejoining for a decade prior to 2014 left them in a ditch for seven years of war under the rule of small time criminals while focusing on Crimea. you'd be surprised what people will put up with when the other side is genocidal far right militias that western press considers 'special forces'
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Feb 16, 2022 22:33
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Regarde Aduck posted:you'd be surprised what people will put up with when the other side is genocidal far right militias that western press considers 'special forces' I have some bad news for you about the other side as well: Wagner Group, a mercenary which is employed by Russia in Ukraine, is also a far-right group with noted Nazis.
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Feb 16, 2022 22:41
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“Wars in Europe rarely start on a Wednesday,” Vladimir Chizhov told German newspaper Die Welt. “As far as Russia is concerned, I can assure you that there will be no attack this Wednesday,” he said, adding there would be “no escalation in the coming week either, or in the week after that, or in the coming months.”
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Feb 16, 2022 22:44
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Cpt_Obvious posted:There's been a bunch of reports of wealthy businessmen leaving the Ukraine for fear of invasion which makes sense because nobody wants to do business in a state about to rolled by tanks. All these expectations of war can only have a negative effect on the economy. Helpfully, the US is proposing that the Ukrainian government take out some loans to fix it. It's just "Ukraine," thanks.
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Feb 16, 2022 22:45
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Isn't that correct though? "the <adjective> government". I am gonna be honest, this whole "'the Ukraine' is a dogwhistle, use just 'Ukraine'" is really confusing to me.
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Feb 16, 2022 22:51
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Xarn posted:Isn't that correct though? "the <adjective> government". No, because 'The Ukraine' is treating it as a place rather than a country, and this has been something Russia has been subtly doing. Putin already made it clear he does not view Ukraine as a legitimate country, he feels that its a territory that must be subservient to Russian interests to that end they often repeatedly call Ukraine "the ukraine" CommieGIR fucked around with this message at 22:56 on Feb 16, 2022 |
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Feb 16, 2022 22:53
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CommieGIR posted:I have some bad news for you about the other side as well: Wagner Group, a mercenary which is employed by Russia in Ukraine, is also a far-right group with noted Nazis. Also, Putin's personal state funded biker gang.
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Feb 16, 2022 22:53
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I guess it’s hard for non-native English speakers? I’d say “the United States of America”, for example. Conversely, in Polish we’d say “jadę do Ukrainy” and not „na Ukrainę” because „do” is for countries and „na” is for regions, or something to that effect.
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Feb 16, 2022 22:57
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Xarn posted:Isn't that correct though? "the <adjective> government". My very poor understanding as someone who does not live in Eastern Europe, but had it explained to me by a Ukranian at one point, is that when Ukrane was a part of the USSR, it was referred to that way, because Ukrane means "bread basket" and it was where the food was grown. It's kind of like saying "The Midwest" if you're in the US. By continuing to call it that, you're basically saying Ukrane (the country) is actually The ukrane (region of Russia) in the same way you would say The midwest (region of the United States). Mokotow posted:I guess it’s hard for non-native English speakers? I’d say “the United States of America”, for example. Conversely, in Polish we’d say “jadę do Ukrainy” and not „na Ukrainę” because „do” is for countries and „na” is for regions, or something to that effect. The "The" in The United States of America is actually part of the name though. Nobody says "The France" or "The India"
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Feb 16, 2022 22:58
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Xarn posted:Isn't that correct though? "the <adjective> government". It’s correct to say “the Ukrainian legal system” or “the government of Ukraine”, since Ukraine is an adjective in those basically. What Ukrainian constitution takes issue with is calling country “the Ukraine”, as in “Tourists often visit the Ukraine in summer.”
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Feb 16, 2022 23:01
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Xarn posted:Isn't that correct though? "the <adjective> government". As for the US, it's similar to the UK, but not "the America" it "the Great Britain". I'm not a linguist, so I couldn't explain what English is doing there. But in those cases, people would just look at you weird, versus Ukraine, where it is explicitly used as a dog whistle.
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Feb 16, 2022 23:04
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