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Oxyclean
Sep 23, 2007


Oh, for sure, I guess I just wanted to point out it was happening again lol.

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Bust Rodd
Oct 21, 2008

by VideoGames
I’m sure they are doing intentionally because they loving hate you sniveling little worms and it has nothing to do with how easy the changes are to implement or test

Paracelsus
Apr 6, 2009

bless this post ~kya
Some of the seasonal gear, notably the pulse and machine gun, feels surprisingly good and light to shoot. I haven't enjoyed a rapid-fire LMG like this since 21% Delirium.

The Fugue sniper also feels better than most of its peers.

haveblue
Aug 15, 2005



Toilet Rascal
Ironic because they put a quest in the game about hating a sniveling little worm and it's pretty good!

Oxyclean
Sep 23, 2007


I haven't used many rapid pulses since Claws of the Wolf - the season pulse feels quite good in PVP.

Bust Rodd posted:

I’m sure they are doing intentionally because they loving hate you sniveling little worms and it has nothing to do with how easy the changes are to implement or test
I mean, I get that, but it doesn't change the user experience. At the same time, I have to imagine they could have doubled drops or increased drop rate of guns in Wellspring just as easily as they can disable very specific loot chests?

Verdugo
Jan 5, 2009


Lipstick Apathy

heated game moment posted:

I'd probably do loot cave for a primary weapon and Shuro for Special/Power ammo weapon.

When you guys are saying loot cave, is it something in patrol? Because outside of Shuro Chi I can't find anything else.

haveblue
Aug 15, 2005



Toilet Rascal

Verdugo posted:

When you guys are saying loot cave, is it something in patrol? Because outside of Shuro Chi I can't find anything else.

The cave at the beginning of Grasp of Avarice, where infinite enemies spawn until you deposit engrams and unlock the entrance. Which is not coincidentally the exact same location as the original loot cave in the first Destiny. Requires you to own the 30th Anniversary expansion

Verdugo
Jan 5, 2009


Lipstick Apathy
Thanks! I have the 30th pack but haven't really looked at the dungeon. Time to check it out.

xzzy
Mar 5, 2009

Only thing to keep in mind with the loot cave is the engrams eventually explode and start a massive chain reaction of thrall getting obliterated by the refuse of other thrall. So you can't just unload into the cave, eventually the engrams will steal all your kills.

You kinda gotta hang back behind the hive mace thing and let them spread out and chase you down.

GoGoGadgetChris
Mar 18, 2010

i powder a
granite monument
in a soundless flash

showering the grass
with molten drops of
its gold inlay

sending smoking
chips of stone
skipping into the fog

RBX posted:

Everything they said is true? I'm not understanding? I'm sounding like a member of the Bungie defense force but what there isn't in game?

Don't get me wrong, it's all completely "true". I just assumed the system would be good and something most players want to engage with. They never made any such promise though.

Bobby Deluxe
May 9, 2004

Also buried in the patch notes to answer an earlier GGGC question:

quote:

Fixed The Ragnhild-D shotgun to display the correct zoom.

Paracelsus
Apr 6, 2009

bless this post ~kya

Bobby Deluxe posted:

Also buried in the patch notes to answer an earlier GGGC question:

So were the reports of super-good OHKO ranges just confirmation bias?

Bobby Deluxe
May 9, 2004

Paracelsus posted:

So were the reports of super-good OHKO ranges just confirmation bias?
No idea, I just know it was something that was mentioned a page or so ago that the listed zoom would give it an obscene range.

Majere
Oct 22, 2005

by Fluffdaddy

(and can't post for 11 years!)

Bust Rodd posted:

The plot of this season and Splicer has really cemented in my mind that the Traveler is a metaphysical parasite that finds a “host” world and then basically dumps out its little sporecloud of ghosts to mutate the local fauna into an army of tiny little zombie wizards that will doggedly and relentlessly protect the big magic corcle that gives them magic laser beams and lets them fly. The Darkness and the Light seem to be two sides of the same paracausal tendency, functioning as a push/pull for energy to be distributed or dissipated as needed, but The Witness & The Traveler are specific entities with motives and agendas that we maybe can’t ever fully comprehend because it’s impossible for our brains to contain multiple dimensions and timelines at once. We won’t ever be able to understand why The Traveler and the Witness are doing what they are doing because they are moving and thinking and existing both in this world as physical entities with magic powers, but also existing in other planes of existence as, like, basically an idea or a theme given shapeless power, either from within or (terrifying to consider) an even more unknowable and shapeless paracausal entity from which both The Traveler and The Witness were derived

There's a whole lot of lore about the Gardener and the Winnower. Assumed to be immutable forces beyond comprehension and our universe. Most likely characterizations of entropy, and the origins of the Vex. I don't know if it's ever specifically stated that the Traveler IS the Gardener or an agent/physical manifestation there of. And now we have the Witness who may or may not be the Winnower from the lore or another actor carrying out the goal of total entropy.

On the grand scale it boils down to Order and Disorder. Disorder being life and free choice, Order being an even void. Not necessarily Good or Evil as your point of view can change from either side. The Vex got their name from the Winnower because it could not eliminate their pattern from creation. It always spontaneously emerged from the void. The worms being agents of Evil used the Krill to further the Winnowers plans of eliminating troublesome "Life" from the universe(which they did with great success), much like our new Witness character using the Black Fleet of pyramid ships. The Traveler seems to float around making sure civilizations survive, helping them in different ways, known or not, bestowing powers, or not. You could argue that the Traveler is evil for abandoning the Fallen, but they still survived. Savathun's goal has always been the continuation of her species, but as we know now the Darkness just got there first and told her that the only way for that was to kill everything else. The Traveler will never pass a chance to keep another civilization alive, especially if Savathun embraces the light. Whether the Krill/Hive continue to be Evil or switch to Good is irrelevant, as long as they survive.

We just happen to be at a point where both entities(and the Nine) are looking at the same place/time for some reason.

When are we getting new darkness classes?! I assume it's not until after they finish reworking Solar and Arc this year...

Junkenstein
Oct 22, 2003

RBX posted:

I never expected to be able to only have literally one gun with every perk to switch between. They never hinted at that and why would they do that?

I never expected it and they never SAID that's how it would work, but this sure hinted that it could be as good as that:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jzTQJzJ6TG4&t=7s



I like the seasonal pulse and WANT to grind it, but I need another FOUR loving red bordered versions to drop. I think it's that layer of RNG on a system that's supposed to make RNG irrelevant that's really annoying me at the moment.

RBX
Jan 2, 2011

It's also been a week, did to think they'd just give everybody God rolls in less than a week? They said they'd patch drops rates anyway.

J.A.B.C.
Jul 2, 2007

There's no need to rush to be an adult.


Roctavian posted:

The issue I am running into with the weapon crafting system: I got a really fun random drop for Red Herring -- impact casing, tracking module, lasting impact -- and I'd love to try it out with enhanced perks.

However, I am not so interested in this rocket launcher that I want to use a version of it WITHOUT all those perks, in order to get the better ones.

So I'm just never going to. I have so many other good rocket launchers, and there will be more good rocket launchers in my future.

This kinda hits it for me, too. That and patterns are super-grindy to get. Still haven't even seen a Tarnation yet, so that quest is just there forever, like the harbinger feathers.

I can understand it from a design aspect: you have a gun that feels great to shoot and matches your build, you take it with you and grow more familiar, you then boost it to make it better than it was before. Helping an old friend out, in a sense, for a stronger identity with your weapons. But as they have it now, it's painful to basically start all over with a favorite weapon when you have a godroll on deck that you can use instead.

If XP increased across weapons with that pattern (perhaps at a reduced rate) and they adjust pattern drops to be more common, that might help with the issue.

Pirate Jet
May 2, 2010

RBX posted:

It's also been a week, did to think they'd just give everybody God rolls in less than a week? They said they'd patch drops rates anyway.

It's been a week and I'm already sick of this argument!

Pirate Jet posted:

I used The Enigma from the second I crafted it to the end of Witch Queen’s campaign and only got it to level 7 out of 15. Assuming later levels require more kills/activity completions, I’m not even halfway done unlocking perks on it, maybe not even a third. All that for one weapon out of the hundreds in the game makes it feel like a reasonable complaint to me.

Getting your ideal roll on a weapon through crafting requires enough of it to randomly drop with Deepsight for you to be able to craft it, then the resources needed to craft it (which could include the currently ultra-rare Ascendant Alloys,) then you need to grind kills with it that eclipse any, say, Exotic catalyst by tenfold to be able to unlock the perks you want, and then you don't even get to respec without spending everything all over again. In a game where part of the main appeal is that it has hundreds of weapons, it's not ridiculous to say that requiring all of this for one of them is unreasonable. I spent the week since Witch Queen launched grinding up a Ragnhild because of its great zoom and now they're saying it's a bug, so that week of grinding is just wasted. Imagine when they nerf perks that people spent tens of hours grinding Master story missions and Shuro Chi for!

GoGoGadgetChris
Mar 18, 2010

i powder a
granite monument
in a soundless flash

showering the grass
with molten drops of
its gold inlay

sending smoking
chips of stone
skipping into the fog
And there's no incentive to reshape it at levels 2, 3, 4, etc on your way up to 20. It's all about enduring that dead weight gun (or switching to it at the end of an activity, which is something bungie really regretted with the Eriana Catalyst quest) until it hits max rank and you can get your desired Godroll for only 1x payment instead of paying in full for each reshape

Coldforge
Oct 29, 2002

I knew it would be bad.
I didn't know it would be so stupid.

GoGoGadgetChris posted:

And there's no incentive to reshape it at levels 2, 3, 4, etc on your way up to 20. It's all about enduring that dead weight gun (or switching to it at the end of an activity, which is something bungie really regretted with the Eriana Catalyst quest) until it hits max rank and you can get your desired Godroll for only 1x payment instead of paying in full for each reshape

Unless you're buying the enhanced perks, the "in full" cost of a perk is usually a couple hundred neutral and twenty-ish of some other element. That's hardly crushing. You might as well switch to something good along the way to 20.

DarkDobe
Jul 11, 2008

Things are looking up...

Crafting didn't need 4 materials that extract based on the perk.
(There's at least 4? Might be more but you cant even see them in your inventory)
I've just been randomly picking which one to pull out of red guns and hoping they turn out useful when one day a year from now I have that red herring maxxed.

life_source
May 11, 2008

i got tired of looking at your edgy baby avatar that a 14-year old would be proud of
If you scroll over a particular perk on a gun it shows you what you will get from it if you extract and how much you have already.

Weapon Crafting needs to get updated like Transmog did and have at least one level of the grind removed.

Kalli
Jun 2, 2001



I wonder if it'd work better if you leveled up the gun by name instead of the specific gun. Like you're not leveling up a crafted Piece of Mind, you're leveling up every Piece of Mind, and you can just craft them with better perks as your level increases.

It'd also give you a way to work towards the harder to craft guns before opening them.

Grimthwacker
Aug 7, 2014

The Glaive fits a weird niche of being a kind of "all-purpose" weapon, but it tends out of juice pretty quickly and you can't use your melee ability while wielding it. I get what it's going for, and it's effective, but I can't see myself using it that often let alone building around it. Nice to have, but surprisingly situational, especially when you've built up a reliable arsenal.

Also, is the quest kinda bugged? I did what it wanted, slapped an enhanced trait on it and reshaped it, but it's still bugging me to do the thing I just did.

DarkDobe
Jul 11, 2008

Things are looking up...

life_source posted:

If you scroll over a particular perk on a gun it shows you what you will get from it if you extract and how much you have already.

Weapon Crafting needs to get updated like Transmog did and have at least one level of the grind removed.

Sure, but short of going back to the station I don't know what perk NEEDS what mat - there's no consistency to it that I've seen.
Is it a set of two for the third column and another pair for the fourth? Can it be any material in any column perk?
It's needlessly convoluted and that layer of material hoarding is loving pointless, especially if you get screwed and none of the red guns you find drop that specific one (since it's a 50/50) chance, presumably.

PERMACAV 50
Jul 24, 2007

because we are cat

Grimthwacker posted:

The Glaive fits a weird niche of being a kind of "all-purpose" weapon, but it tends out of juice pretty quickly and you can't use your melee ability while wielding it. I get what it's going for, and it's effective, but I can't see myself using it that often let alone building around it. Nice to have, but surprisingly situational, especially when you've built up a reliable arsenal.

Also, is the quest kinda bugged? I did what it wanted, slapped an enhanced trait on it and reshaped it, but it's still bugging me to do the thing I just did.

You need to put on an enhanced frame, it’s the big white box on the far left.

Doctor_Acula
May 24, 2011
Perhaps one of you folks can help me out.

I thought maybe my Trust Goes Both Ways was bugged - it just sat at 2/3 chests for days, and it kept pinging Fynch like i needed to talk to him (despite him having nothing for me).
I abandoned the quest figuring I'd just restart it, and Fynch still pings and won't do anything.

Mesadoram
Nov 4, 2009

Serious Business
Anyone know if High Fire Energy buffs the damage of wave frame grenade launchers (like Dead Messenger)?

filmcynic
Oct 30, 2012

Junkenstein posted:

I like the seasonal pulse and WANT to grind it, but I need another FOUR loving red bordered versions to drop. I think it's that layer of RNG on a system that's supposed to make RNG irrelevant that's really annoying me at the moment.

I've been trying to keep focused crafting on the back burner and am just gathering materials/swapping grindable weapons until the next few war table upgrades open up. The unlock that guarantees a red border drop on the first engram of each week should help things a bit.

Kesper North
Nov 3, 2011

EMERGENCY POWER TO PARTY

Mazerunner posted:

The Traveler doesn't know the future, it doesn't know what people will do with the Light. To some extent I'm not even sure it can make plans, because those are essentially, of the Darkness (the excising of the infinite potential ways things could be in favour of the one design most advantageous for the planner). It just kind of... does things as "this is new/interesting".

The Traveler as meme dog: NO PLAN ONLY MAKE

Evilgm
Dec 31, 2014
My issue with the crafting is that if it's intended to take half a season to get the five drops of the Machine Gun that I want, then why the hell did I get capped on the Element materials three days in? My vault is now filled with fully levelled Deepsight guns because I'm capped on Elements which can only go to 250 and Resonant Alloys which are capped at 80 while I need 2000 Neutral Elements to upgrade one perk. It feels like the caps are missing a zero from their limit.

Zedsdeadbaby
Jun 14, 2008

You have been called out, in the ways of old.
Bungos way of saying craft more things

It's particularly egregious that you can choose to extract an element you're maxed out on but the game won't tell you this which seems spiteful to me

Kith
Sep 17, 2009

You never learn anything
by doing it right.


i'd love to craft more things

IF I HAD THEIR loving PATTERNS

harrygomm
Oct 19, 2004

can u run n jump?
.

harrygomm fucked around with this message at 20:40 on Jun 22, 2022

Mazerunner
Apr 22, 2010

Good Hunter, what... what is this post?

Zedsdeadbaby posted:

Bungos way of saying craft more things

It's particularly egregious that you can choose to extract an element you're maxed out on but the game won't tell you this which seems spiteful to me

yes it does

xzzy
Mar 5, 2009

It's more likely they bolted crafting into a game that previously had no concept of crafting so there are a dozen rough edges because the code base is an unmanaged mess so it's going to take them ten years to smooth out all the quirks.

Collateral Damage
Jun 13, 2009

harrygomm posted:

is there somewhere i can see the effect of each tier of all the stats? going from 20 to 30 int for instance gives a bigger reduction than 40 to 50 but i want to be able to see all tiers without having to futz around in game with gear
https://d2armorpicker.com/ shows it if you hover over each tier in the stat picker.

Turra
Oct 28, 2006

Help! A guinea pig tricked me.

DarkDobe posted:

Sure, but short of going back to the station I don't know what perk NEEDS what mat - there's no consistency to it that I've seen.
Is it a set of two for the third column and another pair for the fourth? Can it be any material in any column perk?
It's needlessly convoluted and that layer of material hoarding is loving pointless, especially if you get screwed and none of the red guns you find drop that specific one (since it's a 50/50) chance, presumably.

You only need neutral element for regular perks. Only enhanced perks require the extra flavours, and those are a big investment for a small gain, like grinding for an Adept weapon. There is a method to the element types:

Mesadoram
Nov 4, 2009

Serious Business
Is the Qualichor bugged? I did one refined chest, but not the item doesn't do anything (like turn it into another refined).

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Meiteron
Apr 4, 2008

Whoa! You're gonna be a legend!

Grimthwacker posted:

The Glaive fits a weird niche of being a kind of "all-purpose" weapon, but it tends out of juice pretty quickly and you can't use your melee ability while wielding it. I get what it's going for, and it's effective, but I can't see myself using it that often let alone building around it. Nice to have, but surprisingly situational, especially when you've built up a reliable arsenal.

Also, is the quest kinda bugged? I did what it wanted, slapped an enhanced trait on it and reshaped it, but it's still bugging me to do the thing I just did.

It feels good when you're using it but I've noticed pretty quickly that about 99% of what I use the glaive for comes entirely from seasonal mods - unstoppables, suppression, invisibility triggers, volatile rounds. When this season goes away there's going to be no reason to use this thing - the damage is just too low given it's intrinsic features like the projectile, magazine, fire rate; the shield is entirely superfluous; it's melee does nothing to counteract the disadvantages of being in melee range even in middling endgame content, let alone the really difficult stuff. In pretty much all difficult activities (again excluding seasonal mods) it brings nothing of value to the table.

Without the current mods, I need this thing to be baseline DPS of a fusion rifle, minimum, to merit the slot. It's not. I'm not entirely confident Bungie will make that kind of buff to it either, which is unfortunate, because they are pretty cool.

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