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Presumably you'd also want to avoid the CCG aspect of it. Maybe more in the deckbuilding genre?
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Mar 10, 2022 02:55
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Absurd Alhazred posted:Presumably you'd also want to avoid the CCG aspect of it. Maybe more in the deckbuilding genre? Well in this context I figure proxy cards would be fine, plus I think much of the appeal of this concept would be in replicating Card Game Anime shenanigans anyways so using a preexisting and known TCG would be best(particularly since the players will likely have at least some basic idea how to play through cultural osmosis if nothing else), with much of the system involving developing their decks further and to better fit their characters
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Mar 10, 2022 03:16
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CitizenKeen posted:I think you have to change you're starting assumptions. I've been getting really into Icon (the fantasy Lancer successor), and in Icon, there's no jump ability. You can't jump if your class doesn't have a jump ability. You're the world's greatest warrior and your enemy is standing on the other side of a five foot gulf? Too bad, they might as well be on the moon. The crunchiest game I can think of that does front row/back row is Super Console.
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Mar 10, 2022 03:21
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That Old Tree posted:I am compelled to mention TOR again (sorry if you addressed it already and I missed it). It's a little bit more complex "range"-wise than simply melee/ranged, but just barely. I will have to pick up The One Ring, as I've never read it. Tulip posted:Oh for sure it isn't, but it could be turned into one or a system of a larger RPG if you wanted to be insane I think "RPG but also card game" is a holy grail pursuit, but that's also so much
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Mar 10, 2022 03:27
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CitizenKeen posted:I will have to pick up The One Ring, as I've never read it. Shadowfist adapted to run a Feng Shui game could be awesome
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Mar 10, 2022 03:34
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CitizenKeen posted:I will have to pick up The One Ring, as I've never read it. I think the big thing would be keeping the rules for the non card game portions super simple since the card game and deck building portions would be the most complex and time consuming parts of the game
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Mar 10, 2022 03:36
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drrockso20 posted:I think the big thing would be keeping the rules for the non card game portions super simple since the card game and deck building portions would be the most complex and time consuming parts of the game Agreed. Again, I'm neck deep in Icon, and Icon is basically "Lancer/Final Fantasy Tactics for important combat, vanilla Forged in the Dark for everything else". Lancer did the same thing. I think there's quite a paradigm for "combat is meaty, everything else is one step higher than hand-wavey".
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Mar 10, 2022 03:50
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I feel like the Arkham Horror LCG is as close as it's possible to get as card game + rpg.
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Mar 10, 2022 03:52
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CitizenKeen posted:I will have to pick up The One Ring, as I've never read it. I mean just being a card game is very doable - I read Aurora just now and is an RPG and is a card game but it's not like, remotely a complex one of either of those. e: Thing is I would hate to play an entire game of magic to resolve a single combat
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Mar 10, 2022 04:11
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CitizenKeen posted:Agreed. Again, I'm neck deep in Icon, and Icon is basically "Lancer/Final Fantasy Tactics for important combat, vanilla Forged in the Dark for everything else". Lancer did the same thing. I think there's quite a paradigm for "combat is meaty, everything else is one step higher than hand-wavey". Particularly since following Card Game Anime tropes any major situation would be resolved through Children's Card Games(possibly while on Motorcycles but not required) Tulip posted:I mean just being a card game is very doable - I read Aurora just now and is an RPG and is a card game but it's not like, remotely a complex one of either of those. That's why you'd use a modified form of the rules to speed things up
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Mar 10, 2022 04:24
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Patrol is another game with fairly meaty combat and abstracted other bits.
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Mar 10, 2022 04:51
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CitizenKeen posted:Agreed. Again, I'm neck deep in Icon, and Icon is basically "Lancer/Final Fantasy Tactics for important combat, vanilla Forged in the Dark for everything else". Lancer did the same thing. I think there's quite a paradigm for "combat is meaty, everything else is one step higher than hand-wavey". How is Icon so far btw? Is it close to being fully finished? Triangle Strategy really got me in the tactical rpg mood lately
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Mar 10, 2022 10:59
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drrockso20 posted:Well in this context I figure proxy cards would be fine, plus I think much of the appeal of this concept would be in replicating Card Game Anime shenanigans anyways so using a preexisting and known TCG would be best(particularly since the players will likely have at least some basic idea how to play through cultural osmosis if nothing else), with much of the system involving developing their decks further and to better fit their characters Card Quest the single player videogame might be an interesting place to start from for such a project. I don't know how the hell you would balance it for multiple players. But it has the basic equipment/class feel down pat. The game is sometimes described as a handbuilder. Your deck is determined by your starting style/weapon/off hand. A major factor in play is balancing holding onto defensive cards in your hand vs. drawing cards to fuel your offence. I can post an example or two of play if people don't already own it. Protips: you can mulligan your starting hand for a small stamina fee, you should do that if you have any doubts about your hand. The tutorials are intentionally unforgiving puzzles. If you see a plant depicted on your screen plan around being ambushed.
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Mar 10, 2022 11:37
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Asterite34 posted:So basically, early Final Fantasy-style jrpg combat, where in a given combat encounter everyone can hit everyone and relative positioning is not a consideration outside of maybe "I'm in the back row so I take slightly less damage but melee attacks are weaker" sort of abstract buffs? This is explicitly how Fabula Ultima runs, being inspired largely by JRPGs. The only exception to everyone just being able to hit everyone is if an enemy has the Flying ability, in which case it can only be targeted by ranged attacks and spells, and becomes grounded either when it takes damage of a type it's vulnerable to or when it enters Crisis (being reduced to half HP).
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Mar 10, 2022 12:51
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PurpleXVI posted:I mean, part of it is... when does the exact volumetric blast zone of a fireball matter? Like the main point of it is that if you toss it into a melee, it will also fry your own dudes, not just the enemy dudes. I don't think fireballs having a stated blast radius is necessarily the sick slam dunk against ToTM 2e that you feel it is. The thing is that fireballs don't have a stated blast radius. They have a stated blast volume (in cubic feet, no less) and the radius matters only in so far as it determines the volume. In 2e if you airburst a fireball it has a 20ft radius but if you drop it on the ground its radius is multiplied by the cube root of 2 for about 25ft because the fire can't go down and therefore needs to expand the top half of the sphere. Throw it in a corner and its radius is a whole lot larger again - and bad things happen when you drop one in kobold tunnels.
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Mar 10, 2022 14:01
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Plutonis posted:How is Icon so far btw? Is it close to being fully finished? Triangle Strategy really got me in the tactical rpg mood lately I really disliked it mechanically in the playtest my group did, but I also had the misfortune of playing a Freelancer which probably has the worst class mechanics out of any of them so far. It does the "combat/noncombat" dichotomy better than Lancer did but that's the only positive thing I can really say for the game so far. I filed it next to GUN in terms of Tom's project quality.
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Mar 10, 2022 14:16
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Plutonis posted:How is Icon so far btw? Is it close to being fully finished? Triangle Strategy really got me in the tactical rpg mood lately I admittedly haven't played it, because I want my maps-n-minis games played in person. That being said, when I read the first playtest, I called a friend and said two things: 1. Mainline this poo poo right into my veins. 2. This is going to be a bear to balance. Icon lacks fall-back "basic" moves, so if your class can get into a situation where you can't use your class powers, you're pretty hosed. And its movement economy is the tightest I think I've ever seen (tightest as in "most constrained", not as in "toight"). So if Icon gets kickstarted I'm backing at the highest level, but I doubt I can get my playtest-averse group to tackle it. If it can get to a place where its balanced and fun, though? I'm hopeful. Who knows.
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Mar 10, 2022 15:55
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Icon looks rad as gently caress. Powers like "grab someone, jump so high you're both off the map for a turn, then suplex them for half their health in damage" and "create a bomb everyone has to kick around like a hot potato until it randomly explodes" look fun as hell. The not-in-a-fight stuff looks like an actual game as opposed to the sort of embarrassing cough Lancer had the moment the mechs weren't shooting at each other, so that'll be nice too. Admittedly though, I've not played Icon yet, and some of the choices are very bold, like most characters not being able to move diagonally, or the maps being really small by standard.
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Mar 10, 2022 16:24
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Splicer posted:Are the zones static to each other in your example? Like is it: Does Tunnels'n'Trolls count as a crunchy game? The rules aren't so complicated, but you are slinging buckets of dice PurpleXVI posted:I mean, part of it is... when does the exact volumetric blast zone of a fireball matter? Like the main point of it is that if you toss it into a melee, it will also fry your own dudes, not just the enemy dudes. I don't think fireballs having a stated blast radius is necessarily the sick slam dunk against ToTM 2e that you feel it is.
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Mar 10, 2022 17:12
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Halloween Jack posted:These things sort of develop a subculture around them. Like, "how hosed are we if we cast fireball in this 5' wide hallway" has an entire body of gamer lore attached to it at this point. Sometimes people even carry these assumptions from D&D into other games where the rules work differently. I remember a lot of fireball jokes from the people I played Shadowrun with at the FLGS decades ago. Shadowrun also has a "chunky salsa" rule for explosions in confined quarters doing more damage, though, at least in some editions, so it's actually very relevant there. A fireball in confined quarters just washes through more corridors, it doesn't do more intensive damage. But, yeah, I associate with a lot of players who started on 1e D&D and... "fireball volume" never comes up with them.
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Mar 10, 2022 17:18
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Every other spell: Everything inside the radius does damage and outside the radius does nothing. Don't sweat it. It's magic. Fireball: No, this MUST go off exactly like a FAE, pull out your calculators, we're figuring the cubic footage of this entire map!
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Mar 10, 2022 17:35
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Mirage posted:Every other spell: Everything inside the radius does damage and outside the radius does nothing. Don't sweat it. It's magic. More spells should be math problems, to encourage people to use them less.
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Mar 10, 2022 17:37
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A spell that lets you design your summoned golem using GURPS 3rd Edition Vehicles.
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Mar 10, 2022 17:46
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Mirage posted:Every other spell: Everything inside the radius does damage and outside the radius does nothing. Don't sweat it. It's magic.
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Mar 10, 2022 18:54
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Now I understand why people get that fancy 3D terrain! You can measure fireball volume by tipping an equivalent measure of jam into it and seeing how it spreads!
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Mar 10, 2022 19:31
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There's only one group of adventurers who would dare give me the raspberry!
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Mar 10, 2022 19:38
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"A fireball affects a number of standard grid spaces equal to (whatever the dice modifier is and some appropriate algorithm). In reasonably open spaces such as large caverns or building interiors, or outdoors, treat as (appropriate radius); however, in tight corridors the blast will instead spread out to fill the number of grid spaces, moving evenly in all plausible directions, starting from the direction furthest from the caster's origin point and moving counterclockwise until all possible spaces are filled. example: short illustration or two goes here" You could even genericize this as a "fireball mechanic" for things like vapor/gas spells or traps.
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Mar 10, 2022 19:49
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Grid cubes dammit Everything wants to handwave the 3rd dimension.
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Mar 10, 2022 19:53
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hyphz posted:Grid cubes dammit As someone who's been trying to make a parkour practitioner into a viable character (ie, having any mechanical use for that aspect, whether it's the dominant element or one of several) for the past decade - tell me about it. The concept of "over" and "under" are myths.
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Mar 10, 2022 20:38
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Zafir seems pretty slick. It's made me far more cognizant of the third dimension since I've read it.
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Mar 10, 2022 21:06
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Nessus posted:"A fireball affects a number of standard grid spaces equal to (whatever the dice modifier is and some appropriate algorithm). In reasonably open spaces such as large caverns or building interiors, or outdoors, treat as (appropriate radius); however, in tight corridors the blast will instead spread out to fill the number of grid spaces, moving evenly in all plausible directions, starting from the direction furthest from the caster's origin point and moving counterclockwise until all possible spaces are filled.
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Mar 10, 2022 21:31
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CitizenKeen posted:Zafir seems pretty slick. It's made me far more cognizant of the third dimension since I've read it. The pan flute guy?
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Mar 10, 2022 22:15
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So someone told me that Pathfinder 2nd Edition has some similarities to D&D 4th edition and that immediately made me very interested in Pathfinder 2nd edition. Is this true? Is it good? I didn't see PF2e thread.
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Mar 10, 2022 23:06
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Mordiceius posted:So someone told me that Pathfinder 2nd Edition has some similarities to D&D 4th edition and that immediately made me very interested in Pathfinder 2nd edition. We have to say "Pathfinder" one more time to summon Arivia, but here's a link to the most recent page of the thread, where there seems to be some discussion of Pf2E vs D&D4E. https://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=3270616&userid=0&perpage=40&pagenumber=544 Xiahou Dun posted:The pan flute guy? https://www.zafirgame.com/
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Mar 10, 2022 23:13
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PF2e’s combat structure is similar to D&D4e but does have the issue that although there is a wide variety of combat actions per class, it’s often too good to just pick one and focus everything on it, then have no variety in actual play. (It also has 3D problems. If you are critically hit with a flail while flying then you fall. This works fine in the dungeon but one of the APs tried to have a set piece battle between flying monsters and the PCs in a winged chariot over a city. But the first time a PC critted the monster they plummeted right out of the air and crash landed in the city below. Oddly, being a flying creature allowed them to take no damage from this, but not to not fall.)
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Mar 11, 2022 00:05
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Xiahou Dun posted:The pan flute guy? No, the fermented milk drink.
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Mar 11, 2022 00:22
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hyphz posted:(It also has 3D problems. If you are critically hit with a flail while flying then you fall. This works fine in the dungeon but one of the APs tried to have a set piece battle between flying monsters and the PCs in a winged chariot over a city. But the first time a PC critted the monster they plummeted right out of the air and crash landed in the city below. Oddly, being a flying creature allowed them to take no damage from this, but not to not fall.) Wouldn't this particular kind of situation just mean the monster got the benefit of not taking falling damage (and thus the crit wasn't way more damaging than it should be), but it did have to spend actions getting back into the fight instead of threatening the PCs? I guess depending how far down it was and how fast the monster could move, it might take the monster out of the fight for long enough to seriously mess with the challenge, but otherwise it sounds to me like a nice moment of unexpected synergy between a player's character choices and an unusual situation that would make the fight more memorable after the fact.
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Mar 11, 2022 00:55
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Mordiceius posted:So someone told me that Pathfinder 2nd Edition has some similarities to D&D 4th edition and that immediately made me very interested in Pathfinder 2nd edition. It's not particularly true, and I didn't find much good in PF2e, I'm afraid. It's certainly not the 4.5e the world desperately needs.
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Mar 11, 2022 01:03
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Gort posted:It's not particularly true, and I didn't find much good in PF2e, I'm afraid. It's certainly not the 4.5e the world desperately needs. Does the world need that, though?
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Mar 11, 2022 01:25
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My group would certainly be excited to try it.
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Mar 11, 2022 02:07
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