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I gotta say my Frost Spirit cooler has performed admirably. I've put an indecent amount of hours into Cyberpunk these past few days and never realized I was occasionally CPU bound because the cooler fans never made any noise. 100% CPU utilization for hours, and temps remained at 50C (900RPM). The two previous coolers made it abundantly clear when the CPU was being pushed, but not here. I'm recommending dual towers to everyone from here onwards. Spending $60 on a cooler seems like a lot, but that extra $30 can really make a difference in noise level (or better yet, buy one for $30).
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Feb 19, 2022 08:15
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careful with the new AMD bios https://www.tomshardware.com/news/agesa-1205-bugs-amd-ryzen
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Feb 19, 2022 15:31
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Are GPUs the only expensive items right now? My old PC has a 1080ti I was thinking about harvesting and just building something completely new with a modern CPU. Is AMD better than Intel now? My last CPU is a 7700k. I’d ideally like to rebuild everything from the ground up (new case, new mobo, new cpu…) except the GPU and upgrade that when prices are more sane and GPUs are better. Eyeing AMD since I’d like to consider streaming and I also occasionally use my desktop for programming.
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Feb 19, 2022 17:23
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no, AMD was beating intel until recently but 12th gen intel has taken the crown back. ddr4, b660 and a 12400 would be a big jump, 12600k and whatever the higher motherboard is if you are flush with cash. ddr5 is the only other component with significant availability problems abet tons of other things like cases have inflated quite a bit in response to tariffs and shipping cost escalation.
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Feb 19, 2022 17:27
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CoolCab posted:no, AMD was beating intel until recently but 12th gen intel has taken the crown back. ddr4, b660 and a 12400 would be a big jump, 12600k and whatever the higher motherboard is if you are flush with cash. Awesome, thank you! Is DDR5 worth it? Any recommended motherboards for DDR5 12th gen Intel?
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Feb 19, 2022 18:20
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sailormoon posted:Awesome, thank you! Is DDR5 worth it? Any recommended motherboards for DDR5 12th gen Intel? no, not right now. it will be in some point in future but right now it's like 3 or 4 times the price for comparable performance. CoolCab posted:the only thing that pops out at me is the DDR5, idk if you've already had this chat but right now DDR4 matches or even outperforms it in many tasks at a much lower cost. that's the nature of these generations, this was true back in the DDR3->DDR4 switch too. in time, i'd eyeball a few months to a year in normal conditions, DDR5 will getting better and DDR4 will slowly stop being made and as such eventually becomes more scarse (and obviously isn't improving). also, because this is the end of the generation DDR4 prices are at a nadir, so you can get the higher end kits for cheap. CoolCab posted:
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Feb 19, 2022 18:23
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i can't personally see the justification in going down the "buy expensive ddr5 and board now, upgrade the DDR5 when things get better" route. it's very very possible, although far from a lock, that the total cost would be more than the cost of going down the DDR4 route and buying an extra motherboard when you want to upgrade to ddr5. but in terms of price/performance i doubt either of them beat "buy ddr4 system and chip while it's relatively cheap, in two or three years upgrade everything to the next socket and resell what you have".
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Feb 19, 2022 18:27
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Is it normal for these 3 pin RGB plugs to basically have no locking mechanism? Feels like they'll fall out if the board gets bumped at all
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Feb 19, 2022 19:42
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Hi all. Decided it's finally time to upgrade my 10-year old 3570k setup. I've bought more storage since and a 5700XT a couple years ago, so have included those to get accurate power requirements. New parts would be CPU, cooler, mobo, memory and power supply. What country are you in? UK What are you using the system for? just gaming What's your budget? No real set budget If you're gaming, what is your monitor resolution / refresh rate? currently running a 144Mhz 1440p monitor Would I have any clearance issues with the heat spreaders on the memory? Timings on it are 16-19-19-39 which I think is ok? There's also this lower profile Corsair set for £5 more running at 16-19-19-36. Is 750W adequate for this? Part Picker has estimated requirements at 640W. What's a good LGA 1700-compatible CPU cooler these days? Might be doing some mild overclocking but nothing major. Was looking at the newer version of my current Cooler Master 212 but looks like the new LGA 1700-compatible model isn't available yet. I know I'm short a couple of SATA ports, so am thinking of getting one of those HBA PCI-e cards for the spinny disks. PCPartPicker Part List CPU: Intel Core i5-12600K 3.7 GHz 10-Core Processor (£263.99 @ Technextday) CPU Cooler: Cooler Master Hyper 212 Black Edition 42 CFM CPU Cooler (£32.99 @ Amazon UK) Motherboard: MSI PRO Z690-A DDR4 ATX LGA1700 Motherboard (£177.41 @ CCL Computers) Memory: G.Skill Ripjaws V 32 GB (2 x 16 GB) DDR4-3600 CL16 Memory (£149.49 @ Amazon UK) Storage: Samsung 830 Series 256 GB 2.5" Solid State Drive Storage: Samsung 860 Evo 1 TB 2.5" Solid State Drive (£138.00 @ Amazon UK) Storage: Samsung 870 QVO 4 TB 2.5" Solid State Drive (£278.00 @ Amazon UK) Storage: Seagate BarraCuda Compute 8 TB 3.5" 5400RPM Internal Hard Drive (£155.32 @ Newegg UK) Storage: Western Digital Caviar Blue 1 TB 3.5" 7200RPM Internal Hard Drive (£34.43 @ Amazon UK) Storage: Samsung Spinpoint F3 1 TB 3.5" 7200RPM Internal Hard Drive Video Card: PowerColor Radeon RX 5700 XT 8 GB Red Devil Video Card Power Supply: SeaSonic FOCUS GX 750 W 80+ Gold Certified Fully Modular ATX Power Supply (£79.99 @ Scan.co.uk) Optical Drive: Lite-On iHAS124-14 DVD/CD Writer (£15.76 @ CCL Computers) Case Fan: Corsair ML120 75 CFM 120 mm Fans 2-Pack (£22.99 @ Amazon UK) Case Fan: Corsair ML120 75 CFM 120 mm Fans 2-Pack (£22.99 @ Amazon UK) Total: £1554.65 Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available Generated by PCPartPicker 2022-02-19 18:35 GMT+0000
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Feb 19, 2022 20:04
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Carpet posted:Hi all. Decided it's finally time to upgrade my 10-year old 3570k setup. I've bought more storage since and a 5700XT a couple years ago, so have included those to get accurate power requirements. I understand the desire to just upgrade some components and leave as much as possible but a new case would be easier to build in than almost any 10 year old one. I'd consider an NVMe disk as your main drive for the system so you can remove some of the smaller SSDs (well mostly the 830, it's tiny and not really holding much data at this point). Maybe get another large hard disk to remove the 1tb hard drives, they're ancient and small so you shouldn't have to plan your build around them. For the main disk you could just make the 860 EVO your boot disk but if you're upgrading, then a 1 TB or 2 TB NVMe drive isn't a bad idea if it's in your budget. Moving bulk storage to a second system like a NAS (or turning your old machine into a NAS) would minimize the number of disks you have in there. You could have the samsung 830 be the NAS boot drive and the 8tb (or two) be for bulk data and backups. It's just an idea but I understand it would add to the pricing and you may not want a second system running. As for the specific choices, I'd definitely get a bigger cooler. 12th Gen CPUs run pretty hot and the Hyper 212 okay but limited. Something like a Scythe Fuma 2 would be a better buy. The power supply should be fine.
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Feb 19, 2022 21:01
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How strict is everyone about finding specific model numbers of RAM on the supported memory list for motherboards? The motherboards I'm looking at really don't list a lot of CAS 16. Is that me needing to look at higher-end boards, or are those lists never really used?
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Feb 19, 2022 21:32
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Carpet posted:Hi all. Decided it's finally time to upgrade my 10-year old 3570k setup. I've bought more storage since and a 5700XT a couple years ago, so have included those to get accurate power requirements. Kinda curious what you’re using it for that 8 TB HDD + 4 TB SSD space still needs another 3.25TB on top 
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Feb 19, 2022 21:40
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Shear Modulus posted:Is it normal for these 3 pin RGB plugs to basically have no locking mechanism? Feels like they'll fall out if the board gets bumped at all All of my connectors fit in so snuggly that there’s no way they’d fall out on their own.
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Feb 19, 2022 21:42
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sailormoon posted:Are GPUs the only expensive items right now? My old PC has a 1080ti I was thinking about harvesting and just building something completely new with a modern CPU. Nearly everything is at least a little bit more expensive right now than it otherwise would be due to higher-than-usual demand, the global shipping crisis, and various component shortages, but graphics cards are the only items that are truly painful to buy. You might be getting nickled and dimed out of a total of $100 when adding up all of your other components, but the 3070 by itself is gonna run you $250 over the launch MSRP. If you live near a Micro Center, you can figure out what days they restock GPUs at (they usually post it on their doors) and then show up before opening on those days to be put in a randomized queue for GPU buying. Then you'll be able to purchase a variety of GPUs that will be priced from anywhere between 30 - 100% over launch MSRP, depending on how dumb the particular model is (the double MSRP models are thankfully not too common). If you don't live near a micro center or don't have the time to do this, then your next best option for buying a GPU is from bundles. Newegg and AntOnline are selling bundles. Consider what kinds of builds you can make with these before buying everything but the GPU and leaving yourself in a situation where it no longer makes sense to purchase a bundle. Most of the newegg bundles aren't something I'd recommend (because they come with overpriced or trashy motherboards), and nobody's currently bundling 12th-gen intel motherboards with GPUs (presumably because those actually sell on their own just fine). The Asus bundles with the B550-F Strix and X570 Tuf Gaming motherboards may make the most sense because even though the Intel is better now, you can still put together a pretty good Ryzen system for a bit less. Certainly though, the best bang for your buck you can buy right now will be an Intel 12th gen system, and then you'll be waiting for individual GPUs to become cheaper and easier to buy like everyone else. Being stubborn about not getting ripped off or having to compromise on your component selection is perhaps the smartest move right now.
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Feb 19, 2022 21:43
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So, my old desktop (circa 2015) has apparently given up the ghost after a power outage. I have replaced the power supply already and tried to boot it again -- no dice! It was probably about time I built a new one anyway; taking this as an excuse to do so. I'm operating under the assumption I can reuse my hard drive -- hoping I can, anyway, as there's stuff on there I would like to recover -- and the optical drive I barely ever used, as well as the power supply I already bought. Everything else I'm willing to replace, especially considering I was able to find a compatible video card that's a decent upgrade over my old one for only a couple hundred bucks -- not nearly as bad as I assumed! My only other real constraint is that to fit into the little slide-out compartment in my desk the case has to be about 14.75" tall at most. My last setup was in a Cooler Master N200 (I'd like a different one this time, to differentiate it mentally) and just barely fit. The case I picked this time around should be fine if I don't put the "legs" on it. The part I'm most unsure about is the motherboard -- the ones that are compatible with the case I picked don't have many user reviews, and PCPartPicker keeps giving me vague warnings about how the CPU cooler may or may not require an adapter, which isn't reassuring. What country are you in? USA What are you using the system for? Moderate gaming; a little sound/video editing when the mood takes me but nothing serious or professional-grade. I have coded on my home PC before, but currently have a work laptop. What's your budget? Less than $1K ideally If you're gaming, what is your monitor resolution / refresh rate? Got one of these things. 1920 x 1080, 0.5ms, 165Hz. PCPartPicker Part List CPU: Intel Core i5-12400F 2.5 GHz 6-Core Processor ($184.99 @ B&H) CPU Cooler: Scythe FUMA 2 51.17 CFM CPU Cooler ($59.99 @ Amazon) Motherboard: Asus PRIME H610M-E D4 Micro ATX LGA1700 Motherboard ($117.74 @ Amazon) Memory: G.Skill Ripjaws V 16 GB (2 x 8 GB) DDR4-3600 CL16 Memory ($77.99 @ Newegg) Video Card: Asus GeForce GTX 1050 Ti 4 GB Phoenix Video Card ($255.15 @ Amazon) Case: Fractal Design Focus G Mini MicroATX Mini Tower Case ($63.98 @ Newegg) Power Supply: Corsair CXM (2015) 450 W 80+ Bronze Certified Semi-modular ATX Power Supply ($55.99 @ Amazon) <-- this one I have, again, already bought Total: $815.83 Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available Generated by PCPartPicker 2022-02-19 17:48 EST-0500
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Feb 20, 2022 00:01
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loquacius posted:So, my old desktop (circa 2015) has apparently given up the ghost after a power outage. I have replaced the power supply already and tried to boot it again -- no dice! It was probably about time I built a new one anyway; taking this as an excuse to do so. lurker2006 fucked around with this message at 01:03 on Feb 20, 2022 |
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Feb 20, 2022 00:28
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Paying $255 for a 1050 Ti makes little sense when the 1650 costs $260 at Newegg (or $10 more for one with a heatpipe cooler, which will be quieter). Or the 6500 XT, which is fraught with problems on older systems, but on a PCIe 4.0 system like the one being built), it should be better than the 1050 Ti or 1650 by a decent margin. I honestly don't like spending that much money on any of those cards, but if you must, then make sure you're getting the best card for your money.
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Feb 20, 2022 01:15
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Thanks a lot, guys, that's good intel! My new list: PCPartPicker Part List CPU: Intel Core i5-12400F 2.5 GHz 6-Core Processor ($184.99 @ B&H) CPU Cooler: Scythe FUMA 2 51.17 CFM CPU Cooler ($59.99 @ Amazon) Motherboard: MSI PRO B660M-A DDR4 Micro ATX LGA1700 Motherboard ($139.99 @ Newegg) Memory: G.Skill Ripjaws V 16 GB (2 x 8 GB) DDR4-3600 CL16 Memory ($77.99 @ Newegg) Video Card: ASRock Radeon RX 6500 XT 4 GB Phantom Gaming D OC Video Card ($268.98 @ Newegg) Case: Fractal Design Focus G Mini MicroATX Mini Tower Case ($63.98 @ Newegg) Power Supply: Corsair CXM (2015) 450 W 80+ Bronze Certified Semi-modular ATX Power Supply ($55.99 @ Amazon) Total: $851.91 Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available Generated by PCPartPicker 2022-02-19 19:28 EST-0500 The one issue is with the motherboard as it relates to the power supply: quote:Note:The MSI PRO B660M-A DDR4 Micro ATX LGA1700 Motherboard has an additional 4-pin ATX power connector but the Corsair CXM (2015) 450 W 80+ Bronze Certified Semi-modular ATX Power Supply does not. This connector is used to supply additional 12V current to the motherboard. While the system will likely still run without it, higher current demands such as extreme overclocking or large video card current draws may require it. The power supply is already here, since I tried putting it in my old setup as a last-ditch effort to boot it, so I can't switch it out without doing a whole return song and dance. Is this enough of an issue that I should get a different motherboard? I'm not gonna overclock or anything but I don't know what qualifies as a "large video card current draw". loquacius fucked around with this message at 01:32 on Feb 20, 2022 |
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Feb 20, 2022 01:30
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yeah there are some colossal, colossal problems with the 6500 but you dodged most of them. what about that encoding or decoding thing? I don't fully understand it but if it's like twitch streaming could you offload to to the CPU?
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Feb 20, 2022 02:19
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Yeah nothing professional or anything. That was an afterthought, really. What kind of risks am I looking at using a 6500 on this kind of setup, though? Is it safer to just take a performance hit and go with one of the 1650s, or are the risks more along the lines of the performance being about the same when it should be better?
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Feb 20, 2022 02:33
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loquacius posted:Yeah nothing professional or anything. That was an afterthought, really. What kind of risks am I looking at using a 6500 on this kind of setup, though? Is it safer to just take a performance hit and go with one of the 1650s, or are the risks more along the lines of the performance being about the same when it should be better? The first of the two biggest issues with the 6500 XT is that it has only 4 PCIe lanes instead of the standard 16. This means that when its limited VRAM buffer is exceeded (4GB, like the 1650 and 1050 Ti), the process of swapping data from system memory to VRAM is slower than usual, which can bottleneck performance. In practice, this isn't a big issue with PCIe 4.0 systems since they have enough per-lane bandwidth. Sticking to 1080p also makes it less of an issue. It should only rarely be an issue for you, and when it is turning down texture detail or something will resolve it. According to reviews, with this issue taken into account, the 6500 XT is still 33% faster than the 1650 (which is 25% faster than the 1050 Ti). The other issue, which I honestly forgot, was that it lacks hardware video encode/decode. CPU decoding is typically pretty fast on modern CPUs though, so I don't see that being an issue. The lack of GPU encoding means your video encoding may be slower than before, but if you had a really old GPU before then maybe not, actually. Dr. Video Games 0031 fucked around with this message at 02:48 on Feb 20, 2022 |
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Feb 20, 2022 02:45
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loquacius posted:Yeah nothing professional or anything. That was an afterthought, really. What kind of risks am I looking at using a 6500 on this kind of setup, though? Is it safer to just take a performance hit and go with one of the 1650s, or are the risks more along the lines of the performance being about the same when it should be better? it's not a risk persay, and these are all big jumps over the 1050ti. the card runs super lovely on motherboards and CPUs, mostly older ones but some current ones, which only support PCIE gen 3, which is most existing systems. on a total new build it's much, much better than on an even slightly older one. 12th gen supports it. there's a lot of ill will over it because it's a very rough way to cut cost, particularly since it makes it much worse on the midrange or older low end gear it might want to be slotted into. but here it's optimal like dr vg said. it also has less features than many existing cards in terms of encoding which is what i was alluding to, i don't quite fully understand it but it may make it less useful for either streaming or watching high end video content, where the task instead will need to done by the CPU? i am very murky here. 4gb of vram is rough, and will limit you in some places. but i mean it's an entry level product (even though the cost seems resistant to that idea) and it's still afaik better than a 1050ti.
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Feb 20, 2022 02:46
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Don’t know if it matters to you, but it also has only 2 video outputs
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Feb 20, 2022 02:47
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For most users (who don't stream) the most obvious loss from the 6500s lack of video encoder is that ReLive straight up won't work No DVR capture for games
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Feb 20, 2022 02:50
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I had a 970 before. Would encoding be about the same? Also I only have two monitors so two outputs should be fine.
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Feb 20, 2022 03:10
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Also, anyone know what to make of the warning PCPartPicker gave me about the motherboard's power connection? That's really my major remaining anxiety point.
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Feb 20, 2022 03:11
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loquacius posted:I had a 970 before. Would encoding be about the same? No, the 970 did have a dedicated hardware encoder for low-overhead recording With the 6500 you go back to the dark ages of chewing up significant CPU time whenever you record your gameplay
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Feb 20, 2022 03:12
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loquacius posted:Also, anyone know what to make of the warning PCPartPicker gave me about the motherboard's power connection? That's really my major remaining anxiety point. Oh yeah, that's going to be a problem. I would get something newer. Something like this: https://pcpartpicker.com/product/R2mxFT/corsair-power-supply-cp9020103na Or this would be better for about $10 more than what you chose (full modularity, quieter operation): https://pcpartpicker.com/product/2HbwrH/corsair-rmx-2018-650w-80-gold-certified-fully-modular-atx-power-supply-cp-9020178-na
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Feb 20, 2022 03:19
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Dr. Video Games 0031 posted:Oh yeah, that's going to be a problem. I would get something newer. Something like this: https://pcpartpicker.com/product/R2mxFT/corsair-power-supply-cp9020103na Both of those are giving me the same warning, it looks like.
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Feb 20, 2022 03:34
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My motherboard gave me a warning about connections when I was planning my current system, I think it's just one of those things PC Part Picker can't figure out on its own. It's warning about an 8-pin power connection right?
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Feb 20, 2022 03:40
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loquacius posted:Both of those are giving me the same warning, it looks like. Oh, I see what it's saying now. It's warning you because there are two 4-pin connectors and those power supplies only come with one. Yeah, it's 100% fine, don't sweat it. I'd still get the 650W CXM instead of the 450W one though. Just for future upgrade compatibility if nothing else. Also, wait, are you 100% sure your 970 is dead? You called the 1050 ti a decent upgrade over your old GPU so I thought you had something worse. Just to be clear: The 1050 Ti would've been a heavy downgrade over the 970, and the 6500 XT is just a little bit faster. If you can test the 970 in any way, then I would just keep that if it's still working. The 6500 XT would not be a good upgrade for the money.
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Feb 20, 2022 03:49
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Hm. I have no earthly idea whether the GPU works or not. The old system straight-up does not boot. I don't really have a good sense for graphics cards, really -- I know they need to be relatively up-to-date to run a lot of games and crunch numbers on encoding/decoding, and that they're ridiculously expensive these days, but that's about all. If the budget cards I found really aren't a significant upgrade, I'll try sticking with the old one for now and see if it's fried. Thanks 
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Feb 20, 2022 03:59
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(to be painfully clear I thought the 1050 was better because it is a bigger number than 970 lol) It looks like my old card now costs seven hundred freaking dollars, though whether that's because it's good or because it's rare on account of being old I don't even know
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Feb 20, 2022 04:02
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loquacius posted:Hm. I have no earthly idea whether the GPU works or not. The old system straight-up does not boot. I don't really have a good sense for graphics cards, really -- I know they need to be relatively up-to-date to run a lot of games and crunch numbers on encoding/decoding, and that they're ridiculously expensive these days, but that's about all. If the budget cards I found really aren't a significant upgrade, I'll try sticking with the old one for now and see if it's fried. Thanks
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Feb 20, 2022 04:02
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loquacius posted:(to be painfully clear I thought the 1050 was better because it is a bigger number than 970 lol) Rare. Used it’s closer to $150-$200, probably less now.
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Feb 20, 2022 04:03
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If I wanted to list this MSI 1060 3gb OCv1 card in SAmart or somewhere, what would be a fair price? 150 or so? I could stand to recoup some money from my upgrade, but don't want to make a goon pay too close to the full rip off prices of the current market.
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Feb 20, 2022 04:20
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FlamingLiberal posted:Do you have a mobo with error lights Don't believe so. It's an ASRock H97M PRO4.
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Feb 20, 2022 04:23
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did you try clearing cmos out of curiousity
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Feb 20, 2022 04:26
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Nnnnnope. I asked in the hardware questions thread and "try replacing the power supply first" was the most specific advice I got. I'll give it a try tomorrow before I go spending $800 I guess (or $600 if I end up not replacing the GPU). Either way this is all great advice, thanks guys!
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Feb 20, 2022 04:32
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your 450w psu is actually 50w below the recommended spec for the 970, it's still probably enough to get by but you should just get a gold plus 650 or 750 watt to cover any future upgrades you might make.
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Feb 20, 2022 07:00
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