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Gonzo McFee posted:More people should become Scottish. What else are you gonna be? Welsh? That's no even a real thing. I kind of wish the LOTR linguists had stuck to their guns and got peter jackson to leave the elves with welsh accents, you can sort of hear it in the first bit with Elrond and Isildur. Failed Imagineer posted:
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Mar 4, 2022 15:40
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Camrath posted:Accents are weird. I was born and raised in North London to wealthy professional parents, and ended up sounding as posh as bloody royalty despite neither of them talking like that. Hell, I used to get bullied at the public school I attended for being ‘too posh’ This is almost exactly me. I grew up in leafy rural Hampshire, but both my (wealthy professional) parents are from suburban London (Mum from Norf, Dad from southwest) and have entirely unremarkable modern BBC newsreader-type accents. Mum's parents were both relocated East Enders with accents to match, while Dad's family seems to have been upper middle class for all of recorded history - his Dad looked and talked like Willie Rushton and his mum had one of those preposterously clear-cut Victorian RP accents. So I've somehow ended up with an accent straight out of a Pathe newsreel. When I was single-digit aged I had a proper Wessex/Hampshire Hog ('ampshoyer 'awwg) accent (presumably from spending time at nursery and primary school with local kids) but then it disappeared to be replaced by one from 1955. My Wessex burr ("it's a foin noight...") comes back if I'm drunk and my partner has noticed that I pick up a slight hint of it if we spend a few weeks with the family down in Devon and Cornwall.
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Mar 4, 2022 15:40
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Reveilled posted:I've always found the "glasgow uni accent" thing a bit mystifying because I've heard lots of references to it but don't think I've ever actually heard it, unless it's just a new name for "west end accent". I've got a fairly typical west end accent, but when I was briefly at uni I don't think any of my friends spoke with the same accent as I had unless they were specifically from the west end, and my current D&D group which is almost entirely Glasgow Uni alumni mostly just sound like the places they're from: Edinburgh, Australia, the highlands. You're probably right that the Glasgow Uni accent is more or less the same as a generic upper middle class West End one. I'm not 100% sure though. Here's limmy doing an improv story featuring his only kinda exaggerated version of it https://youtu.be/kN3gb8-Uusc (It's well worth watching the whole thing btw, the guy's hilarious. Must be kinda jarring for a guy from working class Glasgow that his kid now speaks with the accent he takes the piss out of so much, given he's grown up very affluent now his da's loaded)
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Mar 4, 2022 15:41
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keep punching joe posted:The only specifically unique Glasgow accents I can think of is the 'Glasgow Uni' accent which is a sort of weird mid-Atlantic/valley-girl drawl mashed up with with the sort of upper middle class Scots you hear on the West coast. It's just as horrendous as it sounds. loving Newton Mearns man. How can you forget those cunts & their absolutely abominable accent?
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Mar 4, 2022 15:45
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Reveilled posted:I've always found the "glasgow uni accent" thing a bit mystifying because I've heard lots of references to it but don't think I've ever actually heard it, unless it's just a new name for "west end accent". I've got a fairly typical west end accent, but when I was briefly at uni I don't think any of my friends spoke with the same accent as I had unless they were specifically from the west end, and my current D&D group which is almost entirely Glasgow Uni alumni mostly just sound like the places they're from: Edinburgh, Australia, the highlands. I think it probably really just the generic accent around younger people in Hillhead /kelvinbridge rather than specific to the uni (though that's probably the main driver). It's certainly distinct from what I'd class as the more middle class Glasgow voice (Armando Ianucci/Peter Capaldis accent spring to mind here as examples)
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Mar 4, 2022 15:50
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Gonzo McFee posted:More people should become Scottish. What else are you gonna be? Welsh? That's no even a real thing. Therefore the only British people that actually exist are at the National Eisteddfod or in an isolated farmhouse outside Saint-Brieuc. Of course if you apply that same metric to the English, you get an entirely opposite phenomenon, there's more English speakers in the USA than in England, more Anglicans in Nigeria than England, and more people doing odd things with cricket bats (such as cricket) and putting cucumbers where they don't belong (such as in food) in Bangladesh than in England. So do the English even exist as an ethnicity? Do they exist at all? Some people have exciting takes  
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Mar 4, 2022 16:02
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keep punching joe posted:I think it probably really just the generic accent around younger people in Hillhead /kelvinbridge rather than specific to the uni (though that's probably the main driver). It's certainly distinct from what I'd class as the more middle class Glasgow voice (Armando Ianucci/Peter Capaldis accent spring to mind here as examples) ThomasPaine posted:You're probably right that the Glasgow Uni accent is more or less the same as a generic upper middle class West End one. I'm not 100% sure though. Here's limmy doing an improv story featuring his only kinda exaggerated version of it Yeah, it's the funny thing where I've heard people like Limmy "do" the accent, just haven't heard an actual IRL case, which might just be that it's my accent so I can't hear it. Or maybe it is just that it's a young person accent and I'm now officially old enough that the people I think of as "young" aren't young any more. I use a sample paragraph to practice doing accents, I recorded my natural voice reading it: https://voca.ro/13MIz4084GVL Bobby Deluxe posted:I have to admit, I loving love the welsh accent, it's great and I get a kick every time I hear it. There should be more welsh accents in things. 100% same, I love welsh accents and its to my great regret that I can't do one at all unless I'm just quoting lines. I remember when I played the The Old Republic (Bioware's Star Wars MMO) and bumped into an imperial officer, Captain Bryn from the Welsh Planet and he instantly became my favourite star wars character. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Aa4KRJoxhtQ Reveilled fucked around with this message at 16:17 on Mar 4, 2022 |
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Mar 4, 2022 16:14
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I did a masters at Glasgow Uni and I can 100% categorically confirm that there are people with that accent, and as KPJ says it is very distinct from the city's generic middle class one. I'm sure there's probably piles of papers written about it in linguistics journals.
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Mar 4, 2022 16:28
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The Cool Accent For Smart People, An Impartial Study [Dept. Language & Linguistics, U. of Glasgow]
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Mar 4, 2022 16:35
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Speaking of Scots Labour https://twitter.com/HTScotPol/status/1499641366594400262?s=19 It's back baby, its bigoted again!
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Mar 4, 2022 16:41
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happyhippy posted:A work mate is 100% German, moved to Ireland at the age of 8, and has a 100% US accent to this day. When I did german at GCSE our teaching assistant from germany spoke english with a pronounced american accent so i think this is quite common, owing to the proliferation of US media.
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Mar 4, 2022 16:43
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Yeah I met a Chinese guy once who moved here as a student is now fluent in English, but he speaks in a pronounced scouse accent because his teacher was from Liverpool.
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Mar 4, 2022 16:50
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Gonzo McFee posted:Speaking of Scots Labour
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Mar 4, 2022 16:52
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Gonzo McFee posted:Speaking of Scots Labour Though cowards flinch and traitors sneer, we'll keep the red... hand flying here.
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Mar 4, 2022 16:54
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I did German in school, the main thing that stands out in my memory was being told that if we were asked if we speak German, we should hold up our closed hand put our thumb and forefinger close together and say "ein bischen" to mean "a little bit". Now there's nothing necessarily weird about doing that gesture to mean something small, but I think it stuck in my memory because our teacher specifically had us all do that specific hand gesture like it was some mandatory part of the phrase. Many years later I finally went to Germany, and any time I would ask "Do you speak English?" literally every single person did that exact goddamn hand gesture and said "a little bit", no matter how good their English was.
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Mar 4, 2022 16:55
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Reveilled posted:Many years later I finally went to Germany, and any time I would ask "Do you speak English?" literally every single person did that exact goddamn hand gesture and said "a little bit", no matter how good their English was. That's actually... weirdly interesting. I'd never considered that body language might become integrated into spoken language in such a consistent way.
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Mar 4, 2022 17:00
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ThomasPaine posted:That's actually... weirdly interesting. I'd never considered that body language might become integrated into spoken language in such a consistent way. If you think that's weird consider that weird thing we all do where we pull in our lips and give a wee nod to say hello without saying the words.
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Mar 4, 2022 17:04
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I think that's called the "white people smile" I've never much done it personally because I always interpret it as apologetic, but even less in the last two years because you can't see it under a mask, if you want to do face language at people with a mask on you have to get it to reach your eyes so you end up gurning at everyone so they can see you're smiling. Also I have a lot of face hair anyway so again, tend to focus on the eyes as the main expressive part of the face cos you can't see the rest very well. OwlFancier fucked around with this message at 17:15 on Mar 4, 2022 |
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Mar 4, 2022 17:08
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Reminds me of 'lip pointing' as a very culturally linked but almost universal gesture around much of the northern bit of South America (although it gets commonly called Colombian).
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Mar 4, 2022 17:11
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I'm seeing through the eye of the needle here. My world has been turned on its head.
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Mar 4, 2022 17:23
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Jaeluni Asjil posted:I even dare to suggest that if you hear perfect RP being spoken, the speaker is not a native speaker. Hard to know your standards of perfection, but I think you are wrong about older people, anyway. This is me: https://www.theriansaga.com/promotion/default.aspx?autoplay=true
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Mar 4, 2022 17:32
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Guavanaut posted:Reminds me of 'lip pointing' as a very culturally linked but almost universal gesture around much of the northern bit of South America (although it gets commonly called Colombian). Hey, look at that thing over there! 
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Mar 4, 2022 17:32
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Gonzo McFee posted:If you think that's weird consider that weird thing we all do where we pull in our lips and give a wee nod to say hello without saying the words. It's a polite "I am acknowledging you but not engaging in conversation"
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Mar 4, 2022 17:35
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ThomasPaine posted:That's actually... weirdly interesting. I'd never considered that body language might become integrated into spoken language in such a consistent way. A Dutch friend told me he loved the way you could tell Wallace and Gromit were English even with the sound off. He gave a few examples but the one I remember was pulling down one's bottom lip when asking if people would like a cup of tea. ('I don't do that!' I thought, before I said it in a mirror.)
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Mar 4, 2022 17:41
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Bobby Deluxe posted:If I had to imagine there being an SA accent it woulf be Frink from the Simpsons. Come on now Comic Book Guy
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Mar 4, 2022 17:46
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Here's a good interview with the guys behind the Trojan Horse Affair podcast: https://www.vulture.com/2022/03/trojan-horse-affair-podcast-british-response-interview.html
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Mar 4, 2022 18:03
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Anyone that sings well enough to be invited to the same bar twice is going to have enough practice with intonation that theyre not going to need to do weird elocution rituals with the accent they hear every day for several years. And if someone becomes fluent in a language after moving somewhere with a noticeable accent, then that is how that language sounds in their head. Coolie reads your posts in his accent. Please Mr coolie, you can't just say everything is aberdonian now! *Points at seagull* Scurry.
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Mar 4, 2022 18:28
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Coohoolin's alright. I don't agree with him on everything but that doesn't mean I dislike him. It's a bit weird that the thread is bitching about him IMO.
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Mar 4, 2022 18:55
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A searing hot take there. I am not one of these folks who truly believes that language can fully create a reality. Seems to mythopoetic as a set up.
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Mar 4, 2022 19:00
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Hard linguistic determinism has been shown to be horseshit and the guy who came up with it was a hack who didn't know anything about the people he was talking about. No idea what that comic is from but it sounds utterly idiotic. ALSO as I previously threatened I have been watching the shaun harry potter vid and oh my god if you ever wanted confirmation that jowling kowling rowling is basically new labour distilled into human form you should give it a look. So much stuff that is utterly emblematic of the worst 90's liberal understanding of reality. OwlFancier fucked around with this message at 19:08 on Mar 4, 2022 |
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Mar 4, 2022 19:04
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Yeah, languages in general aren't things that come into being fully formed and imbued with a certain culture or handed down by gods (other than like loglang and other languages spoken by a dozen linguistics nerds). English is made up, so are all the rest. In context as an anticolonialist take it makes a bit more sense though, you get big racist cunts like Cecil Rhodes literally forcing the language and culture on millions of people, then you get big racist cunts like Tommy Robinson saying "your not english" when those people decide to live there and their children regard themselves as so. You can't have a global culture and an ethnonationalist metropole. You can try but it makes you poo poo. So it's not so much that English people lack souls (that is amusing tho) as that English culture still has a lot of work it needs to do about who it regards as native or indigenous. That's not determined by the sequence of mouth noises but by the historical nature of that specific language and exactly why it has 1.5 billion speakers. WhatEvil posted:Coohoolin's alright. I don't agree with him on everything but that doesn't mean I dislike him. It's a bit weird that the thread is bitching about him IMO.
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Mar 4, 2022 19:10
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I find it very difficult not to interpret "cultural authenticity" as being just another way of saying "this culture is racialized by the dominant culture in the area and thus in part demonstrates a greater degree of cohesiveness but also is fetishized and commodified while also fundamentally being alienated by this practice from both the people who are racialized as "posessing" it and also the people who buy it as a commodity" To which the obvious rebuttal, IMO, is that it makes no sense to desire the dominant culture to posess "authenticity" or whatever because the entire thing that is identified as that is a product of a power imbalance, if you feel like "your" culture is the dominant one and that it lacks "soul" or whatever then that's a problem of your relationship to power and the only person that can fix that immediately is you, and the only way it can be fixed systemically is by solving racism and capitalism.
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Mar 4, 2022 19:15
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Oh dear me posted:Hard to know your standards of perfection, but I think you are wrong about older people, anyway. This is me: Very nice  Is that also how you speak 'everyday', too? I have very rarely heard people speak like this in regular, daily discourse. (Lived and worked in London for 30 years). You're a few years younger than me though IIRC, so don't count as older people 
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Mar 4, 2022 19:35
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Friends, I'm like 8 pages behind but I thought that you should all see this pin badge urgently: Who is this for? Is there literally anybody that it wouldn't annoy? 
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Mar 4, 2022 19:46
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Time travelling Constantine I? Or possibly mussolini.
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Mar 4, 2022 19:49
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Brian Boru
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Mar 4, 2022 19:51
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E: wrong thread bob
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Mar 4, 2022 19:52
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Jaeluni Asjil posted:Is that also how you speak 'everyday', too? Yes. It is my mother's accent, and my communist father insisted his daughters should have it rather than his own, because he thought it would benefit us (which it definitely has, despite occasional ridicule). I suppose there was a similar reason for my mother's family adopting it originally, but they were all carpenters from Cornwall and umbrella makers from Bethnal Green, so if they did it I imagine a lot of people must have.
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Mar 4, 2022 19:56
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Borrovan posted:Friends, I'm like 8 pages behind but I thought that you should all see this pin badge urgently: maybe ivory coast flag but with a manufacturing error
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Mar 4, 2022 19:57
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Borrovan posted:Friends, I'm like 8 pages behind but I thought that you should all see this pin badge urgently: I love this, it's like a psyonic weapon. Thank you whoever got me my new av. Keep safe!
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Mar 4, 2022 19:59
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